Tactics killing us

[Baggio]

The reason Charlie does get picked is JFK's irish connection. There are a few undroppable under JFK, Butt, Duff and Ameobi.

 

 

Are Butt and Shola Irish too?

[biggs]

we concede too many pens cause Nicky Butt plays

Was butt at fault today for collos bad challenge no,our defence was shit with cacapa playing in it imho .

[Baggio]

Defending deep is the cause of most of our woes under Kinnear which acts as a snowball effect. It is no coincidence that we're conceding penalties a lot because our defenders are usually on top of Shay in the box as we hold a deep defensive line. The midfield gets sucked in too and the forwards then become isolated or get sucked in as well, forcing us to play on the back foot and to concede not only possession but the initiative. Look what happened when we pushed up after the break, we penned them in and forced them deep.

 

On the ball we pump ridiculous flat long balls forward willy nilly and play too narrow. Our full-backs rarely get forward to the bye line either, they get around the area but play the ball back inside a lot. I've never seen us play so many square balls which are dangerous balls to play as they often get intercepted. We're not good enough and lack the movement in the middle to keep the ball tikcing over like that. When we get to the byeline we need to cross it in or get an overlap going and we just don't do that so we are crossing in balls that the defenders are facing which is piss easy to defend against. This is very basic too which pisses me off no end because Kinnear and Hughton are experience guys and the players themselves, surely they have the savvy to see what works and what doesn't for themselves? Enrique for example pumped in long ball after long ball yet none of them really came off for him so why persist? Clueless the lot of them. We are scrapping goals and conceding silly goals. We are yet to perfom well as a collective and I really do worry for us. Passion, spirit and graft are getting us through but that will soon go, especially as Jan comes with a good number eying the exit doors and the more we lose games which will sap the spirit.

 

 

 

The football under Kinnear is similar to what we played under Allardyce, which funnily enough you defended.

[Guest LucaAltieri]

The reason Charlie does get picked is JFK's irish connection. There are a few undroppable under JFK, Butt, Duff and Ameobi.

 

 

N'Zogbia isn't playing because he's a sulking French twat who:

 

1) Doesn't play for the team.

2) Hasn't been living up to the hype recently.

 

Duff is playing due to lack of options, and the fact he has improved somewhat in the last few weeks. Ameobi is scoring goals and Owen was out anyway. Butt is a mystery - I'll give you that. He brings a fighting spirit but he quite clearly doesn't have the ability anymore.

[Mick]

 

N'Zogbia isn't playing because he's a sulking French t*** who:

 

1) Doesn't play for the team.

2) Hasn't been living up to the hype recently.

 

Duff is playing due to lack of options, and the fact he has improved somewhat in the last few weeks. Ameobi is scoring goals and Owen was out anyway. Butt is a mystery - I'll give you that. He brings a fighting spirit but he quite clearly doesn't have the ability anymore.

 

I'd rather watch N'Zogbia than Duff.

[Guest LucaAltieri]

 

N'Zogbia isn't playing because he's a sulking French t*** who:

 

1) Doesn't play for the team.

2) Hasn't been living up to the hype recently.

 

Duff is playing due to lack of options, and the fact he has improved somewhat in the last few weeks. Ameobi is scoring goals and Owen was out anyway. Butt is a mystery - I'll give you that. He brings a fighting spirit but he quite clearly doesn't have the ability anymore.

 

I'd rather watch N'Zogbia than Duff.

 

Fair point, if he's putting the effort in.

[TRon]

What I can't figure out is why Barton and Butt are both sitting so deep. I really expected Barton to be driving forward a lot more if Butt is supposedly in the team to protect the back four.

 

Because our wingers are our main attacking points & with our CB's not being the best & overall our defence being shit they both sit deep to cover them back four.

 

But if both central midfielders are sat back in their own half, doesn't that invite more pressure on the CB's? Which is the point of the original post in the first place I think. I don't think Arsenal have the best defenders but they don't pull everyone back to over-compensate.

 

In fact a lot of the time, Butt was playing further up the field than Barton for me.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Defending deep is the cause of most of our woes under Kinnear which acts as a snowball effect. It is no coincidence that we're conceding penalties a lot because our defenders are usually on top of Shay in the box as we hold a deep defensive line. The midfield gets sucked in too and the forwards then become isolated or get sucked in as well, forcing us to play on the back foot and to concede not only possession but the initiative. Look what happened when we pushed up after the break, we penned them in and forced them deep.

 

On the ball we pump ridiculous flat long balls forward willy nilly and play too narrow. Our full-backs rarely get forward to the bye line either, they get around the area but play the ball back inside a lot. I've never seen us play so many square balls which are dangerous balls to play as they often get intercepted. We're not good enough and lack the movement in the middle to keep the ball tikcing over like that. When we get to the byeline we need to cross it in or get an overlap going and we just don't do that so we are crossing in balls that the defenders are facing which is piss easy to defend against. This is very basic too which pisses me off no end because Kinnear and Hughton are experience guys and the players themselves, surely they have the savvy to see what works and what doesn't for themselves? Enrique for example pumped in long ball after long ball yet none of them really came off for him so why persist? Clueless the lot of them. We are scrapping goals and conceding silly goals. We are yet to perfom well as a collective and I really do worry for us. Passion, spirit and graft are getting us through but that will soon go, especially as Jan comes with a good number eying the exit doors and the more we lose games which will sap the spirit.

 

 

 

The football under Kinnear is similar to what we played under Allardyce, which funnily enough you defended.

 

Its actually not as bad as that and I didn't defend the football we played under Allardyce, I defended Allardyce or rather protested about the growing attitude at the time that he needed sacked after just a handful of games in charge.

[johnnypd]

i wouldnt say Kinnear is tactically inept as he has shown some good insight into exploiting the opposition, but his football at times seems like it is from the wrong century. i also worry about his training methods, everyone, apart from Shola who has improved in this regard, looked like theyd forgotten how to control a football while bullard and murphy made butt and barton look as unfit as pub players.

[madras]

does anyone seriously think defending deep is a deliberate tactic ? it's more likely brought on by players defending with a lack of confidence. as for the long ball etc. V west brom (first half) and villa we played lots of good stuff,getting it down and passing it with some long balls to mix it up.

 

lets make a distinction with the long ball..there is the aimless hoof up field in the hope someone tall bloke will get a flick on and there is the well placed,timed ball. attempting the latter unsuccesfully is better than the former even if the former comes  off.