tmonkey

Councillor and MP's comments seem obvious/harmless, but can't help but feel that they might be making them because of the fear of administration and whatever that entails. Maybe they know something we don't. Or maybe not.

That said, I can see him being one of our better players this coming season. Probably true. If we had a manager who could have us organised into something other than a mess, alot of our s*** from last season would probably be quality in this league. The fact that Bristol City fans are creaming themselves over signing Paul Hartley says it all to me. There is some real s**** in this league. Of the players who are leaving, most of them are our better athletes, what we will be left with is the players who are shot, knackered or just plain s***. This is the same problem as last season, I just don't believe with those players leaving we will be fit or fast enough to challenge at the top of the Championship. It might be a lower level, but the better managers build younger, hungrier sides even at this level. One or two Nicky Butts is good, a team full of them will be over-run and sent packing. "Overrun" and "Nicky Butt" in the same sentance brings back bad memories of games gone by and gloomy visions of future matches If ANY Championship manager watched us last season, they'll be telling their central midfielders to make a beeline for our penalty area. They won't even have to run, a mild jog will do. We really have no hope.

If we weren't relegated and desperate to shift his wages, I'd want around £14m. Inflated, yes, but others seem to have no trouble getting ridiculous fees for decent/average players. In our current plight, I'd want £10m, even if that's unrealistic. I see him as a 15 goal striker with the much sought after commodity called pace. He's proven in the Premiership and Serie A, and still only 24 year olds. When on form, he's a dangerous striker for any opposition to face because he's unpredictable, i.e. can turn defenders easily and get a shot off with either foot. As a package, I think he'd be valuable in the eyes of other managers who'd be willing to take a punt on him. He has flaws, but then based on previous sales flaws don't seem to be considered much when going for a player with good attributes on paper - Jenas went for what, £9m? Dyer for £6m after years of constantly breaking down. Same for Woodgate who went for £13m.

Sir Les of the Ferdinand.

:lol:

Ameobi-esque by Big Al.

Tbf as I said in the other thread, there's no way on earth that Freddy would be able to keep quiet about it when talking to the Chronicle if he was close to getting it. If Freddy is as close to Bobby as he is making us believe (says today that he was on holiday in portugal with him recently, and they are very close) he will surely be there on Sunday. Shearer playing, Freddy possibly in the stand, could be a very interesting weekend! A surprise appearance by Kevin Keegan. Holding the hand of Dennis Wise as they both beam smiles at all the bemused supporters. Side by side, their t-shirts combine to read "thank you for the money".

£38m plus Eto'o and Hleb on loan for a year in exchange for Ibrahimovic. Would be a big "woah" were it not for Madrid's transactions being the mother of all spending sprees this summer. Barca vs Madrid is going to be awesome.

I'd go for the "Beckham Special". A boot kicked in your face. In all honesty, that looks like a pretty nice sports bar/restaurant.

Robben, Huntelaar, Sneijder, Van der Vaart, Van Nistelrooy, Drenthe. Think the previous Madrid president went a bit overboard with Dutch players there.

Possibly. At the same time though, £25m for a striker who was constantly f***ing things up for them is great business, so imo there'll be more chance that he'll go there and negatively affect their playing style and overall effectiveness without scoring enough goals to compensate. It's almost two birds with one stone - possibly weaken your opposition and definitely strengthen your own team. Arsenal needed to get rid of Adebayor. He can score some good goals and is a handful in the air, but he's absolutely abysmal outside of those moments. He's like a goalscoring version of Ameobi - just imagine Shola scoring more goals but still being as frustrating, s*** and idiotic in general play as only Shola can be. Most teams might not care about that, but with Arsenal's intricate style of play and constant attempts to walk the ball into the net, he was far more of a hindrance than he was a help imo.

