PIF and RB Sports & Media - Darren Eales to step down from CEO after being diagnosed with blood cancer.

[Rafalove]

It wouldn’t like, it would just take the right type of politician. We nearly had that in 2017 with Corbyn. Not to discount the way geo political events can change or snowball very quickly.

 

people always say “that could never happen”, and then it does. Ten years ago if you had said huge swathes of the north would vote Tory, you’d be told “no chance”. Same with Trump in 2015. The likes of Gordon Brown were equally dismissive of a potential financial collapse in early and mid 00’s.

 Same with Putin launching a full scale invasion of Ukraine.

 

these events can snowball out of nowhere.

[Dr.Spaceman]

19 minutes ago, Rafalove said:

It wouldn’t like, it would just take the right type of politician. We nearly had that in 2017 with Corbyn. Not to discount the way geo political events can change or snowball very quickly.

 

people always say “that could never happen”, and then it does. Ten years ago if you had said huge swathes of the north would vote Tory, you’d be told “no chance”. Same with Trump in 2015. The likes of Gordon Brown were equally dismissive of a potential financial collapse in early and mid 00’s.

 Same with Putin launching a full scale invasion of Ukraine.

 

these events can snowball out of nowhere.

 

Corbyn was nowhere near tbh, he had every man and their dog out to stop him and he fell at the first hurdle. The same thing will happen the next time anyone with morals tries to get into number 10. There's a hell of a lot to unravel if you want to start looking into things like the UK's relationship with the likes of Saudi, almost too much for it to be possible any time soon.

[Awaymag]

22 minutes ago, Rafalove said:

It wouldn’t like, it would just take the right type of politician. We nearly had that in 2017 with Corbyn. Not to discount the way geo political events can change or snowball very quickly.

 

people always say “that could never happen”, and then it does. Ten years ago if you had said huge swathes of the north would vote Tory, you’d be told “no chance”. Same with Trump in 2015. The likes of Gordon Brown were equally dismissive of a potential financial collapse in early and mid 00’s.

 Same with Putin launching a full scale invasion of Ukraine.

 

these events can snowball out of nowhere.

that's it then....pack up NUFC as at some point St James Park will be a lava pit.    I aint waiting around for that, getting me all invested in the club again and they knew fine well, that the gallowgate was a raging inferno just waiting to happen.   Bastards the lot of them!

[Guest HTT II]

43 minutes ago, Rafalove said:

It wouldn’t like, it would just take the right type of politician. We nearly had that in 2017 with Corbyn. Not to discount the way geo political events can change or snowball very quickly.

 

people always say “that could never happen”, and then it does. Ten years ago if you had said huge swathes of the north would vote Tory, you’d be told “no chance”. Same with Trump in 2015. The likes of Gordon Brown were equally dismissive of a potential financial collapse in early and mid 00’s.

 Same with Putin launching a full scale invasion of Ukraine.

 

these events can snowball out of nowhere.

Boris may be the PM, but he doesn’t make the rules/decisions/decides what’s what… there is not one single reason why our country would sanction PIF and sack off SA as an ally, not now or ever. Not one. People can bemoan their human atrocities and ask questions of their ownership of NUFC all they like, and til the cows come home, but they ain’t selling up, getting sanctioned or removed as some new PL moral crusade against dodgy owners, it’s too far gone for that. Bear in mind the FA and PL didn’t force Abramovic out, our government did and even then it was all about being seen to be doing something…

[Guest HTT II]

48 minutes ago, Rafalove said:

It wouldn’t like, it would just take the right type of politician. We nearly had that in 2017 with Corbyn. Not to discount the way geo political events can change or snowball very quickly.

 

people always say “that could never happen”, and then it does. Ten years ago if you had said huge swathes of the north would vote Tory, you’d be told “no chance”. Same with Trump in 2015. The likes of Gordon Brown were equally dismissive of a potential financial collapse in early and mid 00’s.

 Same with Putin launching a full scale invasion of Ukraine.

 

these events can snowball out of nowhere.

The North has always voted Tory, it’s not some massive Labour strong hold, it’s mainly favoured Labour is all. Putin and Russia have never been an ally, they are deemed as the bad guys of Europe and always have been, even in WW2 we fought Germany, but favoured them over the Red Army. Saudi Arabia are our allies in the ME, they invest hundreds of billions here in our economy, PIF have shares in lots of our companies and globally from Uber to Disney to our very own football club, how do you sanction a legitimate business? We supply arms to them, are in a coalition with them against deemed enemies of the ME and with it the West. Honestly, it would take something unimaginable for our nation to sanction theirs, for the likes of PIF to be barred from trading/doing business in the U.K. and owning a football club. The Ukraine situation is something our nation and others will happily allow to play out and pretend to care about what’s happening, because really, they want a weakened Russia and sanctioning the likes of Abramovic is easier than hauling Putin over the coals and it also serves the self interests of others who are too weak or just can’t go after the real bad guys because they themselves are also the bad guys.

