Italian Serie A - 09/10

[ponsaelius]

There's a lot of Italians who don't want him to play for Italy because they don't see him as truly Italian. Obviously his petulance and serious attitude problem constitute towards most of the hatred he's having directed at him, but Italy isn't exactly the most racially tolerant country in Europe and there's certainly a feeling with alot of people that a 'foreigner' shouldn't be able to play for the national team.

 

It's the line between the personal dislike and the racism that's making it a difficult issue. Like Mourinho said Balotelli needs to sort himself out and just focus on his football in order to realise his potential. Similarly the stigma of bloodline to define nationality within Italy needs to be eradicated, because Balotelli is probably the biggest talent in Italy at the moment, would be a shame for their own benefit if he was to end up playing for a country he doesn't fully identify with because of some backward ideals about the purity of nationality.

 

Ghana would be over the fucking moon if he ended up playing for them like However the kid is far more Italian than he is Ghanaian.

[Guest Heneage]

I think I'd say to those Italians are you happy for Perrotta to play?

[Village Idiot]

Rossi and Camoranesi are as Italian as I am French, were there some issues when they were selected for Italy? (honest question)

[ponsaelius]

Balotelli is certainly more Italian than Perrotta, Rossi and Camoranesi.

 

I guess it's how you define it.

 

I'd say being born in Italy, growing up in Italy with an Italian family, speaking the language, and being culturally Italian in every way is far more of an indicator than having an Italian parent or something. I was shocked when speaking to relatives I have out there that many of Italy (or atleast the region they live in) don't see it that way, very backward way of thinking really.

[Guest Heneage]

Perrotta grew up in Italy he was only born in Manchester.

[Taylor Swift]

Historically people have separated themselves according to how they look so I suppose in certain parts of the world those feelings are still prevalent/can surface. It's obviously more of a surprise that it's happening in Western Europe but I agree with the sentiments re: Balotelli being more Italian than Rossi and Camoranesi.

 

Edit: Rossi and Camoranesi are, however, more 'Italian' in terms of bloodline than Balotelli.

[ponsaelius]

Perrotta grew up in Italy he was only born in Manchester.

 

Ah my apologies. I was under the impression he was half English aswell.

 

Not really as good of an example as Rossi or Camoranesi.

[Taylor Swift]

The writer clearly is a Balotelli fan, I on the other hand am not. It bears nothing to do with the club he plays for, as I am a fan of Sneijder, but it is the way he goes on.

 

For all this claims of racist abuse he has been given a free pass to be a fool and go on like the spoilt child at the Birthday party. In last Saturday's Derby he rolled round on the floor holding his face after being accidentally caught with an elbow to the chest. He like our own Andy Carroll has gotten into a bad habit of falling over or 'Diving' to put it more bluntly.

 

Juve fans answered his claims of racism on Saturday with a banner that read; 'Don't kid yourself Balotelli, we'd hate you if you were white' and it's true, all this talk of it being about race, surely if Juve fans were racist like Lazio they'd boo Melo, they'd boo Trezeguet, Amauri, like Lazio did with Manfredini their own player. If you want to nit pick you could argue Inter's fans are racist, they held cards saying 'better black than bianchoneri (Juve's nickname)' that can be seen as suggesting being black is a bad thing.

 

Please, just because he playacts every now and then doesn't mean he should be subjected to racial abuse. The fact that he is facing racial abuse suggests to me that those sentiments already existed in the minds of certain Italians and his personality and style of play is just a convenient excuse to air the aforementioned feelings.

 

Why would Juve fans boo Trezeguet or Melo? They don't give a fuck whether a Frenchie is black or a Brazilian is black. The relevance of booing Balotelli is that he considers himself Italian, has represented Italy at u-21 levels and therefore, according to civilised nations, would be considered Italian. That is in conflict with how Italians historically view themselves (white, loves pizza etc.) so there's no doubt that Balotelli's skin colour is creating a conflict in many people's view of what an Italian is.

 

That's why he's facing racist abuse and that's why this is a huge deal. I can't believe you're actually blaming the victim

[Guest Alan Shearer 9]

Happy for him to play.

 

http://img.skysports.com/07/08/218x298/Simone_Perrotta_559271.jpg

http://i.media.goal.com/g/26680_news.jpg

 

Not happy for him to play.