He's been at Newcastle now for two years on nearly £2.5 million a year, that's over £7m by the time his contract runs out in 2010. He spent the 10 years previous to that at clubs like Paris Saint Germain and Marsaille were he'll have earned several million pounds at least. In short he's a multi millionaire! Exactly. How would he ever survive on £20k a week, he might have to give up one of his cars and just get by on a few Bentleys, maybe sell one of his homes and just get by with the two homes, my heart bleeds. If he's on £20k per week, that's what, £1m per year before tax and other deductions? And as he's a high earner, he'll be getting taxed 50% on most of that. So from his time here, he'll have roughly earnt around £2m up to the end of his contract. Hardly alot for a "multi-millionaire" really, especially if this is the most he'll be earning in his career. He's not a household name, so might not be earning much from sponsorship, and none of us have any idea what bonuses he may or may not be getting (and based on last season, there won't have been many paid out anyway given the lack of wins/clean sheets/etc). It's common knowledge that wages in France are considerably lower than in the Premiership. Beye never played for PSG and was a reserve there (i.e. even lower wages), and being a defender for Strasbourg/Marseille I doubt he was paid all that highly. This is all conjecture though, so who knows, but based on what we do know, he is most likely nowhere near as rich as someone of his calibre deserves to be in relation to teammates, other players elsewhere, etc. But the point is that unless Beye is going to go into coaching or punditry, the money he has now has to basically last him a lifetime, and the more of it he has before retiring, the better off he and his family will be for it. I don't blame him if he wants to leave because he wants/needs the security of a longer contract at his age. A good number of players at his age, including those at CL clubs, will move for that reason (e.g. 30+ Arsenal stars). It's also perfectly understandable and expected that he'd avoid handing in a transfer request as it'd hurt his own pocket to do so, especially when a transfer would probably happen anyway once the embargo is lifted, added to which the cost of the loyalty bonus for all we know may be included in the purchase price, i.e. the club might not be the one footing the bill.

That's actually a great idea. Make sure our good players aren't on the team bus when it drives off a cliff or something. Or maybe do what Ken Bates did to Matthew Harding, put the team in a helicopter with C4 and a gold watch timer placed underneath. The insurance payout for the likes of Barton, Coloccini, Smith, Butt, etc would enable us to repay the overdraft, fund new transfers, and put a massive dent in the wage bill. Everybody wins.

Having no idea about Beye's financial situation, I'd assume it's a slightly similar (thought not as extreme) to Rod Tidwell, the American footballer from the Jerry Maguire film. Beye's probably on a far smaller contract than his teammates, has only come into the Premiership at a late stage, was probably not on all that much in France, has one year left on his contract, and a family/lavish lifestyle to maintain for the next 50 years or so as he edges towards retirement. Hence, it's important that he get's this last relatively high-paid contract now, because if he gets seriously injured in this final season then that's possibly his career at the top over. He basically needs the security of a good contract.

Would definitely go for the moderately rich owner and Shearer in charge, providing they were rich enough to be able to absorb, or reduce significantly, the club's debts whilst also being able to take a considerable hit in the pocket this year as we fail to shift some of the players on mammoth wages. The club has generated enough revenue in the past to match some of the established CL clubs in Europe, and if it were run efficiently by competent personnel, directors, managers, etc, I dont think we'd need outside funding in order to compete with the top six/seven in the Premiership were we to make it back there. Imagine a Newcastle United run on the same lines as Arsenal or Everton, i.e. signing young, up-and-coming players on reasonable wages. We'd be laughing financially, especially if we qualified for Europe. Also, this club needs to get Shearer out of it's system. We're at a lower level than the Premiership, so the prior arguement of "Shearer should learn the ropes elsewhere first" now applies - to us. This is an appointment that has to be made, and we're unlikely to get anyone else other than jobless, average managers like Curbishley, so it's paramount that we give Shearer a shot and let him succeed or fail as it's the perfect time to do so.

Like him, as he's a player who can turn a defensive, nothing situation into an attacking one, and is great at keeping possession in tight situations, unlike everyone else in the squad (now that Viduka has left). His best games have also been against the top teams for the most part. At the same time though, he's becoming a bit like Michael Owen in that he might well be a much more useful/effective player in a considerably better team, but that "better team" is not us, and won't be for a good few years now that we're no longer a Premiership team. So why have him in the team? The excuses or reasons of "it's the fault of those around him" won't translate to points on the board for us. Would be worth looking into a Kieron Richardson type winger who may be more useful in the short term, providing we can sell Jonas for silly money of course.

