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When you're a fullback, you don't wanna get beat to the byline because a lot more damage can be caused, so most defenders will allow the cutback cross because it's the lesser of two evils. Why does a quality goal have to be turned into a mistake by one of our players?

Piss off. Quality cross, quality header, quality goal. He probably could have closed Malbranque down a bit but that really wasn't 'absolutely fucking awful' defending.

Great header to be fair.

What a good start. Only 5 mins in but we're passing it well and should be 1-0 up already.

Quite a few big games today; apart from our game, there'll be the Merseyside derby which might determine the 4th English qualifier for the Champions League if Liverpool win. In other leagues, there should be a good game at the Bernabeu where Real take on Sevilla (who have steadily improved). If Real win this, they'll again have another 7 pt advantage which when considering that Barca are still in the CL, will probably seal the title for them.

Malbranque had a great time the last time we were at WHL. We have to close their two widemen down quickly and force them to play a more central game. I think our midfield will be overrun today (aint too hard to predict I know) but if Martins is on form, we've got a good chance of getting a point, which will be massive. The scary thing is that if KK sticks with the same formation, we'll have three relatively slow central midfielders playing, which will play right into Spurs' hands.

IIRC Cahill a couple of years ago.

Tbf to Cristiano, he's got a long long time to left to make his mark on the footballing world - he's only 23 so he'll have at least a couple more WCs and a couple more Euros plus the fact that in every season he'll be playing for a quality team consistently challenging for domestic and European honours. He'll have ample time and opportunity to be recognized as a great. But, if this is his peak, then he's not a great.

It's a damn shame that we only got one season of the £15m Shearer.

Shearer performed awfully in WC 98 and Euro 00. You're being very kind After injury/past his peak. Judge him on the seasons prior to that. Edit: He was awesome in that season for Blackburn and in Euro 96.

You had your Terry Butcher's and the "No nonsense" like in Maradona's day. Maradona was short, but he was far from fragile. Sadly, there's almost as much of a chance of Messi's career being wasted away on many a physio's room as there is of him winning a few Ballon d'Ors and helping the Argies win a WC or two. The 'range' [/mathgeek] that his career could take is ridiculously enormous at this stage because of the quality he's shown and the amount of injuries that he's had.

3-2 Betis. What a meltdown by Barca.

The fact that this question is even being asked (and discussed fervently in Argentina) should be taken as a massive compliment by the kid (let's hope he reads N-O ). He's got a massive future if he can stay injury-free but no, he won't get there.

Well i just think he's an amazing talent, he's already achieved a considerable amount in his short career, (CL semi, Euro 2004 Finalist, World Player of the year 3rd, 60-70 goals for Man U as a winger in 4 season(?), 20 goals at international level) For me he's proved himself to an extent at every single level, its unfair to call him a bottler because of the CL Semi final when in reality the whole team misfired), the likes of Zidane achieved personal glory at a much older age, its kind of unfair to directly compare the like s of Ronaldo to Zidane because as far as im concerned a midfileder has far more oppurtunity to control a game, and make a difference whereas its harder for a winger. If we were to consider the greatest winger then he'd be up there with the likes of Best so why not put him in with the likes of Zidane? Well maybe I'm prejudiced against wingers (if Ronaldo is even one), but I'd say in terms of the most impact a position can have, in my very quickly-formed opinion, it goes.. Strikers = Center mids/playmakers > Centerbacks > Wingers = GKs > Fullbacks Maybe this will explain why all the 'greats' in my head tend to be strikers/cms/traditional #10s? So if you're a winger, you're pretty much ruled out from ending up as a 'great' because of the position you play. So if you say Ronaldo is a winger, that'll be my explanation of why he isn't, and won't, end up being mentioned along the likes of Zidane.

The game's way different. It's become way more physical, and even though I believe in the 'quality will shine through' adage, Messi's too fragile to have that of an impact and career.

No.

