No signings = relegation?

[merlin]

4 teams below us picking up points last night? Impossible according to some people on here.

 

You forgot to mention that Birmingham and Wigan lost and gained no points last night !

 

Fck me man.

 

 

 

Because they were playing other teams in the bottom half.

 

You happy with 4th from bottom?

 

For this season? Yes. Next? No.

 

This shows how far we have fallen - all of you who said "give Souness more time, give Roeder time, ALlardyce will fix us" should be f****** ashamed of yourselves.

 

We should be railing against being in the bottom 5 or 6 (a genuine threat to us now), we should be making SJP not just a bad place to come to for away teams, but a place where players KNOW they have to play well for us. Anyone who accepts s**** like Geremi, Smith, Ameobi, Rozenhal, and even TRIES to make excuses for them should bow their heads in abject shame.

 

Agree & disagree with you in equal measure.

 

It's why some supporters, and the following thoughts were voiced on this forum, were stunned amidst the flacid crowd response in the wake of Souness' first season. A season of underwhelming performances were lost amidst the result of the day, that being a gutsy season closing effort against Chelsea. Such incompetance, both from a team & management standpoint, over the course of a season wouldn't stand-up at Anfield for example. Houllier was virtually shouted out of the job, the board listened to it's supporter base who became frustrated at the brand of football Houllier's team was dishing up at the time - despite the Cups and his penultimate CL finish which imo was greatly influenced by injuries to our key players down the stretch ie. Bellamy and Woodgate, our defensive rock & our creative foil around the box.

 

I still think if the SJP terraces had rallied against Souness enmasse, as was the case re: Houllier/Liverpool, after the already mentioned season closer against Chelsea the board - ie. The Halls - would've swiftly pulled the trigger in response and that would've would've stopped the cancerous Souness regime dead in it's tracks.

 

As for supporters 'hanging their heads in shame' for accepting s**** like Geremi etc etc. It's my opinion that Geremi would still make a better RW option than Milner. The likes of Cacapa & Rozenhal, i wanted to see how they'd fare beyond the first month of the campaign where they're were blessed with having to face some lightweight attacking frontlines during the opening stages of their premiership careers - both have failed.

 

Don't peddle this 'don't try to make excuses for them' because i'll rewind the clock a bit. Up until Parker pulled the fingered salute at home you spent the best part of a year defending Parker's performance level under successive managers, especially during Roeder's tenureship where at one stage you suggested playing him in exactly the same role - positionally wise - as he was utilised in Souness's so called 442, and Souness' so-called 442 resembled a narrow & unbalanced 4-1-3-2 which because of it's the team's inability to laterally stretch the opposition's defensive ranks with some left-to-right sideline passing/possession play across the midfield line only served the purpose of having the team play out of it's own half & defending for their lives for the best part of 90 minutes.

 

And yet despite the ramifications of such a positional change, as opposed to Roeder's misguided faith in utilizing him in a balanced offensive & defensive 442 central midfielder in the Rob Lee mould - a role which he clearly wasn't up to, you made that call. At the time you were more than happy to see the midfield formation & balance compromised in order to get the best out of a player who in your exact words was s***.

 

Take a leaf out of your own book mate.

 

SBR said recently that Mourinho had personally warned him that Geremi's legs had gone so I don't agree that he would be any good as a winger - he's hopeless where he's been playing, and that doesn't require anywhere near as much pace as the wing ; the guy is a waste of space and he isn't the only one - should never have been Captain.

[Guest alex]

He's never had any pace. The problem is he can't get up and down - when Allardyce played him as a wing-back at home against Liverpool at home this was painfully apparent.

[sicsfingeredmong]

4 teams below us picking up points last night? Impossible according to some people on here.

 

You forgot to mention that Birmingham and Wigan lost and gained no points last night !

 

Fck me man.

 

 

 

Because they were playing other teams in the bottom half.

 

You happy with 4th from bottom?

 

For this season? Yes. Next? No.

 

This shows how far we have fallen - all of you who said "give Souness more time, give Roeder time, ALlardyce will fix us" should be f****** ashamed of yourselves.

