bealios

I would love it if they went for Keegan

Nolan is a cleverer footballer than anyone we have at the moment. He might have looked shit today, but I would never bet against him scoring in any game. Take note Messi.

Keegan, Kendall, Kenny - it will all end the same way - never go back.

Liverpool were never going to get relegated, and they were never going to get into the top 4/5 - so I'm struggling to see the logic of sacking mid-season to appoint a short term manager. Better of sticking with Woy, to give the club an air of professionalism, and spend the next 5 months looking for a proper manager.

Can't disagree with much of that Nicky. Even though it was me who originally suggested "hit and hope" 

Nolan should, and will, start.

During the game I wasn't thinking we were being outplayed really. They were doing well to make the game congested and close us down, and we weren't passing the ball around enough.

 

It was basically a non-game that we took the wrong approach to creating chances and they got a boost from a highly lucky goal.

 

We play a game that suits these lower-league sides... pumping balls towards their giant CBs was never going to work, but it's our main tactic at the moment.

 

They had more attempts on target, more attempts off target, more possession and more corners and were the only side that looked like scoring before their fortunate goal. I have no doubt they would've turned us over even if that had of flew wide.

 

We didn't turn up, our tactics were a hark back to the good old Souness/Allardyce days and our players looked fucked.

 

I think we've found some common ground 

We'll agree to disagree. I'll take it back about the flukey strike, but I wouldn't read any more into this than a really off day by a team that have played a lot in the last couple of weeks. Might have been better off resting more players, rather than sticking with some players who have played a lot recently who didn't look up for it.

Wigan and West Ham are far better teams than Stevenage, and we haven't suddenly become shit in the space of 3 days.

Since the referee saw it I think its independent. Might be wrong though.

The biggest gripe is that we've seen those sorts of tackles before applauded as fantastic tackles.

Typical cup tie. They fluke a first goal. We're chasing the game, and then a hit and hope goes in.

 

There is always going to be a "big club" casualty in the 3rd round, where a good team has a terrible day, and the small team is really up for it. This year it was us. No reason to overreact, fair play to Stevenage.

 

It shouldn't reflect on the rest of the season, lets look forward to the Mackem match.

 

 

I'm sorry but that first line is bollocks.

 

Fluke first goal - aye, it was a deflection but you can't say they didn't deserve it nor that a goal wasn't coming.

 

We're chasing the game - err, did we?

 

Hit and hope - it was a very good strike from the lad.

 

Agree that Stevenage deserved it.

 

I'm assuming you've watched FA Cup 3rd round day before. Plenty of better teams than ours have come up against a lower team and had a tight game where they've looked shit.

 

To be honest, it breathes a bit of fresh air into a soulless corporate Sky Sports driven sport. If it wasn't us I would have loved  it. Gutted it was us, but it doesn't mean that our chances of survival are less, or that our squad is automatically shit. As things stand, I would rather have beat West Ham 5 - 0, and lost 3 -1 today, than the other way round.

 

 

Of course I've watched round 3 before - what's that got to do with your shite points in your opening paragraph of the original post?

There were 4 points in my opening paragraph. The first 3 were factually correct. The last one is open to debate, and perhaps you're right, it was a great strike, in the same way Ronnie Radford's was. So I'll give you 3 -1.

The overall point of the post was I'm not going to overreact. It was a typical cup tie, which we all would have loved if it wasn't us. Arsenal were relatively equally as shit against Leeds today until the last few minutes. Doesn't mean Wenger is a shit manager, or that they won't be challenging for the title next week.

Typical cup tie. They fluke a first goal. We're chasing the game, and then a hit and hope goes in.

 

There is always going to be a "big club" casualty in the 3rd round, where a good team has a terrible day, and the small team is really up for it. This year it was us. No reason to overreact, fair play to Stevenage.

 

It shouldn't reflect on the rest of the season, lets look forward to the Mackem match.

 

 

I'm sorry but that first line is bollocks.

 

Fluke first goal - aye, it was a deflection but you can't say they didn't deserve it nor that a goal wasn't coming.

 

We're chasing the game - err, did we?

 

Hit and hope - it was a very good strike from the lad.

 

Agree that Stevenage deserved it.

I'm assuming you've watched FA Cup 3rd round day before. Plenty of better teams than ours have come up against a lower team and had a tight game where they've looked shit.

To be honest, it breathes a bit of fresh air into a soulless corporate Sky Sports driven sport. If it wasn't us I would have loved  it. Gutted it was us, but it doesn't mean that our chances of survival are less, or that our squad is automatically shit. As things stand, I would rather have beat West Ham 5 - 0, and lost 3 -1 today, than the other way round.

