Newcastle is Peru...

[madras]

Quite simple.

 

Move to the East end.

aye...walker is twinned with darfur for a good reason

[Guest Knightrider]

i thought your whole point was tha they ignored the likes of scotchy etc now you tell us about how much they are spending on it.

 

No, that was not my whole point. Re-read my posts.

 

no doubt if nothing was done someone else would be on here having a go at the state of it and that the council was doing nowt. at the same time as saying about what the council are(n't) doing shouldn't we be looking at the real reason for that areas problems...the sizeable minority of scummy folk who live there.

 

I see your point but I don't think people would piss and moan if the council decided not to spend a few quid on doing up houses for example, if anything taking over people's houses for up to 5 weeks to skim a few walls and fit a few cupboards has done more to piss people off.

 

And why are people scummy? Take a look around the area. There are places in Bosnia that look more peaceful. The area is depressing, demoralising and trashy. An environment like that can't be healthy. If you are what you eat... the same applies, no?

 

I'm a great believer in people and while there are a lot of lost causes in these areas, you can't tell me people are happy living in such conditions, young or old, and don't want better lives for themselves and their kids?

 

By breaking up communities, dispersing people and trashing whole streets into wasteland, they've created a mess of what was once a sound place to live, work and play. Aye it was always rough compared to places like Gosforth etc. but I have lived here all my life as a bairn and as an adult and I've never known it to be like it is today, just a sheer shit hole that's getting worse by the day.

[ChezGiven]

Meanwhile as the City rises and the business, culture, science and whatever else world paint a glorified picture of Toon, the underbelly of the City is dying. I should know I live in the West End of the City and it's a fucking shit hole. Fuck the City centre and all these art buildings and whatnot, makes no difference when the real people who make up the City, who the City belongs to, are struggling badly in every aspect of life from education to jobs, to poverty to crime. I dare anyone to walk along Armstrong/Elswick road (or Benwell) at night and not be terrified in some way. I'm from this area and what I see scares the shit out of me and if anything things are getting worse. Newcastle is a great City in parts and yes all this regeneration and whatever is a positive, but who for? Reporters from the Guardian, art critics, culture buffs etc?

 

The way I see it is that the City has lost a lot of it's old character and virtures, along with the people. Don't get me wrong I love my City and there isn't a place on Earth I'd rather be but lets not pretend it's great and on the up. The scenery may have changed and the place may smell fresh and new, but outside the City centre it's a hell hole on many levels and all this money coming in I feel needs redirected outwards, not inwards.

 

Have a fucking word.

 

You don't even live here IIRC so wind your neck in.

 

What the fuck has that got to do with it? Born in Wallsend and lived there for 23 years. I certainly understand economic regeneration and you clearly dont so why dont you wind your neck in.

 

EDIT - I also travel back to the area around 12 times a year on average, spending time in the most economically deprived area in the whole region.

 

So you pay a visit now and then, big fucking deal. There is nowt wrong with my comments on the City. The regeneration was needed and has been a positive as I've noted, but the more the City centre thrives, the less the rest does it seems. I just wish the Guardian would go deep into Newcastle and write a story about it, put it this way it would be a lot less pleasent reading than the above bollocks.

 

I assume you are referring to your post.

 

Unbelievable. On the one hand saying the city needs regenerating and on the other saying that i cant comment on it as i moved away (clearly for economic reasons).

 

Hypocrisy or just idiocy? Perhaps both in this case.

 

Pay a visit? Yes, to go to the match, more than you do.

 

I said wind your neck in not because you don't have a right to comment about regeneration but because you have no right to pour scorn on my views which are deep rooted and at least, unlike yourself, come from a daily understanding of things given I live, work and play in the kind of neglected run down areas that I'm bemoaning, issues that don't effect you or issues you can't truly understand so pardon me when I take offence at some fucker saying "have a word".

 

 

I said have a word because you were talking through your arse. You still are you patronising twat.

 

 

About what, in what way? What is it you think I'm talking out of my arse about. That the City outside of the centre is falling a part or being neglected? That parts of this regeneration is misguided or unnecessary or that the City has lost a lot of it's character and virtues? Or was it the line "fuck the City centre" that offended you?

 

It was the idea that cultural regeneration does fuck all for the rest of the region which is wrong and the evidence is all around you. The city has regenerated and that has brought increased wealth. Culture was a vital part of that process. Selling the region to economic investors requires having a place people want to move to, live in, invest in. Cultural investment makes the region attractive and also delivers a sense of self to the inhabitants. There are sink estates in every city, not sure what you propose to do with the £100m or so thats been invested. Increase people's dole for a couple of years? Better to establish a process of regeneration that has knock on effects in terms of job creation. What else is a council meant to do? Start its own companies to create jobs?