 

We should be railing against being in the bottom 5 or 6 (a genuine threat to us now), we should be making SJP not just a bad place to come to for away teams, but a place where players KNOW they have to play well for us. Anyone who accepts s**** like Geremi, Smith, Ameobi, Rozenhal, and even TRIES to make excuses for them should bow their heads in abject shame.

 

Agree & disagree with you in equal measure.

 

It's why some supporters, and the following thoughts were voiced on this forum, were stunned amidst the flacid crowd response in the wake of Souness' first season. A season of underwhelming performances were lost amidst the result of the day, that being a gutsy season closing effort against Chelsea. Such incompetance, both from a team & management standpoint, over the course of a season wouldn't stand-up at Anfield for example. Houllier was virtually shouted out of the job, the board listened to it's supporter base who became frustrated at the brand of football Houllier's team was dishing up at the time - despite the Cups and his penultimate CL finish which imo was greatly influenced by injuries to our key players down the stretch ie. Bellamy and Woodgate, our defensive rock & our creative foil around the box.

 

I still think if the SJP terraces had rallied against Souness enmasse, as was the case re: Houllier/Liverpool, after the already mentioned season closer against Chelsea the board - ie. The Halls - would've swiftly pulled the trigger in response and that would've would've stopped the cancerous Souness regime dead in it's tracks.

 

As for supporters 'hanging their heads in shame' for accepting s**** like Geremi etc etc. It's my opinion that Geremi would still make a better RW option than Milner. The likes of Cacapa & Rozenhal, i wanted to see how they'd fare beyond the first month of the campaign where they're were blessed with having to face some lightweight attacking frontlines during the opening stages of their premiership careers - both have failed.

 

Don't peddle this 'don't try to make excuses for them' because i'll rewind the clock a bit. Up until Parker pulled the fingered salute at home you spent the best part of a year defending Parker's performance level under successive managers, especially during Roeder's tenureship where at one stage you suggested playing him in exactly the same role - positionally wise - as he was utilised in Souness's so called 442, and Souness' so-called 442 resembled a narrow & unbalanced 4-1-3-2 which because of it's the team's inability to laterally stretch the opposition's defensive ranks with some left-to-right sideline passing/possession play across the midfield line only served the purpose of having the team play out of it's own half & defending for their lives for the best part of 90 minutes.

 

And yet despite the ramifications of such a positional change, as opposed to Roeder's misguided faith in utilizing him in a balanced offensive & defensive 442 central midfielder in the Rob Lee mould - a role which he clearly wasn't up to, you made that call. At the time you were more than happy to see the midfield formation & balance compromised in order to get the best out of a player who in your exact words was s***.

 

Take a leaf out of your own book mate.

 

SBR said recently that Mourinho had personally warned him that Geremi's legs had gone so I don't agree that he would be any good as a winger - he's hopeless where he's been playing, and that doesn't require anywhere near as much pace as the wing ; the guy is a waste of space and he isn't the only one - should never have been Captain.

 

Solano never had the pace, not did he ever have the stamina required to be the prototypical end-to-end winger...... a player who could break out of the defensive half & carry the ball through a staggered opposition midfield line, nor was has he able to get back and provide defensive support in the event of the team losing possession when he was fully committed forward near the opposition box or in the wide delivery/crossing zones. Even Robert put in a more noticeable defensive shift, he just couldn't tackle with the blood & guts vigour normally attributed to a born and bred defensive fullback  - ie. Neville - and Robert was burned by a sector of the supporter base because of this.

 

Back to Solano's lack of pace & legs/stamina, even in his prime. He had the energetic Hughes playing behind him, whose stamina level  - and the accompanying propensity & the ability over the course of 90 minutes to overlap his winger/Solano before tracking-back when required - papered over Solano's physical limitations.

 

In the present i think Beye, who has acclimatised physically and to the pace of the end-to-end nature of the EPL, would provide the necessary cover for a player - ie. Geremi - who at this stage of his career shares physical limitations akin to Solano's.

 

On the right i'd prefer somebody who at least has the upper body strength required to shoulder off a challenge and beat his man that way, and somebody who unlike Milner can deliver with consistency a cross, or final ball, which at least has 'goal scoring potential' written on it.

[NG32]

Solanos footballing brain was his pace.

[sicsfingeredmong]

He's never had any pace. The problem is he can't get up and down - when Allardyce played him as a wing-back at home against Liverpool at home this was painfully apparent.

