fredbob

There are a few condensending bits in that letter which would they'd do well to remove but overall, i have to say thats a fantastically constructed letter, really uses the right tone and has actually addressed alot of issues without being abrasive. To who ever wrote that. If only NUSC had relseased that as there first statement.

Mike Ashley did everything right until the moment Kevin Keegan walked in.

I'm reserving judgement until sept 1st, what does that make my IQ?

You make it sound like this is the first season we've been fighting relegation. At the end of the day, id rather fight relegation without the debt then i would with it, if anything im grateful for that. Ill wait till the 1st of Sept, ive seen enough to suggest he did want the best for the club, who knows if he does now, imagine paying all that dosh and still having shit slung at you, how would that make you feel? I didn't make it sound like this was the first time we've fought relegation at all, if I'd wanted it to sound like that I'd have said that. Also I'd certainly rather be doing well in the league with our debt then staring at relegation with the knowledge that if we avoid it this season its almost a certainty next season. I'd rather live with risk then have no future, which is how it seems under Ashley. So why mention it as though its relevant to the point you're making? If the relegation fights came before Ashley input, then i think its fair to say they arent of Ashleys causing, fair? It's kind of what you're implying. As I've said before, Ashley maybe guilty of not stopping the rot, but he definitely isnt the one guilty of starting it.

You don't know anything about the clubs finances, none of us do. And none of us will now that the club is privately owned. Oh and back on topic. No, Ashley does not have my backing, nor will he ever have my backing. Fuck me, did you work that all out on yourself, Watson? The sad thing, is that you dont even see the pure irony of your own post.

You think? With the economic crisis as it is, id say you werent looking at the big picture. For me, the debt repayment is on the same scale as transfer funds, they both serve a purpose for this club maybe of differing scales but they do and thats all i was pointing out that i was happy with. Yeah I think we as FOOTBALL FANS are drifting away from the 90mins of football into all these other areas. The whole Kaka thing, Man City FOOTBALL FANS worried about his signing, just enjoy him playing football if he signs as he is a top player. Were we worried about signing Shearer for that fee at the time? NO because back then it was pre-Leeds & the picture football fans looked at was not as big back then. I am off now, take care & speak tomorrow Sorry, yeh i know what you mean, Tooj said in another thread how much things of changed and how it was no longer about the person who love the game and followed it weekley but about selling a product to the ones who picked up on it and major times like the major tournaments. Money has ruined football now, i blame Chelsea for it, they spoiled thehierarchy of English football which Arsenal had proved was possilbe to break by footballing reasons alone, even now they are struggling to compete and thats a sad state for football when the art comes second to the power of finances. For me the premier league will never be a competition again. Much like the SPL. Shame.

You think? With the economic crisis as it is, id say you werent looking at the big picture. For me, the debt repayment is on the same scale as transfer funds, they both serve a purpose for this club maybe of differing scales but they do and thats all i was pointing out that i was happy with.

When you say pay off are we 100% sure he has? Is it not a case of NUFC owe Mike Ashley? Maybe, im not sure of the finances and im certainly in no postion to categorically comment on them, but in my opinion the debts we did have to 3rd parties were strangling the club in terms of interest etc, if it is the case, then id rather they were owed to Ashley than to the banks. Much like Chelsea owe Roman, either way, Chelseas future is much more stable with there form of debts than Liverpool are with theirs. No on can afford to buy Chelsea with that debt, where Liverpool can be bought for cheaper & have a bigger fan base. Steve "BEST CHAIRMAN EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER" Gibson has not dug deep for his hometown club as they owe him £69 million. The Boro are about £90 million in debt, how they can knock back £14 million for Downing is mind boggling when they A.Johnosn ready to step in. http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/boro-fc/boro-fc-news/2008/11/28/69m-the-debt-of-gratitude-boro-owes-to-steve-gibson-84229-22360988/ Notice in that article that cunt who always has say on 'TOON FINANCES" is a Boro fan. Maybe so but id rather have that form of debt than Liverpool, if we went down a couple of years ago with the debts we had under Freddy, i think it'd be a long long time before we came back up, at least this way the pressure to sell isnt so much. Silver lining and all that...

When you say pay off are we 100% sure he has? Is it not a case of NUFC owe Mike Ashley? Maybe, im not sure of the finances and im certainly in no postion to categorically comment on them, but in my opinion the debts we did have to 3rd parties were strangling the club in terms of interest etc, if it is the case, then id rather they were owed to Ashley than to the banks. Much like Chelsea owe Roman, either way, Chelseas future is much more stable with there form of debts than Liverpool are with theirs. The only things that i heard that are outstanding are transfer fees, and as far as im aware, they arent classified as debt.

You make it sound like this is the first season we've been fighting relegation. At the end of the day, id rather fight relegation without the debt then i would with it, if anything im grateful for that. Ill wait till the 1st of Sept, ive seen enough to suggest he did want the best for the club, who knows if he does now, imagine paying all that dosh and still having shit slung at you, how would that make you feel?

The ironic thing about this is that he's actually already done a huge amount for this club in paying it off our debts.

I see that Ribery is now worth £120m too. Football's gone mad, and City are to blame Ridiculous isnt it? Its completely counterproductive, it may imporve the level of the premierlegaue in terms of quality of player but other teams just dont stand a fighting chance, its sad to say but the premierleague will never be a competition again.

