afar

I think what is pretty clear is that both side are a ways away from each other. My feeling is that, the club has offered a figure of around 80k a week, as other people have suggested. That would still make him the top earner at the club and rightly so. But putting yourself in Owen's shoes, he'll have a hard time accepting that. Not just from a monetary point of view but also pride. My feeling is that Owen will in the end reject it and chose to wait till the summer of 09 to see what offers come in there. He'll probably then leave for a contract of 80k+plus inflation some place else. The club obviously won't want this to happen, so they'll try to sell him but they'll have a hard time finding a buyer who'll offer Owen an acceptable salary. We could even sell him and still pay a portion of his wages. TBH it's not a good situation, the simplest solution is to offer him the same terms as he's currently on. I'm pretty confident he would accept. But I don't think that would sit well with the club's financial folks.

Spot on.

At 15 mill, may be out of our league.

From the beeb: Bolton are ready to battle it out with Newcastle and Aston Villa for Tottenham's £4m-rated defender Michael Dawson. (Various) oh oh !!

I said all along I thought we were just being used here, for him to get a better deal. It's a shame because I think he would have been a huge asset, if and it's a big if, we could have kept him fit.

At last someone quoting alternatives. Bent, I'm not so sure about, got to say. He can look awful sometimes, but I guess every player can, I haven't seen the game but from what's been said Ashton most certainly did against T&T. Crouch, maybe, I think he could be a success, think he'll end up at Villa though in the Barry deal.

I disagree, we also have a choice not to take the risk. I know it sounds crazy but I think it could be done. I know I haven't really explained myself there. I'll try make some sense for once. I rate Dean Ashton, he's a quality player, he could very well be a huge player for this club, but he's got an injury record, this makes him a risk. I don't see anyone out there, with a proven ability in the PL, who can have as big an impact in the role of CF and that we realistically could attract, than Ashton. A strong target man is just what we need, since we really can't rely on Viduka, and Ashton fits the bill completely. It's a risk and at 10 mill a huge risk, but a risk I think we must take if we want to progress. But as I said earlier, I think we are being used here to bump up his contract offer. Or we could all stop living in the past, get over this "We absolutely must have a big target-man up front" thing, stop relying on the "tactic" of booting the ball up the pitch in the general direction of some big lump and praying for a miracle that is him getting the better of the opposition's defenders considering the vast majority of premiership centre-halves can deal with that all day long, get the team playing some decent passing football and try and move away from being the one-dimensional bottom-half cloggers we seem to have become over the last few years. Dean Ashton is a big step backwards in my view. I think you're seriously under-estimating Ashton there. Yes, he plays as a target man, but his touch on the ball is absolutely superb, and he's very comfortable when the ball is played on the deck. You're right I don't rate him much, at all. But even if I did, for the kind of money we'd be talking about to get him we could get players who are much better at that kind of stuff than he is. Ashton's value gets inflated for a number of reasons, including, but not limited to: "he's English", and; "he's the new Shearer", neither of which are relevant and one of which isn't even close to being true!! We'll never play route 1 football under KK, I honestly don't know what you are going on about. He signed 2 big target men in the past for us, Sir Les and Big Al, and at no point did we play the long ball game. You need diversity in your attack to open up defences, Ashton offers us something different to Martins and Owen. KK values that, his best partnership as a player was when he played for Liverpool with John Toshack (sp?), the big man little man combo worked so well and they won 2 European Cups with it. Bottom line is he's a damn good player, he's proven that in the PL, it's nothing to do with him being English or in the same mould as Shearer, it's to do with his ability and he fills one of our needs. If we're never going to play route one, why is it such a desperate need to have a "strong target man"? As for the 2 big target men he signed for us in the past, both Sir Les and Big Al were so much more than that, they were light years ahead of Ashton. They were great players that also happened to be target men, I'm not so sure that applies to Ashton, he's not what I'd call prolific when it comes to top flight football, unlike those two. Hopefully Keegan realises that football's moved on a bit since the 70s and what worked well then, isn't so good now, big-man/little-man who cares!?! Let's have good-man/good-man, over average-big-man/good-man any day. My bottom line is that I don't think he's that good a player, I don't think he's proven in the Premiership and I think this whole proven in the Premiership thing is bollocks anyway. Yeah, there are different demands playing here than some of the other leagues, but that doesn't mean players from those leagues can't shine here, you just need to have a half decent scouting network and a manager that knows what he's on about to pick them out. Fair enough, we haven't had that in the past, but I reckon we might now, so parochial attitudes about who we should and shouldn't sign, will only hold us back. Then go ahead suggest a better option, that is obtainable by NUFC. Who out there fills our need, or do you think we don't have one? You think Owen and Martins as a paring will work ? I have huge doubts and I don't think for one minute KK has faith in that either. He want's a bigger presence in there. Playing with a big man doesn't mean you have play "70's style football" or route 1 stuff. Labour the point once more please. Arsenal play with a reasonably tall chap up front and are reguarded as perhaps the best footballing side in the land. As someone else pointed out Ashton's game is not just about being the target man, he's good on the deck and goals per game record is pretty decent, just doesn't play enough. I never said he was as good as either Sir Les or Big Al, because he quite clearly isn't but your response was predictable. Sigh. My point, which you chose to ignore was that you can still play pretty "modern" football with a big man or even two in your team. This is not a "oh let's buy him cos he's English" thing, why do you keep bleeting on about that ?