 

Hence you play him on the right, in front of a fullback who can get up and down the flank all day and Beye fits the bill now that he has physically acclimatised to the pace and more importantly to the EPL's end-to-end pattern of play......... this would be akin to the Solano & Hughes double-act under Robson's renureship imo.

[Optimistic Nut]

Solanos footballing brain was his pace.

 

Agree with that. Compare that to Milner who if he can't beat his man first time, tries a step-over, if that doesn't work, he shifts the ball onto his other foot...and if that doesn't work, just blast it off the full-back.

[sicsfingeredmong]

Solanos footballing brain was his pace.

 

But in order to cover up his physical limitations, and he wasn't a pure 'pacy/ball carrying winger', he still needed wide attacking support both from the ever overlapping Hughes, and of course from Bellamy who constantly patrolled both wide channels depending on which flank the build-up play was eminating from.

 

Geremi, as a wide attacker, never blew past defenders.......... yet it never stopped him from consistently putting in dangerous final ball/crosses. What he needs at this stage of career, and i bring up Solano's wide assistance from Hughes both offensively & defensively, is a decent end-to-end fullback to accompany him because at the end of the day i have greater faith in Geremi's wide delivery into the danger areas in & around the box as opposed to Milner, because Geremi is a proven product in this area.

[merlin]

Geremi is far more ponderous at 28 than Solano was at 32 - Solano had a far superior football brain as Alex said, and he had much quicker feet than Geremi. When Solano was Geremi's age he had more pace than Geremi...there is no comparison between the two as creators and Nobby gave us nearly 10 years' excellent service - a great buy by KD in 1998.

Incidentally, he was a far better player than Milner too.

[sicsfingeredmong]

Solanos footballing brain was his pace.

 

Agree with that. Compare that to Milner who if he can't beat his man first time, tries a step-over, if that doesn't work, he shifts the ball onto his other foot...and if that doesn't work, just blast it off the full-back.

 

= generally provides sweet bugger-all in terms of 'end product', hence for the time being play Geremi in his preferred position and if Duff isn't within Keegan's right-wing frame give young Lua Lua - who looks as though he could play across the line - an extended crack it at and of course the opportunity to make the position his own.

[sicsfingeredmong]

Geremi is far more ponderous at 28 than Solano was at 32 - Solano had a far superior football brain as Alex said, and he had much quicker feet than Geremi. When Solano was Geremi's age he had more pace than Geremi...there is no comparison between the two as creators and Nobby gave us nearly 10 years' excellent service - a great buy by KD in 1998.

Incidentally, he was a far better player than Milner too.

 

I've never made any sort of comparison to Milner, nor am i questioning or pissing on Solano's attacking attributes by using Geremi as a so-called benchmark as i think you've incorrectly interpreted, since you've backed up your point with the 'nearly ten years of excellent service' reference.

 

But they share similar limitations, that being inability an to get up and down the pitch as i've highlighted, and Solano had a terrific 'running mate' in the form of Hughes. Hughes wasn't top drawer, when compared with the likes of Cole, but he got the job done. Beye appears to be a natural successor to Hughes, and would be able to support Geremi who is more of a 'ball-playing' wide attacker as opposed to an all-out ball carrying winger. For this type of wide-man the balance on the flank has to be right, and this is duly provided by the play of the fullback. It's not about questioning the merits of both players, it's more about getting the combination right. IMO Beye's balanced attacking & defensive play as a 90 minute end-to-end fullback, and Milner's 'one-paced' running style of play doesn't match-up. Of the current options available i'd prefer the ball-player - ie. Geremi - who imo more effectively compliments Beye who is dangerous going forward, over the attributeless headless chicken in Milner who not only tries to do it all by himself but also doesn't spot and utilise his overlapping fullback often enough.

[BONTEMPI]

Given admits Magpies fear relegation fight

By Scott Wilson

Comment

WITH the euphoria that accompanied Kevin Keegan's return to Tyneside having failed to produce an improvement in form, Shay Given last night admitted Newcastle were on the verge of a "relegation battle".

 

Tuesday night's 3-0 defeat at Arsenal extended the Magpies' winless Premier League run to seven games and left Keegan's side just two points clear of Sunday's opponents, Middlesbrough, and four points ahead of bitter North-East rivals Sunderland, two sides who have been widely touted as relegation candidates in recent weeks.