 

It a process that may even reach places like Blyth, where i spend a great deal of time, if they extend the rail network. Money to do that comes from increased commerce, rates and local revenues. Which part isnt making sense and i'll try and spell it out for you?

 

 

[Thespence]

I know the plans for Walker & it is not about bulldozing then rebuilding or tarting a load of gaffs up. There are a lot of long term initiatives to help the prosperity of the area, to halt the population drain, to make day-to-day living cheaper. I cant be arsed to explain them but if anyone is really interested drop me a PM & I  will make sure you get details of the next public meeting 

[madras]

i thought your whole point was tha they ignored the likes of scotchy etc now you tell us about how much they are spending on it.

 

No, that was not my whole point. Re-read my posts.

 

no doubt if nothing was done someone else would be on here having a go at the state of it and that the council was doing nowt. at the same time as saying about what the council are(n't) doing shouldn't we be looking at the real reason for that areas problems...the sizeable minority of scummy folk who live there.

 

I see your point but I don't think people would piss and moan if the council decided not to spend a few quid on doing up houses for example, if anything taking over people's houses for up to 5 weeks to skim a few walls and fit a few cupboards has done more to piss people off.

 

And why are people scummy? Take a look around the area. There are places in Bosnia that look more peaceful. The area is depressing, demoralising and trashy. An environment like that can't be healthy. If you are what you eat... the same applies, no?

 

I'm a great believer in people and while there are a lot of lost causes in these areas, you can't tell me people are happy living in such conditions, young or old, and don't want better lives for themselves and their kids?

 

By breaking up communities, dispersing people and trashing whole streets into wasteland, they've created a mess of what was once a sound place to live, work and play. Aye it was always rough compared to places like Gosforth etc. but I have lived here all my life as a bairn and as an adult and I've never known it to be like it is today, just a sheer s*** hole that's getting worse by the day.

and why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to shit in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

i agree about the breaking up communities as it sometimes spreads the shit to other areas which is unfair on those. what you describe about it being more savage is happening up and down the country in areas where the council have made changes and in those that have been left.

 

 

 

chez...the train is supposed to be going up to bedlington in next year then extended to blyth the year after

[Thespence]

why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to s*** in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

I deal with people from Beaumont Terrace &  Rogerson Terrace & to be fair them people & areas are nowt. I also dont think Benwell or Blyth are that dodgy. The only area is think is fucked big time & has an absloute edge to it is Cowgate.

[madras]

why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to s*** in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

I deal with people from Beaumont Terrace &  Rogerson Terrace & to be fair them people & areas are nowt. I also dont think Benwell or Blyth are that dodgy. The only area is think is f***** big time & has an absloute edge to it is Cowgate.

while east garth looks worse than ever but isn't as rough as it was.

[Guest Knightrider]

It was the idea that cultural regeneration does fuck all for the rest of the region which is wrong and the evidence is all around you. The city has regenerated and that has brought increased wealth. Culture was a vital part of that process. Selling the region to economic investors requires having a place people want to move to, live in, invest in. Cultural investment makes the region attractive and also delivers a sense of self to the inhabitants. There are sink estates in every city, not sure what you propose to do with the £100m or so thats been invested. Increase people's dole for a couple of years? Better to establish a process of regeneration that has knock on effects in terms of job creation. What else is a council meant to do? Start its own companies to create jobs?

 

It a process that may even reach places like Blyth, where i spend a great deal of time, if they extend the rail network. Money to do that comes from increased commerce, rates and local revenues. Which part isnt making sense and i'll try and spell it out for you?

 

 

 

For all of St. James' Park we are still a second rate football team on the pitch where it matters to the fans. To have a side worthy of this magnificent arena a great deal of spending and attention is needed on the first-team to make the fans truly happy. See my point? The City has always been this great institution if you like steeped in culture, history and heritage with or without cultural regeneration, it's a complete myth that Newcastle Upon Tyne pre-regeneration was this drab, dreary uncultured City full of thick insular Geordies that outsiders or one time vistors would have you believe. Of course that doesn't mean that the City centre hasn't needed regenerating (and rebranded) because it's an ultra competitive world commercially now, especially as industries fall and economies merge, i.e. the world gets smaller and more samey samey. But for me it has came at a heavy cost to the City outwards, especially in your more deprived areas and on every level too. You saying all this regeneration will trickle down and help out such areas is all good and well but when and how? How does the Sage for example or selling the City centre to outside employees help say Scotswood or more significantly the people?

 

As for the inhabitants, we've always had a sense of worth and self, this is the very fabric of what Newcastle as a City was built on. We've always been better than the rest, that we are the special people (in our own minds anyway). We've never been short of that. This is why the place is so special because despite all the economic woes and what have you, the people of Newcastle have never once moaned about their City or seen it in any other form other than a special place. A place they would rather live, work and play than anywhere else if giving the choice. So that's bull shit you saying all this re-generation gives us a sense of worth and self. Like the culture, heritage and history, it's always been there. It's not something that needed bought for us. This is what I was referring to with my false as fuck comments.

