Mick

Things had moved on, that was a different argument.

I wouldn't, the same was said about defenders last season and more often than not somebody would come in and people wanted them out next game. Dummett looks good but he's got a lot to learn before he should be willingly thrown in against Premiership teams.

I didn't flip anything, that's your trait. You didn't, eh? From: We didn't try to win the UEFA, we tried to go as far as we could but I have seen nothing to suggest that we tried to win it. To: We were playing mostly inferior teams, it's not as if we had to do a lot to get out of the group. What's wrong with that?

He's played well before and been dropped when he should have stayed in the team.

I think he does well considering he hasn't got the incentive of playing for a place in the team.

I didn't flip anything, that's your trait.

If you say so.

We were playing mostly inferior teams, it's not as if we had to do a lot to get out of the group.

Bollocks did we.

Ok, I'll re-phrase what I was getting at. I don't think we set out to win a cup but we'll take it if we manage to win it.

I didn't say that we weren't trying to win individual games although I could have highlighted games in the UEFA which I don't think we tried to win, especially against Benfica.

Happy face claimed "When we were in the top half, before the awful pre Christmas run? If you won't accept top half standard then he's got no hope." Is it not acceptable that people should educate him? He seems a pretty well educated bloke, to be honest. I'm sure he's well aware of our results and performances from last season, but he may have seen them in a slightly less negative light. I don't know, he'll manage, I think. He clearly thinks our form before Christmas was good enough, that has nothing to do with being less negative, it's delusional.

We started the season with one first team signing and had got rid of 3 players who had played a lot of games the season before. We didn't invest in a team who had potentially 17 extra games to play.

We took on more games without investing in the squad because we wanted to win it, aye, right.

Aye, that's what I meant.

He doesn't get the consistency of games, how can he be expected to play with consistency?

We didn't try to win the UEFA, we tried to go as far as we could but I have seen nothing to suggest that we tried to win it.

Happy face claimed "When we were in the top half, before the awful pre Christmas run? If you won't accept top half standard then he's got no hope." Is it not acceptable that people should educate him?

nailed it - the league is beyond 70% of the teams in it before a ball is kicked, to not try in the cups is a p*ss take tbh It's more confirmation of what most expected anyway. We have no ambition to do anything other than to stay in the division, that is now beyond doubt.

It's not being forced on any club, it's a choice made by our club and that's why some do blame our club.

http://fans.in3sixty.com/2012/08/18/puma/default/

Spot on, unless a club is going to challenge for the league or fight relegation they should be looking to do well in the cups. I can't understand any so called supporter sticking up for the club on this matter.

We lost our next game, it did get worse though because I think we were drawing a few games early on. The Norwich home game in September wasn't very good for a win and the next game was Reading and we drew with them and looked poor. I'm sure Pardew tipped them to stay up after that game and he said they were a good team. They weren't a good team, it was us that made them look less than shite. Our really bad form probably started in early November when we lost to West Ham at home.

You're right, we did start off well last season, we beat Spurs 2-1 at home in our first game and it didn't go pear shaped until after that.

That's not really breaking news.