[Darth Crooks]

I think people are suffering a little from normalcy paradox a little. Yes there has been relative stability based on decades old ties with the ME but we’re dealing with a leader who has his own family under house arrest and radicalist versions of Islam either supported actively or exported within the region - seemingly desperate to diversify away from oil ahead of a massive climate reckoning and struggles for global resources. I wouldn’t like to say what would happen for certain as it would be folly one way or the other but it’s not fertile ground for even short term stability.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Darth Crooks

[Darth Crooks]

That said how we and and impotent government and political system react to all that is another conversation entirely.

[wyn davies]

Would hate to going back to the Westwood's of this world, also not enough owners with big money to run clubs, premier league well out of the reach of run of the mill owners

[madras]

3 minutes ago, wyn davies said:

Would hate to going back to the Westwood's of this world, also not enough owners with big money to run clubs, premier league well out of the reach of run of the mill owners

So the clubs would have to be run on a more sustainable footing ? I see nowt wrong there.

[macphisto]

2 hours ago, Rafalove said:

 

How can you be so confident?

Because Iran is the common enemy.

[Khalidao]

8 minutes ago, Darth Crooks said:

I think people are suffering a little from normalcy paradox a little. Yes there has been relative stability based on decades old ties with the ME but we’re dealing with a leader who has his own family under house arrest and radicalist versions of Islam either supported actively or exported within the region - seemingly desperate to diversify away from oil ahead of a massive climate reckoning and struggles for global resources. I wouldn’t like to say what would happen for certain as it would be folly one way or the other but it’s not fertile ground for even short term stability.

 

 

 

 

Imagine thinking MBS is supporting radical versions of Islam... lol

 

[Darth Crooks]

I don’t or don’t know for sure. But I know it’s there. That post was all about lack of certainty.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Darth Crooks

[macphisto]

2 hours ago, Rafalove said:

It wouldn’t like, it would just take the right type of politician. We nearly had that in 2017 with Corbyn. Not to discount the way geo political events can change or snowball very quickly.

 

people always say “that could never happen”, and then it does. Ten years ago if you had said huge swathes of the north would vote Tory, you’d be told “no chance”. Same with Trump in 2015. The likes of Gordon Brown were equally dismissive of a potential financial collapse in early and mid 00’s.

 Same with Putin launching a full scale invasion of Ukraine.

 

these events can snowball out of nowhere.

I doubt Corbyn would go against UNITE trade union who are well represented at BAE systems.

 

Difficult to be definite but a lot people could have forecasted that a politician like Corbyn would never be accepted by Northern working class communities.

 

Obviously, things can change but that applies to relations with almost all countries so I wouldn't worry about it.

[Khalidao]

Just now, Darth Crooks said:

I don’t. But I know it’s there. That post was all about lack of certainty.

 

MBS is considered as an "anti-christ" by both radical Sunni and Shiite islamists around the world.

[Darth Crooks]

I defer to knowledge on matters Islamic old chum but there’s a lot more to that post than that. The crux of it was about growing global instability. I know that having leaders with family conflict in absolute monarchies at ideological odds with theocratic critics is fertile ground for revolution or a least civil unrest.

[Rafalove]

7 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

MBS is considered as an "anti-christ" by both radical Sunni and Shiite islamists around the world.

 

This is interesting. Can you elaborate?

Saudi is the most Conservatively Muslim country is it not? I get that Saudi have liberalised a lot but it still seems quite conservative?

[Khalidao]

1 minute ago, Rafalove said:

 

This is interesting. Can you elaborate?

Saudi is the most Conservatively Muslim country is it not? I get that Saudi have liberalised a lot but it still seems quite conservative?

 

Of course it's quite conservative by western standards but if you go back pre-2017 you will be amazed how different Saudi Arabia was back then. Under MBS, Saudi started seeing things like this happening in Riyadh and Jeddah (just 80 km away from Mecca) on weekly basis...

