Scouting overhaul?

[Baggio]

Yet more evidence of the mismanagement that has blighted this club, in the year 2007, to have no scouting system, is an absolute joke, seriously. There are clubs like Bolton who have had a scouting system in place for over 5 years now. It is things like this that fills me with zero hope for the future.

 

Which is why we should employ someone separate from the manager to take care of things like this, that way when the manager does leave someone will still be in place to run every other aspect of the club apart from the first team.

 

1 scout is a joke and just highlights that we're being run like the Worlds biggest pub team.

 

I'd rather have a manager that has the enterprise (and skills) to overhaul such a setup himself, personally like, ala Big Sam. Everything at a club must be of the direction of the manager, i.e. everything must be lead by the manager. A Chelsea fan I know reckons the fall-out between Mourinho and Abramovic is very real and not fabricated or overhyped and all down to the academy and scouting, Mourinho's responsibility for those things have been removed apparently, with your man Arnesen and others now in control and he ain't happy and rightly so. If a club is to have a vision, it has to come from the manager and be directed by him, not by some middleman hired because the manager isn't quite good enough to do the overhauling himself or doesn't have such an overall vision.

 

Even if we did appoint such a man, he'd be undermined to some extent anyway by the board who without saying it, are basically against any form of hands on approach by the manager or anyone else, which is why they dish out jobs for the boys and keep things in the family.

 

Depressing isn't it? God they need to go like. I made a post a few months ago about overhauling the scouting setup and while I imagined it to be bad based on knowledge gained and the obvious, I honestly didn't realise things were this bad, shocking really.

 

Things like this piss me off more than a defeat.

 

You can't expect a manager to do it all, what Allardyce has set up at Bolton is something that can be done at a club like that as he isn't under any real presure there, he's still only scouting average European leagues for players rather than top young talent like Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs and now Liverpool are. You're also banking on Freddie Shepherd employing a manager capable of setting up something like this as well as running the first team, judging by his last 2 appointments I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

The talk of Mourinho's fall out with Abramovich over Arnasen is the first I've heard of it and sounds like bullshit, most reports have it down to the signing of Shevchenko who Mourinho didn't want.

 

Mourinho does it all (or did depending on who you talk to), so does Fergie, Benitez and so has Wenger, and they are under far more pressure than anyone at Newcastle United will ever likely to be for the foreseeable future, so again, why can't a manager not put in place such systems here at United? Why a DOF?

 

As for Big Sam and Bolton, the pressure may be different but the job details are the same, yet he found time to overhaul Bolton's setup. Infact he drafted the blueprint in just 2 weeks from what I remember (he once spoke at great length on the John Barnes' Football show about it), he then went to his board and they gave it the green light, he then got in the required people and a few years later...

 

Again, I don't disagree with a DOF and you do make some really valid points, but I think you're so fixated on the idea it is like we must have a DOF. If I'm reading you wrong, let me know, but that's how it comes over as.

 

I'm open to it like, but I'd far rather have a top manager with the enterprise to do it all himself. Alas neither is going to happen at Newcastle though  :'(

 

I've said all along that we need someone on board apart from the manager who has knowledge of things like this, the clubs you've mentioned have some of the best managers in the World, we will never get that here so instead of saying "we need a top manager instead" we need to look at alternatives, you mention Wenger but most of his set up was put in place by Comolli who's now Director of Football at Spurs, I'm not sure what set up Liverpool has as they've only started looking at top foreign youngsters lately, Man Utd are in a league of their own and most of that is down to having the same man in charge for the last 20+ years, it makes you wonder why Kenyon didn't introduce a DOF/technical director at Man Utd.

 

Another thing that all these clubs have is a football man running the club rather than someone who hasn't got a clue about football but owns a large percentage of shares, this is a big advantage when it comes to releasing funds to bring in such set ups, I can't see Shepherd releasing £10 million to fund the purchase of 6 or 7 top youngsters when he could sign a big name player instead, he wouldn't even release £100,000 or whatever it was that Sir Bobby wanted for Prozone.

 

The whole set up of this club with the "Jobs for the boys" attitude is a joke.

[Martin Lol]

Yet more evidence of the mismanagement that has blighted this club, in the year 2007, to have no scouting system, is an absolute joke, seriously. There are clubs like Bolton who have had a scouting system in place for over 5 years now. It is things like this that fills me with zero hope for the future.

 

Which is why we should employ someone separate from the manager to take care of things like this, that way when the manager does leave someone will still be in place to run every other aspect of the club apart from the first team.

 

1 scout is a joke and just highlights that we're being run like the Worlds biggest pub team.

