Newcastle United Finances - 2008 Accounts Recently Filed

[ChezGiven]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Well, you dont build up trust by just releasing financial data. The reason is wasnt believed is because many could see the cynical side of his PR stunts and could not comprehend his personnel decisions.

 

Also, when he came in there was a lot of noise about being a top 5 side that was repeated when Keegan was appointed which was many many months after the financial review.

[Dave]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

[ChezGiven]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

[TRon]

MORE details of the Toons financial state are today revealed.

 

As revealed in later editions of last nights Chronicle, fresh accounts show the Magpies are being kept afloat by a £100m loan from owner Mike Ashley.

 

We told how United suffered a loss last year of more than £20m, have a wage bill of around £70m and are in £22m of debt.

 

But the accounts, signed off by Ashley and managing director Derek Llambias, also make a string of revelations about the clubs previous regime, under the Shepherd and Hall families.

 

They show more than £80,000 a year was being paid to former chairman Freddy Shepherds son Kenneth in consultancy fees, while nearly £350,000 was paid to a company linked to brother Bruce for warehouses.

 

The papers compare Ashleys first year at the helm with the previous 12 months and state: Triple Sports Consultancy Limited (Triple S) is a company of which Kenneth Shepherd (son of WF Shepherd) is a director and shareholder.

 

Amounts payable to Triple S relating to consultancy services were £nil (2007: £81,883).

 

They add: BS Shepherd was a director of the company in the prior year, up to his resignation from the board on June 26, 2007. SMP (Services) Limited (SMP) is a company of which BS Shepherd is a director and in which he has an interest.

 

Amounts payable to SMP during the prior year relating to warehousing facilities and residential properties rented by the Group were £343,458.

 

Ashley paid the Shepherd and Hall families £138m to take control of United.

 

Since then, he has ploughed cash into the club in the form of a recent £10m cash injection and the bumper loan. The Toon accounts state: A loan of £100m from Mr MJW Ashley is unsecured.

 

Other loans comprise bank loans totaling £6,067,000, which are secured on future sponsorship monies.

 

The papers state the clubs previous loans were paid off in full by Ashley in September 2007.

 

There are 118 people employed as playing staff and management, compared to 97 the year before and the wage bill is now around £70m, rising by £5m from the year before.

 

Michael Teasdale, of the Newcastle United Supporters Club, said: All we want if for the owners to communicate with us. If they came to us and said money is tight, I think the vast majority of fans would get behind team and support the club.

 

Richard Slack, principal lecturer in accounting and finance at Newcastle Business School, said: Ashley has bought the club and put £100m in. If the club was to go down, clearly that is not good news but is it a Leeds United scenario? I dont think so.

 

 

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2009/01/23/how-ashley-cash-keeps-newcastle-united-afloat-72703-22761888/

 

Freddie and family were on a nice little earner there. But in his favour he wasn't a cockney cunt and was a proud local lad from Walker. 

 

[Dave]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

[Tooj]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

Wasn't that after he said the money was there for any player that Keegan wanted though? All us fans want is a bit of honest communication.

[OzzieMandias]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Well, you dont build up trust by just releasing financial data. The reason is wasnt believed is because many could see the cynical side of his PR stunts and could not comprehend his personnel decisions.

 

 

"He's obviously lying because he wants to stand among the supporters and has given a job to that cockney cunt Dennis Wise."

 

[fredbob]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

~EDIT: For me personally, these accounts dont excuse Ashley from spending any money but they do go on to explain the absolute nessecitiy of the system and its importance to the club.

 

 

 

[ChezGiven]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

Wasn't that after he said the money was there for any player that Keegan wanted though? All us fans want is a bit of honest communication.

 

As i said above, thats why he's not trusted. He has come out loads of times and said the finances were fucked whilst also saying there is money there to spend.

 

Problems would arise of course if not everyone on the manamgement team is in agreement about the long term value of the investment into the player, given the state of the finances and his apparent willingness to put at least something in.

[NJS]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

 

 

I didn't expect £100m budgets but I did expect a realisation that the only way to any success was through moderate speculation - a view I still take even in light of these figures.

 

 

[fredbob]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

 

 

I didn't expect £100m budgets but I did expect a realisation that the only way to any success was through moderate speculation - a view I still take even in light of these figures.

 

 

 

So the issue for the uproar is changning now - its now more about how much he's spent rather than backing Wise over Keegan?

 

Like i say, i wouldnt care if we made a profit window by window providing we improved the squad.

[Dave]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

~EDIT: For me personally, these accounts dont excuse Ashley from spending any money but they do go on to explain the absolute nessecitiy of the system and its importance to the club.

 

I never thought we were 'flushed', but then I saw the owner come out several times and say he'd be looking to back his manager with significant funds to improve the first team. That didn't happen IMO.

 

I seem to remember when Mort came out with that quote, most people were still fully behind Ashley. It's what's gone on since then which has turned many, hence my request for a link from Ozzie. I can't recollect 'no fucker' believing him, apart from NE5.

