fredbob

Most said he was about an £8m player, £3m away from what we offered and £7m away for what Rennes want... Maybe its Rennes with the delusion?

good point It is a good point but i dont see too many players coming off the back of percieved stability now that Joe Kinnear is in charge 'full time'. In fact i dont think many players will have heard of Kinnear in the first place for them to be swayed by this news. Has there been any official statement yet? the point has nothing to do with players having heard of kinnear. it could be southgate or phil brown or tony pulis or any number of managers that foreign players will not have heard of. the point is when a player hears about interest from a club they are more likely to want to sign for a permanent manager who specifically wants them to come and has a longterm role for them in his side. if a manager is trying to sign them who is due to leave in a couple of months they're more likely to be reluctant, a new man will come in and the player won't be 'theirs', they'll have no pinpointed role for them and might not even want them at all. Good point. of course if we dont pay the going rate in fees and wages then it's all bollocks cos no-one is going to sign for us! Another good point! Stick to the basics. I hope they pull something out the bag to make me feel a bit better about the potential future with Keegan.

It's called hindsight. The fact that we were excited about it at the time certainly doesn't exempt it from being a failure. Especially considering that our excitement was mostly predicated on the assumptions that Joey Barton wouldn't go to prison and that Alan Smith was a footballer. whats your measurement for failure? I mean if we'd signed Henry, Lampard and ronaldihno that window and they all failed, would that make the window a failure in your eyes? Umm.... Yes? So a windows success or failure is based entirely on the completely unpredicatable nature of footballers? Surely there has to be some objective measure of a windows succes? Its a bit like saying appointing Wenger is only good appointment if he suceeds completely ignoring the merit of the appointment. The way i see it is that appointing Wenger will be a good appointment, full stop.

good point It is a good point but i dont see too many players coming off the back of percieved stability now that Joe Kinnear is in charge 'full time'. In fact i dont think many players will have heard of Kinnear in the first place for them to be swayed by this news. Has there been any official statement yet? the point has nothing to do with players having heard of kinnear. it could be southgate or phil brown or tony pulis or any number of managers that foreign players will not have heard of. the point is when a player hears about interest from a club they are more likely to want to sign for a permanent manager who specifically wants them to come and has a longterm role for them in his side. if a manager is trying to sign them who is due to leave in a couple of months they're more likely to be reluctant, a new man will come in and the player won't be 'theirs', they'll have no pinpointed role for them and might not even want them at all. Good point.

as I said, you have changed your server. In actual fact, why not ask people now, if they think Gartside is better than Shepherd, in fact, ask how many other chairmen anywhere have run better football clubs than Shepherd ? Where does this persecution delusion come from? You'll be telling us next that everybody appreciated having a team qualifying regularly for europe and didn't demand the fat bastard out and spent millions on new players almost every time the team lost a game. So whats your point? You want people to appreciate Shepherd? You want people to hold a candle to him? Is that your mission ? Most people recognise the good job he did, however they also recognise the bad job he did, imagine if he appointed Souness after Keegan? Would we be giving him the praise you think he deserves? Feel free to not reply to this directly. you've been watching too many yank movies fredbob. I think far too many people take far too much notice of Louise Taylor by the way, falling right into what she wants ........ You're having one there NE5. "Yank movie"?? What are you on about?? Since when has the word "mission"been an american word? Thought you wouldnt address the post bytheway!

good point It is a good point but i dont see too many players coming off the back of percieved stability now that Joe Kinnear is in charge 'full time'. In fact i dont think many players will have heard of Kinnear in the first place for them to be swayed by this news. Has there been any official statement yet?

Theres absolutely no excuse for this. If they havent realised by now the importance of making sure you get the right man to do the job in hand then theres no hope, not even if they sign the next 11 best players in the world. This is the single most important decision that the club have to make, a decision i havent seen made correctly in 5 years now. Souness Roeder Allardyce Keegan/Redknapp Kinnear/Venables Kinnear. I agree Fredbob. You just couldnt make it up. We can just cling on to the thought that the story isnt correct Im clinging as hard as possilbe. This is just inexcusable in my book, the only possilbe ray of light in this is that he's learnt a thing or 2 from his mate, Wenger.

as I said, you have changed your server. In actual fact, why not ask people now, if they think Gartside is better than Shepherd, in fact, ask how many other chairmen anywhere have run better football clubs than Shepherd ? Where does this persecution delusion come from? You'll be telling us next that everybody appreciated having a team qualifying regularly for europe and didn't demand the fat bastard out and spent millions on new players almost every time the team lost a game. So whats your point? You want people to appreciate Shepherd? You want people to hold a candle to him? Is that your mission? Most people recognise the good job he did, however they also recognise the bad job he did, imagine if he appointed Souness after Keegan? Would we be giving him the praise you think he deserves? Feel free to not reply to this directly.

