UV

When people invest in stocks and shares it's a risk investment. They expect to get a higher rate of return on their money than sticking it in the bank where it would be safe. A football club is not like other businesses which can easily expand and diversify therefore the oportunity for share price growth is more limited. (Unless you want us to open a chain of hotels, casinos or supermarkets which would eventually become far more profitable than a football club and make the NUFC part of the business irrelevant). The dividends given out are at or below the rate of inflation (% of the club value). The losses you refer to are directly due to the amount spent on transfer fees and wages in a period where we have made extraordinary expenditure in transfer fees due to the need to replace our main striker with a quality replacement and then to repair the team after the wastefulness and incompetence of the previous manager, and also having to cover for incredible bad luck with injuries to Owen. This is also in a year when we were not in European competition, sot the profits were hit there. When losses are made it is because money is being reinvested back into the business. If a company acquires a smaller business it will affect its profits and may even make a loss for the financial year. As a shareholder would you expect to not receive a dividend because of this extraordinary expenditure? So relating back to the original question, the board obviously does back its managers. Too much for your liking it would seem. Perhaps you would be happier if the board gave less money to the manager for transfers, say only £5m a year on average instead of £10m? That’s £50m over 10 years. You seem to think that the amount of transfer money spent doesn’t affect team performance, so the income would be the same and the profits would be healthy. The board could give even bigger dividends and you’d be happy because the club was making a profit. NOONE believes the board are currently sinking their own money from outside the business into the club, and anyone who says others think this are being incredibly condescending towards their fellow supporters to say that they do.

We have wildly different interpretations of reality mon ami.

You want us to play attractive football like Arsenal or Man U, but not have players who harrass the ref like Arsenal or Man U. You want us to be successful but to put entertainment and fair play ahead of winning. You want the perfect chairman and manager who make the right decisions and say the right things all the time. You want us to be loved and respected by the media and fans of the teams we are beating because of our beautiful football and honourable conduct. You want us to do all this without spending any money. Are you HTT in disguise?

I got as far as "Chel$ki" then stopped reading the lecture on lack of class.

So you'd be happy for them to pay a dividend if the club had made a profit? You know by not backing the managers or something.

Not according to certain soopafans he doesn't, they saw everything they needed to see the moment he didn't score a hatrick in his first game. You have to understand that some people can judge a player instantly. They don't need knowledge or logic of course, they only need to hear there nearest thick drunk gobshite shouting about lazy spaniards and they just know...... Sheep the lot of them According to the poll as it stands there are 13 "sheep" but 84 independantly minded football experts who know better than someone who sees the player train nearly every day. I guess they know better using a combination of their extensive knowledge of Spanish footy (watching all of Luque's games in full of course), and an uncanny ability to extrapolate how he played there in a different team with a different system against different opposition styles based on his performances for us which by their own admission have been very limited. I for one am very impressed that we have so many expert analysts as our fans, and that they can all come to the same conclusion independantly using their knowledge and logic (for they are the ones who are not sheep of course) with much less information to hand than the manager is simply staggering.

I'm thinking of starting a couple of follow up polls: 1) Does a player deserve to be picked because of his form from 2 years ago in a different league prior to a serious injury irrespective of how he performs in training and reserve games? Yes Maybe Don't be a fucking idiot of course he doesn't 2) Does a player deserve to be picked to play even if the team performance will probably suffer just because a bunch of his internet fanboys say so? Yes No IT'S NOT FAIR. I HATE YOU ROEDER! Oh no it's GhoeberX all over again but now there's loads of them

you'd anymore

Yeah, it's just like those black players who moan about racist taunts all the time, they should just say nowt about it instead of fishing for sympathy like they do. That's if there really were any racist taunts... You decide.

He's got Amdy Faye setting them up on a plate for him at Charlton though.

Straight swap for Luque? Liverpool Spanish contingent++ blueyes.gif I wont believe it 'till I've heard it from a Spurs ITK tho.

Forgive me for being petty again, but if you've already written Roeder off ("it strikes me as obvious that what we need to come in at some point soon is a manager who won't take any shit.") then what purpose does it serve keeping him on until we reach your definition of "soon" whenever that unspecified time may be? The point is that every person in the world has SOME personality differences to every other person. To pick out some difference after the fact and say X is different to Y because X likes sprouts, but Y doesn't, OMG KNEEJERK APPOINTMENT! is ridiculous. If you want some credibility please tell me who the knee-jerk anti-Roeder appointment will be BEFORE it happens. Most people on here would have you believe that Roeder knew nothing about trying to sell Milner, glad you agree that the chaiman doesn't interfere with transfers :winking: Actually, I agree with you that I think selling Milner would have been a bad idea. I think Duff is an excellent purchase. Time will tell. I think to say his purchase has had a negative impact on n'zogbias progress is ridiculous, unless you want a 20 year old playing over 50 games in a season. If at 20 n'zogbia can't stand any competition for places at all, then is he really the sort of player you want in your squad? He's going through a bit of a slump in form which is common at his age. He'll get over it. The first part is quite right, but the second part is pretty condecending don't you think. Are you better than other people because you can use a computer? But you're argument was that we should have spent less on the attacking side than we did? I have no doubt that we'll get someone in instead of Rossi, and Sibierski is in our squad as a forward. So you don't want Roeder out now, but you think the longer he's manager the more the club will suffer. I can only conclude you're a Mackem.

