Carling Cup- Wednesday Matches

[Wullie]

Is the draw not tonight?

[Dragon55544]

No Sat Noon

[Wullie]

Fuck's sake. Cheers.

[YankeeToon]

3 out of 7 chance of drawing a team we could beat...

 

Would've been worse if ManU had made it.

 

We could still have a fair chance of making the semifinal...

[Guest js]

liverpool, arse, and chelsea are the teams to avoid.

i'd actually like us to draw Spurs, especially at SJP. we can take them.

[Martin Lol]

liverpool, arse, and chelsea are the teams to avoid.

i'd actually like us to draw Spurs, especially at SJP. we can take them.

 

Depends what team is selected.  Make it the team that beat Chelsea and I would be extremely confident home or away.  If it was last night's team, would be very difficult to be confident about winning.  Barcham made his debut and looked a promising Championship player, Ifil has seriously gone backwards over the last 2 years and Davids' playing days are just about over imho.

 

The big big plus for Spurs was the debut of Dorian Dervite, 18 yr old French CB, 6' 4" and built like a tank.  Extremely composed on the ball, good positioning, on the night was better than Dawson.  Looking forward to see how he fares playing against premiership opposition, because I think Dawson may well have serious competition for a starting berth in the not too distant future.

[Rebellious]

liverpool, arse, and chelsea are the teams to avoid.

i'd actually like us to draw Spurs, especially at SJP. we can take them.

 

I think your actually thinking of an NUFC a few years ago.  I will be worring about the game even if we draw wycombe.

[Nobody]

newcastle - southend

chelsea - liverpool

spurs -arsenal

charlton - wycombe

 

draw wycombe in the semi-finals

 

agree that everton are the biggest scumbags in the league, especially that f**k cahill

[Guest js]

liverpool, arse, and chelsea are the teams to avoid.

i'd actually like us to draw Spurs, especially at SJP. we can take them.

 

Depends what team is selected.  Make it the team that beat Chelsea and I would be extremely confident home or away.  If it was last night's team, would be very difficult to be confident about winning.  Barcham made his debut and looked a promising Championship player, Ifil has seriously gone backwards over the last 2 years and Davids' playing days are just about over imho.

 

The big big plus for Spurs was the debut of Dorian Dervite, 18 yr old French CB, 6' 4" and built like a tank.  Extremely composed on the ball, good positioning, on the night was better than Dawson.  Looking forward to see how he fares playing against premiership opposition, because I think Dawson may well have serious competition for a starting berth in the not too distant future.

 

Spurs are certainly playing better football than us but what gives me optimism against your lot is that you're still susceptible to the regular off day when the side plays like they've forgotten they're supposed to be a good team. we probably had our easiest win of last season against Spurs at SJP.

 

if Spurs do click on the day though, then yeah i'd probably be worried especially if we start giving gifts at the back as we've been in the habit of doing. but i'd fancy our chances, certainly a lot more so than if we're drawn against pool, arse, or chelsea, just because i still see Spurs as a side that blows hot and cold.

 

Davids is way past his best but among all those young players esp midfielders that you have, i think he serves an important role as sort of a minder even if he's not playing. like what Naybet used to do for the centre backs. i suspect it is no coincidence that Spurs's central defense, one which used to be clueless with no communication, suddenly seemed pretty useful since Arnesen brought him in to the mix. i still recall last season my Spurs mates practically had their heads in their hands when Davids got a yellow card which kept him out of the Arsenal derby. that was barely a year ago and it's a testament of the progress the side has made that Davids no longer has such an important role now in the team, but among so many young players a guy like him can be an inspiration, if nothing else other than his acceptence of being on the bench which could make other players who've achieved so much less in their careers ie Defoe, Huddlestone, Mido, etc etc think twice before mouthing off about not being given a regular spot.

[Martin Lol]

liverpool, arse, and chelsea are the teams to avoid.

i'd actually like us to draw Spurs, especially at SJP. we can take them.

 

Depends what team is selected.  Make it the team that beat Chelsea and I would be extremely confident home or away.  If it was last night's team, would be very difficult to be confident about winning.  Barcham made his debut and looked a promising Championship player, Ifil has seriously gone backwards over the last 2 years and Davids' playing days are just about over imho.

 

The big big plus for Spurs was the debut of Dorian Dervite, 18 yr old French CB, 6' 4" and built like a tank.  Extremely composed on the ball, good positioning, on the night was better than Dawson.  Looking forward to see how he fares playing against premiership opposition, because I think Dawson may well have serious competition for a starting berth in the not too distant future.

