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SJP development plans that never happened/future development debate


Guest Howaythetoon

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Guest Howaythetoon

SJP the future: East Stand raised to L7

 

http://www.newcastle-online.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10201/sjp_future_eaststandraised.jpg

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Guest Howaythetoon

http://www.newcastle-online.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10201/sjp_future_eaststandraised1.jpg

 

This pic shows just how vast SJP would become if the East Stand was raised to L7, how much bigger and all consuming it would become from an inside view.

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I tried doing a more in depth 3D version looking in from the SJH Corner L7 where the away fans sit, to give an idea of how vast and expansive all 4 sides raised would look, but I couldn't get the composition right, will have another try as it looked quite good scalled down to hide all the seam lines ;)

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http://www.newcastle-online.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10201/sjp_future_eaststandraised1.jpg

 

This pic shows just how vast SJP would become if the East Stand was raised to L7, how much bigger and all consuming it would become from an inside view.

 

That looks immense, given that the East Stand holds 4,500 now, and The Milburn plus corners 22,000, that would mean our capacity would increase by 18,000, to 70,000.  Do we need it?  Course we fuckin do 99.5% of seats are full for every League game, meaning every week we are losing potential extra in come of maybe £500-800,000, which would be £15m - £18m a season, the value of Michael Owen (well the price we paid for Michael Owen).

 

Newcastle are the only club other than Manchester United, who have 70,000 people who are willing and able to watch football in this country (Arsenal struggled to fill 60,000, Liverpool can barely fill little Anfield, Chelsea - no chance, Tottenham see Liverpool), and I think we need an increase.  Unfortunately it won't happen at St James' unless some Scochwad, commits arson on them student flats on Leazes Terrace.

 

I remember one of the proposed schemes apart from The Leazes Park proposals, was a 75,000 seater stadium at Newburn Haugh, which would've been great for me because I live with 20 minutes walk, it would've worked as well because the A1 is right near by, as is the 21 bus stop.

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The grass wouldn't grow at all.

 

Dave - What's that got to do with "proposals for a new stadium that never happened", mate?

 

Mind you, am I allowed to say I agree with you and that the grass won't grow?

 

I didn't read most of the thread, I just looked at Grassroot's mock-ups and decided to comment. Whenever people say 'that looks great' i'm not sure i've ever seen anyone make the point that building those stands would mean there was little or no light or air movement getting onto the pitch. Considering the problems we've had before with a shit pitch it would be nigh-on impossible to maintain.

 

As I said, I agree with you, the grass wouldn't grow. Thing is, I'm not allowed to say that had we done what we should have done and relocated to a larger stadium for less money, it could have been designed from scratch in such a way that the grass would grow. It's actually an important point, the quality of the pitch is vital, as we've seen since SJP has been extended as it's cost us when it's been shit.

 

As TheOrder mentioned, we've got those big scaffolded lights on the go now. The pitch was better last season than I've seen it for years, I see no reason why it wouldn't remain the same if the stadium was extended again. Just put the lights on for longer on any given day, I suppose. Granted, it'll cost us more money, but Freddy knows what he's doing.

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The grass issue is as old as the stadium itself, we have always had problems with the grass. Towering stands block out the light, heat, cold, and other particles needed for grass, but new tecniques can replicate that, we have one already that heats the grass, as a result our pitch last season was for 90% in perfect condition.

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Does anyone have any side elevations of the Milburn? Ideally as a drawing like this pic here:

 

http://www.newcastle-online.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10201/normal_1990proposal1.jpg

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What about the air flow?

 

Easy, just tie a few tumble driers to the back of the stands, extend the air release pipes through into the playing surface, and bob's ya ma's brother.

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Guest Howaythetoon

Right I've removed all posts that descended into the usual "the board is crap/the board is great" diatribe (my own posts included) as this thread has nothing to do with that debate, a debate that had been debated to death. If people want to continue that debate, check this link: http://www.newcastle-online.com/nufcforum/index.php/topic,24330.0.html

 

If people want to debate past stadium development plans and future stadium development plans, then post away.

 

Please don't attempt to hijack this thread. If anyone has any issues with this, PM me.

 

Cheers

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http://www.newcastle-online.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10201/sjp_future_eaststandraised1.jpg

 

This pic shows just how vast SJP would become if the East Stand was raised to L7, how much bigger and all consuming it would become from an inside view.

 

That looks immense, given that the East Stand holds 4,500 now, and The Milburn plus corners 22,000, that would mean our capacity would increase by 18,000, to 70,000.  Do we need it?  Course we fuckin do 99.5% of seats are full for every League game, meaning every week we are losing potential extra in come of maybe £500-800,000, which would be £15m - £18m a season, the value of Michael Owen (well the price we paid for Michael Owen).

 

Aye, long term it would all pay for itself and then sum.

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Ok, I'll start the debate off again with 2 questions.....

 

1. Give me one reason why the club would not have benefited from movng to a new ground only a few minutes away from SJP that : 

a) would have cost less to build, meaning that over the following years more money in the coffers for players.

b) wouldn't need future expansion, again leaving more money in the coffers for players.

c) just so you understand, we're talking A LOT OF EXTRA MONEY in the coffers, not just a few bob.

 

Make the reason an intelligent one, not a stupid one like moving the ground 5 minutes away from where it is now would screw up the economy of the city, or a sentimental one like, " we've played at SJP for years so we can't move now ".