Theres absolutely no excuse for this. If they havent realised by now the importance of making sure you get the right man to do the job in hand then theres no hope, not even if they sign the next 11 best players in the world. This is the single most important decision that the club have to make, a decision i havent seen made correctly in 5 years now. Souness Roeder Allardyce Keegan/Redknapp Kinnear/Venables Kinnear.

I can't believe people on this board pretend that they watch Rennes games. That's a daft thing to say really, you have no idea what anyone watches :S I dont understand where they watch it though? In fact i have no idea where people watch fringe players prem players, they're only on TV occasionally and surely you;d ned more than 2-3 full matches to gauge how good a player is. Match of the Day style highlights dont give a full show of what aplayers about either...

Mid table? Thats ambitious Is it? I thought it was pretty crap personally.

as I said, you have changed your server. In actual fact, why not ask people now, if they think Gartside is better than Shepherd, in fact, ask how many other chairmen anywhere have run better football clubs than Shepherd ? Where does this persecution delusion come from?

Fuck me what a fucking traversty, this is a ridiculous state of affairs if true. Truly embarrsessed, theres nothing worse than knowing the future of the club before its even happneded, this nails us on for mid table no matter how good our transfers policy is. what a truly unambitious appointment.

Theres got to be more to this bid, surely you wouldnt compare the player your after to one of the best midfielders in the world then say you've bid £5m for him?

So has the bid been rejected then? Ive heard that line a 1000 times, doesnt change a thing in my (eternally optimisitic) book.

Every single manager out there has signed a dud. Personaly ive never seen the issue with Jenas that a lot of others seem to, ive liked him as a player, good on the ball, tidy passer of the ball, doesnt give away the ball often, his major weakness is that he's not a great tackler and that he's got no outstanding qualities as a midfiedler aside from being a natural athlete.

It's called hindsight. The fact that we were excited about it at the time certainly doesn't exempt it from being a failure. Especially considering that our excitement was mostly predicated on the assumptions that Joey Barton wouldn't go to prison and that Alan Smith was a footballer. whats your measurement for failure? I mean if we'd signed Henry, Lampard and ronaldihno that window and they all failed, would that make the window a failure in your eyes?

Yes, yes it is.

This could backfire stupendously, on 2 front, one Kaka could be a massive flop like Shev, and 2, how hard is it gonna be for Mark Hughes to motivate his team when they all know that they'll be replaced at the end of the season no matter how well they play now. Kaka to sign for £107m then have a release clause should they go down or fail to re qualify for Europe next season.

I bet there wage bill was high.

it isn't me who think the club should be run with similar ambitions to that of the likes of Bolton So why are you citing them in your comparisons?

Arent we supposed to be acting like a big clb NE5? If so then why are you looking at Bolton to score brownie points for Mr Shepherd?

You only have to look at our CB's to see that you can get shite (Colo) for huge £££'s & a good centre back for less than £2 million (Bassong). But the clubs that win stuff show you have to spend big to compete. thats it in a nutshell. So difficult to comprehend for some, but so basic. The only team in the top 5 who have 2 proven world class centre half parnterships before they were signed were Chelsea with Carvhallo and Terry, what does that say about spending big to compete? Liverpool Carragher Hyypia Man U Ferdinand Vidic Chelsea Terry Carvahllo/Alex Arsenal Gallas Toure Villa Laursen Davies Stop turning this winning lark into such a simple equation its not. Sure it helps, but the evidence suggests that it helps as much as being frugal with your money and finding your gems. The real key is finding the rght manager to put it all together, something we've failed to do now for 5 years. As for Colo "being shit" i beg to differ, he's had some very iffy moments ill give but he's definitely not allowed his value to slip. I'm not sure where you found that Spence quote, but he;s done it again, well done Spence, you've managed to write so much but so little in a post yet again, in fact you've even managed to contradict yourself in the same sentence. Thats no mean feat. Spending big = success, good players but in the very same sentence Spending big on Colo = shit player. Make up your mind. So Chelsea, Manu, Liverpool have spent all that money when there has been no need to ? Do you think their managers will be sacked for their gross incompetence ? Nope but they've got into a position where they can look to spend big money. If we went out and spent £30m on a centre half right now, id go apoplectic. Do you know why? If you read my post you'll see that i said that being frugal and searching for the gems is equally important as buying big. Bolded in case you miss it the second time round. Do you disagree with that? you've changed your stance somewhat. I actually havent, but you have by the looks of this post. What is it you think I've changed? just before the January window last year you insisted the club shouldn't be wasting any money buying players because you were happy with where they were in the league. Thats not quite what i said, you know that. But if it gives you the minor victory that your little brain needs then have it. Still dont see the change in stance over the transfer policy that i advocate. Whereas yours has always we ned to spend big "its not rocket science etc", i see you conceded a little. My little brain will take that victory that it needs. I don't think so. We are in the shit, and Ashley has done what you and some others advocated, and has stuck to his "plan". I dont think his plan was to put the club up for sale after fans protests. Another thing the fans wanted and got but are complaining about. I called it at the time. The ironic thing is that those very fans who've caused some of the uncertainty we have now refuse to acknowledge that they had any influence over the matter. Well what was the point of protesting then?