 

If anything, that sense of worth and self is decreasing despite the regeneration and global hit our City has become and that's because of the collapse of industry, communities and outward sourcing of pretty much everything but most of all because of the separation of Newcastle City centre from it's outer communities.

 

Anyway as someone who lives and works here and has done all my life all I can say is what I see and what I feel based on these experiences and my views in this thread are my honest observations and true feelings regarding my City, all this regeneration and more importantly to me, the area I was born in and grew up in which no longer exists. If that's re-generation for you, I'll take things pre-regeneration thankyou where there was fuck all wrong with my area in the whole (fewer than 10 years back) nor my City centre, a City centre that outsiders may not have been attracted to, but tough. I loved it. Now? For me it's a place I am not especially proud of or consider to be getting better.

[Guest Knightrider]

why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to s*** in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

I deal with people from Beaumont Terrace &  Rogerson Terrace & to be fair them people & areas are nowt. I also dont think Benwell or Blyth are that dodgy. The only area is think is fucked big time & has an absloute edge to it is Cowgate.

 

Cowgate is rough as fuck. Benwell, Eslwick and parts of Scotswood can deceive. Wouldn't catch me walking home alone at night in any of those areas where as even in daylight, there are streets you just wouldn't like to pass through or want to spend any time in.

[Guest Knightrider]

i thought your whole point was tha they ignored the likes of scotchy etc now you tell us about how much they are spending on it.

 

No, that was not my whole point. Re-read my posts.

 

no doubt if nothing was done someone else would be on here having a go at the state of it and that the council was doing nowt. at the same time as saying about what the council are(n't) doing shouldn't we be looking at the real reason for that areas problems...the sizeable minority of scummy folk who live there.

 

I see your point but I don't think people would piss and moan if the council decided not to spend a few quid on doing up houses for example, if anything taking over people's houses for up to 5 weeks to skim a few walls and fit a few cupboards has done more to piss people off.

 

And why are people scummy? Take a look around the area. There are places in Bosnia that look more peaceful. The area is depressing, demoralising and trashy. An environment like that can't be healthy. If you are what you eat... the same applies, no?

 

I'm a great believer in people and while there are a lot of lost causes in these areas, you can't tell me people are happy living in such conditions, young or old, and don't want better lives for themselves and their kids?

 

By breaking up communities, dispersing people and trashing whole streets into wasteland, they've created a mess of what was once a sound place to live, work and play. Aye it was always rough compared to places like Gosforth etc. but I have lived here all my life as a bairn and as an adult and I've never known it to be like it is today, just a sheer s*** hole that's getting worse by the day.

and why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to shit in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

i agree about the breaking up communities as it sometimes spreads the shit to other areas which is unfair on those. what you describe about it being more savage is happening up and down the country in areas where the council have made changes and in those that have been left.

 

 

 

chez...the train is supposed to be going up to bedlington in next year then extended to blyth the year after

 

 

I disagree Madras, I believe the environment they are in is creating them or if not is keeping them trapped.  Ever since the council started to demolish homes and dispersing people, things have progressively gotten worse. If you can trace a timeline it would lead all the way back to that.

 

What saddens me today in particular is that kids today are missing out on what I experienced as a kid which I'm sure helped shape me for the better despite hailing from a rough area and you could say starting from a disadvantage, and what I'm referring to is the community. When I was a kid the streets were always full with kids which forced you to interact with others, to form friendships, to become sociable and this forced kids' parents to become pally too. What ensued was a tightnit community that looked out for one another. I was never bored as a kid which meant I was always having fun and when you're having fun you're happy. Kids today are ultra bored and desensitised to fun and happiness.

 

There is no such thing as community today and I feel nothing but sadness for today's kids who will dangerously be our next generation. I fear for society I really do.

[Big Geordie]

The West End - a time bomb ?  : Sure it's got it's not too good areas, but so does everywhere else. Scotswood is being regenerated at the moment which will hopefully give the area a lift. I live in Fenham and rest assured, it's no $hithole.

[madras]

i thought your whole point was tha they ignored the likes of scotchy etc now you tell us about how much they are spending on it.

 

No, that was not my whole point. Re-read my posts.

 

no doubt if nothing was done someone else would be on here having a go at the state of it and that the council was doing nowt. at the same time as saying about what the council are(n't) doing shouldn't we be looking at the real reason for that areas problems...the sizeable minority of scummy folk who live there.

 

I see your point but I don't think people would piss and moan if the council decided not to spend a few quid on doing up houses for example, if anything taking over people's houses for up to 5 weeks to skim a few walls and fit a few cupboards has done more to piss people off.

