Guest Sniffer Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 I don't mind piss boring football if we finish in the top four and win a cup now and again. Ask arse and everton fans what they'd prefer. I don't expect it and get beaten by a team like Derby as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmonkey Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 You would want piss-boring footy at NUFC? Have had it for many years now, will probably have it for many years with the present manager, so what difference would it make if it were accompanied by better results and probably some trophies? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Allarydyce done an absolutely fantastic job at Bolton. Which took him 8 years to take them up a division and make them a consistent top 8 team, over the top saying it's an absolutely fantastic achievement although he did do well to achieve what he did, most Bolton fans regard Rioch as a better manager for them in terms of what he done for the club and the football they played, he was another manager who done well at a smaller club but got found out when he made the step up. The stakes are different now for Allardyce, he's at a bigger club and results are expected pretty much from the off, the level of expectation on him is huge and early signs are not promising, if we fail to qualify for Europe he'll be sacked IMO. We will see how long they last in the Premiership without him. He didn't just take them up and keep them there, he transformed every aspect of that club on and off the field, his time at Bolton could be likened to KK's here at Newcastle, only without the cash and big scale of it all. Could Mourinho take over a Championship club, take them up and keep them in the top flight, transforming them into a top 6 club, on a net spend of zero? Could he fuck as like. Don't underestimate Big Sam's achievements at Bolton, they were phenomenal. As for Bolton fans, ask them in 8 years time who did the most for Bolton and I guarantee Big Sam will win that one. I'm not sure if Mourinho could transform a Championship club into a top 8 team if he were given 8 years to do so, I'm not sure if Ferguson, Rafa or Wenger could either, what they all are capable of is turning a good team into a great one, now is Allardyce capable of that because that's the situation that he's faced with, there's a huge difference between a manager making a poor club good and a manager making a good club great. I'd also look at Bolton's downfall being down to replacing him with Sammy Lee who's obviously out of his depth as a Premiership manager. Newcastle are not a good team though, or weren't when Sam took us over, so he's not faced with turning a good team into a great one. His job is to turn a shite team into a good one. Only then can we ascertain whether he can turn a good team into a great one.. And he'll need more than 5 games to do that... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Allarydyce done an absolutely fantastic job at Bolton. Which took him 8 years to take them up a division and make them a consistent top 8 team, over the top saying it's an absolutely fantastic achievement although he did do well to achieve what he did, most Bolton fans regard Rioch as a better manager for them in terms of what he done for the club and the football they played, he was another manager who done well at a smaller club but got found out when he made the step up. The stakes are different now for Allardyce, he's at a bigger club and results are expected pretty much from the off, the level of expectation on him is huge and early signs are not promising, if we fail to qualify for Europe he'll be sacked IMO. We will see how long they last in the Premiership without him. He didn't just take them up and keep them there, he transformed every aspect of that club on and off the field, his time at Bolton could be likened to KK's here at Newcastle, only without the cash and big scale of it all. Could Mourinho take over a Championship club, take them up and keep them in the top flight, transforming them into a top 6 club, on a net spend of zero? Could he fuck as like. Don't underestimate Big Sam's achievements at Bolton, they were phenomenal. As for Bolton fans, ask them in 8 years time who did the most for Bolton and I guarantee Big Sam will win that one. I'm not sure if Mourinho could transform a Championship club into a top 8 team if he were given 8 years to do so, I'm not sure if Ferguson, Rafa or Wenger could either, what they all are capable of is turning a good team into a great one, now is Allardyce capable of that because that's the situation that he's faced with, there's a huge difference between a manager making a poor club good and a manager making a good club great. I'd also look at Bolton's downfall being down to replacing him with Sammy Lee who's obviously out of his depth as a Premiership manager. Newcastle are not a good team though, or weren't when Sam took us over, so he's not faced with turning a good team into a great one. His job is to turn a shite team into a good one. Only then can we ascertain whether he can turn a good team into a great one.. And he'll need more than 5 games to do that... We're not a shite team in the sense that we're a Championship team though are we which was the point I was making. I know we've only played 5 games but the football has been dreadful, he's sacraficed signing players with pace and creativity for players who graft which isn't a good sign for the style of football he'll have us playing, I know you've backed him all the way but don't expect people not to voice their concern when he's playing awful football, using bizarre tactics and playing players out of position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 On German telly they're saying that one of the issues was that he didn't 'get on' with Ballack.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Side by side Mourinho is the better manager, his skills are more honed and he has more experience at the very top level, he's also the more successful of the two. However they are not poles apart as their respective CVs would indicate. Lets not forget that Mourinho took over a very strong Chelsea side that had already had £100m plus spent on it, while he has spent as much himself since. While Porto are the Portuguese Man Utd, and the Portuguese league more in line with the SPL than the Premiership. Of course you can't take anything away from his Champions League success or his UEFA Cup success, those were outstanding acheivements, especially the former and I doubt Big Sam could take the Premiership equivalent of Porto to Champions League success, although the UEFA Cup isn't the competition it once was and doesn't take a great team to win it, nor a great manager. However if Big Sam had of taken over from Ranieri and spent the same amount Mourinho has, I'm sure he'd have challenged for the league too and maybe even won it, I mean lets face it Man Utd and Arsenal haven't been at their best during Chelsea's two successes and were going through transitional stages, Chelsea, due to Ranieri's spade work, were the club most primed to take advantage of that. At Newcastle right now I don't think Mourinho would be able to turn us into a great