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BNP, Racism, etc


Beren
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These threads don't really prosper unless someone takes a controversial stand at the start I find.

 

 

Any takers? blueeek.gif

 

NE5 doesn't read the general chat over here. bluebigrazz.gif

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No need for antagonists, Parky! ;)

 

We need only to "discuss" what constitutes racism?

 

Prejudice? Prejudice that leads to discrimination? Are we all to a degree prejudice(/racist)?

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In the land of General Chat boards it is a core topic Ankdh and people regurgitate a lot of stuff they feel people expect them to say. bluesleep.gif

 

 

You see how I border on the controversial but don't quite cross the line? blueuhoh.gif

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In the land of General Chat boards it is a core topic Ankdh and people regurgitate a lot of stuff they feel people expect them to say. bluesleep.gif

 

 

You see how I border on the controversial but don't quite cross the line? blueuhoh.gif

 

Chicken, Parkfly?

 

;)

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In the land of General Chat boards it is a core topic Ankdh and people regurgitate a lot of stuff they feel people expect them to say. bluesleep.gif

 

 

You see how I border on the controversial but don't quite cross the line? blueuhoh.gif

 

Like a seasoned expert. bluecool.gif

 

It is a rather strange one though. Humans aren't equal. Gender, race, genetics - we're all different. Are we striving for the hopeless concept of equality in vain? Unless we evolve into a creature that is barely passable as organic, and are indeed more synthetic than anything else, is equality even possible?

 

All this effort for an unworthy dream? Sounds like an American Dream, really.  head_hurts_kr.gif  whistling.gif

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What if the statistics did show what he believes to be justified?

 

I'd suppose the statistics won't exist for obvious reasons, but if it were true, that black kids from single parent families are more likely to go into crime/lower standard of job than a white kid from the same family situation, would he have a point? Would it still be racist?

 

And if he has a point, is he merely directing us to the wrong solution, when the situation could be better improved by improving help and education to said group of people.

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In the land of General Chat boards it is a core topic Ankdh and people regurgitate a lot of stuff they feel people expect them to say. bluesleep.gif

 

 

You see how I border on the controversial but don't quite cross the line? blueuhoh.gif

 

Like a seasoned expert. bluecool.gif

 

It is a rather strange one though. Humans aren't equal. Gender, race, genetics - we're all different. Are we striving for the hopeless concept of equality in vain? Unless we evolve into a creature that is barely passable as organic, and are indeed more synthetic than anything else, is equality even possible?

 

All this effort for an unworthy dream? Sounds like an American Dream, really.  head_hurts_kr.gif  whistling.gif

 

It's equality of opportunity that we need - ie best man/woman/etc for the job gets the job etc - what we don't need is positive discrimination, which is just a misnomer. Discrimination should only be conducted based upon ability/talent/etc, not race/religion/sex/etc, unless those attributes are relevant.

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I'm all for celebrating differances.

 

Even if the implications are detrimental to a certain group? For example, women's pay/success in the workplace is inhibited by the notion that they will at a certain age want to have children and leave work. Whilst this won't be true of all women, it may be of some. How would you celebrate this difference? Should employers discriminate by promoting men ahead of women when faced with this immutable reality [evolution of humans allowing males to give birth, aside]?

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What if the statistics did show what he believes to be justified?

 

I'd suppose the statistics won't exist for obvious reasons, but if it were true, that black kids from single parent families are more likely to go into crime/lower standard of job than a white kid from the same family situation, would he have a point? Would it still be racist?

 

And if he has a point, is he merely directing us to the wrong solution, when the situation could be better improved by improving help and education to said group of people.

 

Statistics can be spun to proove almost anything.

 

No two people live the same life and have the same influences upon them, therefore any study of something like that could easily lead to a flawed conclusion.

 

Politicians love statistics because they provide easily, one-size-fits-all "answers" to complex and difficult problems, which they don't want to really tackle.

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I think basically we need to stop getting so wound up with racism, just treat it with contempt and try and educate the runts.  We need to stop treating it as a crime, otherwise we're getting nowhere.  It's not a crime, it's just an extreme view.

 

Is there really anything more racist between saying all scousers will be murderers, or all black people?  I don't think there is.  But then I don't think racism is the terrible thing everyone goes on about.  It's just another person's opinion, let them have it.  We always pick an choose what's racist, and what's not. 

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What if the statistics did show what he believes to be justified?

