Ashley has failed Newcastle United.

[NE5]

Question was aimed at mick. The failure to rectify signings that have not worked out is a big mis-judgement.

 

Who made the mistakes?

 

It's up to the manager to rectify the signings that have not worked, the signings which Allardyce made so yes if we go down Allardyce should take a large proportion of the blame, but not all.

 

Quite. Some blame must be levelled at the man who appointed him. If we go down.

 

If we don't go down we'll all be able to look forward this summer.

 

you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.

 

I've heard everything now 

 

As I've said, Allardyce bought Barton and Smith, others bought Elano and Petrov for a little more . That showed very poor judgment by a manager who had been appointed by the previous chairman. Ashley's mistake was not to go with his judgement right away, something he admits. Allardyce is simply the last in a series of mistakes of various magnitudes made by the previous chairman.

 

Blaming Ashley for our current predicament and ignoring the previous five years?

 

I've heard everything now.

 

straight out of micks book of hypocrisy. If Allardyce had did well, Ashley would get the credit, now he's gone, Shepherd gets the blame.

 

2 years ago we were 7th in the league and qualified for europe. Who's to blame for that ?

 

See the bold bit for the critical comment, as Allardyce also bought Anelka for Bolton for 8m ..........

 

The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way. Only a few people disagreed, at the time. Are you using hindsight too ?

 

 

[Guest fraser]

'you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.'

 

and

 

'The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way.'

 

Presumably you now agree that Ashley did back his manager last summer (something he clearly now regrets). Not hypocrisy or hindsight on your part, more a case of having your cake and eating it.

[Mick]

 

he hasn't rectified the problems, as you said.

 

You should be in batman films, you're the riddler and the joker at the same time without realising it

 

Anything Shepherd does is crap, anything Ashley does is beyond criticism.

 

What a guy  mackems.gif

 

Give us an idea of how our summer spending compares with the previous 10 so that we can put our spending into context.

 

As for January "Newcastle thrashed out a proposed £7 million deal for Middlesbrough defender Woodgate on Friday." 

[NE5]

'you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.'

 

and

 

'The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way.'

 

Presumably you now agree that Ashley did back his manager last summer (something he clearly now regrets). Not hypocrisy or hindsight on your part, more a case of having your cake and eating it.

 

I always said last summers transfers weren't good. I also pointed out Allardyces comments that he wasn't happy with the support he was getting. Unless you know better.

 

Are you happy with the resultant season we are having. If you are, fine, if you aren't, I rest my case.

 

Now, as I asked you earlier, who is to blame for our position of 7th and subsequent UEFA Cup run during the last 5 years of decline you are harping on about

[Guest BooBoo]

Its baffling to think that Roeder took us to 7th with midfielders like Lee Clark and Amady Faye getting regular games. It just shows how much the standard of sides in the Premier League has improved in a few short years.

[Parky]

Question was aimed at mick. The failure to rectify signings that have not worked out is a big mis-judgement.

 

Who made the mistakes?

 

It's up to the manager to rectify the signings that have not worked, the signings which Allardyce made so yes if we go down Allardyce should take a large proportion of the blame, but not all.

 

Quite. Some blame must be levelled at the man who appointed him. If we go down.

 

If we don't go down we'll all be able to look forward this summer.

 

you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.

 

I've heard everything now 

 

As I've said, Allardyce bought Barton and Smith, others bought Elano and Petrov for a little more . That showed very poor judgment by a manager who had been appointed by the previous chairman. Ashley's mistake was not to go with his judgement right away, something he admits. Allardyce is simply the last in a series of mistakes of various magnitudes made by the previous chairman.

 

Blaming Ashley for our current predicament and ignoring the previous five years?

 

I've heard everything now.

 

straight out of micks book of hypocrisy. If Allardyce had did well, Ashley would get the credit, now he's gone, Shepherd gets the blame.

 

2 years ago we were 7th in the league and qualified for europe. Who's to blame for that ?

 

See the bold bit for the critical comment, as Allardyce also bought Anelka for Bolton for 8m ..........

 

The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way. Only a few people disagreed, at the time. Are you using hindsight too ?

 

 

 

I started huge, unwieldy - whinning pedantic threads when I first saw the danger emerge that we weren't going to add creativity to the midfield.

 

I am win.

[Parky]

'you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.'

 

and

 

'The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way.'

 

Presumably you now agree that Ashley did back his manager last summer (something he clearly now regrets). Not hypocrisy or hindsight on your part, more a case of having your cake and eating it.

 

I always said last summers transfers weren't good. I also pointed out Allardyces comments that he wasn't happy with the support he was getting. Unless you know better.

 

Are you happy with the resultant season we are having. If you are, fine, if you aren't, I rest my case.

 

Now, as I asked you earlier, who is to blame for our position of 7th and subsequent UEFA Cup run during the last 5 years of decline you are harping on about

 

There's a good quote somewhere from last summer when Mort says words to the effect of he likes money coming in before it goes out.

 

Mort is a great administrator btw but knows fuck all about football.