Aye, what a brilliant man he is for going high and mighty and washing his hands of all of us. Better man than Ashley, who is doing nothing other than digging us into a big hole. It's already been pointed out in this thread, but feeling negativity towards Keegan is NOT SUPPORTING ASHLEY. Granted, but i posted before reading the whole thread. I still feel Keegan is being made scapegoat for the actions of Ashley back in September. I dont think he is, i dont think you'll find anyone who thinks Ashley is blameless but i think it's fair to say (judging by some of the reactions in this thread) that theres a fair few who wont allow Keegans named to be dragged through the same mud. (I get the feeling that theres a fair bit of "faux accountability" attributed to Keegan, but nothing genuine or substantial. I wasn going to start a thread a while back about Keegans accountability in all this but decided not to becasue of the inevitability of the thread.

Has he a history of it? Debateable. Also he did lose control over transfers but still wanted to soldier on for the club he loved.... SBR was 10 times the manager Keegan was, antoher reason why i dont understadn the messiah like status afforded to Keegan. He only won one trophy in England though. Dalglish was 10 times the manager Sir Bobby was With Ipswich. Also wont the UEFA cup, and numerous other trophies thoroughout his career. Dalglish has only done it at an already great liverpool side (admittedly) and once at Blackburn. Its up to you to say which one you think is the mightier achievement. You might even say, what do you think of a manager who won four titles at two different clubs and three manager of the year awards. What do you think of a manager who won 2 division 1 titles and 1 division 2 title and no manager of the year awards with 4 different clubs? Harsh, but fair. And is our best manager ever Fair enough!

Has he a history of it? Debateable. Also he did lose control over transfers but still wanted to soldier on for the club he loved.... SBR was 10 times the manager Keegan was, antoher reason why i dont understadn the messiah like status afforded to Keegan. He only won one trophy in England though. Dalglish was 10 times the manager Sir Bobby was With Ipswich. Also wont the UEFA cup, and numerous other trophies thoroughout his career. Dalglish has only done it at an already great liverpool side (admittedly) and once at Blackburn. Its up to you to say which one you think is the mightier achievement. You might even say, what do you think of a manager who won four titles at two different clubs and three manager of the year awards. Harsh, but fair.

Has he a history of it? Debateable. Also he did lose control over transfers but still wanted to soldier on for the club he loved.... SBR was 10 times the manager Keegan was, antoher reason why i dont understadn the messiah like status afforded to Keegan. He only won one trophy in England though. Dalglish was 10 times the manager Sir Bobby was With Ipswich. Also wont the UEFA cup, and numerous other trophies thoroughout his career. Dalglish has only done it at an already great liverpool side (admittedly) and once at Blackburn. Its up to you to say which one you think is the mightier achievement.

Well who do you rate higher? Keegan or Dalglish? What has Keegan achieved at nufc that Dalglish hasnt achieved at Liverpool. The timescales are similar, i doubt liverpool fans would be blinkered enough to hold the same torch for Dalglish that they do for Keegan, they certainly wouldnt protest like we did. Do you know who Keegan is? Jesus wept. He brought this club up through the divisions, established us, got us to the top and were the most entertaining side in England. So that makes him a better manager? Ye, have you seen a manager take over Exeter or a similiar club and storm through the divisions like he did, a few points off the title? No? Obviously. Iv seen Redknapp take over pompey near the bottom of the first and eventually take them to FA Cup win, and 7th place finish and Europe. Did it in harder times as well with more competing clubs, did it more recently as well and i bet there'd be plenty of people on here who;d still maintain Keegan was a better manager then him even though the records arent amillion miles apart. Ive also seen Allardyce take Bolton from the first division to 5th (?) in the premier league and a league cup final. That is the level we're looking at. Its up to you to argue whether Keegan was the best of the bunch but no way was he at a higher level.

Has he a history of it? Debateable. Also he did lose control over transfers but still wanted to soldier on for the club he loved.... SBR was 10 times the manager Keegan was, antoher reason why i dont understadn the messiah like status afforded to Keegan.

What if i compared him to redknapp?

Well who do you rate higher? Keegan or Dalglish? What has Keegan achieved at nufc that Dalglish hasnt achieved at Liverpool. The timescales are similar, i doubt liverpool fans would be blinkered enough to hold the same torch for Dalglish that they do for Keegan, they certainly wouldnt protest like we did. Do you know who Keegan is? Jesus wept. He brought this club up through the divisions, established us, got us to the top and were the most entertaining side in England. So that makes him a better manager? Its pretty futile arguing this, dalglish is by far a better manager than Keegan, the only place he's failed was nufc and even then he got us to the FA Cup, he also didnt get a great deal of time here. Keegan has achieved one notable thing in his managerial career, over 15 years ago and somehow is still regarded as highly as the likes of Houllier etc. What if i compared him to Redknapp?

Well who do you rate higher? Keegan or Dalglish? What has Keegan achieved at nufc that Dalglish hasnt achieved at Liverpool. The timescales are similar, i doubt liverpool fans would be blinkered enough to hold the same torch for Dalglish that they do for Keegan, they certainly wouldnt protest like we did. On a purely objective basis - Dalglish pisses all over Keegan as a manager, but we'd still think Keegan was better than Dalglsih....a few shade up from rose tinted id say.

Do you think Liverpool fans would have Dalglish back? Do you still think they rate him as a manager?

There's a reason they're called the "Cockney Mafia".

I wuld gladly take them both, IMO Johnson would walk into out XI, was different class last season plus he has the potential. Onuoha probably wouldn't if Beye was fit, but would be a more than usefull back up at RB & CB. Depth is just what we need right now. Johnson and Elano or Johnson and Onuoha?

£8m isnt enough for me, Given has proven himself to be one of the best keepers in the Premiership, if not world. If Bellamy is going for £14m, then i want similar amounts for Given.