Keegan or Shearer?

[johnnypd]

keegan's 2nd spell here wasn't great, and in fact we got worse, results wise, immediately after he took over. But he turned it round. i think we probably played the best football we've seen since Robson left in that little period (roeder's run probably comes 2nd). it's just a shame he wasn't able to do his job properly and was forced out, as I know we wouldn't be where we are now if the club had been ran more professionaly.

[TRon]

Keegan has proven already that he can do the job. Twice.

 

That's a bit like saying Elizabeth Taylor has been happily married 8 times.

 

That's funny...but can you actually make a case that he hasn't done a good job twice without the humour?

 

 

 

God, I've been getting into a lot of fights recently, but a polite question deserves a polite reply.

 

It never quite seems to work out for KK, throughout his management career, does it? He's walked out from us twice, and the England job once. At Man City he seemed to run out of steam and the players were reported to be unhappy with him. He then left football for three years, saying he was disillusioned with the game. The only time it seems to have ended on a good note and he moved positively forward was Fulham to England, and we know how long that lasted.

 

We can get into a debate about precisely why he left in each individual circumstance, but there comes a time when you have to say that perhaps there's a problem with Kevin, rather than the job or the employer.

 

To return to my earlier analogy, it'd be like Liz Taylor saying how rubbish all her husbands were, rather than that she wasn't really suited to marriage.

 

No one is arguing that Keegan doesn't come with baggage so I won't bother trying to defend him on that score. I actually wanted Keegan to lose this case before all the facts came out so I'm not a Keegan bummer either. What's struck me is after this business I recalled Keegan explaining why he had come back into the game with us when he said he was a figure the Newcastle fans could trust with their club. After seeing what's been going on under Ashley I don't have much trust in anyone at the club right now.

 

Sentiment aside, if he was prepared to come back I would love it. Yes he's always going to be a bit flakey but if someone was prepared to back him properly I still think he's as good a manager as we'll get. He'll ensure we play football the right way for one thing, that means he'll buy proper footballers rather than the type of cloggers which Kinnear was bringing in.

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

Keegan has proven already that he can do the job. Twice.

 

That's a bit like saying Elizabeth Taylor has been happily married 8 times.

 

That's funny...but can you actually make a case that he hasn't done a good job twice without the humour?

 

 

The second time, he amassed about 3 points in the first eight matches, before the good players returned from injury and we went on a good little 4 or 5 match run through the Sunderland match...at which point the season fizzled out. Then, we had an average start to the next season...before he quit...four matches in. He was an improvement on Fat Sam, but it wasn't great times or anything.

 

'before the good players returned'...nowt to do with Keegan's tactics?  Better tell Man U to get rid of Ferguson, it was Ronaldo that won them 3 titles!  Why couldn't Allardyce get Owen, Martins and Viduka playing well?  Under Keegan was those three players best ever spells for the club. 

 

The reason Keegan started off slowly is because he inherited Allardyce's team which was low confidence and playing s*** football.  Once Keegan implemented his own tactics we were flying.

 

As for an average start to the next season?  Four point from Man U, Bolton and Arsenal plus through to the second round of the cup...that's average?  Bloody hell.

Christ, all you do is mock peoples responses and post that damn facepalm picture. It's repetitive and boring. Viduka, Martins, Barton  all came back from injury and we got an easier run of fixtures. We went on a good run of about five matches. That's it. Fulham, Reading, Spurs, Pompey (I think), and Sunderland. After that we have average results. Tbh, our results in the next season were nothing to shout about either. We got a creditable draw against an undermanned Man U, laboured to victory against Bolton, struggled to beat a Championship side with a pretty strong team, and were humiliated by Arsenal. That's average. Kinnear was rubbish, and Keegan was obviously better, but still average.

[Frazzle]

Keegan has proven already that he can do the job. Twice.

 

That's a bit like saying Elizabeth Taylor has been happily married 8 times.

 

That's funny...but can you actually make a case that he hasn't done a good job twice without the humour?

