James Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Le Tour starts in Monaco on Saturday is an interesting route. Won't be able to watch on Eurosport, but am going out to get a freeview box so I can watch the ITV coverage. Obviously eyes will be on Armstrong, but he's in his team as support for Contador, but a repeat of 1986 would be interesting. British interest will be on Cavendish, who is probably favourite to win the most stages, and he has a chance of being the first Brit to win Green in le Tour, but that might still be slightly early for him. Millar and Wiggins are both in good form too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TêteDeMaure Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Le Tour starts in Monaco on Saturday is an interesting route. Won't be able to watch on Eurosport, but am going out to get a freeview box so I can watch the ITV coverage. Obviously eyes will be on Armstrong, but he's in his team as support for Contador, but a repeat of 1986 would be interesting. British interest will be on Cavendish, who is probably favourite to win the most stages, and he has a chance of being the first Brit to win Green in le Tour, but that might still be slightly early for him. Millar and Wiggins are both in good form too. Bradley Wiggins! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 The rider line-up is also almost complete: Agritubel Full team confirmed: Maxime Bouet, Sylvain Calzati, Brice Feillu, Romain Feillu, Eduardo Gonzalo, David Le Lay, Geoffroy Lequatre, Christophe Moreau and Nicolas Vogondy. AG2R La Mondiale Full team confirmed: Jose-Luis Arrieta, Cyril Dessel, Hubert Dupont, Vladimir Efimkin, Stéphane Goubert, Lloyd Mondory, Rinaldo Nocentini, Christophe Riblon and Nicolas Roche. Astana Full team confirmed: Lance Armstrong, Alberto Contador, Andreas Klöden, Levi Leipheimer, Dmitriy Muravyev, Sergio Paulinho, Yaroslav Popovych, Gregory Rast and Haimar Zubeldia. BBox Bouygues Telecom Full team confirmed: Yukiya Arashiro, Pierrick Fedrigo, William Bonnet, Saïd Haddou, Laurent Lefèvre, Alexandre Pichot, Pierre Rolland, Thomas Voeckler and Yuriy Trofimov. Caisse d'Epargne Full team confirmed: David Arroyo, Rui Costa, Arnaud Coyot, Ivan Gutiérrez, Luis Pasamontes, Oscar Pereiro, José Joaquin Rojas, Luis León Sánchez and Rigoberto Uran. Cervélo TestTeam Full team confirmed: Inigo Cuesta, Volodymir Gustov, Heinrich Haussler, Thor Hushovd, Andreas Klier, Brett Lancaster, José Angel Gomez Marchante, Hayden Roulston and Carlos Sastre. Cofidis Le Credit en Ligne Full team confirmed: Stéphane Augé, Samuel Dumoulin, Leonardo Duque, Bingen Fernandez, Christophe Kern, Sébastien Minard, Amaël Moinard, David Moncoutié and Rémi Pauriol. Team Columbia - HTC Full team confirmed: Mark Cavendish, Bernhard Eisel, Bert Grabsch, George Hincapie, Kim Kirchen, Tony Martin, Maxime Monfort, Mark Renshaw, Michael Rogers. Euskaltel - Euskadi Full team confirmed: Mikel Astarloza, Igor Antón, Rubén Pérez, Amets Txurruka, Egoi Martínez, Gorka Verdugo, Juan Jose Oroz, Koldo Fernández de Larrea and Alan Pérez. Française des Jeux Eight riders confirmed: Sandy Casar, Jérôme Coppel, Anthony Geslin, Yauheni Hutarovich, Sébastien Joly, Christophe Le Mével, Benoît Vaugrenard and Jussi Veikkanen. One rider to be selected from: Rémy Di Gregorio and Jérémy Roy. Garmin - Slipstream Full team confirmed: Julian Dean, Tyler Farrar, Ryder Hesjedal, Dan Martin, David Millar, Danny Pate, Christian Vande Velde, Bradley Wiggins and David Zabriskie Team Katusha Full team confirmed: Alexandre Botcharov, Joan Horrach, Mikhail Ignatiev, Sergei Ivanov, Vladimir Karpets, Danilo Napolitano, Filippo Pozzato, Nikolay Trusov and Stijn Vandenbergh. Lampre - NGC Full team confirmed: Alessandro Ballan, Marco Bandiera, Marzio Bruseghin, Angelo Furlan, David Loosli, Daniele Righi, Mauro Santambrogio, Marcin Sapa and Simon Spilak. Liquigas Full team confirmed: Daniele Bennati, Vincenzo Nibali, Franco Pellizotti, Roman Kreuziger, Fabio Sabatini, Alksandr Kuschynski, Alessandro Vanotti, Fredrik Willems and Brian Bach Vandborg. Team Milram Full team confirmed: Gerald Ciolek, Markus Fothen, Johannes Fröhlinger, Linus Gerdemann, Christian Knees, Niki Terpstra, Peter Velits, Fabian Wegmann and Peter Wrolich. Quick Step Full team confirmed: Carlos Barredo, Sylvain Chavanel, Steven De Jongh, Jérôme Pineau, Sébastien Rosseler, Matteo Tosatto and Jurgen Van de Walle (+ Tom Boonen or Allan Davis). Rabobank Full team confirmed: Stef Clement, Juan Antonio Flecha, Oscar Friere, Juan Manuel Garate, Robert Gesink, Denis Menchov, Grischa Niermann, Joost Posthuma and Laurens ten Dam. Team Saxo Bank Full team confirmed: Kurt-Asle Arvesen, Fabian Cancellara, Stuart O'Grady, Gustav Larsson, Andy Schleck, Fränk Schleck, Chris Anker Sørensen, Nicki Sørensen and Jens Voigt. Silence – Lotto Full team confirmed: Mickael Delage, Thomas Dekker, Cadel Evans, Sebastian Lang, Matthew Lloyd, Staf Scheirlinckx, Greg Van Avermaet, Jurgen Van den Broeck, Johan Vansummeren. Skil - Shimano Full team confirmed: Fumiyuki Beppu, Simon Geschke, Kenny Van Hummel, Jonathan Hivert, Kurt de Koen, Cyril Lemoine, Piet Rooijakkers and Albert Timmer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearer9 Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Would like to see them do a time trial again on the last stage, would be exciting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 I might listen to some Kraftwerk later actually. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowen Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 I'm discussing cheats in the football section and a tour de france thread pops up. How intruiging. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