 

I'd rather have a manager that has the enterprise (and skills) to overhaul such a setup himself, personally like, ala Big Sam. Everything at a club must be of the direction of the manager, i.e. everything must be lead by the manager. A Chelsea fan I know reckons the fall-out between Mourinho and Abramovic is very real and not fabricated or overhyped and all down to the academy and scouting, Mourinho's responsibility for those things have been removed apparently, with your man Arnesen and others now in control and he ain't happy and rightly so. If a club is to have a vision, it has to come from the manager and be directed by him, not by some middleman hired because the manager isn't quite good enough to do the overhauling himself or doesn't have such an overall vision.

 

Even if we did appoint such a man, he'd be undermined to some extent anyway by the board who without saying it, are basically against any form of hands on approach by the manager or anyone else, which is why they dish out jobs for the boys and keep things in the family.

 

Depressing isn't it? God they need to go like. I made a post a few months ago about overhauling the scouting setup and while I imagined it to be bad based on knowledge gained and the obvious, I honestly didn't realise things were this bad, shocking really.

 

Things like this piss me off more than a defeat.

 

You can't expect a manager to do it all, what Allardyce has set up at Bolton is something that can be done at a club like that as he isn't under any real presure there, he's still only scouting average European leagues for players rather than top young talent like Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs and now Liverpool are. You're also banking on Freddie Shepherd employing a manager capable of setting up something like this as well as running the first team, judging by his last 2 appointments I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

The talk of Mourinho's fall out with Abramovich over Arnasen is the first I've heard of it and sounds like bullshit, most reports have it down to the signing of Shevchenko who Mourinho didn't want.

 

Mourinho does it all (or did depending on who you talk to), so does Fergie, Benitez and so has Wenger, and they are under far more pressure than anyone at Newcastle United will ever likely to be for the foreseeable future, so again, why can't a manager not put in place such systems here at United? Why a DOF?

 

As for Big Sam and Bolton, the pressure may be different but the job details are the same, yet he found time to overhaul Bolton's setup. Infact he drafted the blueprint in just 2 weeks from what I remember (he once spoke at great length on the John Barnes' Football show about it), he then went to his board and they gave it the green light, he then got in the required people and a few years later...

 

Again, I don't disagree with a DOF and you do make some really valid points, but I think you're so fixated on the idea it is like we must have a DOF. If I'm reading you wrong, let me know, but that's how it comes over as.

 

I'm open to it like, but I'd far rather have a top manager with the enterprise to do it all himself. Alas neither is going to happen at Newcastle though  :'(

 

They may retain the ultimate decision making on signing players, but they would have significantly more scouts and better scouting networks available to them than Newcastle.  The same applies to Big Sam, in your own words "he then got in the required people".  The  point is that SAF, Benitez, Wenger etc may retain the ultimate responsibility but have the personnel in that they trust completely.  SAF has his brother, Allardyce his son, Wenger tried to recruit Comolli back to Arsenal as Director of Development before DC opted for Spurs.  The only difference between that suggested position and DoF is that the final word remains with Wenger.

[Dinho lad]

We've had more pressing matters than employing scouts since he came. He's just got round to it now.

 

Rubbish. Roeder is not working alone at this football club!

[Mr. Slugworth]

Yet more evidence of the mismanagement that has blighted this club, in the year 2007, to have no scouting system, is an absolute joke, seriously. There are clubs like Bolton who have had a scouting system in place for over 5 years now. It is things like this that fills me with zero hope for the future.

 

Which is why we should employ someone separate from the manager to take care of things like this, that way when the manager does leave someone will still be in place to run every other aspect of the club apart from the first team.

 

1 scout is a joke and just highlights that we're being run like the Worlds biggest pub team.

 

It's a fair point, if true, but we're all so fucking negative on here, let's just think about what was said...  Just maybe, the new guy they're targeting is someone whose 'contacts' are other scouts, someone who could set this thing up, so that we'll have a network or scouts.  Might even be fucking Comolli!!

 

Plus, clubs don't just have 'full-time' scouts on the books, they'll call upon a worldwide network of 'freelance' scouts i.e. we'll pay you so much to scout this league/find us a decent left-back etc.  We need to get with the times!!

[Martin Lol]

Yet more evidence of the mismanagement that has blighted this club, in the year 2007, to have no scouting system, is an absolute joke, seriously. There are clubs like Bolton who have had a scouting system in place for over 5 years now. It is things like this that fills me with zero hope for the future.

 

Which is why we should employ someone separate from the manager to take care of things like this, that way when the manager does leave someone will still be in place to run every other aspect of the club apart from the first team.

 

1 scout is a joke and just highlights that we're being run like the Worlds biggest pub team.