 

 

What's the difference? To suggest Balotelli isn't suffering abuse because of his skin colour is daft

[Guest Heneage]

The writer clearly is a Balotelli fan, I on the other hand am not. It bears nothing to do with the club he plays for, as I am a fan of Sneijder, but it is the way he goes on.

 

For all this claims of racist abuse he has been given a free pass to be a fool and go on like the spoilt child at the Birthday party. In last Saturday's Derby he rolled round on the floor holding his face after being accidentally caught with an elbow to the chest. He like our own Andy Carroll has gotten into a bad habit of falling over or 'Diving' to put it more bluntly.

 

Juve fans answered his claims of racism on Saturday with a banner that read; 'Don't kid yourself Balotelli, we'd hate you if you were white' and it's true, all this talk of it being about race, surely if Juve fans were racist like Lazio they'd boo Melo, they'd boo Trezeguet, Amauri, like Lazio did with Manfredini their own player. If you want to nit pick you could argue Inter's fans are racist, they held cards saying 'better black than bianchoneri (Juve's nickname)' that can be seen as suggesting being black is a bad thing.

 

Please, just because he playacts every now and then doesn't mean he should be subjected to racial abuse. The fact that he is facing racial abuse suggests to me that those sentiments already existed in the minds of certain Italians and his personality and style of play is just a convenient excuse to air the aforementioned feelings.

 

Why would Juve fans boo Trezeguet or Melo? They don't give a f*** whether a Frenchie is black or a Brazilian is black. The relevance of booing Balotelli is that he considers himself Italian, has represented Italy at u-21 levels and therefore, according to civilised nations, would be considered Italian. That is in conflict with how Italians historically view themselves (white, loves pizza etc.) so there's no doubt that Balotelli's skin colour is creating a conflict in many people's view of what an Italian is.

 

That's why he's facing racist abuse and that's why this is a huge deal. I can't believe you're actually blaming the victim

Racist's don't care what country you are from, they boo you because of your skin not because of your passport. Lazio proved that, youtube it, they boo manfredini and make monkey noises when his name is read out, yet they cheer him when he scores.

 

I'd be happy for him to play for the full team if his skill merits it, I would not want him to be played on the grounds of 'proving italy isn't racist.' Because that's just daft.

 

I think he suffered abuse last year but instead of use his talent to show the small section what he can do, he instead has gone on like a complete fool. He was not booed because he asked to represent Italy, I don't even think it's a problem for as many as you are making out, I think his attitude is his biggest problem in getting into the national team right now, not his skin colour, his situation is not like Cassano's who is being forceably kept out of the team.

 

Right now there are names ahead of Balotelli, Cassano, Rossi are two, because both are more consistent and offer more. Like I have said if he sorts himself out stops the flamboyant play acting and general idiocy on the pitch, Suzie Camponari highlighted it best, when he gets more consistency in his game, he can have no reason to be kept out of the squad.

[Taylor Swift]

He's 19 years old. Give the kid a break. He'll come good because his determination is already there for all to see. The fact that he's reacting to abuse shows that he cares; now he just needs to channel it to his football because that's the most effective response. I'm not sure if he understands this yet but immaturity is quite a common trait for teenagers.

 

He's already a very talented footballer who has a big role to play for one of Europe's top teams. He has also shown that he can score in the top competitions in the world, so I expect that he'll be a fixture in the national team soon enough.

[Taylor Swift]

The writer clearly is a Balotelli fan, I on the other hand am not. It bears nothing to do with the club he plays for, as I am a fan of Sneijder, but it is the way he goes on.

 

For all this claims of racist abuse he has been given a free pass to be a fool and go on like the spoilt child at the Birthday party. In last Saturday's Derby he rolled round on the floor holding his face after being accidentally caught with an elbow to the chest. He like our own Andy Carroll has gotten into a bad habit of falling over or 'Diving' to put it more bluntly.

 

Juve fans answered his claims of racism on Saturday with a banner that read; 'Don't kid yourself Balotelli, we'd hate you if you were white' and it's true, all this talk of it being about race, surely if Juve fans were racist like Lazio they'd boo Melo, they'd boo Trezeguet, Amauri, like Lazio did with Manfredini their own player. If you want to nit pick you could argue Inter's fans are racist, they held cards saying 'better black than bianchoneri (Juve's nickname)' that can be seen as suggesting being black is a bad thing.