 

 

The second time, he amassed about 3 points in the first eight matches, before the good players returned from injury and we went on a good little 4 or 5 match run through the Sunderland match...at which point the season fizzled out. Then, we had an average start to the next season...before he quit...four matches in. He was an improvement on Fat Sam, but it wasn't great times or anything.

 

'before the good players returned'...nowt to do with Keegan's tactics?  Better tell Man U to get rid of Ferguson, it was Ronaldo that won them 3 titles!  Why couldn't Allardyce get Owen, Martins and Viduka playing well?  Under Keegan was those three players best ever spells for the club. 

 

The reason Keegan started off slowly is because he inherited Allardyce's team which was low confidence and playing s*** football.  Once Keegan implemented his own tactics we were flying.

 

As for an average start to the next season?  Four point from Man U, Bolton and Arsenal plus through to the second round of the cup...that's average?  Bloody hell.

Christ, all you do is mock peoples responses and post that damn facepalm picture. It's repetitive and boring. Viduka, Martins, Barton  all came back from injury and we got an easier run of fixtures. We went on a good run of about five matches. That's it. Fulham, Reading, Spurs, Pompey (I think), and Sunderland. After that we have average results. Tbh, our results in the next season were nothing to shout about either. We got a creditable draw against an undermanned Man U, laboured to victory against Bolton, struggled to beat a Championship side with a pretty strong team, and were humiliated by Arsenal. That's average. Kinnear was rubbish, and Keegan was obviously better, but still average.

 

And you wonder why I use the facepalm, you're chatting ****.

[TRon]

Keegan has proven already that he can do the job. Twice.

 

That's a bit like saying Elizabeth Taylor has been happily married 8 times.

 

That's funny...but can you actually make a case that he hasn't done a good job twice without the humour?

 

 

The second time, he amassed about 3 points in the first eight matches, before the good players returned from injury and we went on a good little 4 or 5 match run through the Sunderland match...at which point the season fizzled out. Then, we had an average start to the next season...before he quit...four matches in. He was an improvement on Fat Sam, but it wasn't great times or anything.

 

'before the good players returned'...nowt to do with Keegan's tactics?  Better tell Man U to get rid of Ferguson, it was Ronaldo that won them 3 titles!  Why couldn't Allardyce get Owen, Martins and Viduka playing well?  Under Keegan was those three players best ever spells for the club. 

 

The reason Keegan started off slowly is because he inherited Allardyce's team which was low confidence and playing s*** football.  Once Keegan implemented his own tactics we were flying.

 

As for an average start to the next season?  Four point from Man U, Bolton and Arsenal plus through to the second round of the cup...that's average?  Bloody hell.

Christ, all you do is mock peoples responses and post that damn facepalm picture. It's repetitive and boring. Viduka, Martins, Barton  all came back from injury and we got an easier run of fixtures. We went on a good run of about five matches. That's it. Fulham, Reading, Spurs, Pompey (I think), and Sunderland. After that we have average results. Tbh, our results in the next season were nothing to shout about either. We got a creditable draw against an undermanned Man U, laboured to victory against Bolton, struggled to beat a Championship side with a pretty strong team, and were humiliated by Arsenal. That's average. Kinnear was rubbish, and Keegan was obviously better, but still average.

 

You are using results to make your case, did you watch any of the games? The struggle to beat a Championship side with a pretty strong team you mention for example, we played pretty fantastic football for big periods of tht game but we conceded two goals when Coloccini and Bassong both got beaten in hte air for the two Coventry goals. Other than that they hardly had a kick.

[Guest icemanblue]

Babatunde, what did you think of Keegan's first spell as manager?

[SEMTEX]

Babatunde, what did you think of Keegan's first spell as manager?

 

He doesn't go to the games man, it's not worth asking, he's nothing to you.

[Guest Heneage]

Babatunde, what did you think of Keegan's first spell as manager?

 

He doesn't go to the games man, it's not worth asking, he's nothing to you.

 

 

SUUUUPA FAN.

[Segun Oluwaniyi]

Babatunde, what did you think of Keegan's first spell as manager?