 

And why are people scummy? Take a look around the area. There are places in Bosnia that look more peaceful. The area is depressing, demoralising and trashy. An environment like that can't be healthy. If you are what you eat... the same applies, no?

 

I'm a great believer in people and while there are a lot of lost causes in these areas, you can't tell me people are happy living in such conditions, young or old, and don't want better lives for themselves and their kids?

 

By breaking up communities, dispersing people and trashing whole streets into wasteland, they've created a mess of what was once a sound place to live, work and play. Aye it was always rough compared to places like Gosforth etc. but I have lived here all my life as a bairn and as an adult and I've never known it to be like it is today, just a sheer s*** hole that's getting worse by the day.

and why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to s*** in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

i agree about the breaking up communities as it sometimes spreads the s*** to other areas which is unfair on those. what you describe about it being more savage is happening up and down the country in areas where the council have made changes and in those that have been left.

 

 

 

chez...the train is supposed to be going up to bedlington in next year then extended to blyth the year after

 

 

I disagree Madras, I believe the environment they are in is creating them or if not is keeping them trapped.  Ever since the council started to demolish homes and dispersing people, things have progressively gotten worse. If you can trace a timeline it would lead all the way back to that.

 

What saddens me today in particular is that kids today are missing out on what I experienced as a kid which I'm sure helped shape me for the better despite hailing from a rough area and you could say starting from a disadvantage, and what I'm referring to is the community. When I was a kid the streets were always full with kids which forced you to interact with others, to form friendships, to become sociable and this forced kids' parents to become pally too. What ensued was a tightnit community that looked out for one another. I was never bored as a kid which meant I was always having fun and when you're having fun you're happy. Kids today are ultra bored and desensitised to fun and happiness.

 

There is no such thing as community today and I feel nothing but sadness for today's kids who will dangerously be our next generation. I fear for society I really do.

what you describe is happening up and down the country in areas where the councils are pro active and in those where they dont care. i know environment can affect peoples behaviour but i also know that some will destroy whatever they get. that "some" appears to be getting more numerous

[Guest Knightrider]

The West End - a time bomb ?  : Sure it's got it's not too good areas, but so does everywhere else. Scotswood is being regenerated at the moment which will hopefully give the area a lift. I live in Fenham and rest assured, it's no $hithole.

 

There is growing racial tension for one, especially in Benwell. Some streets are becoming no go areas for white kids, while conversely others are no go areas for foreign kids. A white lass of 14 in Fenham btw was nearly dragged into a car last night or Friday night by two black blokes according to my mate who knows the family. A gang of relations went round in a car looking for them tooled up. I'm telling you there will be kick-offs soon. As for other areas, melting pots. Oh and Fenham is a shit hole, the council ends.

 

As for Scotswood, it's not being regenerated at the moment, it's being bulldosed. I'm in no doubt that in years to come it will be a decent area though, but only because most from there will be replaced by a better quality of resident. God knows where they'll end up, the riff raff. Another Scotswood will pop up somewhere. You can take the person out of Scotchy but not the Scotchy out of the person. Maybe in your street

[Guest Knightrider]

i thought your whole point was tha they ignored the likes of scotchy etc now you tell us about how much they are spending on it.

 

No, that was not my whole point. Re-read my posts.

 

no doubt if nothing was done someone else would be on here having a go at the state of it and that the council was doing nowt. at the same time as saying about what the council are(n't) doing shouldn't we be looking at the real reason for that areas problems...the sizeable minority of scummy folk who live there.

 

I see your point but I don't think people would piss and moan if the council decided not to spend a few quid on doing up houses for example, if anything taking over people's houses for up to 5 weeks to skim a few walls and fit a few cupboards has done more to piss people off.

 

And why are people scummy? Take a look around the area. There are places in Bosnia that look more peaceful. The area is depressing, demoralising and trashy. An environment like that can't be healthy. If you are what you eat... the same applies, no?

 

I'm a great believer in people and while there are a lot of lost causes in these areas, you can't tell me people are happy living in such conditions, young or old, and don't want better lives for themselves and their kids?

 

By breaking up communities, dispersing people and trashing whole streets into wasteland, they've created a mess of what was once a sound place to live, work and play. Aye it was always rough compared to places like Gosforth etc. but I have lived here all my life as a bairn and as an adult and I've never known it to be like it is today, just a sheer s*** hole that's getting worse by the day.

and why are the people scummy ? don't know,sociologists and psychologists will argue for ever and not agree but i think yoiu are getting things the wrong way round....the environment they are in isn't creating them...they are creating it. i live further out in westerhope,brought up in newbiggin hall and spent a bit time in lemington ansd in my experience there are plenty who like nowt better than to s*** in their own nest. maybe the council hit on the idea of "if we tart their houses up they may look after them" and that may be a start to making the local environment better.