[madras]

'you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.'

 

and

 

'The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way.'

 

Presumably you now agree that Ashley did back his manager last summer (something he clearly now regrets). Not hypocrisy or hindsight on your part, more a case of having your cake and eating it.

 

I always said last summers transfers weren't good. I also pointed out Allardyces comments that he wasn't happy with the support he was getting. Unless you know better.

 

Are you happy with the resultant season we are having. If you are, fine, if you aren't, I rest my case.

 

Now, as I asked you earlier, who is to blame for our position of 7th and subsequent UEFA Cup run during the last 5 years of decline you are harping on about

i'm not happy with the season so far but i have more confidence for the future than i've had since robson left.

[Parky]

Its baffling to think that Roeder took us to 7th with midfielders like Lee Clark and Amady Faye getting regular games. It just shows how much the standard of sides in the Premier League has improved in a few short years.

 

Yup.

 

More importantly the level of spend.

[ChezGiven]

The club has been handled terribly since the christmas period. We needed to invest otherwise we wouldn't now be talking about fucking relegation! Were we talking about it before then? No. Blaming shepherd is for spackas too as the club looked like it was heading for mid table mediocrity until they decided to change things. 

[Baggio]

There is no immature unthinking hatred from me towards them, i'm impressed with a lot they have done, they just clearly know less about this football club than i do and i was able to see very clearly that the most pressing issue facing the team was the quality of the players on the pitch.

 

They decided that the best thing to do was pay debts off (someone mentioned yesterday that a clause was invoked - perhaps the change of ownership spraked a clause as large scale debt is lot to do with personal relationships and trust). What they should have been doing was getting someone with better technical ability in with pace and an eye for goal for the midfield, a striker with pace and strength and maybe a right winger. Their failure to spot this may cost us our premiership status.

 

I dont think Keegan should be held responsible in the slightest, i think its a bit stupid to think he could waltz into the job with 2 weeks of a Jan transfer window to go and know what was needed. His failure to act is understandable (he did try to sign some players tbf), the people who put him in that position are more accountable for this.

 

So on the one hand you're saying they don't know enough about football, then you go on to say they should know enough about football to go out and buy specific players over the new managers head that will guarantee to improve our position.

 

That Chez is bollocks.

[ChezGiven]

In the face of ridicule I backed you all the way parky. Clear as day to everyone now hopefully.

[NE5]

'you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.'

 

and

 

'The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way.'

 

Presumably you now agree that Ashley did back his manager last summer (something he clearly now regrets). Not hypocrisy or hindsight on your part, more a case of having your cake and eating it.

 

I always said last summers transfers weren't good. I also pointed out Allardyces comments that he wasn't happy with the support he was getting. Unless you know better.

 

Are you happy with the resultant season we are having. If you are, fine, if you aren't, I rest my case.

 

Now, as I asked you earlier, who is to blame for our position of 7th and subsequent UEFA Cup run during the last 5 years of decline you are harping on about

 

There's a good quote somewhere from last summer when Mort says words to the effect of he likes money coming in before it goes out.

 

Mort is a great administrator btw but knows fuck all about football.

 

yep Parky, I know that you were also one of the few with a bit of foresight of the glaringly obvious. Despite the fact that people who like to criticise the old board for whatever they can think of, Morts view of how football works is wrong and very dangerous, as we can see now maybe looking at our short term prospects and the position we are now in, and he does indeed appear to understand fuck all about football.

 

 

[ChezGiven]

Baggio there is nothing illogical in what I said. Its called expecting them to have a fucking clue about the quality of the talent they pay to woprk for them. Fundamental requirement for any business.

[Parky]

In the face of ridicule I backed you all the way parky. Clear as day to everyone now hopefully.

 

I remember it well Chezzer. 

[Guest BooBoo]

I couldnt help on Saturday when i saw KK and Terry Mac looking clueless and downbeat on the bench, wonder where we'd have been if we tried to get out of this "you must know the club to manage it" nonsense and gone down the route of Spurs and Man City. Two sides that have regularly finished below us in Premier League history and now seem to have shot miles past us.

[Baggio]

Baggio there is nothing illogical in what I said. Its called expecting them to have a fucking clue about the quality of the talent they pay to woprk for them. Fundamental requirement for any business.

 

Yes there is Chez, because people would be crying about them going over Keegan's head as soon as he got here, they were already doing that when they got the wrong end of the stick about Dennis Wise coming here, the fact is Keegan had money to spend (unless he's lying) and chose not to spend it for whatever reason, for you to expect a board that you yourself say know less about football to go out and buy players that the manager might not even want come the Summer is one of the most short sighted things I've seen on here.

 

What if they had gone out and spent big on players that didn't improve us? Then what? What happens come the Summer when they have to tell Keegan that a large portion of his transfer funds are gone because they thought they were doing the right thing in buying players that they thought he'd want even though they know little about football?

[Parky]

Baggio there is nothing illogical in what I said. Its called expecting them to have a fucking clue about the quality of the talent they pay to woprk for them. Fundamental requirement for any business.