Llambias' Daughter: "Daddy, I can't do this maths question. What is 15 to the power of 4 times pi?" Llambias: "More than two, that's for sure." What a strange quote.

My point about Villa fans and their views of Milner is that I'm referring to Milner's time at NUFC, and the fact that plenty of fans were happy with him until his last season here when patience wore thin. So at that specific point in time, I'd say the majority of NUFC fans were happy with Milner despite his flaws, because he's the type of player that fans in general will like - tries hard, chips in with assists/goals, can't fault him for effort, so on and so forth. At the time, I wasn't overly happy with Milner, because a winger with no pace, little teamplay or technical ability (aside from a few routine tricks he's great at) and such abhorrent inconsistency isn't for me. Looking at a Villa forum: http://www.villatalk.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=53561&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight= "I expected more from Milner. Can't fault the lad for effort and commitment, but he doesn't offer enough attacking wise down that right hand side, he's a workhorse, but he's better than that. O'Neill needs to give him a licence to get forward and take some of the pressure off Young on the left, which will also make us a little less predictable. " There's at least one Villa fan out there with slightly similar views. So you have ignored the majority of comments that suggest he will be a key player for them next season and have chosen the ONE comment that slightly resembled what you say about him Yes? I dont see how you're failing to understand what I'm saying. The point is that the majority are going to like him and be happy with him, just like Newcastle fans prior to his last season here. The dissenters will be in the minority, even more so with Villa being relatively successful. I looked up one thread with Milner in it, and found a viewpoint by a Villa fan that backs up what I've been saying. That doesn't mean I'm right, just like it doesn't mean the Villa fans' opinion is right. On the other side of the coin, concluding that Milner has been good for Villa because the majority of Villa fans are happy with him is flawed logic. Chlesea fans were happy with Duff in his last season there, chanting his name whenever he had the ball, yet I could see what a useless pile of shit he was and couldn't understand why they were so happy with such a useless player. But they were hardly going to complain about a "solid" hard worker when they were winning the title, were they?

That's like saying Kevin Nolan reminds me of a slightly better Kaka.

My point about Villa fans and their views of Milner is that I'm referring to Milner's time at NUFC, and the fact that plenty of fans were happy with him until his last season here when patience wore thin. So at that specific point in time, I'd say the majority of NUFC fans were happy with Milner despite his flaws, because he's the type of player that fans in general will like - tries hard, chips in with assists/goals, can't fault him for effort, so on and so forth. At the time, I wasn't overly happy with Milner, because a winger with no pace, little teamplay or technical ability (aside from a few routine tricks he's great at) and such abhorrent inconsistency isn't for me. Looking at a Villa forum: http://www.villatalk.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=53561&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight= "I expected more from Milner. Can't fault the lad for effort and commitment, but he doesn't offer enough attacking wise down that right hand side, he's a workhorse, but he's better than that. O'Neill needs to give him a licence to get forward and take some of the pressure off Young on the left, which will also make us a little less predictable. " There's at least one Villa fan out there with slightly similar views.

