Guest Sniffer Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 The players we are talking about are not comparable to Owen though, NE5. Even though he's returning from injury I'd say he's a reasonably safe bet to score goals consistently over the season. It's Sam's job to convince him that we are going to be capable of challenging and make him stay by suurounding him with the players capable of doing it. I understand the ramifications of the bosman rule, but other teams convince their players to stay or replace them with comparable quality. I'm not convinced that any of the players we are looking at are good enough and it wouldn't surprise me if Owen thinks the same thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 If we sell Owen to Liverpool and he scores 20 goals a season which he is capable of doing, then it's similar to the Andy Cole deal which set Manure up for years in the goals department. We can say goodbye to a top four spot because players like martins and viduka are not consistent throughout a season to maintain a challenge. Anelka also, IMO, is too temperamental to have a winning mentality. ameobi is just s**** and not a factor. Selling Owen and replacing him with second rate players smacks of settling for a uefa cup spot and giving up before the season begins. I agree. But the hard facts of football life is that the Bosman rule has changed things, we have had very little from Owen for 16-17m quid, in 2 years. He's a free agent in 2 years time, in 18 months he can talk to clubs. He owes us, big style. If he won't commit, then we stand to lose his entire transfer fee. Only if he scores the winner in the FA Cup Final can he even begin to repay his fee now. And, the plan is to replace him with another quality player, not an average one, but don't ask he who in particular. There ARE players out there who are quality players, and we would have to go and get one of them, on a longer contract, who wants to sign such a contract and wants to play for Newcastle. not really,the plan behind letting cole go was to get ferdinand in(which should have happened at the easter but QPR'Sshit run put themin relegation trouble).take your pick ferdinand/beardsley...beardsley/cole...ferdinand/cole.................keegan made the right choice in my mind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 The players we are talking about are not comparable to Owen though, NE5. Even though he's returning from injury I'd say he's a reasonably safe bet to score goals consistently over the season. It's Sam's job to convince him that we are going to be capable of challenging and make him stay by suurounding him with the players capable of doing it. I understand the ramifications of the bosman rule, but other teams convince their players to stay or replace them with comparable quality. I'm not convinced that any of the players we are looking at are good enough and it wouldn't surprise me if Owen thinks the same thing. Possibly. If Owen went, we would HAVE to look at a worthy replacement is what I'm saying, Owen could of course be persuaded to stay if we bought big, but in truth his heart is still with Liverpool and he would go back there like a shot, [that is natural - most NUFC supporters playing for other clubs would prefer to play for Newcastle] especially so as due to his injury he has not experienced the adulation he would get at Newcastle which could also change his mind, and its quite possible he could leave having never experienced it now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Possibly. If Owen went, we would HAVE to look at a worthy replacement is what I'm saying, Owen could of course be persuaded to stay if we bought big, but in truth his heart is still with Liverpool and he would go back there like a shot, [that is natural - most NUFC supporters playing for other clubs would prefer to play for Newcastle] especially so as due to his injury he has not experienced the adulation he would get at Newcastle which could also change his mind, and its quite possible he could leave having never experienced it now. Liverpool can have Owen & we get Cisse,Bellamy & Sinama-Pongolle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Pongolle has just joined Recreativo. However, if we could get the best out of Cisse, him and Bellamy just off Viduka has the look of an excellent attack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Pongolle has just joined Recreativo. if we could get the best out of Cisse, him and Bellamy just off Viduka has the look of an excellent attack. I didnt know that it had been made permanent. He is having his best season goal wise. We would be like a posh Bolton Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Pongolle has just joined Recreativo. However, if we could get the best out of Cisse, him and Bellamy just off Viduka has the look of an excellent attack. So you would take Cisse but don't rate Martins? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fraser Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 I don't think that Owen will go. This isn't because he doesn't really want to but because he has nowhere to go. He does not want to move abroad again. Nobody, but nobody, will pay him anywhere near as much as we do: a. Because he's no longer worth that much, and/or, b. Other clubs wages structures would be blown apart, and, c. The transfer fee is effectively already £9m minimum. The top four don't want him (the only clubs that he may be persuaded to take a pay cut to join). There is, therefore, no room for Bellamy. N.B All of the above is subject to correction if Owen does go and Bellamy does return. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Cisse at his best is better than Martins at his best imo. Plus there's about an £8-10m difference in transfer fees. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sniffer Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Again, none of these players are as good as Owen so you are replacing him with vastly inferior ones. If he goes to Liverpool and I accept NE5's point that if that's what he wants we can't do much about it, then the players you lot are suggesting like cisse and pongolle are not adequate replacements for a world class finisher. As for martins, I don't think we'll win anything with him. He looks to me like a player who will score spectacular goals but be so inconsistent that we won't mount a challenge over a full season. If he's 22 he may learn more but I wonder if he's smart enough... If he's 28 this is the best it gets because he's peaked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Cisse at his best is better than Martins at his best imo. Plus there's about an £8-10m difference in transfer fees. I disagree, Martins at his best is practically unplayable! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Again, none of these players are as good as Owen so you are replacing him with vastly inferior ones. With Owen being/was one of the best strikers in the world & us currently being a team that finished below Boro, I dont think atm players better than Owen will be joining us just yet. So we look at what we can get; potential that has grown but has age on its side or big buys that havent worked out so we get a cheap deal. Once & maybe if we can make the big 4 become the massive 5 we can look to sign players better or equal to Owen status. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sniffer Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Anelka hasn't worked out anywhere and he won't be cheap which is something I've never understood. Benitez, recognized by most to be a good manager saw that bellamy and cisse don't have what it takes, either because they don't have the ability or because their heads aren't screwed on properly. Maybe a reason why he wouldn't put in a bid for martins. These players don't have a winning mentality. Owen does. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 I'd take Anelka plus Bellamy instead of Owen like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 I'd take Anelka plus Bellamy instead of Owen like. I'd take Anelka, Bellamy can rot wherever he resides for all I care. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sniffer Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 That's because you are happy to settle for second best and why we won't win anything. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 That's because you are happy to settle for second best and why we won't win anything. Righto. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 That's because you are happy to settle for second best and why we won't win anything. So me some how, in your mind, wanting Anelka over Bellamy, will make sure we will never win anything? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sniffer Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 No...selling Owen and replacing him with second rate players like anelka or bellamy will ensure that that we are amongst the also rans before the season even starts. Owen is a winner and you need players like him in addition to a strong supporting cast. Top teams and managers recognise that. We don't. And apparently neither do you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Owen is a winner is just a meaningless cliche tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 selling Owen Owen may go & we cant stop him. replacing him with second rate players We finished last year in the bottom half, no European football, which players do you think are going to want to come here, if we did sell Owen? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kmdnufc Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Bellamy coming in would almost certainly spell the end of Owen's time at our club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SLK Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Was Owen playing with Liverpool when they won the treble ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Again, none of these players are as good as Owen so you are replacing him with vastly inferior ones. If he goes to Liverpool and I accept NE5's point that if that's what he wants we can't do much about it, then the players you lot are suggesting like cisse and pongolle are not adequate replacements for a world class finisher. As for martins, I don't think we'll win anything with him. He looks to me like a player who will score spectacular goals but be so inconsistent that we won't mount a challenge over a full season. If he's 22 he may learn more but I wonder if he's smart enough... If he's 28 this is the best it gets because he's peaked. Exactly. That is what I think too, and you have put it into words perfectly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hagler Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 benitez is not a good manager even though he's won things....he never played cisse to his potential ...plays ridiculous formations and makes strange subs....like in the cl finale Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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