 

i agree about the breaking up communities as it sometimes spreads the s*** to other areas which is unfair on those. what you describe about it being more savage is happening up and down the country in areas where the council have made changes and in those that have been left.

 

 

 

chez...the train is supposed to be going up to bedlington in next year then extended to blyth the year after

 

 

I disagree Madras, I believe the environment they are in is creating them or if not is keeping them trapped.  Ever since the council started to demolish homes and dispersing people, things have progressively gotten worse. If you can trace a timeline it would lead all the way back to that.

 

What saddens me today in particular is that kids today are missing out on what I experienced as a kid which I'm sure helped shape me for the better despite hailing from a rough area and you could say starting from a disadvantage, and what I'm referring to is the community. When I was a kid the streets were always full with kids which forced you to interact with others, to form friendships, to become sociable and this forced kids' parents to become pally too. What ensued was a tightnit community that looked out for one another. I was never bored as a kid which meant I was always having fun and when you're having fun you're happy. Kids today are ultra bored and desensitised to fun and happiness.

 

There is no such thing as community today and I feel nothing but sadness for today's kids who will dangerously be our next generation. I fear for society I really do.

what you describe is happening up and down the country in areas where the councils are pro active and in those where they dont care. i know environment can affect peoples behaviour but i also know that some will destroy whatever they get. that "some" appears to be getting more numerous

 

Either way, they are to blame. Not fully of course but when you bulldose communities expect problems. Equally when you ignore them, expect things to stay the same or get worse. I personally think the council don't have a clue how to deal with troubled areas one way or another and whether they do or don't is doing nowt but harm. Mind, when you have a bloke living in a 500K house in Gosforth in charge of sorting out a Scotswood, it's not surprising the council haven't a clue. I'm in favour of handing over communities to the people. If you own your house, you look after it. If you rent from a dodgy landlord, are you really bothered? Give people the responsibility they need. If it doesn't work, what's the difference anyway. Too many people today look to everyone but themselves to sort out their problems and that's probably one of the biggest factors behind the problems that exist in these areas.

[Greg]

So Tiburón, what would you do to solve the problems you go on about and how would you finance such projects?

[Guest Knightrider]

So Tiburón, what would you do to solve the problems you go on about and how would you finance such projects?

 

I'll have to have a think about that one in all seriousness.

[Mick]

Good thread.  

[Guest Knightrider]

So Tiburón, what would you do to solve the problems you go on about and how would you finance such projects?

 

I'll have to have a think about that one in all seriousness.

 

OK, bear with me this is flying off from the top of my head here.

 

Approach it an experiment or trial kind of way. Go to residents of a troubled area and tell them you want to create a super community, to get rid of all the problems, to make their lives better and their kids lives better. But make it a reward and incentive driven thing. Ask each resident to volunteer for this scheme, opt in but no opt out. Build a street in this troubled area and hand over the properties to those who volunteered for the scheme. They now own their properties. Lots of clauses though. If you don't work, you have to go into training or get a job. If you have kids they have to go to school. If you're a single parent, while the kids are at school, you have to get a part-time job or go into training. If your kid is only a baby, once the kid is old enough for nursery, you have to get a part-time job or go into training. Break this and you lose your property and have to move out. Fit CCTV at the top and bottom of the street. Give each resident a garden with swings, goals, to get kids playing in the garden. Put internet in every house. Build a community housing clinic at the end of the street. Residents will run this place and this place will deal with all community matters, from housing to reports of incidents (hopefully there won't be any). Every 3 months the whole street has to go on a street trip. When I was a kid our street organised it's own trips to Flamingo Land or the Coast. Not all residents went of course, but most did. Build a youth centre at the end of the street. Parents run it. Only open a few days a week, don't want kids couped up all the time. Build a play pen at the end of the street too. Put goals up, basketball, benches, climbing frames etc. Give it 12 months. See what happens. Get business to sponsor it/fund it. At the end get the BBC around to make a documentary about it to spread the word, to make other communities interested in the scheme. As a taxpayer, I will happily contribute to such a scheme. I wouldn't whinge because people are getting houses for nowt. I'm fortunate, I have a job and have enough about me to do something for myself in life. Not everyone is the same. Some people need help to help themselves. Some people need a leg up, a second chance. Appoint a housing, social and community person to this street, an independent person whose job it is to monitor things, to chip in with advice regarding jobs, schooling etc.

