Football : The Undiscovered country.

[Guest Knightrider]

It was only ever a fad for you anyway

 

Football is, NUFC has me for life now, the bastards.

[Keefaz]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

I agree in principle, but kids are naturally competitive. Divide any group of kids into two and you'll create an 'us vs them' mentality. They should be encouraged to play the game for fun, but they're usually going to want to win whether it be for personal pride or for the sake of the team.

[Guest Knightrider]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

I agree in principle, but kids are naturally competitive. Divide any group of kids into two and you'll create an 'us vs them' mentality. They should be encouraged to play the game for fun, but they're usually going to want to win whether it be for personal pride or for the sake of the team.

 

They can win their own games like I tried to do when I played singles or doubles, or gates. Take away adults from their game and that competitiveness and desire to win will still be there, only without any kind of pressure meaning no fear of failure, more freedom of expression and a greater love for the game. Not to mention a higher degree of skill and a much more rapid learning curve.

 

Kids go into a game wanting to win, but when they don't it matters because us adults have placed 3 points in their faces and put them under pressure to perform to move up that table.

 

Take away the adults and the 3 points and kids go into a game wanting to win, only after the match the result doesn't matter though.

 

A much healthier environment.

[Keefaz]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

I agree in principle, but kids are naturally competitive. Divide any group of kids into two and you'll create an 'us vs them' mentality. They should be encouraged to play the game for fun, but they're usually going to want to win whether it be for personal pride or for the sake of the team.

 

They can win their own games like I tried to do when I played singles or doubles, or gates. Take away adults from their game and that competitiveness and desire to win will still be there, only without any kind of pressure meaning no fear of failure, more freedom of expression and a greater love for the game. Not to mention a higher degree of skill and a much more rapid learning curve.

 

Kids go into a game wanting to win, but when they don't it matters because us adults have placed 3 points in their faces and put them under pressure to perform to move up that table.

 

Take away the adults and the 3 points and kids go into a game wanting to win, only after the match the result doesn't matter though.

 

A much healthier environment.

 

A good summary, grass. To play with a natural will to win, but without the massive pressure of 'avoiding defeat any cost'.

[Guest Knightrider]

I posted this on another forum which sums my thoughts up about kids and league football and all that:

 

The irony regarding winning and everything about it is that it is a natural occurrence anyway so doesn't need introduced, encouraged or made an issue of whatsoever.

 

Does anyone here honestly think that kids don't want to be the best, don't want to win or that losing means nothing to them? They are more competitive than us adults man, and at all age levels and skill levels too.

 

If you make an issue of winning and losing though you run the risk of striking a fear of failure into kids which is guaranteed to hinder development to the point where it can actually regress development.

 

Furthermore, a win at all costs mentality saps away at fun levels because it's a pressurised environment which is actually counter-productive because a relaxed environment is more likely to yield results and success while fun in itself leads to quicker learning rates.

 

This is why it amazes me that winning and losing is even a factor in kids' football because it goes against the grain of everything a coach, a team and a kid wants from football which is to have fun, develop further and to win.

 

If you provide a fun, relaxed environment and as a coach can improve kids' technique and whatever via coaching methods like say dribbling games or skills practice in the right way, then development and winning will occur naturally as a result.

 

Kids are the biggest sore losers in football, they hate losing and badly want to win. They are ultra competitive. But when they don't win or lose out, unlike the adults, they don't make a fuss of it and that is what we must protect because they are kids and don't need to feel bad about themselves or any kind of pressure whatsoever.

 

We must remember, football is a game, a hobby, a play activity for our kids. Winning and losing has no relevance whatsoever in their sport outside of the moment.

 

This is why I am against league football or competitive football for kids.

 

The answer to that is always "well kids want to win". They do yes, but can they not win a friendly game? Can they not win by scoring a goal? Can they not win by beating an opponent in a dribble or a race to the ball? Of course they can.

 

Only us as adults have added a whole new dimension of winning and losing, to the point where yes it does matter because you can go up or down a place, win a trophy, get relegated, win promotion. The stakes are high. The pressure is on. Can you handle it.

 

Well that's not on, there should be no winners and losers in kids football, they are all winners, if we would just let them be.

 

"If there is nothing to aim for, how can a kid achieve anything"?

