Theregulars

No, it's not bad, but to my mind there have now been enough poor / timid performances in matches of that nature that I think it's fair to ask the question. That is genuinely all.

I agree, those were all tremendous performances. But there have been just as many nervy, unconvincing our outright poor displayers in similar high-pressure matches or matches against better sides: cup final, Brighton away, Leeds away, Leicester home, Manchester City away this and last season, Liverpool home this and last season. Maybe that's just football, but in my view there's enough in there to question whether the manager is yet at a point where he is comfortable and reliable in these situations. I don't think he is, and that's a legitimate view based on the evidence in my opinion. I fully hope he can get there and I'll give him a very long time to do it. I would say - not in response to @NEEJ - that it does feel sometimes on this forum that divergence of opinion isn't allowed or tolerated. It feels somehow like I have blasphemed by criticising him. I love him and the team; I can still criticise them. I love my girlfriend and dog; I still criticise them when they're twats or do stupid shit.

I categorically disagree that it's the most important context needed. The most important contexts, for my money, are the context of how the team plays and the significant investment in the playing squad. Despite you phrasing it as fact, it's an opinion, and we differ. When you watch us regularly and in detail, you see a team with no fear who outrun, outmuscle, outduel etc others. My question is, therefore, why does that disappear (in whole or in part) in some high-pressure matches / matches against the better sides? Clearly, against squads which are more expensive than ours and longer in the tooth as established teams than ours, we can perform this way (Manchester United at home, Spurs home and away, Manchester City home last year) - so what I don't understand is twhy, in certain matches, that identity / culture / ethos etc goes missing. In my opinion, it went missing in the last two matches under instruction from the manager to some extent (we were so reserved and timid in both games). It went missing in the cup final because, in my view, the occasion was too big for the manage and squad. So, politely, calling people "willfully obtuse" and context-ignorant because they disagree with you is cheap and lazy in my view. I don't think Eddie Howe is faultless. I think he has done an excellent job but, when he does something or presides over or has some degree of responsibility for a situation in which the outcome is so obviously undesirable, is it not fair to ask a question or make a criticism? You come across as quite didactic: "if you don't agree with me then you're ignorant", essentially.

And compounded by taking off Tonali and replacing him with an even less effective Longstaff. I think the giveaway is that the players visibly panicked, withdrew into their own half and couldn’t pass to one another. That shows a mentality issue, which is the manager’s domain. Some big questions for him, let’s hope he answers them. Blaspheme, blaspheme!

What context have I missed? My opinion has been fairly consistent: he’s really good, but his record in big pressure matches and matches against the bigger sides is mixed. I therefore concluded that he appears not to be the man for the big occasion. I don’t think it’s as outrageous a view as you think it is, but that’s the beauty of diversity of opinion. I hope you “win” this argument and I’m proved totally wrong; I fear I shan’t be. This does not ignore the magnificent job he has done, this acknowledges the reality of what football now is and where our ambitions are being literally directed by those who own the institution. I understand that you think it’s knee-jerk, that’s fine. But I’m not entitled, ignorant, childish etc; I just have a different opinion to yours and I’m happy to debate it in a peaceful manner.

I’ve not said he’s struggling; just that his record in big matches and against the better teams is mixed.

Doesn’t this just illustrate my point - that’s a mixed record.

He’s also lost to 3 of those 5 though…

Yes, I think his record in those fixtures is meh. I really like him. I hope he can improve, because he’ll need to.

I don’t think it is, really. Your stance appears to permit no criticism of Howe. Yes, we overachieved with a small squad. But also, yes, his record in big games is mixed. Why can’t both be true?

Arguably it’s entitled to walk around calling anyone entitled who disagrees with you. I’ll state it again - he did a great job last year and we overachieved. Nonetheless, his record in big matches is mixed.

But literally they do. His record is a mixed bag of outcomes in them, including some quite meek losses. It’s not blasphemy to criticise Eddie Howe. The last 9 days show that he needs to get better in some areas, especially in matches against the big teams and in big matches.

I don’t think that’s fair. You just challenged me to admit he did well last season, which I’ve done. Can you now concede that his record in big fixtures is mixed?

I don’t think I am - I think it’s a fairly reasonable comment. His record in big games with us is mixed.

It was a colossal achievement to finish 4th with that squad. it doesn’t mean that he’s also not the best in big games - he just isn’t, his record in them for us is mixed.

I’ll go through them again: - cup final: lost - CL crunch run-in: Leeds away scabby draw, Leicester home very nervy, Brighton home fantastic - last year away games vs sky 6: lost at Liverpool, lost at Man City, drew at arsenal, drew at Manchester United, won at Tottenham, drew at Chelsea - meh record - cup semi last year: it gets forgotten but we laboured massively. Adam Armstrong was fucking unlucky not to tie the home leg 1-1. - last year home games vs sky 6: great draw v city, meek against arsenal, great win against Manchester United, poor loss against Liverpool, good win vs Chelsea, destroyed spurs - this year first 2 big games: lost with poor performances. The point I’m making is, on evidence, his record on big occasions isn’t great. I don’t think it’s as wild a take as you’re making it out to be. This is before we remember all the really disappointing performances last year when we couldn’t score. He is a very very good manager, I sense that he isn’t elite. I hope I’m wrong.

As I’ve said in my other post now, his record in big matches is really mixed. We seem to line up afraid of the bigger sides. That needs to change or he won’t last in the role; it’s denying factual reality to suggest he’s a big game manager. He isn’t, on evidence with us thus far.

Well I’m not sure your take is as nuanced as reality suggests it should be. When the pressure of the run-in really ramped up - ie when Liverpool started winning every week - we drew at leeds looking pretty ropey, we played great v Brighton, and we were edgy and a pope wondersave away from a loss against Leicester. We were meek AF in the cup final. We were meek away to city both this and last season. We were wank at home to arsenal last season. We devoured spurs when we needed to and beat Man U at home in a big match. His record in big fixtures is mixed. It suggests to me that he isnt quite top table at this stage. Today we didn’t look like a well coached team.

Not the man for the big occasion, at all.

That wasn’t the performance of a top 4 side, basically.

Indeed - which makes it even more difficult to explain why the manager instructed the players to stand off them let them have possession.

Well they had a body short, and still deservedly and confidently beat us. That match was nothing to do with FFP. Was just crap from manager in particular and players.

I hope someone asks Howe in the presser “why do you seem to be scared of Klopp and Liverpool?”

Yup - really poor from him today, and last week. Same as the cup final, home to arsenal, Leicester match etc - there’s an evident and clear trend of them bottling the big occasion and not knowing how to step up. That was a concession, not a defeat.

No, I won’t. It’s a fair comment. That was extremely poor in-game management from Howe.