[NJS]

So the issue for the uproar is changning now - its now more about how much he's spent rather than backing Wise over Keegan?

 

Like i say, i wouldnt care if we made a profit window by window providing we improved the squad.

 

I've made a few posts where I've said that his lack of ambition/speculation is much more of an issue for me than the Keegan thing - though I do think he got that badly wrong.

 

I agree that improvement is a better measure than "money out" but then if so fundamental to the business why appoint a very inexperienced team?

[TRon]

When all's said and done, Ashley's not exactly penniless, he probably could release more funds if he really wanted to stay at Newcastle, but I don't think he does. He's probably worried that spending on the squad will increase the selling price of the club, putting off any future bids. Especially since the prospective buyers have mostly been relative paupers compared to the premiership big guns.

 

[Baggio]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

~EDIT: For me personally, these accounts dont excuse Ashley from spending any money but they do go on to explain the absolute nessecitiy of the system and its importance to the club.

 

I never thought we were 'flushed', but then I saw the owner come out several times and say he'd be looking to back his manager with significant funds to improve the first team. That didn't happen IMO.

 

I seem to remember when Mort came out with that quote, most people were still fully behind Ashley. It's what's gone on since then which has turned many, hence my request for a link from Ozzie. I can't recollect 'no fucker' believing him, apart from NE5.

 

How many times have you read people say that he's been pocketing our money? Or laughing off his claims that he was prepared to put £20 million in a season because we didn't spend it on players in the Summer?

 

Fwiw I think money was there in the summer but not much, the article in the NOTW where someone from the club said we had £12 million to spend was the truth IMO.

[NJS]

When all's said and done, Ashley's not exactly penniless, he probably could release more funds if he really wanted to stay at Newcastle, but I don't think he does. He's probably worried that spending on the squad will increase the selling price of the club, putting off any future bids. Especially since the prospective buyers have mostly been relative paupers compared to the premiership big guns.

 

 

I can see him being in a quandary at the moment - if the club was still officially for sale then nobody would have expected any investment but after having come out with statement last month he's put the pressure of expectation back on himself.

 

I also think Kinnear has told one truth in all of this - they honestly have not realised what danger we are in of going down.

 

 

[fredbob]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

~EDIT: For me personally, these accounts dont excuse Ashley from spending any money but they do go on to explain the absolute nessecitiy of the system and its importance to the club.

 

I never thought we were 'flushed', but then I saw the owner come out several times and say he'd be looking to back his manager with significant funds to improve the first team. That didn't happen IMO.

 

I seem to remember when Mort came out with that quote, most people were still fully behind Ashley. It's what's gone on since then which has turned many, hence my request for a link from Ozzie. I can't recollect 'no fucker' believing him, apart from NE5.

 

Fair enough thats your opinion, my opinion is that the moeny WAS there to spend, i dont believe the Modric bid was a PR stunt and i dont think these accounts show that we are on a Bolton style budget, i think Ashley was happy to invest his own money, people were right to back Ashley at the time.

 

In my opinion, these account emphatically show the importance of the system and the clubs transfer policy.

 

There are 2 main issues which have surrounded the club :

 

a) Ashley backing Wise over Keegan

b) Not spending enough and therefore not having a complete squad.

 

Well for me, the accounts emphatically vindicate the decision to back Wise over Keegan, they also go to show the reasons for b) but dont excuse the fact.

 

Its the reaosn why im giving Ashley till Sept 1.

[bealios]

We are a high turnover club, one of the highest. The reason for the poor financial performance is the scandalous wages being paid to non-contributing players, with no sell on value.

 

You can still be financially sound by paying high wages, as long as they are paid to key members of your first team squad. But you cannot have loads of players picking up £3m plus per year who are not contributing anything (or very little) to the first team. Think Viduka, Smith, Duff, Butt, Geremi, Cacapa. IMO you can still pay star players (i.e. Owen) high wages if they're contributing. Owen's goal record suggest he may not be a complete waste of money.

 

The same goes for transfer fees. Economically it is less of a risk spending large amounts on players, if there is some sort of resale value. Modric - if we got him, even if he didn't perform then it would be put down to not suiting this league, and due to his age there would have been a number of clubs in Europe who would take him back and we would recoup the fee. However if he was a sensation the CL clubs would be offering silly money. Xisco is not as bad a purchase as you would think. Its his first season, but even if he doesn't make it next year then a Spanish club will take him back for a couple of million.

 

Next year's accounts will quite possibly be worse, with the same high wages, lower gates and commercial revenue, and potentially a Keegan pay off.

 

It's going to be nerve wracking, but if we do stay up then I genuinely think there is a better time ahead - losing the aforementioned players from the wage bill would be a good start, only Owen will damage the first team - otherwise I still think we are attactive enough to get players as good as or better than  Viduka, Smith, Duff, Butt, Geremi, Cacapa. FFS - Martins accepted £30,000 per week when he signed.