 

Why not. Where I live they are building a so-called super academy at a huge cost and moving kids from Westgate Community College (my old school), a school that good teachers wouldn't fix, so why not build a super community. It can be done and while it would cost good money, the future of our kids is priceless and a better society would be worth it. You would then be able to truly filter out the lost causes or those who don't want any help, or can't be helped. What you do with the, let them fest away somewhere. Shame we stopped sending people to Australia Seriously, even troubled people who may have a history of anti-social behaviour, crime, or whatever, can be decent people or want to be decent people. It's not easy though for these people. All they know is bother. The environment traps them and helps create them. I'm reading a good book at the moment, Charles Bronson, that poor bastard. A violent man yes, but a good man. He wouldn't have caused half the bother he did in Jail to himself, others and the jails themselves if he was penalised in a better environment. And before people say anything, I'm no do-gooder or liberal, but I do think there is some good in a lot of wrong uns and especially in the area I grew up in. Just takes someone with balls and someone to stand up and go for it. Sir Beecham in his 500K Gosforth House with his private school education and his cronies on excessive wages for doing fuck all are not those people and nor are their plans right for those people. Demolishing their communities, dispersing them and promising them affordable homes when big business had had their wicked way on my old stomping grounds. I'll post some photos tomorrow, yous will be shocked some of you at the state of the area and that people still live in these rund down death traps of broken streets. People need more than a new home, or a re-touched home.

[Greg]

So Tiburón, what would you do to solve the problems you go on about and how would you finance such projects?

 

I'll have to have a think about that one in all seriousness.

 

OK, bear with me this is flying off from the top of my head here.

 

Approach it an experiment or trial kind of way. Go to residents of a troubled area and tell them you want to create a super community, to get rid of all the problems, to make their lives better and their kids lives better. But make it a reward and incentive driven thing. Ask each resident to volunteer for this scheme, opt in but no opt out. Build a street in this troubled area and hand over the properties to those who volunteered for the scheme. They now own their properties. Lots of clauses though. If you don't work, you have to go into training or get a job. If you have kids they have to go to school. If you're a single parent, while the kids are at school, you have to get a part-time job or go into training. If your kid is only a baby, once the kid is old enough for nursery, you have to get a part-time job or go into training. Break this and you lose your property and have to move out. Fit CCTV at the top and bottom of the street. Give each resident a garden with swings, goals, to get kids playing in the garden. Put internet in every house. Build a community housing clinic at the end of the street. Residents will run this place and this place will deal with all community matters, from housing to reports of incidents (hopefully there won't be any). Every 3 months the whole street has to go on a street trip. When I was a kid our street organised it's own trips to Flamingo Land or the Coast. Not all residents went of course, but most did. Build a youth centre at the end of the street. Parents run it. Only open a few days a week, don't want kids couped up all the time. Build a play pen at the end of the street too. Put goals up, basketball, benches, climbing frames etc. Give it 12 months. See what happens. Get business to sponsor it/fund it. At the end get the BBC around to make a documentary about it to spread the word, to make other communities interested in the scheme. As a taxpayer, I will happily contribute to such a scheme. I wouldn't whinge because people are getting houses for nowt. I'm fortunate, I have a job and have enough about me to do something for myself in life. Not everyone is the same. Some people need help to help themselves. Some people need a leg up, a second chance. Appoint a housing, social and community person to this street, an independent person whose job it is to monitor things, to chip in with advice regarding jobs, schooling etc.

 

Why not. Where I live they are building a so-called super academy at a huge cost and moving kids from Westgate Community College (my old school), a school that good teachers wouldn't fix, so why not build a super community. It can be done and while it would cost good money, the future of our kids is priceless and a better society would be worth it. You would then be able to truly filter out the lost causes or those who don't want any help, or can't be helped. What you do with the, let them fest away somewhere. Shame we stopped sending people to Australia Seriously, even troubled people who may have a history of anti-social behaviour, crime, or whatever, can be decent people or want to be decent people. It's not easy though for these people. All they know is bother. The environment traps them and helps create them. I'm reading a good book at the moment, Charles Bronson, that poor bastard. A violent man yes, but a good man. He wouldn't have caused half the bother he did in Jail to himself, others and the jails themselves if he was penalised in a better environment. And before people say anything, I'm no do-gooder or liberal, but I do think there is some good in a lot of wrong uns and especially in the area I grew up in. Just takes someone with balls and someone to stand up and go for it. Sir Beecham in his 500K Gosforth House with his private school education and his cronies on excessive wages for doing fuck all are not those people and nor are their plans right for those people. Demolishing their communities, dispersing them and promising them affordable homes when big business had had their wicked way on my old stomping grounds. I'll post some photos tomorrow, yous will be shocked some of you at the state of the area and that people still live in these rund down death traps of broken streets. People need more than a new home, or a re-touched home.

 

It's not as simple as that though is it. If it was it would have been done.

[Keefaz]

I think HTT, or whatever his name is, has made some good points. There are massive problems in these areas, but I've no idea how to fix them. I wonder what effect the recent migration to the area of African, Asian and Eastern-Europeans is going to have.