Typical cup tie. They fluke a first goal. We're chasing the game, and then a hit and hope goes in.

There is always going to be a "big club" casualty in the 3rd round, where a good team has a terrible day, and the small team is really up for it. This year it was us. No reason to overreact, fair play to Stevenage.

It shouldn't reflect on the rest of the season, lets look forward to the Mackem match.

looking forward to motd now!

I think Football First with match choice is on Sky at 10.30 so you can watch extended highlights of this match only

More realistic is that we are trying to arrange sensible deals for Keane and Bentley, and 'Arry is saying no, but they might be willing to do a deal if Carroll was thrown into the picture. Testing our resolve to hang on to him

Not wanting to tempt fate, but we're probably just back at the level we were when Ashley took over - not quite good enough to make Europe, not quite bad enough to go down or seriously get caught up in the relegation scrap.

The difference is that we're on a sounder financial footing, and the composition of the squad is moving away from highly paid mercenaries, to decent committed players, and a bit of youth/potential. We still have highly paid players of course, but they tend to be on the pitch performing, rather than on the bench sitting out their contracts.

So if you take the emotion out of it and forget Ashley, I personally think as a club we are slightly better of than when he arrived, but miles away from where I hoped we would be when it was announced a billionnaire was taking over!

As others have said though, a lot depends on whether we can hold on to our performing on demand players - Carroll, Enrique, Colocinni, Barton - one thing that Ashley hasn't done yet is sell any star players under our noses. If we can keep top players despite Spuds etc. unsettling, and we start 2011/2012 with those players, then I'm optimistic. If we cash in, I'm less so.

Can only judge on 4 results, but 6 points from the last 4 games is a very good return, given who those games were against, and also the performance in the City game (ignoring the first 5 minutes).

Pick up 3 points against West Ham and it is going to take one hell of an injury crisis or capitulation for us to go down. Combine that with a couple of decent January signings (HBA being one), and realistically we're in at least as strong a position than we would have been if Hughton had stayed.

As soon as they justify it.

NUFC's problem has always been signing players on massive wages initially who have looked good in the past at other clubs, or who are unproven in the Premier League.

No problem with Ashley's policy of low wages for new signings, seems perfectly sensible until they have proven they are an asset to the team, and can cope with playing in front of 50,000 fans at home in the Premier League.

If they start to show promise, and consistent quality, then renew/improve straight-away, even if after 1 year of a 4 year deal. Man Utd and other clubs do this all of the time with their players - they reward the player with a better contract if they deserve it, and it keeps them happy and focused, and stops the agents trying to manufacture moves.

If Barton, Colo, Enrique go through this season and are vital parts of a first team squad that keeps us up, or even in the top 12, they should have their contracts renewed, at the current level, no questions. A club with the turnover and financial resources of NUFC should be able to offer a small selection of its most important first team players a £60K per week contract. It is when they start offering all of the average players who don't play regularly similar or better contracts when the problems start.

The problem is that many people want Ashley out, and there seems to be a general understanding that unless somebody gets £250m for Christmas, then the only realistic prospect of that happening is if his current £100m or so loss looks like being a £150m or £200m loss, so that he wants to get rid as quickly as possible. Which is why there is an understandable move to boycott, stop buying pies, stop going to games, create hostile atmospheres, lose more games at home etc. It is the only realistic way how people can get back at him and express their anger, by getting at his wallet.

The problem with that approach, is that it would probably work in the end if done properly.

The reason it would work is that as we have seen, this sort of shit tends to end one way - relegation. This time I am sure we would not be so lucky to keep enough top players to walk promotion. Take away the 40K plus crowds as well, and the match day income which supports the wages available for players and transfer fees, then all of a sudden we are Middlesboro/Sheff Wed. Another team where supporter interest has died, and hence income, with no new investment. The club would be worth less than half of what it is worth today. Ashley might then cut his losses, as he has felt pain in his pocket. The supporters will have finally won.

Hate is as we do, our interests are directly aligned with Ashleys. If the club starts losing vast amounts of income, it becomes less valuable, and Ashley will get out as quick as he can. However, we lose the club to the wastelands of english football for a generation.

So there lies the dilemma. Do we turn on the club, protest, boycott the games, try and force Ashley to sell by threatening the value of his asset. Or do we support the club, support the team, create a great atmosphere at games, and try our best to keep the club in the league. It's a difficult one.

