Jump to content

Ivan Toney


Recommended Posts

One thing I will say is that the scouts must have seen something in him, and ultimately they've been vindicated. 

The same scouts have been taking pelters for recommending Joelinton, but that deal might have had very little to do with scouting, something altogether fishy about it. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Yelevats said:

Graeme Carr in hindsight was extremely consistent with his recommendations. 
 

Steve Nickson however 🤦🏻‍♂️

Carr had some blinding signings for sure and some dead rubbers (you can say that about most clubs though). I’m surprised Ashley didn’t bring him back into the fold full time, though I’m sure I read last year that he was still involved in an advisory role (not heard his name mentioned this year mind).

Presume the reason why Rafa wanted Carr gone as he obviously wanted full control, whilst Carr in the past had been in total control of all signings. Shame they couldn’t have worked together as Carr did bring in some decent signings as mentioned above. Carr is supposed to have a pretty stubborn and forceful presence and we know Rafa had that side also, so probably clashed quite a bit. I remember reading that Carr wasn’t impressed with some of Rafas’s choices before he left.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, et tu brute said:

Carr had some blinding signings for sure and some dead rubbers (you can say that about most clubs though). I’m surprised Ashley didn’t bring him back into the fold full time, though I’m sure I read last year that he was still involved in an advisory role (not heard his name mentioned this year mind).

Presume the reason why Rafa wanted Carr gone as he obviously wanted full control, whilst Carr in the past had been in total control of all signings. Shame they couldn’t have worked together as Carr did bring in some decent signings as mentioned above. Carr is supposed to have a pretty stubborn and forceful presence and we know Rafa had that side also, so probably clashed quite a bit. I remember reading that Carr wasn’t impressed with some of Rafas’s choices before he left.

Rafa was and is a hero to me however Carr maybe was right in his judgement of some of Rafa’s signings. He made some steady ones but he signed some duds. 
 

- Muto

- Hanley

- Lazaar

- Sels

- Murphy (big portion of the budget at the time)

I’m sure there’s more and equally positive signings too however it’s late 

Link to post
Share on other sites

The Muto one was a dud but Rafa was forced to shop in the bargain bin:

  • Joselu - £5mil
  • Muto - About £7mil I think
  • Rondon - Loan (and turned out to be a brilliant signing)

 

Then the next manager comes along and we immediately spunk £40mil on a striker

Link to post
Share on other sites

Murphy has turned out to be decent imo. I can see why Rafa thought he would be good too, he has a lot of tools in his locker it was just a case of him being able to use them. We simply don’t know how far down the list he was. Rafa had the likes of Bruno and Dias scouted and was quite desperate for Abraham. Imagine where we’d be if we had them three

Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Rafalove said:

Murphy has turned out to be decent imo. I can see why Rafa thought he would be good too, he has a lot of tools in his locker it was just a case of him being able to use them. We simply don’t know how far down the list he was. Rafa had the likes of Bruno and Dias scouted and was quite desperate for Abraham. Imagine where we’d be if we had them three

We (Ashley) with those players would be a 50-80m up after selling them that’s where ‘we’ would be had we signed them

Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

There isn't a manager in history who hasn't made shite signings as well as cracking ones. With Rafa one could focus on the Hanley, Sels and the Lazaar's, alternately one could focus on the Dubs, Rondon and Schar's

The caveat on all of Rafa's signings was Ashley's tightarseness, i doubt once was Rafa allowed to spend how he saw fit with a transfer fee and wage for a player, but always within a budget that restricted his want.

 

 

 

Edited by Bimpy474

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

The trouble with some of his signings was that he was simply getings bodies through the door rather than saving his limited budget to get a genuine talent or two in. Muto is the prime example, almost 10M and played half a dozen games in total. Sels was a disaster but at least we got the majority of the fee back for him and Hanley as well, we'll get nothing for Muto.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Beth said:

The trouble with some of his signings was that he was simply getings bodies through the door rather than saving his limited budget to get a genuine talent or two in. Muto is the prime example, almost 10M and played half a dozen games in total. Sels was a disaster but at least we got the majority of the fee back for him and Hanley as well, we'll get nothing for Muto.