 

Spurs are certainly playing better football than us but what gives me optimism against your lot is that you're still susceptible to the regular off day when the side plays like they've forgotten they're supposed to be a good team. we probably had our easiest win of last season against Spurs at SJP.

 

if Spurs do click on the day though, then yeah i'd probably be worried especially if we start giving gifts at the back as we've been in the habit of doing. but i'd fancy our chances, certainly a lot more so than if we're drawn against pool, arse, or chelsea, just because i still see Spurs as a side that blows hot and cold.

 

Davids is way past his best but among all those young players esp midfielders that you have, i think he serves an important role as sort of a minder even if he's not playing. like what Naybet used to do for the centre backs. i suspect it is no coincidence that Spurs's central defense, one which used to be clueless with no communication, suddenly seemed pretty useful since Arnesen brought him in to the mix. i still recall last season my Spurs mates practically had their heads in their hands when Davids got a yellow card which kept him out of the Arsenal derby. that was barely a year ago and it's a testament of the progress the side has made that Davids no longer has such an important role now in the team, but among so many young players a guy like him can be an inspiration, if nothing else other than his acceptence of being on the bench which could make other players who've achieved so much less in their careers ie Defoe, Huddlestone, Mido, etc etc think twice before mouthing off about not being given a regular spot.

 

The difference between having the off day and not is the same as breaking into the Big 4's group and trying to.  The off days are (I think) getting a bit more infrequent, there's no disputing Spurs at SJP last season was a big an off day as we'd had since Pleat went.  Still more upgrading to do imho before we seriously push the top 4, but I think we're in line for a similar finish to last season, at the present time we're just 1 point worse off than we were against the same teams last season.

 

You're exactly right about Naybet's and Davids' influence, 'winning mentality' has become a well worn phrase but they taught the younger ones in the squad the right mental attitude, particularly Naybet with Dawson and Davids with Lennon.  That's why I think it was a disastrous decision for Newcastle not to sign Campbell.  In Ramage and Taylor there are 2 CD's with a lot of potential and Craig Moore isn't going to help them move forward.  Only a top class CD can really do that and no matter what I think about him, I can't deny that he has been a world class CD.  Still, it seems ever likely that Davids will be staying next season as a coach while he completes his badges and I'm very happy with that.

 

Hudd's made no warning noises of wanting to play more, he knows he will be pivotal to Spurs in the not too distant future.  Defoe will be gone in January I think, Villa probably, and Mido, well, is Mido.  Don't have to guess why he wasn't included in the squad against Port Vale, another hissy fit and a two weeks wages fine.  Still, not all bad news.  Now being widely reported that Spurs have agreed a deal for Leonardo Vitor Santiago for €750k, about £500k.  Another risky character but shouldn't lose money on him.

 

 

[Guest js]

 

 

The difference between having the off day and not is the same as breaking into the Big 4's group and trying to.  The off days are (I think) getting a bit more infrequent, there's no disputing Spurs at SJP last season was a big an off day as we'd had since Pleat went.  Still more upgrading to do imho before we seriously push the top 4, but I think we're in line for a similar finish to last season, at the present time we're just 1 point worse off than we were against the same teams last season.

 

You're exactly right about Naybet's and Davids' influence, 'winning mentality' has become a well worn phrase but they taught the younger ones in the squad the right mental attitude, particularly Naybet with Dawson and Davids with Lennon.  That's why I think it was a disastrous decision for Newcastle not to sign Campbell.  In Ramage and Taylor there are 2 CD's with a lot of potential and Craig Moore isn't going to help them move forward.  Only a top class CD can really do that and no matter what I think about him, I can't deny that he has been a world class CD.  Still, it seems ever likely that Davids will be staying next season as a coach while he completes his badges and I'm very happy with that.

 

Hudd's made no warning noises of wanting to play more, he knows he will be pivotal to Spurs in the not too distant future.  Defoe will be gone in January I think, Villa probably, and Mido, well, is Mido.  Don't have to guess why he wasn't included in the squad against Port Vale, another hissy fit and a two weeks wages fine.  Still, not all bad news.  Now being widely reported that Spurs have agreed a deal for Leonardo Vitor Santiago for €750k, about £500k.  Another risky character but shouldn't lose money on him.