So he has a couple of personality traits that are different from Souness, that hardly makes him the anti-Souness or a knee-jerk appointment in a completely different direction. The main problems that were associated with Souness were that he fell out with players, holding personal grudges to the detriment of the team, and that he was tactically inept. Both these criticisms (whether deserved or not) have also already been levelled at Roeder. Uh.... Okay Joker. We had 3 wingers - one of whom is ageing, and another who is just a kid - we now have 4. Hardly overstocking is it? Especially when the wingers are typically the first players who get subbed to freshen up a team. We brought in 3 strikers actually. I guess you haven't been reading this board for long otherwise you'd know that for the vast majority on here the "desires of the fans" were actually to spend most of any money available on a complete overhaul of the defence. We are 9th in the goals conceeded table, and rock bottom of the goals scored table. Who was right about where we needed to strengthen? Manager or fans? Charlton are idiots. If Charlton jumped off a cliff...

Back that up please. In what way is Roeder is the "anti-Souness"? If he is, then surely he must be the best manager the world has ever seen? I think it's ironic how some people (not just you) will complain about the board sacking managers too often or at the "wrong" time, yet are desparate to get rid of Roeder after a 12 game bad run without any different managers (that most would deem acceptable) being available now than there were at the end of last season.

No, plain old supporter will do. Just someone who wants us to win every game we play rather than someone who wants a result to go against us or hopes a player will do badly or gets injured just so they can prove a point and feel superior on an internet message board.

That's what i fear. Please stop "supporting" the same team as me. TIA.

Martins should change his nationality rather than be associated with a country which can't even qualify for the world cup ahead of Angola, a country with a population a tenth the size of Nigeria's. The Nigerian national team is ruining his international career with its constant underachievement, a team which is supposedly the best in Africa but has only qualified for 3 world cups, never getting past the first knockout stage and only won the African Cup of Nations twice in 25 attempts. Ditch those losers Obi.

If only we had a top class defence like Liverpool or Spurs, or signed Woodgate & Huth instead of Middlesbrough, this season would have been so different :PMT: imho tbh etc PS It's your opinion that's the theory, not the fact that our goals conceded stats, season after season, are mid-table at worst.

You're right. In fact we should not play our international players for at least 2 weeks before an international game in case they get injured and can't play for their country, and then pay for their flights in case the poor National Associations can't afford it. Thank god football is currently in the safe hands of someone as selfless and altruistic as Sepp Blatter. Excuse me while I go and tell my boss he should be paying my insurance for my skiing holiday next year.

Apparently we're all insanely jealous http://www.readytogo.net/smb/showthread.php?t=156096

You want me to get this team to play well? That is illogical chairman.

No. I may have started with anger in my heart, but that doesn't mean that is where I ended up. The site has no rant about "fat cat salaries", not any comment on anyone bleeding the club of money. Take the dividends page http://www.nufc-finances.org.uk/dividends.htm I will happily comment on here that I hate, with a vengeance the clubs dividend policy. The site doesn't give that opinion, just states the facts and lets you decide. The site has been thro many filters to try and ensure that it is fact based. This message board is opinion based, with the occasional fact backign it up. I fell the figures are so pwoerful themselves I have no need to guide anyone to make a conclusion. Propaganda isn't all about misleading information and opinions, it's also about the selective use of only certain information which agrees with the message you want to put over. For example on the dividends page you state "This includes nearly £1m during a time when the club did not spend any money on players. ". There is not however a balancing statement that no dividends at all were paid during a time when the club spent £20-30m (not sure what the exact net spend was last year). As for the dividends, you say that "The chairman of any company is duty bound to protect shareholder interests.", so surely the minimum a shareholder should expect is a return on their investment of more than they could get by sticking their money in a savings account. Doing some quick caclulations I believe the club is currently worth around £80m (128m*0.62). I get over 5% on my savings account, so using that as a minimum you could get for such large sums, 5% of £80m is £4m. Is an average of around £2.4m/yr dividend - about what you could get in a current bank account - therefore not a reasonable amount? If anything it's way too small - the chairman better watch out or the shareholders might replace him with someone who'll give them more return for their investment.

At least now you're admitting your site is anti-Shepherd propaganda, and its purpose isn't in fact "not to try and influence your opinion on the way the club has been run, just to give you the facts, and let you draw your own conclusions."

You're contradicting yourself there. If the board are complacent and resting on their laurels, then why weren't they happy to carry on with Robson? They saw a downturn in performances and results, and Bobby's increasing inability to keep the players in line and acted on it. That's not a sign of complacency. No nepotism at Man Utd at all is there :roll: Because it's relatively easy to have one or two very good seasons (Norwich & Villa 92/93, Blackburn 93-95, Leeds 97-01, Everton 04/05, Spurs 05/06?) but it's a damn sight harder to maintain that and not just fall back into the rest of the pack. Every other team in the league is trying to improve every year. Every year some team gets lucky but when their luck runs out (best players or manager leaves, their tactics are sussed) they fall back. We drop back into the pack every now and then, but for the most part even then we're at the top of that pack. A lot of supporters seem to think that's easy and we have a divine right to be one of the best teams in the country, but it's not and we dont.