[Guest Knightrider]

I think HTT, or whatever his name is, has made some good points. There are massive problems in these areas, but I've no idea how to fix them. I wonder what effect the recent migration to the area of African, Asian and Eastern-Europeans is going to have.

 

I'm not optimistic myself. More separation, ghetto like estates and lots of racial tension. For me, the immigration has went to the wrong areas. Powder keg stuff. These areas are already under educated, intolerant of rules, law and general decency people (not all of course) who don't respect shit. You populate their streets with immigrants who get this and that help of the government rightly or wrongly and it just breeds trouble. I live and work amongst all this and it's going to kick-off one day. A popular opinion amongst a sizeable white people is that the West Road end has been taken over by "darkies" and "wogs". There is already segregation in Benwell, no-one mixes. The last thing these areas need is to be forced into some kind of multi-cultural mix. They can't even be civil to one another never mind an alien race of people who can't speak their language and rightly don't want to mix back. People feel the powers that be give them preference. They look at all the kebab joints opening up and are asking where's the money coming from. It's a sad state of affairs. I guarantee there will be race riots in coming years. Fucked area full stop. There are gangs of white lads tooled up looking for a fight. There are immigrants arming themselves ready for it. Nothing gets reported of course and you'll only read about it in the Chronicle when riots are taking place. There is a sinister hate filled aura about Benwell, Elswick and Cowgate. Scotswood hasn't been too badly effected as there are not many immigrants about and wisely so. But hey, all is great [/chez] 

[Mick]

I've lived in a few areas where very few coloured people lived and they mixed really well and never had a problem regarding colour.  I've also lived in the Midlands where coloured people have been grouped together and the racial problems have been fairly bad, both sides disliking each other and looking for excuses to kick off.  Newcastle has created the same problem in the West End, it could have been avoided.  I must admit, I hate the way certain parts of the West End has become a Ghetto and a colour barrier, stupid ignorant b****** councillors.

[Guest Knightrider]

So Tiburón, what would you do to solve the problems you go on about and how would you finance such projects?

 

I'll have to have a think about that one in all seriousness.

 

OK, bear with me this is flying off from the top of my head here.

 

Approach it an experiment or trial kind of way. Go to residents of a troubled area and tell them you want to create a super community, to get rid of all the problems, to make their lives better and their kids lives better. But make it a reward and incentive driven thing. Ask each resident to volunteer for this scheme, opt in but no opt out. Build a street in this troubled area and hand over the properties to those who volunteered for the scheme. They now own their properties. Lots of clauses though. If you don't work, you have to go into training or get a job. If you have kids they have to go to school. If you're a single parent, while the kids are at school, you have to get a part-time job or go into training. If your kid is only a baby, once the kid is old enough for nursery, you have to get a part-time job or go into training. Break this and you lose your property and have to move out. Fit CCTV at the top and bottom of the street. Give each resident a garden with swings, goals, to get kids playing in the garden. Put internet in every house. Build a community housing clinic at the end of the street. Residents will run this place and this place will deal with all community matters, from housing to reports of incidents (hopefully there won't be any). Every 3 months the whole street has to go on a street trip. When I was a kid our street organised it's own trips to Flamingo Land or the Coast. Not all residents went of course, but most did. Build a youth centre at the end of the street. Parents run it. Only open a few days a week, don't want kids couped up all the time. Build a play pen at the end of the street too. Put goals up, basketball, benches, climbing frames etc. Give it 12 months. See what happens. Get business to sponsor it/fund it. At the end get the BBC around to make a documentary about it to spread the word, to make other communities interested in the scheme. As a taxpayer, I will happily contribute to such a scheme. I wouldn't whinge because people are getting houses for nowt. I'm fortunate, I have a job and have enough about me to do something for myself in life. Not everyone is the same. Some people need help to help themselves. Some people need a leg up, a second chance. Appoint a housing, social and community person to this street, an independent person whose job it is to monitor things, to chip in with advice regarding jobs, schooling etc.

 

Why not. Where I live they are building a so-called super academy at a huge cost and moving kids from Westgate Community College (my old school), a school that good teachers wouldn't fix, so why not build a super community. It can be done and while it would cost good money, the future of our kids is priceless and a better society would be worth it. You would then be able to truly filter out the lost causes or those who don't want any help, or can't be helped. What you do with the, let them fest away somewhere. Shame we stopped sending people to Australia Seriously, even troubled people who may have a history of anti-social behaviour, crime, or whatever, can be decent people or want to be decent people. It's not easy though for these people. All they know is bother. The environment traps them and helps create them. I'm reading a good book at the moment, Charles Bronson, that poor bastard. A violent man yes, but a good man. He wouldn't have caused half the bother he did in Jail to himself, others and the jails themselves if he was penalised in a better environment. And before people say anything, I'm no do-gooder or liberal, but I do think there is some good in a lot of wrong uns and especially in the area I grew up in. Just takes someone with balls and someone to stand up and go for it. Sir Beecham in his 500K Gosforth House with his private school education and his cronies on excessive wages for doing fuck all are not those people and nor are their plans right for those people. Demolishing their communities, dispersing them and promising them affordable homes when big business had had their wicked way on my old stomping grounds. I'll post some photos tomorrow, yous will be shocked some of you at the state of the area and that people still live in these rund down death traps of broken streets. People need more than a new home, or a re-touched home.