Arsenal were dominated in that game against Chelsea though - not necessarily the best match to make Henry's case. Inter Meelan away. Touche I think Henry does have a decent case but the lack of a European title/memorable run obviously counts against him. He's unlucky in that the Arsenal team of those days (the latter days of Vieira) were never seemingly suited to European football, and he was also pretty unlucky in that he, like nearly every other Frenchman, was overshadowed by Zidane's brilliance on the international stage.

What's he done then? Why do you place him up there with the likes of Zidane? Edit: to fredbob.

Arsenal were dominated in that game against Chelsea though - not necessarily the best match to make Henry's case.

Shame about the injuries.

Rivaldo, really Jonny? Could have done so much more with what he had, though that overhead kick is definitely in the top 10 all-time moments of football 'clutchness' (borrowing a term from the Americans). Romario officially retired a couple of days ago as well I remember being woken up by my dad in the late hours of the night to watch some of the '94 WC matches, and remember seeing his goal against Sweden in the semis. Larsson's hair back then was quality Bebeto was a fav of mine as well with his baby-rocking celebration, which was obviously imitated quite a few times at the park the next day even though I had no idea what it meant

Not a problem In other news, Inter have scored. They're playing well against a pretty good Lazio side. With Roma only getting a draw, they could settle it today.

I think it's more about a sense/feeling about who you expect to deliver. You expect (that cunt) Gerrard to deliver when it matters. The key is to consistently deliver in these big moments because those are the only moments that will matter 20 years from now. That's why even though players like van Basten had a short-ish career, they'll always be remembered for their 'moments'. What's Ronaldo's 'moment' so far? What's any top footballer's 'moment' so far? I'd say that even Ronaldinho hasn't had his and will not go down as one of the greats. Great players have moments/tournaments which are forever associated with them. Eusebio had his 4 goals against North Korea as his moment, van Basten the wonder goal, Baggio with his incredible play in the '94 WC, Zizou the double in the WC final and the goal against Leverkusen - obviously I could go on but that's the gist of my argument. Only if its in a Liverpool Shirt and he can cheat. Gerrard is no where near being a great if Ronaldo the second isn't I never said he was a great. His resume still lacks quite a lot but I mentioned him because he has delivered when it mattered most. That's obviously a factor in whether a player ends up being considered a great, don't you think? That, combined with general awesomeness in domestic and international football, would boost the credentials of any wannabe 'great' player. I should preface this by saying I don't think Gerrard is (or will end up being) considered a great. I'm just saying that he does tick one of the main boxes - delivering when it matters most; CL final, FA Cup final, rescuing his team against Olympiakos etc. That's all. He doesn't tick the two other main boxes - general awesomeness in domestic football, and general awesomeness in international football. I only mentioned him because there just aren't any players out there who consistently deliver when it matters most. Not one. Not Ronaldo, Kaka, Rooney, Henry nor Messi. At least not yet anyway, so I had to settle for Gerrard because he ticked that particular box and I was discussing that particular 'box'. That's it

I think it's more about a sense/feeling about who you expect to deliver. You expect (that cunt) Gerrard to deliver when it matters. The key is to consistently deliver in these big moments because those are the only moments that will matter 20 years from now. That's why even though players like van Basten had a short-ish career, they'll always be remembered for their 'moments'. What's Ronaldo's 'moment' so far? What's any top footballer's 'moment' so far? I'd say that even Ronaldinho hasn't had his and will not go down as one of the greats. Great players have moments/tournaments which are forever associated with them. Eusebio had his 4 goals against North Korea as his moment, van Basten the wonder goal, Baggio with his incredible play in the '94 WC, Zizou the double in the WC final and the goal against Leverkusen - obviously I could go on but that's the gist of my argument. Only if its in a Liverpool Shirt and he can cheat. Gerrard is no where near being a great if Ronaldo the second isn't I never said he was a great. His resume still lacks quite a lot but I mentioned him because he has delivered when it mattered most. That's obviously a factor in whether a player ends up being considered a great, don't you think? That, combined with general awesomeness in domestic and international football, would boost the credentials of any wannabe 'great' player.

I'm abstaining. I think that these arguments can't really be done until after a few years (at least) after the players have peaked. It's way too early to judge how much of an impact Ronaldo is currently having on football in general.