 

What, a plastic cup? A plastic man of the match award? My nephew would swap all that for a hat-trick or a Zidane turn in his own half to evade 3 players, that to him is winning, that to him is being the best and achieving something. Something tangible and meaningful to HIM.

 

The fact that thousands of kids go home every weekend crying is tragic, all because they failed to pick up three points, or missed a penalty, or could only draw.

 

And what about those kids that win? I can only speak about my nephew here but when he comes home from football he doesn't talk about the win or loss or where the win or loss puts them in the table, he talks about what he did in the match or wished he had done or what he didn't do but will the next time.

 

Winning is important to kids, very important, but it's a fickle importance and is only important within the context of the actual match and that's the way it should always be, just like when I was a kid I hated losing a game of singles and tried my best to win all my games. Did I go home and cry about it afterwards though or give it a moments thought on the way home? No, school, football stickers, Newcastle United, girls, everything dominated our thoughts.

 

For kids where winning and losing is an issue, after their matches they go home unhappy, sometimes with a berating still ringing in their ears from mum, dad or the coach, or from themselves such is the pressure they feel under, these kids don't enjoy the game, they see it as a job. They will eventually stop developing and even drop out of the sport altogether. They'll soon find a new job.

 

Winning is important to kids, but it's more important to adults, hence competitive football. Yet ironically, pit a kid against another kid in any setting and competitiveness is alive and kicking. Do we need to throw in points to spice things up more? No we don't, we do it to justify our own involvement in the sport because we as adults, we measure everything by results, success and failure. Especially ourselves.

 

Kids don't.

[Parky]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

I agree in principle, but kids are naturally competitive. Divide any group of kids into two and you'll create an 'us vs them' mentality. They should be encouraged to play the game for fun, but they're usually going to want to win whether it be for personal pride or for the sake of the team.

 

They can win their own games like I tried to do when I played singles or doubles, or gates. Take away adults from their game and that competitiveness and desire to win will still be there, only without any kind of pressure meaning no fear of failure, more freedom of expression and a greater love for the game. Not to mention a higher degree of skill and a much more rapid learning curve.

 

Kids go into a game wanting to win, but when they don't it matters because us adults have placed 3 points in their faces and put them under pressure to perform to move up that table.

 

Take away the adults and the 3 points and kids go into a game wanting to win, only after the match the result doesn't matter though.

 

A much healthier environment.

 

A good summary, grass. To play with a natural will to win, but without the massive pressure of 'avoiding defeat any cost'.

 

....a message lost on SA perhaps?

[Parky]

It's something I've become aware of in Germany, like when I watch a French film with Mrs Parky....We've been watching ''Les Amants du Pont Neuf''...I've seen it a fair few times and after a brief discussion with her about it I've come back on here...She says the film is depressing, I say it's poetic. This is more or less what this thread is about.

 

 

...and Coach you must admire the Arsenal post-Wenger compared to the Arsenal pre-Wenger...Even the pre-Wenger Arsenal had space for Liam Brady.

 

Good football will nearly always (not always) triumph over containing and negative football. Yes there is always room for sides who don't have the resources to 'compete' with what they have....But that is not OUR destiny.

[Keefaz]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

I agree in principle, but kids are naturally competitive. Divide any group of kids into two and you'll create an 'us vs them' mentality. They should be encouraged to play the game for fun, but they're usually going to want to win whether it be for personal pride or for the sake of the team.

 

They can win their own games like I tried to do when I played singles or doubles, or gates. Take away adults from their game and that competitiveness and desire to win will still be there, only without any kind of pressure meaning no fear of failure, more freedom of expression and a greater love for the game. Not to mention a higher degree of skill and a much more rapid learning curve.

 

Kids go into a game wanting to win, but when they don't it matters because us adults have placed 3 points in their faces and put them under pressure to perform to move up that table.

 

Take away the adults and the 3 points and kids go into a game wanting to win, only after the match the result doesn't matter though.

 

A much healthier environment.

 

A good summary, grass. To play with a natural will to win, but without the massive pressure of 'avoiding defeat any cost'.

 

....a message lost on SA perhaps?

 

Well, quite, Parklington.

[Guest Knightrider]

I admire many things about Arsenal, but then I see them cheating, chasing down refs and other things that represent the ugly game to me which is such a shame given they are as close to the beautiful game theory in terms of football you could possibly get to. It's Brazilian football played at an English tempo. Magic.