 

Yes there is Chez, because people would be crying about them going over Keegan's head as soon as he got here, they were already doing that when they got the wrong end of the stick about Dennis Wise coming here, the fact is Keegan had money to spend (unless he's lying) and chose not to spend it for whatever reason, for you to expect a board that you yourself say know less about football to go out and buy players that the manager might not even want come the Summer is one of the most short sighted things I've seen on here.

 

What if they had gone out and spent big on players that didn't improve us? Then what? What happens come the Summer when they have to tell Keegan that a large portion of his transfer funds are gone because they thought they were doing the right thing in buying players that they thought he'd want even though they know little about football?

 

I love the way you throw in a whole bunch of hypotheticals...

 

You scoundrel. 

[S.S.R.]

I haven't got faith in the guy to do anything than try to make money. The only major cash he's spent is on a debt he admitted he didn't know the true extent of, and which he had no real choice but to pay off.

 

 

[NE5]

Baggio there is nothing illogical in what I said. Its called expecting them to have a fucking clue about the quality of the talent they pay to woprk for them. Fundamental requirement for any business.

 

Yes there is Chez, because people would be crying about them going over Keegan's head as soon as he got here, they were already doing that when they got the wrong end of the stick about Dennis Wise coming here, the fact is Keegan had money to spend (unless he's lying) and chose not to spend it for whatever reason, for you to expect a board that you yourself say know less about football to go out and buy players that the manager might not even want come the Summer is one of the most short sighted things I've seen on here.

 

What if they had gone out and spent big on players that didn't improve us? Then what? What happens come the Summer when they have to tell Keegan that a large portion of his transfer funds are gone because they thought they were doing the right thing in buying players that they thought he'd want even though they know little about football?

 

Well, now that we have a DOF, we are guaranteed success then, yes ? Even if Keegan leaves, due to interference from the DOF, appointed by the board who are doing everything right, it won't make any difference because whoever takes his place doesn't change the fact we have a DOF.

 

Maybe they want their DOF to buy the players, as he knows about football ?

 

What a load of bollocks.

 

 

[Baggio]

Baggio there is nothing illogical in what I said. Its called expecting them to have a fucking clue about the quality of the talent they pay to woprk for them. Fundamental requirement for any business.

 

Yes there is Chez, because people would be crying about them going over Keegan's head as soon as he got here, they were already doing that when they got the wrong end of the stick about Dennis Wise coming here, the fact is Keegan had money to spend (unless he's lying) and chose not to spend it for whatever reason, for you to expect a board that you yourself say know less about football to go out and buy players that the manager might not even want come the Summer is one of the most short sighted things I've seen on here.

 

What if they had gone out and spent big on players that didn't improve us? Then what? What happens come the Summer when they have to tell Keegan that a large portion of his transfer funds are gone because they thought they were doing the right thing in buying players that they thought he'd want even though they know little about football?

 

Well, now that we have a DOF, we are guaranteed success then, yes ? Even if Keegan leaves, due to interference from the DOF, appointed by the board who are doing everything right, it won't make any difference because whoever takes his place doesn't change the fact we have a DOF.

 

Maybe they want their DOF to buy the players, as he knows about football ?

 

What a load of bollocks.

 

 

 

Seriously, get help.

 

 

[Guest fraser]

'you can't blame the Halls and Shepherd for Ashley not backing his manager, last summer and last month.'

 

and

 

'The vast majority of people on here, concluded that last summers transfer had been very successful, good for the team, and "good for the business" by the way.'

 

Presumably you now agree that Ashley did back his manager last summer (something he clearly now regrets). Not hypocrisy or hindsight on your part, more a case of having your cake and eating it.

 

I always said last summers transfers weren't good. I also pointed out Allardyces comments that he wasn't happy with the support he was getting. Unless you know better.

 

Are you happy with the resultant season we are having. If you are, fine, if you aren't, I rest my case.

 

Now, as I asked you earlier, who is to blame for our position of 7th and subsequent UEFA Cup run during the last 5 years of decline you are harping on about

 

2003 - 3rd

2004 - 5th

2005 - 14th

2006 - 7th

2007 - 13th.

 

Notice any trends here?

 

Would you like a graph?

 

Thanks for helping to turn 3rd into 7th?

 

Thanks for helping to turn 7th into 14th?

 

In the past five years, whatever went before for which we are all duly grateful, the trend has been unmistakable. The previous board had taken the club as far as it could, it was time for change, that's all.

[Parky]

Guys can we get back on topic I don't want another beautiful thread locked.

 

Many thanks.

 

P.

[madras]

under shepherd i used to think,we've came 3rd,4th etc and lost money but champs lge again could get us back up there,then it was big losses and team going backwards (i don't think we could have kept on like that). under ashley so far it's been ,wipe out the debts and hopefully prepare for much strengthening in the summer.

[Guest fraser]

Guys can we get back on topic I don't want another beautiful thread locked.

 

Many thanks.

 

P.

 

OK. No they haven't.