 

This might give some clue to the unrest with Keegan - I don't believe the crap about him wanting Henry, Beckham, Lampard etc. - but if he was willing to pay Richard Dunne £90,000 per week to get him here on a 4 year deal, we may have had another Stephen Carr on our hands.

 

 

 

 

[NJS]

Well for me, the accounts emphatically vindicate the decision to back Wise over Keegan

 

I don't get that at all - Wise was spending money on Xisco on Gonzales when all Keegan wanted was a left back.

[fredbob]

So the issue for the uproar is changning now - its now more about how much he's spent rather than backing Wise over Keegan?

 

Like i say, i wouldnt care if we made a profit window by window providing we improved the squad.

 

I've made a few posts where I've said that his lack of ambition/speculation is much more of an issue for me than the Keegan thing - though I do think he got that badly wrong.

 

I agree that improvement is a better measure than "money out" but then if so fundamental to the business why appoint a very inexperienced team?

 

Whats so inexperienced about it? We had a top class negotiator who had many footballing contancts, and we had a scout whos scouted for the biggest club in the world we also had someone with footballing experince at the hishglest level sitting on the board. Just becasue Wise doesnt have the official DOF experiences, it doesnt make him unqualified, especially if his primary target is to look for good youth talent and the occasional first teamer.

 

It makes more sense to work with peopleyou're familiar with than those who you;re not.

[Baggio]

Well for me, the accounts emphatically vindicate the decision to back Wise over Keegan

 

I don't get that at all - Wise was spending money on Xisco on Gonzales when all Keegan wanted was a left back.

 

Wise or Jimenez?

 

I don't really get where this opinion that Ashley backed Wise over Keegan anyway.

[NJS]

Well for me, the accounts emphatically vindicate the decision to back Wise over Keegan

 

I don't get that at all - Wise was spending money on Xisco on Gonzales when all Keegan wanted was a left back.

 

Wise or Jimenez?

 

I don't really get where this opinion that Ashley backed Wise over Keegan anyway.

 

Agreed - his team vs Keegan is probably more accurate but I still think there was a shift making Wise more central as the summer went on - just my obviously biased reading of it of course - just like everyone elses.

 

 

[Dave]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

~EDIT: For me personally, these accounts dont excuse Ashley from spending any money but they do go on to explain the absolute nessecitiy of the system and its importance to the club.

 

I never thought we were 'flushed', but then I saw the owner come out several times and say he'd be looking to back his manager with significant funds to improve the first team. That didn't happen IMO.

 

I seem to remember when Mort came out with that quote, most people were still fully behind Ashley. It's what's gone on since then which has turned many, hence my request for a link from Ozzie. I can't recollect 'no fucker' believing him, apart from NE5.

 

How many times have you read people say that he's been pocketing our money? Or laughing off his claims that he was prepared to put £20 million in a season because we didn't spend it on players in the Summer?

 

Fwiw I think money was there in the summer but not much, the article in the NOTW where someone from the club said we had £12 million to spend was the truth IMO.

 

Until now that has been the logical conclusion for many, given his claims about backing the manager. The accounts show that we've just got no money to spend. As others say, he could dip into his pocket further to try guarantee our survival but I think he's just gambling on us doing so regardless.

 

I don't know how I feel about that approach tbh.

[OzzieMandias]

But he basically explained the situation ages ago and no fucker believed him.

 

Link?

 

Come on Dave, we all remember it.

 

I remember him appointing Kevin Keegan and saying money was there 'if Kevin wanted' a player.

 

Seems a bit at odds with the pretty straightforward explanation that we're skint as fuck.

 

Theres still no suggestion that he wouldnt puthis and in his pocket when keegan was signed - hence the bid for AModric amongst others. We knew that finances were tight at the point that mort said "we were close to collapsing like a house of cards".

 

I dont understand, though at which point did you think we were ever flushed after the owner having to put £100m into the club to keep us afloat?

 

~EDIT: For me personally, these accounts dont excuse Ashley from spending any money but they do go on to explain the absolute nessecitiy of the system and its importance to the club.

 

I never thought we were 'flushed', but then I saw the owner come out several times and say he'd be looking to back his manager with significant funds to improve the first team. That didn't happen IMO.

 

I seem to remember when Mort came out with that quote, most people were still fully behind Ashley. It's what's gone on since then which has turned many, hence my request for a link from Ozzie. I can't recollect 'no fucker' believing him, apart from NE5.

 

I was thinking about his explanation of subsidising the club to the tune of £20 million per annum.

 

Plenty of people moaning ever since that he obviously wasn't doing this, though I can't be arsed to look for links.

[TRon]

Well for me, the accounts emphatically vindicate the decision to back Wise over Keegan

 

I don't get that at all - Wise was spending money on Xisco on Gonzales when all Keegan wanted was a left back.

 

In the summer I was saying that we needed a big mobile striker and a central midfielder as a priority as well, and quite a few people here were saying similar. At the time Enrique and Zog seemed decent full back choices though Keegan was probably right.