 

 

 

[Newcastle Fan]

23 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

Imagine thinking MBS is supporting radical versions of Islam... lol

 

 

 

Stuff like this shows just how detached from reality a lot of people are about Saudi, "MBS supports radical version of islam" ffs, he's been the main person fighting against in recent times at personal risk and cost.

[Darth Crooks]

Except I never said that, I said he has his family under house arrest and there are forms of extreme Islam present and supported in the region/state. Imagined indeed. If you want to bat for MBS as an individual crack on but it wasn’t the crux of my point.

[Dr Jinx]

7 minutes ago, Rafalove said:

 

This is interesting. Can you elaborate?

Saudi is the most Conservatively Muslim country is it not? I get that Saudi have liberalised a lot but it still seems quite conservative?

 

King Salman is far more conservative and resistant to change, MBS since essentially taking over sees the bigger picture. They have stacks of cash, an oil supply which will eventually run out and a reputation like they are from the stone age.

 

And they are, or more like they have been. Modernisation won't happen overnight, certainly not quick enough for some journalists who are still sore about nufc being in the money now. The thing is, if they were to relax all the traditional rules too quickly, there would be chaos, it would make the regime seem weak etc. Hence 81 executions the other day. I'm sure the point has already been made, but where were the same journos when the United States have executed 12 people so far this year and will go on to 43 people for the year, so are they human rights activists or are they using anything they can to write bad press about the club.

 

China execute so many people they don't even record the numbers - nobody was asking Everton this when they came in.

 

I'm not trying to justify anything, I think capital punishment is abhorrent but the hypocrisy runs deep when it comes to the agenda against our club.

[Rafalove]

17 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

Of course it's quite conservative by western standards but if you go back pre-2017 you will be amazed how different Saudi Arabia was back then. Under MBS, Saudi started seeing things like this happening in Riyadh and Jeddah (just 80 km away from Mecca) on weekly basis...

 

 

 

 

 

Im aware there has been a period of liberalisation. What I am asking is how does modern Saudi rank against other Islamic countries. For example some of the things that are happening now in Saudi are things that have been happening in other Muslim countries for sometime, right? Saudi can’t be the only Muslim country with music festivals. Or that allows women to drive.

How liberal are MBS’ beliefs? What type of society do we see Saudi as in the long run. Could we for example see an end to executions? Perhaps an allowance for free speech? Democracy? Or something more resembling democracy? The right to protest? Will there be no more Jamal Kashoggi type killings?

[Khalidao]

10 minutes ago, Darth Crooks said:

Except I never said that, I said he has his family under house arrest and there are forms of extreme Islam present and supported in the region/state. Imagined indeed. If you want to bat for MBS as an individual crack on but it wasn’t the crux of my point.

 

What do you mean he has his family under house arrest? All +8000 of AlSaud family?

 

Those under house arrest (not many) are corrupted royals who stole billions over the past 3 decades. It was a very, very popular move by MBS among all Saudis. Lobbyists in the US however, who saw their usual payments by those corrupted individuals cut, hated it.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Khalidao

[Darth Crooks]

6 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

What do you mean he has his family under house arrest? All +8000 of AlSaud family?

 

Those under house arrest (not many) are corrupted royals who stole millions over the past 3 decades. It was a very, very popular move by MBS among all Saudis. Lobbyists in the US however, who saw their usual payments by those corrupted individuals cut, hated it.

I clearly don’t mean that as the first part and you know that based on your second point so I’d sooner not dance around with the pendantry of language choice and the art of rhetorical jousting via straw men. Explain corrupted royals to me in the context of Saudi and stole what from whom? We have a bit of a problem with corrupted royals in the UK for different reasons. ?

 

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Darth Crooks

[McCormick]

MBS has done wonders for finally improving women’s rights in KSA; he deserves a lot of credit for that as well as being (at least from what I’ve seen in Jeddah and Riyadh) the spearhead for a more “progressive” KSA.

 

There is, justifiably, a lot of criticism to be leveled at him but I’ve seen so many incredibly positive changes in the last 5 years in Saudi as a direct result of him coming into power. 

[Khalidao]

8 minutes ago, Darth Crooks said:

I clearly don’t mean that as the first part and you know that based on your second point so I’d sooner not dance around with the pendantry of language choice and the art of rhetorical jousting via straw men. Explain corrupted royals to me in the context of Saudi and stole what from whom? We have a bit of a problem with corrupted royals in the UK for different reasons. ?

 

 

Those under house arrest were royals who used their official status to steal from the government in many different ways. One popular way, was getting cheap government contracts for their own personal businesses, a few payed what they stole back and had the transfer ban lifted.