 

It's not as simple as that though is it. If it was it would have been done.

 

Oh I know, my idea above is off-wall stuff and will never happen but I'd love to see something happen along those lined as an experiment. The trouble with the world today is people lack commitment to things and proper planning. The council's idea of fixing a problem area is to bulldose it, remove the people and sell the land to developers who will build wafer thin cheap as cheap new homes built with piss poor materials and cowboy builders on the cheap, to maximise profits as much as possible. They kid themselves that these dispersed people now removed from the bad area will return enriched and ready to repopulate and grow a community all over again for them, cheeky bastards. Bull. These dispersed people won't be able to afford to return nor should I imagine they would want to, moving is stressfull enough, being forced out is even worse. My mate lost his house to compulsory purchase, the home he grafted to buy, to settle down with and create a family, taken away from him. He's now in an area he hates and knows nothing of. A local shop keeper, compulsory purchased, trader has option to move his business to a new area. Will his customers be moved too? It's all wrong.

[Guest Knightrider]

I've lived in a few areas where very few coloured people lived and they mixed really well and never had a problem regarding colour.  I've also lived in the Midlands where coloured people have been grouped together and the racial problems have been fairly bad, both sides disliking each other and looking for excuses to kick off.  Newcastle has created the same problem in the West End, it could have been avoided.  I must admit, I hate the way certain parts of the West End has become a Ghetto and a colour barrier, stupid ignorant b****** councillors.

 

When I was a kid growing up in Scotswood, we had a few Asian families move in and of course, Asian shops started to crop up, but it was a gradual thing, it was easy to get used to and come to know and indeed trust and get on with. No problems whatsoever. When it's happening at such a rate of numbers in such a short space of time it's going to cause tensions and it's just getting started. You cannot lump such huge numbers on tiny, fractioned and fucked up communities and ask people to get on and make things work. Humans don't work like that. This isn't so much a racial issue either, it's a population thing. This is what pisses me off because the people making these decisions haven't even stepped foot in these troubled spots and haven't a fucking clue.

[Guest Knightrider]

Not that you'd guess it from what Keegan recently said of Newcastle United's fans: "They come here to be entertained. It's like the people down south going to a theatre." In the north, the implication ran, they don't hold with effete things such as drama. It's a remark that glancingly belittles some of the great achievements of cultural regeneration on both sides of the Tyne in the past 10 years, and unjustly confirms some outsiders' impressions of geordies as artistically philistine. It's one that has driven civic leaders and arts professionals potty: they've spent the past decade creating theatres, galleries and concert halls that rival the NUFC's dreams of emotion, excitement and passion, not to mention entertainment.

 

"God bless him and I wish him well and all that," says Andrew Lovett, acting director of the Baltic Centre for contemporary art in Gateshead, the five-year-old jewel in the crown of Tyneside's cultural renaissance, "but he is so hopelessly wrong, he so badly misunderstands what has happened in the region that it isn't even funny."

 

He's bound to say that, he has a product to sell to people whose predominant culture has centred around sport so much. KK is spot on though. The Baltic doesn't sell out, the Sage likewise. They are a minority thing. Meanwhile SJP keeps selling out. If you asked Geordies what warms their cockles SJP or the Sage/Baltic, 99.9% of them would say SJP where as a huge percentage wouldn't even be interested in the Sage et al if they were paid to go. The Sage and Baltic are an acquired taste and Lovett is deluding himself if he thinks the people of Newcastle are not the kind of people KK was referring too. This is another pet peeve of mine where these goons are concerned. They play it like they've created this for us, to get us culturally up to scratch, thinking because they are involved in some project they are experts on culture or that we must listen to them, ignoring that we always have been culturally up to scratch and that culture and art isn't fixed or defined by this or that, it's a definition of one's tastes and experiences. The Sage or Baltic are not bastions of culture and art or whatever, they are new things actually struggling in the grande scheme of things. The real culture is the people, our dialect, our mentality, our ways, our history, where as the art is our City full stop. From the Tyne Bridge to SJP. The Baltic and Sage are eye candy to impress the world. They don't impress me though or mean anything to me, the Jewell

 

Btw it was the Angel's birthday the other day, now that's a proper jewell in our crown. I love the thing myself. Like the Tyne Bridge, that road sign that says Newcastle or SJP, it means home to me. I never used to like it but I pass it so much these days it's special.