 

Cheers

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Ok, I'll start the debate off again with 2 questions.....

 

1. Give me one reason why the club would not have benefited from movng to a new ground only a few minutes away from SJP that : 

a) would have cost less to build, meaning that over the following years more money in the coffers for players.

b) wouldn't need future expansion, again leaving more money in the coffers for players.

c) just so you understand, we're talking A LOT OF EXTRA MONEY in the coffers, not just a few bob.

 

Make the reason an intelligent one, not a stupid one like moving the ground 5 minutes away from where it is now would screw up the economy of the city, or a sentimental one like, " we've played at SJP for years so we can't move now ".

 

Cheers

 

The club would have benefited from Castle Leazes, financially in terms of both income and savings, but today it's a moot point because we never did move which I'm glad, for sentimental and traditional reasons. That is my opinion, you disagree, I respect that. Please respect mine.

 

Cheers

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I can understand why some fans, quite a lot in fact, would not bat an eye lid if we did move from St. James' Park, but for me, SJP is Newcastle United, it's our home, our monument. In an age where tradition, history and roots are being traded like dollars, I value those properties more so than money or trophies.

 

That's just me though, that doesn't mean I have no ambition for my club or desire to see us compete with other clubs BTW, I do, I just believe in the club, not the people, the club, enough to believe we can challenge, we can be successful, without neglecting our history, traditions and roots.

 

I consider St. James' Park to be this club's greatest ever achievement and no trophy could ever top it. Trophies get handed back to the next winner, SJP is something tangible, something solid, something that will forever be ours.

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Ok, I'll start the debate off again with 2 questions.....

 

1. Give me one reason why the club would not have benefited from movng to a new ground only a few minutes away from SJP that : 

a) would have cost less to build, meaning that over the following years more money in the coffers for players.

b) wouldn't need future expansion, again leaving more money in the coffers for players.

c) just so you understand, we're talking A LOT OF EXTRA MONEY in the coffers, not just a few bob.

 

Make the reason an intelligent one, not a stupid one like moving the ground 5 minutes away from where it is now would screw up the economy of the city, or a sentimental one like, " we've played at SJP for years so we can't move now ".

 

Cheers

 

The club would have benefited from Castle Leazes, financially in terms of both income and savings, but today it's a moot point because we never did move which I'm glad, for sentimental and traditional reasons. That is my opinion, you disagree, I respect that. Please respect mine.

 

Cheers

 

Don't moan when we fall further behind the top teams due to having less revenue than them. Lots less revenue. Remember that you're happy we're at SJP for tradition and sentimental reasons, with all the limitations that brings with it. Keep in mind also that as those other clubs increase their revenue we'll be very dependant upon being lucky with a quality managerial appointment if we're to challenge them. In fact we'll have to find a Wenger MkII, not easy to find, you may agree. Fergie and Mourinho have achieved things at their clubs due to massive financial resources, wouldn't you agree? Good managers yes, but they've had massive financial backing. Wenger is a one-off imo, but that's what we need now.

 

BTW If it's such a moot point that we didn't move, why did you start the original thread about development plans that never happened?

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How long do you think it is possible for this to come about, or do you think it would take 80 years like it did the last time due to having shit directors ?

 

 

 

For what to come about?

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I can understand why some fans, quite a lot in fact, would not bat an eye lid if we did move from St. James' Park, but for me, SJP is Newcastle United, it's our home, our monument. In an age where tradition, history and roots are being traded like dollars, I value those properties more so than money or trophies.

 

That's just me though, that doesn't mean I have no ambition for my club or desire to see us compete with other clubs BTW, I do, I just believe in the club, not the people, the club, enough to believe we can challenge, we can be successful, without neglecting our history, traditions and roots.

 

I consider St. James' Park to be this club's greatest ever achievement and no trophy could ever top it. Trophies get handed back to the next winner, SJP is something tangible, something solid, something that will forever be ours.

 

The fact that we did not move to Castle Leazes, means we will never run at our potential until we have a bigger stadium, and also if other clubs join Arsenal and improve their grounds to larger than ours, we will be operating at a disadvantage to them.

 

Personally, I put maximising our potential way ahead of a further 5 minute walk to the ground on match days. Those that disagree and are happy to stay at SJP, there are 2 points.

 

1. If we had moved, you would be happy as a pig in shit, despite what you say now

2. Don't bother complaining when we lag behind other teams that may pull away from us ie Arsenal and Liverpool

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I can understand why some fans, quite a lot in fact, would not bat an eye lid if we did move from St. James' Park, but for me, SJP is Newcastle United, it's our home, our monument. In an age where tradition, history and roots are being traded like dollars, I value those properties more so than money or trophies.

 

That's just me though, that doesn't mean I have no ambition for my club or desire to see us compete with other clubs BTW, I do, I just believe in the club, not the people, the club, enough to believe we can challenge, we can be successful, without neglecting our history, traditions and roots.

 

I consider St. James' Park to be this club's greatest ever achievement and no trophy could ever top it. Trophies get handed back to the next winner, SJP is something tangible, something solid, something that will forever be ours.

 

You think the subjects aren't linked, but in reality they can't be separated, not when you say the things you do. You claim you believe the ground to be the club's biggest achievement and yet you relentlessly slag the Board.

 

I think you're posting for effect.

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