 

Please, just because he playacts every now and then doesn't mean he should be subjected to racial abuse. The fact that he is facing racial abuse suggests to me that those sentiments already existed in the minds of certain Italians and his personality and style of play is just a convenient excuse to air the aforementioned feelings.

 

Why would Juve fans boo Trezeguet or Melo? They don't give a f*** whether a Frenchie is black or a Brazilian is black. The relevance of booing Balotelli is that he considers himself Italian, has represented Italy at u-21 levels and therefore, according to civilised nations, would be considered Italian. That is in conflict with how Italians historically view themselves (white, loves pizza etc.) so there's no doubt that Balotelli's skin colour is creating a conflict in many people's view of what an Italian is.

 

That's why he's facing racist abuse and that's why this is a huge deal. I can't believe you're actually blaming the victim

Racist's don't care what country you are from, they boo you because of your skin not because of your passport. Lazio proved that, youtube it, they boo manfredini and make monkey noises when his name is read out, yet they cheer him when he scores.

 

I'd be happy for him to play for the full team if his skill merits it, I would not want him to be played on the grounds of 'proving italy isn't racist.' Because that's just daft.

 

I think he suffered abuse last year but instead of use his talent to show the small section what he can do, he instead has gone on like a complete fool. He was not booed because he asked to represent Italy, I don't even think it's a problem for as many as you are making out, I think his attitude is his biggest problem in getting into the national team right now, not his skin colour, his situation is not like Cassano's who is being forceably kept out of the team.

 

Right now there are names ahead of Balotelli, Cassano, Rossi are two, because both are more consistent and offer more. Like I have said if he sorts himself out stops the flamboyant play acting and general idiocy on the pitch, Suzie Camponari highlighted it best, when he gets more consistency in his game, he can have no reason to be kept out of the squad.

 

Of course racists give a shit about the country that you're from. I think the vast majority of people in the world have no problems with African Americans who live in America, but the white Americans did because it's happening in their country, it's happening right in their faces; that these people - people who don't look like them, talk like them nor act like them - now have the same rights and privileges that they do just because they're born in the same place. It creates a conflict because the country that you identified yourself with is now also the same country that a different group of people identify themselves with. Can't you see how that creates a problem? It's tougher to identify yourself with that country now so you either a) accept and embrace new values or b) reject the other people's claims. A minority of Italians obviously reject the fact that Balotelli is Italian because he represents a different group of people, right? That's why he's facing abuse. Nationalism is unfortunately still a strong sentiment today and Balotelli being abused is an expression of it.

[Colocho]

Happy for him to play.

 

http://img.skysports.com/07/08/218x298/Simone_Perrotta_559271.jpg

http://i.media.goal.com/g/26680_news.jpg

 

Not happy for him to play.

 

 

What's the difference? To suggest Balotelli isn't suffering abuse because of his skin colour is daft

[Guest Heneage]

He's 19 years old. Give the kid a break. He'll come good because his determination is already there for all to see. The fact that he's reacting to abuse shows that he cares; now he just needs to channel it to his football because that's the most effective response. I'm not sure if he understands this yet but immaturity is quite a common trait for teenagers.

 

He's already a very talented footballer who has a big role to play for one of Europe's top teams. He has also shown that he can score in the top competitions in the world, so I expect that he'll be a fixture in the national team soon enough.

 

What do you mean give him a break?

 

All I've said is that he's not ready now, cos he isn't he's doing well at U21 so why rush him through? But that's my point you can't link his racism to his immaturity, it's crazy he's not going on like a fool because of abuse he got in one game, that's when it becomes an excuse. I honestly would not predict how he will do as he is very much on the hinge of success and failure.

 

As for your other long post that could do with better formatting, I shall say this. For some Italians his colour means nothing, for some he will never be good enough, and that has nothing to do with his colour, it is because he is not pureblood Italian he is Ghanian/Italian, those same people do not like Perrotta, just like there are English who didn't want Hargreaves in the team, and would refuse Almunia. (But his situation is different ofc). 

 

For me, Balotelli is Italian, plus It would be a bit hypocritical of me to say he didn't deserve it when he's arguably more Italian than myself. But as I said I only want him in the senior team if and when he is good enough, he should not be seen as a token.

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

Balotelli is clearly not ethnically Italian. He is born of African immigrants and is a citizen of that nation. There is a key difference here, imo. Those who say Balotelli is an Italian are correct. those who say Balotelli is not Italian are also correct. Citizenship and heritage are two very different things, especially in this globalized world. For the purposes of national teams, I think they should be open to those who hold citizenship of that nation and also those who can ethnically identify with a nation through parents, etc.