polpolpol Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Well, here are my predictions for the tour. I suppose Contador will win it so long as nothing goes wrong, but I haven't put him in here because this is based on who I will be betting on, and he's such short odds it's not really worth backing him. (All odds (#s in brackets) are current betfair odds.) Top 3 Pellizotti (55): a bit of a strange one, but I think he'll have a go at doing a Rasmussen – going on a break on a mountain stage under the guise of looking for stage win / KoM points and hoping there is a miscalculation and that he can take some serious time on his unsuspecting rivals. I think Liquigas is the only team (apart form maybe Astana) that has the strength in numbers – ie enough climbers to sacrifice - to really reel in a break in the mountains. D Menchov (4.4) C Evans (2.72) Top 6 A Schleck (1.74): think he's one off day away from being top 3 material + time trialling not his best thing Kim Kirchen (6): will be able to follow wheels up hills and time trial well M Rogers (14): About time he put in a performance, will have good team support. Top 10 (odds are for top 6 place (can't find any top 10's)) D Millar (55): based on great Dauphine – think he can climb acceptably well at the moment, and I think Vandevelde will not be able to lead Garmin in last two weeks, so he might get the support. V Nibali (23): Liquigas' best chance? Luis Leon Sanchez (7.8) Efimkin (36): looked good last year, and will consider top 10 a real victory. Green Haussler (30): Cavendish will not go for the intermediates, just stage wins, and I think Haussler is the second best sprinter in the bunch, especially as he won't need a train like Bennati and Freire. Green jersey winners tend to be opportunists. Polka dot Millar (no price) or Pellizotti (26): Totally left-field, but I think Millar will be cut loose by Garmin once Vandelvelde chokes, and I can see him having a go at the mountain stages so longs as there is enough of a time gap for the peloton to et him go. Pellizotti is only going to the tour because he's in form and he's said all he is after are stages, which will be mountain stages. I think he'll be in all the breaks he can follow in the mountains. So should pick up intermediate and finishing line KoM points. White Loquvist (23): Because the odds on Schleck are too short if he has a lead from time trialling, he'll try and hang on. Team Liquigas (20): 3 real GC chances and Szmyd backing them up means they should do some damage on the mountain stages – they looked good in the Giro at controlling the race. Misc predictions Once it is clear he will not win, Armstrong will pull out. Miller will do something on Simpson day (the 25th) up the Ventoux Most likely drug busts: F Schleck, Kloden, Popovych, hopefully Armstrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 A.Schleck or Menchov for the win! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Thomas Dekker's failed a drugs test, so will be replaced by British rider Charles Wegelius. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keefaz Posted July 1, 2009 Share Posted July 1, 2009 Thomas Dekker's failed a drugs test, so will be replaced by British rider Charles Wegelius. They'll run out of replacements if they keep that up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Got to put this into context Keef. Cycling uses drugs tests that other sports stars and federations either won't use or are even protesting against. This drugs test involved taking blood and urine samples very regularly for each pro (at least once a month) since 2008. Scientists then look at how natural bodily chemicals within these sportsmen naturally fluctuate over time to show signs that a cyclist might be using a drug that hasn't been discovered by the testers yet. That isn't enough evidence to suspend, but it means that a rider becomes under investigation. In the case of Thomas Dekker, his blood count has gone down this year now he's on a new team, so they investigated by testing old samples for some new variants of EPO. The positive test came from an out of season test in December 2007. Football and Tennis are currently protesting against out of season testing, and there is no chance of them doing the more advanced stuff. So hence cyclists are getting caught because the cycling federations are trying to catch them. Thus cycling is actually the biggest success story against drugs in sport right now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newcastle Fan Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 The rider line-up is also almost complete: Caisse d'Epargne Full team confirmed: David Arroyo, Rui Costa, Arnaud Coyot, Ivan Gutiérrez, Luis Pasamontes, Oscar Pereiro, José Joaquin Rojas, Luis León Sánchez and Rigoberto Uran. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowen Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Got to put this into context Keef. Cyclists use drugs that other sports stars and federations either won't use or are even protesting against. This drugs test involved taking blood and urine samples very regularly for each pro (at least once a month) since 2008. Scientists then look at how natural bodily chemicals within these sportsmen naturally fluctuate over time to show signs that a cyclist might be using a drug that hasn't been discovered by the testers yet. That isn't enough evidence to suspend, but it means that a rider becomes under investigation. In the case of Thomas Dekker, his blood count has gone down this year now he's on a new team, so they investigated by testing old samples for some new variants of EPO. The positive test came from an out of season test in December 2007. Football and Tennis are currently protesting against out of season testing, and there is no chance of them doing the more advanced stuff. So hence cyclists are getting caught because the cycling federations are trying to catch them. Thus cycling is actually the biggest success story against drugs in sport right now. Fixed your second sentance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 any guesses on how many will be out due to drugs this time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
polpolpol Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 any guesses on how many will be out due to drugs this time? At least 95% of the peloton are 'doping' in some way: usually blood, probably HGH and Testosterone, a version of EPO too but probably not during the race - probably well before it to get maximum hematocrit values. The ones who get caught are usually the ones who get careless, by either using too much or using stuff which shows up too easily (such as Landis for the former, or Ricco the latter). Then you have riders who 'improve' too quickly (Kohl) and unbalance the hierarchy, or riders who are considered jerks (Dekker) that the peloton doesn't mind losing. I would guess about 10 will go out for something during the tour, and maybe another 10 after the tour from biological passport data, but there's no way anyone in the top 20 will be clean. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TêteDeMaure Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 any guesses on how many will be out due to drugs this time? At least 95% of the peloton are 'doping' in some way: usually blood, probably HGH and Testosterone, a version of EPO too but probably not during the race - probably well before it to get maximum hematocrit values. The ones who get caught are usually the ones who get careless, by either using too much or using stuff which shows up too easily (such as Landis for the former, or Ricco the latter). Then you have riders who 'improve' too quickly (Kohl) and unbalance the hierarchy, or riders who are considered jerks (Dekker) that the peloton doesn't mind losing. I would guess about 10 will go out for something during the tour, and maybe another 10 after the tour from biological passport data, but there's no way anyone in the top 20 will be clean. Wiggins has to be surely? Olympian and all that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
polpolpol Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 any guesses on how many will be out due to drugs this time? At least 95% of the peloton are 'doping' in some way: usually blood, probably HGH and Testosterone, a version of EPO too but probably not during the race - probably well before it to get maximum hematocrit values. The ones who get caught are usually the ones who get careless, by either using too much or using stuff which shows up too easily (such as Landis for the former, or Ricco the latter). Then you have riders who 'improve' too quickly (Kohl) and unbalance the hierarchy, or riders who are considered jerks (Dekker) that the peloton doesn't mind losing. I would guess about 10 will go out for something during the tour, and maybe another 10 after the tour from biological passport data, but there's no way anyone in the top 20 will be clean. Wiggins has to be surely? Olympian and all that. Not necessarily, or at least not as much as you might think. The 'worst' dopers are the guys who use things like EPO, a synthetic hormone which makes more red blood cells (more red blood cells = more oxygen to muscles) to help them get through long stages and over mountains; or those who