 

 

 

i think you had a big "off day" against everton this season too, and even perhaps against fulham. but it sickens me to watch spurs beat chelsea last sunday as that could really be the catalyst for the side to finally believe they can beat the top dogs rather than just draw against them. i think you'd be silly to sell Defoe, and if i have one crictism of Jol (the real one) it'd be how he can't seem to bring the best out of Defoe who's probably as good a finisher as anyone in the prem, at least in my book. i recall how he was on fire last season and Jol strangely decided to "rest" him against Blackburn if i'm not mistaken and since then he's been going downhill. i still rate Defoe higher as a goalscorer than Keane.

 

i like watching out for Spurs's progress because i feel what your team has been doing is the exact reverse of what we've been doing. as i've said before, we're going down the route of Spurs circa 98-01 and it's not a very bright idea. in those days Spurs spent heavily on "proven" players like Leonhardsen, Sherwood, etc etc who were never going to have any sell on value. in fact if you look at it a bit more, Spurs bought an England centreforward with a great goalscoring record but was constantly injured in Sir Les, similar to our fate now with Owen. you also gambled on expensive imports (Rebrov) who were ill suited for the ENglish game (Luque). you bought centre backs who did well in other leagues but looked amateurish in the prem (Vega / Boumsong). and when you sacked a manager, which you frequently did, you were left with a bunch of dross that the new man didn't want but couldn't give away. we're facing that now.

 

my Spurs mates these days laugh at those times, when they pinned all their hopes on very few supposedly "potential" players like Steffen Iversen. while these days there are so many young potentials there that they lose track of the names. Lennon, Dawson, Huddlestone, are already looking like special players and i heard there are reasons to believe there is also a bunch of others like Devitte and some teenage Irish lad who will be coming through too soon.

 

in the meantime we've gone back and copied your old model and spent huge amounts and getting nothing in return. the signing of SIbierski sums it up for me and how Roeder is raving about him after a couple of goals as if he's made the biggest transfer coup of the decade worries me no end (Andy Booth, anyone?). the loan of Rossi too is a strange one. it's unthinkable that under the days of SBR we'd be resorting to such desperation and lack of imagination in the transfer market.

 

as for Campbell, i don't think he's a very good defender tbh, certainly not one to marshall a defence. he's always relied on his speed to get him out of trouble, and dominated through strength. but now that he's lost his pace he looks very vulnerable, i thought Defoe had him in his pocket when spurs beat portsmouth. ran rings around campbell. then again, looking at bramble and moore, makes campbell look like Maldini in comparison.

maybe roeder just looked at the ex-spurs player we have now (Carr) and thought no way we're going down that route again...

 

 

[Martin Lol]

 

 

The difference between having the off day and not is the same as breaking into the Big 4's group and trying to.  The off days are (I think) getting a bit more infrequent, there's no disputing Spurs at SJP last season was a big an off day as we'd had since Pleat went.  Still more upgrading to do imho before we seriously push the top 4, but I think we're in line for a similar finish to last season, at the present time we're just 1 point worse off than we were against the same teams last season.

 

You're exactly right about Naybet's and Davids' influence, 'winning mentality' has become a well worn phrase but they taught the younger ones in the squad the right mental attitude, particularly Naybet with Dawson and Davids with Lennon.  That's why I think it was a disastrous decision for Newcastle not to sign Campbell.  In Ramage and Taylor there are 2 CD's with a lot of potential and Craig Moore isn't going to help them move forward.  Only a top class CD can really do that and no matter what I think about him, I can't deny that he has been a world class CD.  Still, it seems ever likely that Davids will be staying next season as a coach while he completes his badges and I'm very happy with that.

 

Hudd's made no warning noises of wanting to play more, he knows he will be pivotal to Spurs in the not too distant future.  Defoe will be gone in January I think, Villa probably, and Mido, well, is Mido.  Don't have to guess why he wasn't included in the squad against Port Vale, another hissy fit and a two weeks wages fine.  Still, not all bad news.  Now being widely reported that Spurs have agreed a deal for Leonardo Vitor Santiago for €750k, about £500k.  Another risky character but shouldn't lose money on him.

 

 

 

i think you had a big "off day" against everton this season too, and even perhaps against fulham. but it sickens me to watch spurs beat chelsea last sunday as that could really be the catalyst for the side to finally believe they can beat the top dogs rather than just draw against them. i think you'd be silly to sell Defoe, and if i have one crictism of Jol (the real one) it'd be how he can't seem to bring the best out of Defoe who's probably as good a finisher as anyone in the prem, at least in my book. i recall how he was on fire last season and Jol strangely decided to "rest" him against Blackburn if i'm not mistaken and since then he's been going downhill. i still rate Defoe higher as a goalscorer than Keane.