 

Newcastle do not quite fall into that category yet, with five sides standing between them and the relegation zone. But with Keegan's arrival having failed to reverse a downward spiral that began under the club's former manager, Sam Allardyce, the alarm bells will be ringing if Middlesbrough prevent the Magpies claiming all three points at the weekend.

 

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"There is a danger now of getting sucked into the relegation battle," said Given, on the back of conceding 11 goals in his last four league games. "We are very aware of that and we are looking over our shoulders.

 

"The good thing is that we are not playing Arsenal away every week, even though it seems like it after the last two games.

 

"We have a massive game on Sunday now against Middlesbrough. It's a derby and they are in and around us in the table, so it is a huge game."

 

When Keegan agreed to replace Allardyce two weeks ago, the talk was of a possible UEFA Cup spot and a long-term desire to break into the established big four.

 

Since then, Newcastle have crashed out of the FA Cup, suffered a three-goal defeat to Arsenal in the league and failed to win a home game against Bolton.

 

The upshot is a strange blend of suppressed optimism and mounting panic, but Given feels early predictions of an immediate improvement were always likely to prove wide of the mark.

 

"I think everybody got carried away a bit," admitted the Irishman. "There's a lot of work to be done and Kevin has not got a magic wand. It is not going to happen overnight.

 

"Kevin is starting to get his ideas over to us, but it has only been ten days. It is going to take time for him. It will take a while, but Kevin has an enthusiasm and an aura - when he walks into the dressing room, you sort of stand up. He has that sort of charisma, and I believe in the long run we will be a much better team for it."

 

In the short term, however, Keegan must deal with the fall-out from his failure to sign anyone during the current transfer window.

 

Brazilian centre-half Alvaro was the latest player to be linked with an 11th-hour move to Newcastle yesterday, but there is no chance of the Magpies matching Levante's £3m valuation of the 30-year-old.

 

With Keegan having expressed a preference for players with Premier League experience, Newcastle officials are not prepared to invest in a relatively unknown South American.

 

They are, however, keen to sign a teenage midfielder from Atlanta for an initial fee of £300,000, but that will be an Academy-level signing rather than a potential addition to the first team.

 

Keegan will be forced to work with what he has until the transfer window re-opens in the summer, and while the return of Obafemi Martins, Geremi, Habib Beye and Abdoulaye Faye from the African Cup of Nations will provide a timely boost - the latter duo could even be available for Sunday if Senegal fail to beat South Africa tonight - there is a disappointment that signings have proved elusive this month.

 

"It would have been nice to get a few players in but, right now, it looks like we are not going to get any in before the transfer window closes," said Given.

 

"The gaffer has said he does not want to bring players in for the short term, for a quick fix, so, if people don't arrive, we will have to make do with what we have until the summer and get some players in then.

 

"I believe there is enough talent in the squad as it is. I suppose confidence is a bit low at the moment, with the results going the way they have, but there are a lot of Premier League teams that would swap some of their players for some of ours."

 

Charles N'Zogbia will miss Newcastle's trip to Aston Villa on February 9 after picking up his fifth booking of the season at Arsenal on Tuesday.

 

 

[Cronky]

I was expecting us to make at least one first-team signing this window, and I'm a bit concerned. I was hoping we'd revitalise the attack, but that hasn't happened.

 

I've taken a closer look at our closing run of fixtures, and it's really tough. Even if we win the home games that we should (which we haven't been doing of late) then I reckon we'll still only end up with around 40 points.

 

As at the start of the season, I'm pinning a bit of hope on Barton. He's been way off his best so far, but there were some encouraging signs against Arsenal.

[Guest The Corner]

Why rush into signing players? Thats panic buying and we'll get the players values inflated that way! We have 4 good players coming back from africa; beye, faye, geremi and martins plus joey barton and emre from suspension...thats 6 players all with premiership experience to hopefully get us enough points so why should we panic...waiting till the summer might not be a bad thing?

 

Agree with what you said but saying Geremi is a good player is outrageous.

[NG32]

Agree with what you said but saying Geremi is a good player is outrageous.

 

No but he can do a job until summer.