I have no grudge against Milner, well I hope not as he's not done anything to me personally, I just don't rate him very highly at all. There have been times when I certainly could see a potentially good winger in him, that game against Chelsea down the left flank a year or two ago was pure class, but in the long run that imo it turned out that that was a one-off game where he gave what may have been an off-form fullback a torrid time. Milner's stats may be somewhat impressive, but I can only go by what I've seen of him (no different to the Owen debate, where his stats suggest he was pretty decent for us whereas that contradicts what many of us will have seen on the pitch). There have been numerous games where Milner has just been a waste of a position for Villa, someone who when the team works hard to put the opposition on the back foot, gets the ball on the flank and then it's out for a goal kick, into the keeper's hands or over the head of his teammates. And he's done it repetitively throughout an entire game. Over the course of a season he may have a decent number of assists, and he'll have more for Villa because Villa are a better side with better strikers and teammates, but how many moves or promising situations will he have broken down to get that? It's sounds ridiculous to say 10-20 woeful crosses before putting in a good one, but that's what Milner often does. On top of this, he has no pace. A winger without pace had better be exceptionally talented to compensate, ala Nobby Solano. But he's not exceptionally talented. He's has a few tricks in his locker, but he's a very limited player technically imo, and it often shows whenever he's not in one of his normal positions. For us, particularly in his last season here, whenever he was on the end of a decent chance he'd completely fluff his lines and look a bit fo a donkey. Bit like Nolan when receiving the ball in the penalty box, just doesn't look right when the ball is only slightly difficult to control. I'm not saying Milner is shit, it's fair enough that you think he's good, I'm just arguing that imo he's a very average winger with real limitations, limitations that make him a bad teamplayer when the team is in possession of the ball, a player who'll often relieve the opposition of any pressure his own team is putting them under. O'Neill was mad to not only pay £12m for him, but also think that he was going to actually improve the team. They were a better side with Agbonlahor down the right, even though he's a striker playing out of position.

Possibly would have fit in, but that's debateable. At the time a few people on here were saying he'd have fitted into Geremi's position, but Geremi, despite the lack of legs, has the ability to play a good pass unlike Milner, and is more of a team player on the ball (will release the ball quickly, play quick one-twos, play short, etc). Milner imo is a one-dimensional player who hasn't got a decent assist outside of crossing for years. Get the ball on the wing, check in and out, float it into the box. If he were in that formation on the right of a central midfield trio, he'd be adding work rate only, because aside from that I view him as being the paceless equivalent of N'Zogbia - a selfish, head down player who runs into dead ends alot and doesn't know how to play a team game. He's just not a central midfielder for me, much like Gurthrie or Barton aren't wingers. As for Villa, he's been poor everytime I've seen him play imo. Villa fans might say he's been class, £12m well spent, so on and so forth, and although I'd respect their opinions, I'd view it as being no different to the pro-Milner views we had whilst he was with us, floating endless crosses into no-mans land and wasting promising position after promising position. He's a hard working lad who'll chip in with the odd goal/assist and will constantly try to put crosses into the box, so there'll always be people who admire or rate that. 1. I honestly think one of the reasons why Villa haven't challenged, and won't be challenging, for 4th spot is because of signing Milner. They should have looked to add pace and dribbling (or technical ability and creativity) down the right to compliment Young down the left. As stated before, a two flanked attack is infinitely better than a one flanked attack with a workhorse on the other flank (unless the team has world class players spread throughout it). If the pacey winger on the one flank has an off day, or comes across a fullback on form who he can't get the better off, the service/penetration/creativity is not stiffled for the entire team if there's a pacey or creative winger on the other flank. So Villa could have improved the team greatly in this respect. Instead, they've added an average workhorse for big money on that side, a "trier" who on a good day might put in a decent cross or two, and as a result they haven't improved from the year before, despite the big outlay. 1 2. you were just saying how N'Zogbia and Jonas worked so well together because one did all the attacking crossing etc and the other was the worker, now you are saying thats a bad thing? 1) ? I think that's a fair comment. The view is that Villa are a 5th/6th calibre team capable of moving up to realistically challenging for 4th spot (i.e. being there, or close, come the final day of the season) if they can improve the first team well enough. Signing Milner has ensured that they missed the opportunity to improve the team's attacking threat and effectiveness imo. It's like spending big to just stay in the same position - the team is no worse off, but it's not better off either, even if the player does chip in according to the stats. 2) I've not said Jonas was the "worker". My definition of a worker is someone who works hard off the ball - both Jonas and Milner do that very well. But Jonas is a ball carrier and helps retention, i.e. he can dribble past players and make the ball stick to him when he's under pressure in tight spots. That can drive the team forward from defensive or nothing situations when the team is camped in their own half. His end product is s***, but how many times did he win a free kick or corner having dribbled from within his own half, with noone to pass to around him, and forced the play in our favour? Having that on one flank, and a player with pace, dribbling, can cut inside or go down the line, and end product, down the other flank, is a pretty useful combination. It's not as effective when you have a player who's similar to the pacey winger down the other flank, but in fact isn't pacey and has similar flaws (inconsistent, inaccurate, head-down and run into brick walls, limited team-play).