team. NUFC need someone to do the spadework first, for that to even become a possibility as we are so far behind at all levels. But in Big Sam we have the ideal manager for our club. He'll do the spadework and more and who knows, maybe he can turn us into a great team. We just can't tell at the moment. Back to Mourinho, he has his faults too. His buying record at Chelsea is suspect to say the least as are his team lineups, tactics and ability to fall out with players and club officials. He is high maintenance. I also doubt he can maintain things or change with the times ala Fergie and Wenger. He has the skills to do this but not the temperament nor the patience, perhaps that will come when he's been around the block a few times. Great manager but he'd fail spectacularly at Newcastle in my opinion and because of his name and reputation, expectations would be massive and totally unrealistic. I mean Big Sam is getting stick 5 games in for the style of football, contentious tactics and team lineup and negative attitude that's been on display, things that Mourinho was renowned for at Chelsea, and partly why he's been sacked. I'll stick with Big Sam myself because I have faith in him to do the job he was appointed to do and if he can't then take the club that extra step forward then will be the time to look for alternatives. But only until then, and not before. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Shibby Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 LMAO at this thread! Big Sam would be so demoralised if he read this thread...! Oh, back to the question. YES! Jose in SAMMY OUT! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stephen927 Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 In the current situation, I would rather we stuck with Allardyce. Sam is laying strong foundations for the future, it's going to take a while for this team to be challenging consistently for Europe. So let's say we take a chance with Mourinho, we sign him, he underachieves and leaves for Real Madrid when they get sick of their manager. I'd much rather stick with Sam and bring some much needed stability to this club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest black n white Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 be crazy not to try......depends on how much mike wants to spend and how quickly he wants our club to move forward if not sam is the perfect man to take us forward. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 There is only one manager in world football I'd swap for Big Sam at the moment. Wenger. Oh and a certain German Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest black n white Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 his stats have just been on sky ....impressive considering how he much spent 150 mill + wages for the success he has had sounds good business sorry to many jack daniels while your on mike build us a new stadium better than wembley and reduce season ticket prices Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Mourinho's first nine Chelsea games: Chelsea 1-0 Man Utd Birmingham 0-1 Chelsea C Palace 0-2 Chelsea Chelsea 2-1 Southampton Aston Villa 0-0 Chelsea Chelsea 0-0 Tottenham Middlesbrough 0-1 Chelsea Chelsea 1-0 Liverpool Man City 1-0 Chelsea So that's four 1-0 wins, two 0-0s and a defeat - against Man City, where they failed to score. The only games they got 2 in were against teams who eventually got relegated. 8 goals in 9 games. He'd just spent £70m topping up a squad who had been topped up to the tune of £120m the summer before and who had just finished second. The boring cunt, no creativity, etc. Lucky he wasn't with us really, we'd have had him sacked off by the end of September. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Of course i'd have him,sad to see him go tbh if only for the fact he stood up to Ferguson.He's a loss-Chelsea will be the English Heart of Midlothian now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparta Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 no Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazy Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I'll stick with Big Sam, I want to see what he can do (I just hope he doesn't make any more column in zoo/nuts, whichever it is, about other managers). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 If it was just after we sacked Roeder and we had a choice of Jose or Sam then it would have been Jose. We have got Sam now, he has brought in a lot of his own players and staff and I think he will improve us and give us a solid future. Really wouldn't want to start all over again and have to wait even longer for things to click and fall into place. As said (by others and myself) with the players we currently have and the lack of spending power he had at Chelsea I doubt Mourinho would be playing any more exciting football. Chelsea are far from exciting now despite vast amounts of money being spent. Allardyce will start building this team with his grafters and then bring in the more attacking players once we start having a bit of success. He did similar at Bolton and tried to bring in the creative players whenever he was given the funds. Can't really call the likes of Okocha, Anelka and Diouff "grafters". I still find it funny to see people completely missing the point that our only real creative centre mids have been out all season and our best winger is playing in defence. Lets judge how creative we really are when Barton or Emre are in the team and N'Zogbia is on the left wing with Enrique behind him. With these players in the team and also not forgetting Duff I think its pretty obvious we are going to look a lot more creative than we have with a Geremi Butt partnership and Smith on the right! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I hope you're right Jon but there was no hiding the fact that the players should be doing better with their movement and passing no matter how functional the manager wants them to be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 Mourinho's first nine Chelsea games: Chelsea 1-0 Man Utd Birmingham 0-1 Chelsea C Palace 0-2 Chelsea Chelsea 2-1 Southampton Aston Villa 0-0 Chelsea Chelsea 0-0 Tottenham Middlesbrough 0-1 Chelsea Chelsea 1-0 Liverpool Man City 1-0 Chelsea So that's four 1-0 wins, two 0-0s and a defeat - against Man City, where they failed to score. The only games they got 2 in were against teams who eventually got relegated. 8 goals in 9 games. He'd just spent £70m topping up a squad who had been topped up to the tune of £120m the summer before and who had just finished second. The boring cunt, no creativity, etc. Lucky he wasn't with us really, we'd have had him sacked off by the end of September. I remember watching a few of those games and some of the performances were dire, I also remember Drogba looking way out of his depth at the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wacko Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 On German telly they're saying that one of the issues was that he didn't 'get on' with Ballack.. I heard a lot of the players didn't get on with Ballack. Bit of a lazy so-and-so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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