Northern Monkey

You dont know that, I think we have to give him his chance to buy the players which suit his system. Once we do that and he has brought his own players and his "system" is ready we can then judge and say thumbs up or thumbs down. Its utter wank at the minute but we have to stick with it. He's spent £25m and brought in 9 players. His players, that he wanted. And they have, in the main, been bad buys.

and you, sir, are incorrect.

2 or 3 seasons. and you think he'll be a success in that time? And by success, i mean get us into a stable position in the top 6/7.

Do you think a new manager will not want his own staff, players and time to gel a team/system? I reckon this season is a write-off whether we sack him or not. A season of rebuilding is not wasted. Even half a season of looking at the team and planning for the future is not wasted. Keeping a manager with no chance of success or even a clue what to do is a waste of a season.

But, what would happen if we did sack Allardyce, and a 'World Cass' manager of the quality of Hitzfeld, or Capello, etc became available and joined us - either within the next month, or in the summer with money to spend. How long would they get to turn us round, even if we were playing inconisistent/poorly and not getting results in their first 6-7 months?? After all, they would be the perceived 'World Class' manager that people are crying out for, and seem to think we can/should be able attract, despite how our standing has slipped over the last 3-4 years! Where did i say world class? What i DID say was that Allrdyce is not good enough. If a manager came in who: * spend money well * wasn't tactically inept * played to the teams strengths * played people on their actual positions * had a clear plan for the future then i think all NUFC fans would rightly give him time. Allardyce has proven that he has fuck all of those attributes. Why shoudl we stick with a man destined to make us fail??

1) More than 20 games 2) Enough money to say, "well you've had enough and your plans are not working" 3) Damage? do you mean relegation?, we wont go down. 4) Wasting time? we are not in a position to be hurrying our way up the league especially after the Souness and Roeder seasons. Its pisses me off and hurts just as much as what you feel but its the cold cold truth. How long does he get, then? If we end up, after spending £25m oh HIS players, 11th, after playing people out of position, etc etc, is that good enough? Because we'll be LUCKY to get that. As for damage, i mean another wasted season, more money wasted, more embrassment to us. He's NOT good enough, and giving him more time, money etc is just throwing resource away.

Yes, lets stick with a manager who is not good enough, and get right behind him as he makes us the top of the bottom half of the Premier League. Fucking pathetic - him and us, if we sit and lamely accept a manager like Allardyce.

So we stick with a manager who is not good enough, for how long? How much damage do we let him do, how much money do we let him waste? How much time do we waste on him?

You dont know that, another summer transfer window and we could get the players we need. We need to buck this trend of sacking managers. Allardyce has already seen fit to spend £25m on almost entirely poor players. His tactics, formations and player selections have been awful. He's not new to this league, and neither are some of the flops he's bought. I really can't see anything to suggets he'll suddenly come good, learn from his mistakes and becoem a good manager. He's living off past 'successes', but football has moved on. Unfortunately for us, Allardyce and his methods have not.

Aye, that Torres is shit like. There wont be many other defenders he'll beat for pace over 40 yards. Your point being thats its OKAY for Bramble to do badly against good players? Thats the kind of attitude that keeps shite players at our club for far too long.

What exactly is this forum about? Is it about fans putting across their genuine feelings about their club, or about only posting positive stuff to keep you happy?

Thats a bad analogy. It would be a good one, if Allardyce was capable of making us good, but he's not.

Yes I have Sadly we cant keep on sacking mangers, it has to stop or change somewhere. We have to give the right manager time, certainly. the RIGHT one. But that isn't the current one, which you must know if you actually go to, or even watch, our games.

Change the record. Is that an order? Or are we still allowed to say what we think?

Thats fucking laughable, that.

Have you seen us play this season? Have you seen Allardyce's formations, tactics and player selections? Have you seen the layers he saw fit to shell £25m out on? HE'S NOT THE RIGHT MANAGER FOR US.