 

I'd suppose the statistics won't exist for obvious reasons, but if it were true, that black kids from single parent families are more likely to go into crime/lower standard of job than a white kid from the same family situation, would he have a point? Would it still be racist?

 

And if he has a point, is he merely directing us to the wrong solution, when the situation could be better improved by improving help and education to said group of people.

 

Statistics can be spun to proove almost anything.

 

No two people live the same life and have the same influences upon them, therefore any study of something like that could easily lead to a flawed conclusion.

 

Politicians love statistics because they provide easily, one-size-fits-all "answers" to complex and difficult problems, which they don't want to really tackle.

 

I'm by no means defending politicians, but could not statistics be worthwhile explicitly acting as generalizations, so long as they don't act under false pretence, in certain circumstances?

 

E.g Homocide has increased xyz% in _____.

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I think basically we need to stop getting so wound up with racism, just treat it with contempt and try and educate the runts.  We need to stop treating it as a crime, otherwise we're getting nowhere.  It's not a crime, it's just an extreme view.

 

Is there really anything more racist between saying all scousers will be murderers, or all black people?  I don't think there is.  But then I don't think racism is the terrible thing everyone goes on about.  It's just another person's opinion, let them have it.  We always pick an choose what's racist, and what's not. 

 

People should be allowed to think and say whatever they want openly without fear of prosecution, that's not the same as saying people should be allowed to do whatever they want, if it affects others.

 

Restrict actions, but set thoughts free.

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Ankdh,

What I mean by differances is that we should celebrate and learn and accept there are racial and cultural differances. Not talking about jobs and such like.

 

Point taken. :)

 

All sub-text to my asking void, can you answer the question regarding work?

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I think basically we need to stop getting so wound up with racism, just treat it with contempt and try and educate the runts.  We need to stop treating it as a crime, otherwise we're getting nowhere.  It's not a crime, it's just an extreme view.

 

Is there really anything more racist between saying all scousers will be murderers, or all black people?  I don't think there is.  But then I don't think racism is the terrible thing everyone goes on about.  It's just another person's opinion, let them have it.  We always pick an choose what's racist, and what's not. 

 

People should be allowed to think and say whatever they want openly without fear of prosecution, that's not the same as saying people should be allowed to do whatever they want, if it affects others.

 

Restrict actions, but set thoughts free.

 

I don't think we're talking about actions here though, it is just thought.  A guy's PRIVATE phonecall, at that.  I'd love to hear what Blair said in his private phonecalls...

 

Distorting facts isn't just the game of the BNP, all parties do it.

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I think basically we need to stop getting so wound up with racism, just treat it with contempt and try and educate the runts. We need to stop treating it as a crime, otherwise we're getting nowhere. It's not a crime, it's just an extreme view.

 

Is there really anything more racist between saying all scousers will be murderers, or all black people? I don't think there is. But then I don't think racism is the terrible thing everyone goes on about. It's just another person's opinion, let them have it. We always pick an choose what's racist, and what's not.

 

People should be allowed to think and say whatever they want openly without fear of prosecution, that's not the same as saying people should be allowed to do whatever they want, if it affects others.

 

Restrict actions, but set thoughts free.

 

Relating to Machiavelli here, but do you not think that, realistically, thought will never stay confined to just thought, and not action, given human nature?

 

Or does the principle outweigh the terrorism/racism we experience? Just asking like. :)

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What if the statistics did show what he believes to be justified?

 

I'd suppose the statistics won't exist for obvious reasons, but if it were true, that black kids from single parent families are more likely to go into crime/lower standard of job than a white kid from the same family situation, would he have a point? Would it still be racist?

 

And if he has a point, is he merely directing us to the wrong solution, when the situation could be better improved by improving help and education to said group of people.

 

Statistics can be spun to proove almost anything.

 

No two people live the same life and have the same influences upon them, therefore any study of something like that could easily lead to a flawed conclusion.

 

Politicians love statistics because they provide easily, one-size-fits-all "answers" to complex and difficult problems, which they don't want to really tackle.

 

I'm by no means defending politicians, but could not statistics be worthwhile explicitly acting as generalizations, so long as they don't act under false pretence, in certain circumstances?

 

E.g Homocide has increased xyz% in _____.

 

Surely the important question is why? Not how much?

 

The number of murders is a meaningless figure, if you don't know anything else about it.

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