[Keefaz]

It's something I've become aware of in Germany, like when I watch a French film with Mrs Parky....We've been watching ''Les Amants du Pont Neuf''...I've seen it a fair few times and after a brief discussion with her about it I've come back on here...She says the film is depressing, I say it's poetic. This is more or less what this thread is about.

 

 

...and Coach you must admire the Arsenal post-Wenger compared to the Arsenal pre-Wenger...Even the pre-Wenger Arsenal had space for Liam Brady.

 

Good football will nearly always (not always) triumph over containing and negative football. Yes there is always room for sides who don't have the resources to 'compete' with what they have....But that is not OUR destiny.

 

I was just about post something along these lines. Time has shown that the most successful--and popular--Newcastle sides have played attacking, fearless football. To me, it's suicide for a manager to come in and try to change that with their 'cat and mouse', 'game of chess' setups.

[danswan]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

So essentially, lock them in a cage with a ball.

 

I like it.

[Parky]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

Developing local football should be a source of pride for any community.

[Guest Knightrider]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

Developing local football should be a source of pride for any community.

 

Or allowing it to flourish naturally.

[Parky]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

Developing local football should be a source of pride for any community.

 

Or allowing it to flourish naturally.

 

...probably better as from what I'm aware coaching in England is on the whole shit. Based too much around formations and fitness.

[Guest Knightrider]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

 

Developing local football should be a source of pride for any community.

 

Or allowing it to flourish naturally.

 

...probably better as from what I'm aware coaching in England is on the whole shit. Based too much around formations and fitness.

 

It's not so much that it's shit, just that is it really needed? Too many cooks and all that...

[madras]

It's always been a myth. There is only one thing truly beautiful about football and that's that winning feeling. Everything else is plain ugly.

 

1 team is going to win the league....do you want mid table (hopefully) mediocrity playing the present hoof and percentage stuff or playing pass and go ?

[merlin]

Was it Cloughie who said 'It's not rocket science is it..'

 

I said a couple of months ago  Sam had his head so far into statistics now that he had forgotten the simple things. Need a Back to Basics campaign here, get the dossiers out.

 

Cloughie also said that 'Football is a simple game made complicated by buffoons..'

We are seeing the proof of that now....

[Guest Pie]

'Kids games' and 'caring about the result' as Keefas said.

Now therein those two phrases is the root cause of what is wrong with football in our country.

Kids should not have to care about the result.

If I had my way I would ban coaches, ban parents and put floodlit all weather fenced in vandal proof pitches on every housing estate with free balls supplied and just let them get on with it.

Jumpers for goalposts for the 3rd millenium if you like.

The money is in the game to do this,

Redistribute some of it away from the pockets of the elite few (and agents) at the top and back into grass roots.

Give it 10 years and you,d have more footballers for your winning teams to satisfy the coaches (for it is they who want the medals not the young kids).

Only then they can teach them to play their two touch football and the shift the ball quickly stuff after they have been left alone to develop the ball skills through the joy of playing for fun with their pals.

 

Sick to death of the greedy and misguided idiots ruining our game.

 

Doug.

Ajax seemed to do well with 'coaches' for a few decades. Some bloke called Johan Cruyff is testament to that (he joined them at the age of 10). Giving money to kids is commonplace - see Shaun Murray of Kettering Town fame despite being the most sought after kid in England at the time. Perhaps the kids are just shit? Or lazy fat bastards who eat kebab meat and drink cider at 11pm in city centre takeaways as witnessed on xmas eve?

[Doug]

I think you will find the facilities on every estate idea alive and well in Holland.

Was'nt Van Persie a product of the 'cage' as they call it in Rotterdam.

Pie, As for Cruyf, now you are talking my lingo. The finest exponent of the beautiful game I have ever seen in my lifetime.

Danswon, If putting the kids in a cage keeps coaches out as well as keeping the kids in then lets go for it I say.

 

Doug.

[Parky]

We saw some of it today and it was like a breath of fresh air.

 

 

There is hope. Play Faye in midfield and let Zoggy and Duffer loose.

There was move where we interchanged 16 passes.

 

Attacking football is the way forward.

 

Take note SA.

[Keefaz]

We saw some of it today and it was like a breath of fresh air.

 

 

There is hope. Play Faye in midfield and let Zoggy and Duffer loose.

There was move where we interchanged 16 passes.

 

Attacking football is the way forward.

 

Take note SA.

 

Well said, Parkistan.