Payback as in scoring a goal and being responsible for conceding one?

we lost because of the players and the manager. oh, and all of those fans who were getting onto their knees to suck Viduka off when he arrived - despite ALL of us slating him when he was at the Beasts - he's NOT a great player, he's not even a particularly good one. Its about time Newcastle fans realised that just because a player signs for us, it DOESN'T make him great. one last thing - Cacapa: not good,. He got away with a few things last night, but he's a liability.

You're content with our current central midfield then? No but it's horses for courses as far as I'm concerned. The course being a shite manager who has no clue, and the horses being poor midfielders?

No, you're right. And neither should they be, its US who should have been more aware of the fact that he's an arsehole, and not signed him in the first place.

Well, bearing in mind Allardyce has one tactic, I think "hope the long ball works" is the answer there.

1-2. Although we have a better chance if Smith is out, and we have to play a competent player in his place.

NOTHING APART FROM MISSING THE ASHTRAY WITH HIS CIGAR That didn't go to court so won't even be mentioned. Anything else? Has he been found guilty of anything in court before? What's your point though? My point is people are going on about his previous activities that have been well publicised in the papers but the courts only take into account things he's been found guilty of in court previously. so are we saying that he DIDN'T: * put a cigar out in a young team mates eye * assualt a team mate in training * attack passers by in the street * beat a man to the ground * assualt a 15 year old Everton fan * have to be held back from further attacking the boy by a team mate

I hope not. Still not convinced myself. What kind of wedge he gets in Jan could be very telling I feel. I said that recently, on here or TT. He needs to spend in January too. I'd say we are a few players short - another CB in the Faye mould, a pacy striker and a creative midfielder. And that's just for starters. I'm not holding my breath though. Agreed, we badly need some quality which may not provide us with all the answers but would go a long way in helping matters I feel, especially if the manager can sign the right type of player for him which a good few of our players just aren't, even those he's signed himself. What abotu the money he has already spent? He spent that very badly, in the main. If there was a meal - and lets face it, if we're reading much into the Sunday Sun we're in trouble - i hope it was a LAst Supper.

Surely there are any number of managers clearly better than Fat Sam. Do the rules of your game specify that this manager has to be without a job? Its just that two of our 3 last managers were at other clubs, so is all you want a list of managers who are better than Allardyce? I'd just like to see who people would swap him with and on what basis. So far some of the names suggested range between laughable to who? While others would only represent a sideways step. Who would you swap him with btw? I disagree abotu the sideways step, absolutley and fundamentally. I think Allardyce is an awful manager for us, and there are a number of better options even in the PL (although they are also at medium sized clubs like us, so might be hard to prise away). Nonetheless, i think that a "sideways" step would be Roeder or Souness, because thats the level Fat Sam is on. A step UP would be the likes of Hughes, Moyes, Redknapp (i hate him, but he's better than Allardyce), O'Neill, Eriksson, etc. I'm not saying they'd be easy to get, or would even come at all, but they are all better than Allardyce. From Europe, it depends what we intend to do. If we intend to grasp the opportunity and push on, then we need a good coach, like a Houllier etc. Or a bigger name that we have to throw money at. The simple fact is - Allardyce is not good enough, he's proven himself to be an imbecile with transfers, team selection, formation and tactics, and someone who cannot learn from his mistakes. Oh, and he's doing the "x player did great" thing that we saw with our last 2 managers, in blatant disregard to the actual truth. Time to get rid, get a GOOD manager in, and then allow them to build. Check their respective records, I think you'll find Allardyce is, statistically anyway, a better manager than the likes of Hughes and Moyes. I'd be devastated if we swapped Sam for any of those managers personally. If we are to get rid I want an exceptional manager to justify the whole craziness of sacking this one who going off your logic, isn't doing too bad a job given that the majority of our players are shite and we are shite... Anyway, I just know that if we did replace him with Moyes or Hughes and they too started the season like Sam has, we'd be having the very same discussion we're all having now, guaranteed. I disagree. I think its vital that we give the right manager time. the RIGHT manager. And the current one and the last 2 have been so clearly not the right manager that its laughable.