 

Btw, all these Italian teams have racist elements. ALL OF THEM. It's nasty, but it is also true. What was it? Four years ago that Inter fans caused Marc Zoro to stop playing because of abuse. I don't think it is any different in England, tbh. It really is a matter of what authorities do to stamp these elements out.

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

Side note: Balotelli is a petualnt fool and not even that good of a player. At least not good enough to succeed with the attitude he has right now. He has enough talent to have a very, very nice career, but it won't happen unless he gets his things together.

[Guest Heneage]

Rossi and Camoranesi are as Italian as I am French, were there some issues when they were selected for Italy? (honest question)

Erm well, yes and no. Not many like Camo even Juve fans are very split on him.

 

I personally don't mind, as I said, if they have Italian parentage or lived there fine, I'd love to play Italy so couldn't denie anyone else the chance because they are not 100% italian. But sadly as with any country you will have nationalists who demand purity.

[Village Idiot]

For some reason, all this reminds me of when we tried to get Dani Alves to play for Spain  

(not that it's nearly the same thing!)

 

We have a long story of headhunting foreign aces and fast-tracking their citizenship applications to get them Spanish caps (Puskas, Kubala, Donato, Senna, Di Estéfano...)

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

Village Idiot, I have to say I find that sort of behavior kind of disgusting. There shouldn't be Brazilians playing for Spain just like there shouldn't be Nigerians playing for Qatar. It is against the spirit of international play.

[Village Idiot]

I'm totally against it. That was pure cheating. We sadly do that a lot in sports, we have had a number of foreign aces play part in winning World Championships and Olympic medals in athletics, handball, skying, etc... I don't object to people of foreign origin that have lived and started their careers here, or have blood ties with Spain, but the way we seem to headhunt foreigners for our national teams is not very sporting. All within the rules mind, but still cheating.

 

Still, I don't know how did we manage to have Puskas, Kubala and Di Estéfano in the same football team and do fuck all with it.

[Guest Heneage]

I think you need some form of citizen ship to play for a team, be it parentage or living in the country from childhood/birth.

[Guest foreverer]

Balotelli is clearly not ethnically Italian. He is born of African immigrants and is a citizen of that nation. There is a key difference here, imo. Those who say Balotelli is an Italian are correct. those who say Balotelli is not Italian are also correct. Citizenship and heritage are two very different things, especially in this globalized world. For the purposes of national teams, I think they should be open to those who hold citizenship of that nation and also those who can ethnically identify with a nation through parents, etc.

 

Btw, all these Italian teams have racist elements. ALL OF THEM. It's nasty, but it is also true. What was it? Four years ago that Inter fans caused Marc Zoro to stop playing because of abuse. I don't think it is any different in England, tbh. It really is a matter of what authorities do to stamp these elements out.

Not all Italian teams have racist elements.

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

Balotelli is clearly not ethnically Italian. He is born of African immigrants and is a citizen of that nation. There is a key difference here, imo. Those who say Balotelli is an Italian are correct. those who say Balotelli is not Italian are also correct. Citizenship and heritage are two very different things, especially in this globalized world. For the purposes of national teams, I think they should be open to those who hold citizenship of that nation and also those who can ethnically identify with a nation through parents, etc.

 

Btw, all these Italian teams have racist elements. ALL OF THEM. It's nasty, but it is also true. What was it? Four years ago that Inter fans caused Marc Zoro to stop playing because of abuse. I don't think it is any different in England, tbh. It really is a matter of what authorities do to stamp these elements out.

Not all Italian teams have racist elements.

I think every team has racist/nasty elements to some degree. This is true for every country. It's just a matter of how many people are this way, and whether or not the club represses these sentiments. This varies huge amounts in Italy and worldwide.

[Guest Heneage]

Lazio are some of the worst offenders imo.

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

I think you need some form of citizen ship to play for a team, be it parentage or living in the country from childhood/birth.

The problem is nations are giving out citizenship to footballer like it is nothing, while the poor people who would actually benefit are thrown back to wherever the hell they came from. You may remember the Dutch trying to fast track Soloman Kalou to citizenship. Qatar has some ridiculous rule that allows you to become a citizen after two years of residence and they have adopted several foreign mercenaries this way.