I will never argue with anyone about his first tenure. From what I gather, he was very good to us. Hell, my father loves the man (as a player too), but I was ages 1-7 during his tenure, so I'll avoid any praise or criticism.

[Guest icemanblue]

Babatunde, what did you think of Keegan's first spell as manager?

 

He doesn't go to the games man, it's not worth asking, he's nothing to you.

 

 

SUUUUPA FAN.

 

 

Plastic fans UNITE!

[Guest Heneage]

I was at that Bolton game at home, and we were not anything special, when compared to Old Trafford the Sunday previous it was a different team at times.

[SEMTEX]

Me too. It was pretty fucking dire at times. Still, I blame Bolton more for that.

[Frazzle]

Bolton came to defend, it was a hard fought win with Coloccini and Jonas playing well, and Owen when he came on.

[tmonkey]

We looked like a potential top 6 side once the results started picking up under Keegan (key word being potential before I get crucified). It wasn't merely a matter of wins against average or poor opponents, it was the fact that we were playing decent football on the deck with a tailor-made formation that got the best out of most of the players available (including Nicky Butt). Something we never saw under clueless managers like Souness, Roeder, Allardyce, Houghton, Kinnear, et al.

 

IMO it was no different to seeing the initial slow improvement under Sir Bobby, back when he took over from Gullitt (in fact, Shearer getting a new lease of life under Sir Bobby was pretty similar to Owen finding himself again briefly under Keegan). Take away the random 8-0 win against an awful Sheffield Wednesday, and we were pretty mediocre under Sir Bobby for some time due to the limitations of the squad he had at his disposal (limitations that were only removed once he spent big money on players like Bellamy, Robert, etc). But even during that "mediocre" spell, we still saw an improvement in the team's shape, the football it played, the solidarity, the motivation and performance levels of individual players, so on and so forth. That was entirely down to Sir Bobby making good use of the assets at his disposal, assets that looked alot worse under lesser managers.

 

It'd be easy to point to individual games and say things were average under Keegan, but as with Sir Bobby, a good manager can't turn water into wine so to speak. There's only so much he can improve without investment and backing over a good period of time.

[Guest Heneage]

Me too. It was pretty f***ing dire at times. Still, I blame Bolton more for that.

YEAH BUT MY SEAT WAS CLOSA SO AM DA MORE SUPA FAN.

 

But yeh Bolton came with 4-5-1 in mind, using counter attacking to win which failed obv. But still, even the best teams can break down a tough defence our play was poor as well.

[TRon]

We looked like a potential top 6 side once the results started picking up under Keegan (key word being potential before I get crucified). It wasn't merely a matter of wins against average or poor opponents, it was the fact that we were playing decent football on the deck with a tailor-made formation that got the best out of most of the players available (including Nicky Butt). Something we never saw under clueless managers like Souness, Roeder, Allardyce, Houghton, Kinnear, et al.

 

IMO it was no different to seeing the initial slow improvement under Sir Bobby, back when he took over from Gullitt (in fact, Shearer getting a new lease of life under Sir Bobby was pretty similar to Owen finding himself again briefly under Keegan). Take away the random 8-0 win against an awful Sheffield Wednesday, and we were pretty mediocre under Sir Bobby for some time due to the limitations of the squad he had at his disposal (limitations that were only removed once he spent big money on players like Bellamy, Robert, etc). But even during that "mediocre" spell, we still saw an improvement in the team's shape, the football it played, the solidarity, the motivation and performance levels of individual players, so on and so forth. That was entirely down to Sir Bobby making good use of the assets at his disposal, assets that looked alot worse under lesser managers.

 

It'd be easy to point to individual games and say things were average under Keegan, but as with Sir Bobby, a good manager can't turn water into wine so to speak. There's only so much he can improve without investment and backing over a good period of time.

 

Summed up pretty well. You have to look beyond a few results and look at the style of play being established and the mood of the camp which was sky high before Wise and Ashley started playing games. As someone else mentioned Owen was looking to extend his contract such was the optimism at the time. Although I agree with Fatty on that one, it was right to bomb him out.