[Guest NorwegianMag]

That's the problem with Newcastle, too many players that can "do a job". No real class.

[Guest Guinness]

I'm disappointed we didn't make any signings, from what the players have said in recent weeks it was clear they wanted to see new faces too. I just hope we manage to start winning our "winnable" home games or we could really run into problems. We've not played well in ages, we don't create anything and our defence is poor. I just hope Emre or Barton start showing their worth in the creativity department.

[ShearMagic]

We should get ready for the Championship then eh?

[Martin Lol]

I was expecting us to make at least one first-team signing this window, and I'm a bit concerned. I was hoping we'd revitalise the attack, but that hasn't happened.

 

I've taken a closer look at our closing run of fixtures, and it's really tough. Even if we win the home games that we should (which we haven't been doing of late) then I reckon we'll still only end up with around 40 points.

 

As at the start of the season, I'm pinning a bit of hope on Barton. He's been way off his best so far, but there were some encouraging signs against Arsenal.

 

I think most people were, not just Newcastle fans.

 

Although KK hasn't had a huge amount of time to evaluate the squad (and Dennis Wise even less), it's not as though Newcastle have a huge squad, I was expecting signings to supplement the players you've got now and the real changes being made in the summer.  With no signings of any significance, I wonder just how freely Ashley will spend the money when targets are identified, I think most fans could have come up with a couple of realistic targets.  Was it that KK couldn't produce a couple of targets or MA  wouldn't spend the money without the second opinion of Dennis Wise?

[merlin]

We should get ready for the Championship then eh?

 

Just don't tempt fate - many a true word spoken in jest....

[NG32]

I think most people were, not just Newcastle fans.

 

Although KK hasn't had a huge amount of time to evaluate the squad (and Dennis Wise even less), it's not as though Newcastle have a huge squad, I was expecting signings to supplement the players you've got now and the real changes being made in the summer.  With no signings of any significance, I wonder just how freely Ashley will spend the money when targets are identified, I think most fans could have come up with a couple of realistic targets.  Was it that KK couldn't produce a couple of targets or MA  wouldn't spend the money without the second opinion of Dennis Wise?

 

I think its more the fact that the people we were after were not available.

[Martin Lol]

I think most people were, not just Newcastle fans.

 

Although KK hasn't had a huge amount of time to evaluate the squad (and Dennis Wise even less), it's not as though Newcastle have a huge squad, I was expecting signings to supplement the players you've got now and the real changes being made in the summer.  With no signings of any significance, I wonder just how freely Ashley will spend the money when targets are identified, I think most fans could have come up with a couple of realistic targets.  Was it that KK couldn't produce a couple of targets or MA  wouldn't spend the money without the second opinion of Dennis Wise?

 

I think its more the fact that the people we were after were not available.

 

If the ones Newcastle ideally wanted weren't available, I'm still surprised that there weren't any contingency names................. unless, of course, they weren't available either.

[merlin]

I think most people were, not just Newcastle fans.

 

Although KK hasn't had a huge amount of time to evaluate the squad (and Dennis Wise even less), it's not as though Newcastle have a huge squad, I was expecting signings to supplement the players you've got now and the real changes being made in the summer.  With no signings of any significance, I wonder just how freely Ashley will spend the money when targets are identified, I think most fans could have come up with a couple of realistic targets.  Was it that KK couldn't produce a couple of targets or MA  wouldn't spend the money without the second opinion of Dennis Wise?

 

I think its more the fact that the people we were after were not available.

 

...Or didn't want to join NUFC..!

[NG32]

Or didn't want to join NUFC..!

 

That as well, so whats the point of going and spunking money on players which are 2nd third and fourth choice.

 

KK and his team have obviously decided that they have enough of a squad to see the season through to the end.

 

THis was always going to be a season of transition, so nothing much has changed in that way,  lets see what happens in the summer.

 

I'll also mention that I am over the moon the way the club has gone out and bought some kids for the long term future of the club.

[Skirge]

Fact is we could go down therefore we are not safe!!

We have enough quality here if they stay fit to survive but its not going to be easy..

[ATB]

oh no we are going to play CC next season. I can´t belive it and it´s all KK´s fault because he can´t bring in new players and our squed i problebly worse than Derby´s