 

It's a fair point, if true, but we're all so f****** negative on here, let's just think about what was said...  Just maybe, the new guy they're targeting is someone whose 'contacts' are other scouts, someone who could set this thing up, so that we'll have a network or scouts.  Might even be f****** Comolli!!

 

Plus, clubs don't just have 'full-time' scouts on the books, they'll call upon a worldwide network of 'freelance' scouts i.e. we'll pay you so much to scout this league/find us a decent left-back etc.  We need to get with the times!!

 

Christ I hope not!! :lol:  He's signed an improved contract so I think we're alright.

 

When Spurs were looking for a replacement for Arnesen, with input from Arnesen (!!), SGE and SBR, it apparently came down to a straight choice between Comolli and Ramón Rodríguez Verdejo (or Monchi), the Sporting Director at Sevilla.  He was keen to join the premiership with Spurs then and I can't think of a good reason for him to change his mind now.

 

As for Sevilla, the world now knows about the obvious treasures in their midst and will look to pillage the squad, nothing new for a club that has made a reputation for itself as an astute trader and great developer, turning healthy profits on the likes of Reyes, Sergio Ramos and Julio Baptista in the past few years.

 

Navas and Alves seem set to add to Sevilla’s shrewd work in the transfer market and training track.

 

The man credited with much of this is sporting director, Ramon Rodriguez Verdejo, responsible for reorganising the development structures when he arrived at the club in 2000, a policy that has reportedly seen almost 20 kids introduced to the first team in five years. As for his eye in the transfer market, Baptista left for seven times the value he arrived. Alves and Maresca were unknown when they arrived but would command a kings ransom if sold today.

 

Those that follow La Liga will know that Sevilla have been building towards this success over the past two seasons, finishing sixth on both occasions. This season, under new manager Juande Ramos, they are in fifth, three points off a Champions League qualification spot with one game in hand on fourth placed Osasuna. While its two remaining games are at home, they are against Barcelona and Real Madrid, two teams they are hoping to join in next year’s showpiece.

 

Anyone who witnessed their methodical demolition of Boro this morning would certainly hope to see them back on the European stage sooner rather than later.

 

http://roundballanalyst.blogspot.com/2006/05/sevilla-make-telling-mark.html

 

Team effort

Ramos sees himself as just another piece in the Sevilla puzzle. He took charge with the remit of continuing the fine job his predecessor Joaquín Caparrós had started and is quick to share praise with other members of the Sevilla staff. Nothing is left to chance. Ramón Rodríguez Verdejo, or 'Monchi', heads Sevilla's visionary scouting system and oversees the club's successful youth set-up; head psychologist Miguel Ángel Gómez has played a crucial role in establishing belief among the players while club dietician Antonio Escribano ensures they are in peak condition come kick-off. President José María del Nido, meanwhile, was the man who sparked Sevilla’s revolution.

 

http://www.uefa.com/magazine/news/kind=4/newsid=514618.html

 

I don't think anyone could convince me that Monchi's recruitment would in any way be a backwards step from the days of Roeder on his own!

[Guest Verlaine]

Yet more evidence of the mismanagement that has blighted this club, in the year 2007, to have no scouting system, is an absolute joke, seriously. There are clubs like Bolton who have had a scouting system in place for over 5 years now. It is things like this that fills me with zero hope for the future.

 

What, the fact that we're adressing it now makes you pessimistic?

[Mr. Slugworth]

In tonight's Ronnie Gill, Roeder tells us that Freddy has given him permission to recruit 6 more full time scouts (giving us 8 in total) and suggests that they are close to appointing someone in a major European city. Should have been done a long time ago tbh, but definately a step in the right direction! Encouraging.

[biggs]

In tonight's Ronnie Gill, Roeder tells us that Freddy has given him permission to recruit 6 more full time scouts (giving us 8 in total) and suggests that they are close to appointing someone in a major European city. Should have been done a long time ago tbh, but definately a step in the right direction! Encouraging.

yes fingers crossed that they have a proven track record of success 

[Martin Lol]

In tonight's Ronnie Gill, Roeder tells us that Freddy has given him permission to recruit 6 more full time scouts (giving us 8 in total) and suggests that they are close to appointing someone in a major European city. Should have been done a long time ago tbh, but definately a step in the right direction! Encouraging.

 

The truth indeed.

[Guest toon tone rudeboy]

The new scout:

 

http://us.movies1.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.com/images/hv/photo/movie_pix/touchstone_pictures/goal__the_dream_begins/stephen_dillane/goal1.jpg

[macbeth]

In tonight's Ronnie Gill, Roeder tells us that Freddy has given him permission to recruit 6 more full time scouts (giving us 8 in total) and suggests that they are close to appointing someone in a major European city. Should have been done a long time ago tbh, but definately a step in the right direction! Encouraging.

 

Edinburgh ?