use stimulants like testosterone (also a muscle booster) for the same reason. Wiggins is a time triallist which means his skill is to ride by himself in short stages, and Wiggins' speciality in this discipline is along the shortest of time trials. This is why he's a favourite for the 15k time trial on Saturday. Cycling is essentially physics – making something go in a line at the optimal speed – and the key to being a good time triallist is the best possible power output, which a is a combination of muscle force / weight. The whole oxygen thing is less important, although in a sport where the margins are so tight, it would still be a huge advantage to be blood doping. Wiggins could well be doing something on the muscular side, but cycling isn't about becoming as massive as possible, its about finding a perfect ratio, so it's unlikely that anyone would need to do a mega Ben Johnstone style steroid fest because, given the amount they train, they can basically pick their optimal size depending on their goals. Plus, Wiggins races for the Garmin team which is easily the most anti-doping team organisation in the tour. It is run by a guy who hates doping after he was forced to do it on Armstrong's team back in the 90's, and it would definitely not be organised on the same level that it is in a few other teams. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
T̻teDeMaure Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 any guesses on how many will be out due to drugs this time? At least 95% of the peloton are 'doping' in some way: usually blood, probably HGH and Testosterone, a version of EPO too but probably not during the race - probably well before it to get maximum hematocrit values. The ones who get caught are usually the ones who get careless, by either using too much or using stuff which shows up too easily (such as Landis for the former, or Ricco the latter). Then you have riders who 'improve' too quickly (Kohl) and unbalance the hierarchy, or riders who are considered jerks (Dekker) that the peloton doesn't mind losing. I would guess about 10 will go out for something during the tour, and maybe another 10 after the tour from biological passport data, but there's no way anyone in the top 20 will be clean. Wiggins has to be surely? Olympian and all that. Not necessarily, or at least not as much as you might think. The 'worst' dopers are the guys who use things like EPO, a synthetic hormone which makes more red blood cells (more red blood cells = more oxygen to muscles) to help them get through long stages and over mountains; or those who use stimulants like testosterone (also a muscle booster) for the same reason. Wiggins is a time triallist which means his skill is to ride by himself in short stages, and Wiggins' speciality in this discipline is along the shortest of time trials. This is why he's a favourite for the 15k time trial on Saturday. Cycling is essentially physics Рmaking something go in a line at the optimal speed Рand the key to being a good time triallist is the best possible power output, which a is a combination of muscle force / weight. The whole oxygen thing is less important, although in a sport where the margins are so tight, it would still be a huge advantage to be blood doping. Wiggins could well be doing something on the muscular side, but cycling isn't about becoming as massive as possible, its about finding a perfect ratio, so it's unlikely that anyone would need to do a mega Ben Johnstone style steroid fest because, given the amount they train, they can basically pick their optimal size depending on their goals. Plus, Wiggins races for the Garmin team which is easily the most anti-doping team organisation in the tour. It is run by a guy who hates doping after he was forced to do it on Armstrong's team back in the 90's, and it would definitely not be organised on the same level that it is in a few other teams. You certainly know your stuff Sir. I take it you are a cyclist? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Thor Hushovd to get that sprint shirt. You heard it here first. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted July 2, 2009 Share Posted July 2, 2009 Thor is a monster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 Enjoying todays timetrial so far, decent effort by Armstrong, Millar away now.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted July 4, 2009 Share Posted July 4, 2009 Cancellara won as expected, Wiggins did much better than I expected from the course and will now be favourite for yellow after the team time trial. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Looking like a sprint finish for today with Cav's team right at the front!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magpie Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Fucking pissed it!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 Yeah Cav is just too good Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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