I would love to be able to hurt Ashley, but it seems impossible to do it (legally) without hurting the club. I don't want to do the latter, and whilst we are a premier league club, then we always have the chance of a trophy investor coming in and buying us. So whilst I won't like it, I will continue to go to games, I won't buy any more or less beer and pies than I would otherwise do, and I will not boo the players, or even Alan Pardew.

Or that Pardew's targets were being sourced whilst Hughton was still in the job?

Will still support NUFC in the same way.

In the cold light of day nothing has really changed over the last week. The owner is still a maverick who could at any moment make a stupid decision, we still have the same playing squad, we still have the same financial resources available to spend in January, and our acquisition policy is still based in the main upon youth/loans, and we have a relatively unproven manager, and we will still get beaten by Liverpool.

The main difference I suppose is that the atmosphere at home games will be more hostile, but the team hasn't been playing well at home anyway, so it is not as if the supporter unrest is going to topple fortress St. James's.

The idea of not going to games in principle to hurt Ashley's pocket and watching it on TV is a bit daft. If all Newcastle fans cancelled Sky subscriptions then they would put less games on the TV, and hence less income. So why don't you do that as well?

Thought I better wait a day or two to let emotion subside before posting.

Interesting question - if Pardew comes in and we finish top half, does this mean that the replacement of Hughton before the transfer window opened was actually a good move?

I'm as gutted as everyone for the way Hughton has been treated, I was actually starting to enjoy supporting NUFC again, despite the nagging feeling that a couple of fantastic results were papering over the cracks of a wafer thin squad and a relegation battle ahead. Bottom line is though that I support NUFC and not Chris Hughton. If Pardew comfortably keeps us up or better, then surely it has to be seen as a good decision, or at the very least a neutral one?

I'm not saying I think he will by the way, more in vain hope trying to see this debacle in some sort of positive light.

This isn't directed at any comment in particular on this thread, but ever since I have watched NUFC the home crowd have always had one or two players who they just didn't get on with, regardless of performance. It usually starts with a bad run of form or a couple of mistakes, but once that happens, it is difficult to win the crowd back, they will generally be unforgiving of any further mistakes or performances, and will leap on that players back quicker than any other.

 

First noticed it with Kevin Scott (no worse than Brian Kilcline around the same time), and it happened to Sheedy, Sellars, Hooper, Darren Peacock, you could go on. The current incumbent seems to be Shola, and now that Nicky Butt has moved on, they are replaced with Smith and Nolan, despite both of those players playing a very large hand in the fact that we are currently sitting in the top half of the premier table, when just over a year ago many thought we were on course to "do a Leeds".

 

I'm not saying that players should be immune from criticism for poor performances, but it should probably be spread around a little more. Jonas has some absolute shockers and he gets away fairly lightly, as does Lovenkrands. Shola was hailed as our saviour this time last season, and through no fault of his own has reverted to being a joke again.

 

 

 

Smith is a dire, Championship level player as was Butt. Any criticisms levelled at either player over the last couple of years have been fully justified.

So by dire Championship player you mean he is one of the worst Championship players? Absolute bollocks. He is an average Premiership player, and I reckon every single team in the Championship would take him now without question.

This isn't directed at any comment in particular on this thread, but ever since I have watched NUFC the home crowd have always had one or two players who they just didn't get on with, regardless of performance. It usually starts with a bad run of form or a couple of mistakes, but once that happens, it is difficult to win the crowd back, they will generally be unforgiving of any further mistakes or performances, and will leap on that players back quicker than any other.

First noticed it with Kevin Scott (no worse than Brian Kilcline around the same time), and it happened to Sheedy, Sellars, Hooper, Darren Peacock, you could go on. The current incumbent seems to be Shola, and now that Nicky Butt has moved on, they are replaced with Smith and Nolan, despite both of those players playing a very large hand in the fact that we are currently sitting in the top half of the premier table, when just over a year ago many thought we were on course to "do a Leeds".

I'm not saying that players should be immune from criticism for poor performances, but it should probably be spread around a little more. Jonas has some absolute shockers and he gets away fairly lightly, as does Lovenkrands. Shola was hailed as our saviour this time last season, and through no fault of his own has reverted to being a joke again.

I really have no clue what he earns so this is just playing with numbers. If he had an average wage of around £15,000 per week for those 10 years, then we have paid him £7,800,000 so far. 

Which would be a very small fraction of what we have spent on proper utter utter shite players in the last 10 years.

Or alternatively, what we paid Michael Owen for a season and three months (most of which he would have been injured).

The Keane deal was based on Taylor going the other way.