You only have to look at our CB's to see that you can get shite (Colo) for huge £££'s & a good centre back for less than £2 million (Bassong). But the clubs that win stuff show you have to spend big to compete. thats it in a nutshell. So difficult to comprehend for some, but so basic. The only team in the top 5 who have 2 proven world class centre half parnterships before they were signed were Chelsea with Carvhallo and Terry, what does that say about spending big to compete? Liverpool Carragher Hyypia Man U Ferdinand Vidic Chelsea Terry Carvahllo/Alex Arsenal Gallas Toure Villa Laursen Davies Stop turning this winning lark into such a simple equation its not. Sure it helps, but the evidence suggests that it helps as much as being frugal with your money and finding your gems. The real key is finding the rght manager to put it all together, something we've failed to do now for 5 years. As for Colo "being shit" i beg to differ, he's had some very iffy moments ill give but he's definitely not allowed his value to slip. I'm not sure where you found that Spence quote, but he;s done it again, well done Spence, you've managed to write so much but so little in a post yet again, in fact you've even managed to contradict yourself in the same sentence. Thats no mean feat. Spending big = success, good players but in the very same sentence Spending big on Colo = shit player. Make up your mind. So Chelsea, Manu, Liverpool have spent all that money when there has been no need to ? Do you think their managers will be sacked for their gross incompetence ? Nope but they've got into a position where they can look to spend big money. If we went out and spent £30m on a centre half right now, id go apoplectic. Do you know why? If you read my post you'll see that i said that being frugal and searching for the gems is equally important as buying big. Bolded in case you miss it the second time round. Do you disagree with that? you've changed your stance somewhat. I actually havent, but you have by the looks of this post. What is it you think I've changed? just before the January window last year you insisted the club shouldn't be wasting any money buying players because you were happy with where they were in the league. Thats not quite what i said, you know that. But if it gives you the minor victory that your little brain needs then have it. Still dont see the change in stance over the transfer policy that i advocate. Whereas yours has always we ned to spend big "its not rocket science etc", i see you conceded a little. My little brain will take that victory that it needs.

But then people complain about the silence? Is there no one out there who mightbelieve that thisistheclubs reaction to the fans wanting more communication? I don't think we need to know exactly which player we've bid for and how much, that might be taking things too far. Anyway, I'm starting to think this is all a smokescreen, we are probably bidding on a totally different player. It makes no sense to get everyone's hopes up unless everything is more or less tied up. Does the club know this though? So you believe him when he says he's bid £5m? Maybe it isnt the game of checkers that everyone seems to think it is, i think the clubs been very clever with the way they've conducted transfers in the past, i see no reason why it should beany different now. That's just it...it is different to how they've done things. With Guttierez and Coloccini no one had a clue and the club kept their cards very close to their chest. Even when the modric bid was made, Mort who was the chairman kept his mouth shut until it was leaked from the Croatian end. That's what makes me think this is probably a smokescreen. But the statemnt they released after ht ekeegan debacle said he was not allowed to talk about transfers, now kinnear IS allowed, is there no possbility that they are allowing this as a reaction to some of the fan wanting more communication? Fans want more communication from the owner and his chairman, to tell us of their plans, hopes and expectations, I don't think it's expected that every transfer target should be publicised. If the policy of managers not being allowed to discuss transfer targets was there it was there for a reason. I don't see any reason that would be changed if it was in the club's interest. Which leads back to my original post, do the club know this? The fans wanted more commuication, and now they're getting it on an issue which was a contentiuos one over the summer. Im not saying that the club are being gracious to us or whatsoever, all im saying is that the fans havent got exactly what they want and they're complaining of the fact. I don't think the club are so stupid to assume the fans wanted JK blabbing about signings he hasn't made yet. If they want to communicate why doesn't Llambias open his mouth now and then? Wouldn't that be a better way to actually communicate? There's no reason to logically believe that that isnt what the fans want? Not logically, no.