 

i like watching out for Spurs's progress because i feel what your team has been doing is the exact reverse of what we've been doing. as i've said before, we're going down the route of Spurs circa 98-01 and it's not a very bright idea. in those days Spurs spent heavily on "proven" players like Leonhardsen, Sherwood, etc etc who were never going to have any sell on value. in fact if you look at it a bit more, Spurs bought an England centreforward with a great goalscoring record but was constantly injured in Sir Les, similar to our fate now with Owen. you also gambled on expensive imports (Rebrov) who were ill suited for the ENglish game (Luque). you bought centre backs who did well in other leagues but looked amateurish in the prem (Vega / Boumsong). and when you sacked a manager, which you frequently did, you were left with a bunch of dross that the new man didn't want but couldn't give away. we're facing that now.

 

my Spurs mates these days laugh at those times, when they pinned all their hopes on very few supposedly "potential" players like Steffen Iversen. while these days there are so many young potentials there that they lose track of the names. Lennon, Dawson, Huddlestone, are already looking like special players and i heard there are reasons to believe there is also a bunch of others like Devitte and some teenage Irish lad who will be coming through too soon.

 

in the meantime we've gone back and copied your old model and spent huge amounts and getting nothing in return. the signing of SIbierski sums it up for me and how Roeder is raving about him after a couple of goals as if he's made the biggest transfer coup of the decade worries me no end (Andy Booth, anyone?). the loan of Rossi too is a strange one. it's unthinkable that under the days of SBR we'd be resorting to such desperation and lack of imagination in the transfer market.

 

as for Campbell, i don't think he's a very good defender tbh, certainly not one to marshall a defence. he's always relied on his speed to get him out of trouble, and dominated through strength. but now that he's lost his pace he looks very vulnerable, i thought Defoe had him in his pocket when spurs beat portsmouth. ran rings around campbell. then again, looking at bramble and moore, makes campbell look like Maldini in comparison.

maybe roeder just looked at the ex-spurs player we have now (Carr) and thought no way we're going down that route again...

 

 

 

In hindsight, the performances against Everton and Fulham weren't as bad as the results.  Everton played like they did a couple of years ago when they finished 4th and Fulham kept the ball out more by luck than judgement on a few occasions.  Like the 3 away defeats, Bolton Manu and Liverpool, evryone was saying what a poor run of results but none of those are easy away from home. Can't help but agree that Newcastle's buying strategy is all wrong, and as you say, you only need to look at Spurs 5 or 6 years ago to realise it will fail more times than it will succeed.  Even Chelsea are struggling to get Shevchenko going!

 

The buying philosophy introduced by Arnesen and carried on by Comolli (to a lesser degree) makes the most sense, buy young and cheap and offload quickly if it doesn't happen for them.  Someone on a Spurs site yesterday was saying that in the last 2 and a half years Spurs have bought or sold over 100 players, some (like the Portsmouth 3) having to be counted twice.  In that time, the only losses made were on the players bought pre-Arnesen, we haven't lost on a player bought since the summer of 2004.  It says everything that the previous player to be sold at a profit was Gazza!!

 

The worrying thing imo about Newcastle's buying strategy is that there doesn't seem to be any plan there at all.  Just keep on buying players who may be available until the money runs out and hope that there are sufficient players to cover all the vacancies in the squad.  Whether that is down to FFS or GR it's hard to say, my guess is FFS but GR should still be banging on the door talking about the deficiencies in the squad.  By contrast, Comolli imho is doing a better job in the transfer market now than Arnesen, getting quality for the first team (Berbatov and the best 2 full backs we've had in at least 20 years) and some amazing youngsters (Dervite, Olsen and Pekhart are all Comolli signings, Dixon, Hutton and Martin have come through the ranks).

 

I take your point about Campbell but equally Naybet had no pace either when he arrived at WHL.  Simply organised the back 4, got it into their heads where they should be in a certain situation and then let their younger legs do the bulk of the work.  King improved positionally noticeably and Dawson's all round game was barely recognisable.  To be fair, there was also marked improvement in Davenport and (to a lesser degree) Gardner too.  I still reckon that not signing Campbell has been GR's/FFS's worst decision of the lot, and there have been a few iffy ones to say the least.  If the 2 CD's had stayed solid, the 2 FB's, who are both experienced internationals, would have spent more time concentrating on their own roles rather than what was happening in the middle. 

 

One look at Pompey now gives an idea of how solid Newcastle could have been at the back if Campbell had been signed.  As I said before, Newcastle would have been his first choice destination.