 

Well he wasn't allowed to look for genuinely good players. 

 

10m for a striker is effectively nothing. 

 

 

Edited by AyeDubbleYoo

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 31/05/2021 at 15:30, Bimpy474 said:

There isn't a manager in history who hasn't made shite signings as well as cracking ones. With Rafa one could focus on the Hanley, Sels and the Lazaar's, alternately one could focus on the Dubs, Rondon and Schar's

The caveat on all of Rafa's signings was Ashley's tightarseness, i doubt once was Rafa allowed to spend how he saw fit with a transfer fee and wage for player, but always within a budget that restricted his want.

 

 

Some of Fergie's signings were beyond belief.

 

Eric Dejmba-Djemba, Kleberson, That portugeuse kid that looked 4 divisions out of his depth

Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, neesy111 said:

 

Some of Fergie's signings were beyond belief.

 

Eric Dejmba-Djemba, Kleberson, That portugeuse kid that looked 4 divisions out of his depth

Veron, Dong, Bellion, Tosic, Obertan, Owen, Diouf, Bebe, Poborsky…. All clubs, even the top ones, have shit signings to be fair. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Manxst said:

Veron, Dong, Bellion, Tosic, Obertan, Owen, Diouf, Bebe, Poborsky…. All clubs, even the top ones, have shit signings to be fair. 

Poborsky was OK for them from what I remember, every manage signs sum duds, law of averages. KK didn’t seem to sign many bad ones mind :smitten:

 

 

Edited by HTT II

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, jackyboy said:

Rafa did make some poor signings but I think they were 4th or 5th choice because of the money

He did, the sign of a good manager though is identifying the right players for the right roles/positions and Rafa strengthened us in that sense.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Rafa had next to nowt to spend so the margin for error was so minimal. I remember a Rafa quote, can't remember when, which said that managers tend only get 80% of their signings right. 

 

He still made mistakes though. Sels was terrible and that was from the window where he was allowed to bring in whoever he wanted. Lazaar, Barecca, Muto all poor signings too given how many minutes they've played. He was wrong in letting Mbabu go too, should've let Janmaat go and bring only Yedlin in to compete with Mbabu for that RB spot in the Championship season instead of bringing in Jesus Gamez who barely played.

Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

 

Well he wasn't allowed to look for genuinely good players. 

 

10m for a striker is effectively nothing. 

 

 

 

True, but would that 10M not have been better invested into improving the academy and facilities rather than on a squad filler?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Beth said:

True, but would that 10M not have been better invested into improving the academy and facilities rather than on a squad filler?


Maybe, not sure if that was an option. You can’t manage a PL football squad without trying to add somebody. 
 

Obviously Muto turned out to be a bad signing but the way the club is run on a shoestring is a massive factor. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, HaydnNUFC said:

Rafa had next to nowt to spend so the margin for error was so minimal. I remember a Rafa quote, can't remember when, which said that managers tend only get 80% of their signings right. 

 

He still made mistakes though. Sels was terrible and that was from the window where he was allowed to bring in whoever he wanted. Lazaar, Barecca, Muto all poor signings too given how many minutes they've played. He was wrong in letting Mbabu go too, should've let Janmaat go and bring only Yedlin in to compete with Mbabu for that RB spot in the Championship season instead of bringing in Jesus Gamez who barely played.

 

Mbabu was pretty much a perma crock when he was here, yes the talent was evident but it was in the balance as to whether he'd make it at a high level. He had to go back to the Swiss league to rebuilt his career, hardly a no brainer to keep him at the time.

 

We also don't know how much was left in the kitty at the end of the Championship summer, for all we know it was a choice of Gamez and Gayle or a different right back and no stirker. Didn't Janmaat make it pretty clear he wanted to leave once we went down?

Link to post
Share on other sites

The one thing I will say is that I trust Rafa 100% over any player signed, regardless of their cost. ability, reputation or potential. That is, for me, the most important factor when it comes to managers. More so I trust Rafa 100% to improve a player who he signs. Basically, with a Rafa, in Rafa I trust. Just a shame Ashley didn’t…

 

 

Edited by HTT II

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...