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia. N'Zogbia was the bigger loss of the two, without a doubt for me. Was absolutely furious at the sale. The guy had pace and dribbling, and was the only player in the squad who used it relatively effectively. f*** JFK for getting rid of that for what I presume to be xenophobic reasons. Prior to being droped by JFK once Duff returned from injury (and after one average game), N'Zog down the left and Jonas down the right looked like an excellent wing partnership. End product and pace down one flank, ball retention and carrying it forward under pressure down the other. Having a two-flanked attach has always reduced the impact of teams doubling up on one player, as most teams did with Jonas. Certainly remember there being a thread where many of us were getting excited at this combination. Had he not been sold, I think we'd have stayed up. What's the assist and goal stats for last season for: Zoggy Milner Jonas ? What's the point being made though? Jonas and Zog on opposite flanks only happened for a few games whilst Duff was out injured and (iirc) Enrique was fit. And stats won't reflect the fact that a team looked much more dangerous with two complementing wingers in it then without - if Zog beats two players with great skill, puts a peach of a ball in, and Martins heads it eight metres high, stats will never show what happened. We might have lost the games Jonas/Zog played in for all I know, the point is that it looked a very promising "partnership" at the time, far better then the alternatives, and it should have been our first choice based on performance/skill. Instead it was dimsantled pretty quickly because of the reputation of some other player the manager preferred.

Possibly would have fit in, but that's debateable. At the time a few people on here were saying he'd have fitted into Geremi's position, but Geremi, despite the lack of legs, has the ability to play a good pass unlike Milner, and is more of a team player on the ball (will release the ball quickly, play quick one-twos, play short, etc). Milner imo is a one-dimensional player who hasn't got a decent assist outside of crossing for years. Get the ball on the wing, check in and out, float it into the box. If he were in that formation on the right of a central midfield trio, he'd be adding work rate only, because aside from that I view him as being the paceless equivalent of N'Zogbia - a selfish, head down player who runs into dead ends alot and doesn't know how to play a team game. He's just not a central midfielder for me, much like Gurthrie or Barton aren't wingers. As for Villa, he's been poor everytime I've seen him play imo. Villa fans might say he's been class, £12m well spent, so on and so forth, and although I'd respect their opinions, I'd view it as being no different to the pro-Milner views we had whilst he was with us, floating endless crosses into no-mans land and wasting promising position after promising position. He's a hard working lad who'll chip in with the odd goal/assist and will constantly try to put crosses into the box, so there'll always be people who admire or rate that. I honestly think one of the reasons why Villa haven't challenged, and won't be challenging, for 4th spot is because of signing Milner. They should have looked to add pace and dribbling (or technical ability and creativity) down the right to compliment Young down the left. As stated before, a two flanked attack is infinitely better than a one flanked attack with a workhorse on the other flank (unless the team has world class players spread throughout it). If the pacey winger on the one flank has an off day, or comes across a fullback on form who he can't get the better off, the service/penetration/creativity is not stiffled for the entire team if there's a pacey or creative winger on the other flank. So Villa could have improved the team greatly in this respect. Instead, they've added an average workhorse for big money on that side, a "trier" who on a good day might put in a decent cross or two, and as a result they haven't improved from the year before, despite the big outlay.

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia. N'Zogbia was the bigger loss of the two, without a doubt for me. Was absolutely furious at the sale. The guy had pace and dribbling, and was the only player in the squad who used it relatively effectively. Fuck JFK for getting rid of that for what I presume to be xenophobic reasons. Prior to being droped by JFK once Duff returned from injury (and after one average game), N'Zog down the left and Jonas down the right looked like an excellent wing partnership. End product and pace down one flank, ball retention and carrying it forward under pressure down the other. Having a two-flanked attach has always reduced the impact of teams doubling up on one player, as most teams did with Jonas. Certainly remember there being a thread where many of us were getting excited at this combination. Had he not been sold, I think we'd have stayed up.