Unbelievable

How can we be in talks with him if we aren't even close to meeting his club's valuation? Surely they wouldn't allow him to talk to us as that would weaken their hand substantially? There is nothing in those two tweets that suggests we are in talks with the player. NUFC are in talks with Norwich; Murphy and his agents are also in talks with Norwich. Ah right. First tweet is open to interpretation, but you may be right reading it again.

How can we be in talks with him if we aren't even close to meeting his club's valuation? Surely they wouldn't allow him to talk to us as that would weaken their hand substantially?

Bloody hell

So we first have to shift the deadwood before we can get tomorrow's dead wood? This is what you get when you refuse to spend the extra million for the likes of Aubameyang or Lacazette and revert to the likes of Mitrovic and Riviere instead.

Coincidentally and sadly, we've had a similar story going on in Holland, with a boy (Tijn Kolsteren) suffering from terminal brain cancer raising money for charity: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/24/terminally-ill-dutch-child-raises-2m-with-nail-painting-challenge Tijn has died aged 6 last night. Such a horrible, horrible disease.

Game of puns must end. Ok if you incest

Is he aware Sunderland have been relegated?

I see some people saying we spent 80m last summer, but looking at the fees involved it looks like it's more like 60m, and that's been entirely recpuped by the Sissoko and Wijnaldum sales. What am I missing?

Defoe has issued a statement confirming he's leaving for Bournemouth. What a day for them. What's next? Carver announced as new manager?

The Germans, having looked at the club's financial position in detail probably wanted Short to pay to take the club of his hands, rather than the other way around. Can't blame them, they're hamouraging money and it will only get worse.

I doubt Rafa caree much about how much players cost, just that he can strengthen the squad within the budget he's been given (and was reportedly happy with). It does seem though that he's having to fight others in positions of power over player valuations and ability. we don't know though do we? Rafa was proved wrong over Townsend, the board said no and got it right, plenty of time in truth and the price tag doesn't always mean success , no panic as yet from me , either way i'm looking forward being back in the big time It's not about being right or wrong about individual players though, it's about being given a responsibilty and a budget to do the best job possible and being given the freedom and trust to do the job without being second guessed or having to explain/defend your decisions and having them cancelled above your head. How do Charnley and co plan to evaluate Rafa's performance (in the wider remit of also being responsible for player recruitment) if they keep meddling in it? Will Rafa be allowed the players he thinks he needs, or has nothing changed at all in practice?

MA isn't working with him though is he? it's that f***ing tool Charnley, the non football man tasked with getting them over the line, good god. Maybe not directly (much), but undoubtedly he's getting fed back what's happening through Charnley and that new lawyer with his unknown remit (and previously Carr). He went from pushing around Pardew and McClaren to being told what's what by Rafa (by proxy or not). Can Ashley handle a strong character challenging him oublicly as the club's most visible figure? Not even adecade ago, when he was himself still ambitious and enthousiastic about owning us he most definitely couldn't.

I doubt Rafa cares much about how much players cost, just that he can strengthen the squad within the budget he's been given (and was reportedly happy with). It does seem though that he's having to fight others in positions of power over player valuations and ability.

I wonder what Ashley makes of working with Rafa. He's used to being surrounded by submissive nobody's kissing his bottom in appreciation of the fact they got a job they're completely unqualified for, and that he can push around at will. Rafa obviously doesn't fit that profile and presents a treath to the way he likes to operate. Wouldn't surprise me at all if he privately thought is more hassle than he's worth, especially now it's job done and we're back on the gravy train. Guess we'll find out this summer if anything has changed or not, because I doubt Rafa will put up with going into the season with a squad destined for relegation.

, especially the bit in bold.

I've defended him loads for his scouting record (and still believe he was hamstrung by Ashley being a cheapskate, i.e. some of his targets we missed out on for the sake of a million or two have gone on to prove themselves massively and triple or quadruple in price while we signed his n-th choice recommendation), but the right time to go was when he dared to suggest his good mate Steve McClaren as our manager. Deserved the boot for that alone, and the idiot who gave him the power to make it happen deserves far worse.

Make. It. Happen. Hang on, it's being linked to the consortium that have officially pulled out. Journalism

Exactly. In that article they seem to imply that another 100m or so a year for the next 6 seasons is required to compete at the top level, which is probably true enough if you want to be challenging for titles regularly. To do better than Ashley nowhere near that much investment would be required. Some football savy and not draining the club from some of its potential revenue growth areas would be a good start. Any penny invested from their own money would already elevate them over anything Ashley has put in since taking over, apart from adding to its debt to pay for his own mistakes. The club is financially strong and we have an excellent manager, so we have strong foundations to build on for somebody who knows what they're doing (which Ashley obviously doesn't).

If clearing the debt amounts to almost doubling it, aye he has cleared the debt.

Presumably the £90 million Short is looking for excludes outstanding external debt of £141 million (2016), which consists of £58 million owed to Short (Drumaville) and £83 million owed to Security Bank Corporation (SBC), the latter of which expires on 27 August 2019 and carries an interest rate of 7.5% plus LIBOR? Mind you, the asking price is less than the £101 million part of the debt Short has converted into equity in recent years (all numbers from a 2016 Swiss Ramble analysis). At first glance £90 million looks quite cheap for them, but you're probably looking at the best part of a quarter of a billion if you include their debt, and than there's the vast losses they will continue to incur year on year, even more so if they can't bounce straight back up, and the investment needed in their playing squad to turn their fortunes around. I expect most investors attracted by the reasonable asking price will run a mile when they dig a little deeper.

I like the thread title. Everybody can read into it what they want

Ado Den Haag. Their owner promised they would soon be challenging for top honours and has been legally charged by the club recently for failing to meet his end of the investment bargain. Seems very much a mixed bag. Still, I'd rather take a mixed bag than a downright crap one.