Of course it bloody reduces the risk, he doesn't need to adapt, he's proven he can adapt. I really don't get some people's logic. For every player they have a list of risks associated with them, you can check off Ashton's "Ability to play in the PL" risk, because he's proven he can. Player XYZ however from the French first division hasn't played here so you can't. honestly that's not rocket science. Ashton's list has other risks on it, that player xyz might not have, that's my point, there's a risk in buying any player, it's the job of the club to determine which gamble is best, which horse to put our money on.

Oh and who are these strikers we could get. Because I don't see any other realistic options who have proved themselves. As much as 10 million is a risk for Ashton because of his injury record, so to is 10 million for any player out in the lesser leagues that hasn't played in England before. For every Berbatov there's Rebrov as Spurs found out. At the end of the day with any player you are taking a risk, I just hope the club backs a winner this time, we've put our money on black and it came out red too many times now.

I disagree, we also have a choice not to take the risk. I know it sounds crazy but I think it could be done. I know I haven't really explained myself there. I'll try make some sense for once. I rate Dean Ashton, he's a quality player, he could very well be a huge player for this club, but he's got an injury record, this makes him a risk. I don't see anyone out there, with a proven ability in the PL, who can have as big an impact in the role of CF and that we realistically could attract, than Ashton. A strong target man is just what we need, since we really can't rely on Viduka, and Ashton fits the bill completely. It's a risk and at 10 mill a huge risk, but a risk I think we must take if we want to progress. But as I said earlier, I think we are being used here to bump up his contract offer. Or we could all stop living in the past, get over this "We absolutely must have a big target-man up front" thing, stop relying on the "tactic" of booting the ball up the pitch in the general direction of some big lump and praying for a miracle that is him getting the better of the opposition's defenders considering the vast majority of premiership centre-halves can deal with that all day long, get the team playing some decent passing football and try and move away from being the one-dimensional bottom-half cloggers we seem to have become over the last few years. Dean Ashton is a big step backwards in my view. I think you're seriously under-estimating Ashton there. Yes, he plays as a target man, but his touch on the ball is absolutely superb, and he's very comfortable when the ball is played on the deck. You're right I don't rate him much, at all. But even if I did, for the kind of money we'd be talking about to get him we could get players who are much better at that kind of stuff than he is. Ashton's value gets inflated for a number of reasons, including, but not limited to: "he's English", and; "he's the new Shearer", neither of which are relevant and one of which isn't even close to being true!! We'll never play route 1 football under KK, I honestly don't know what you are going on about. He signed 2 big target men in the past for us, Sir Les and Big Al, and at no point did we play the long ball game. You need diversity in your attack to open up defences, Ashton offers us something different to Martins and Owen. KK values that, his best partnership as a player was when he played for Liverpool with John Toshack (sp?), the big man little man combo worked so well and they won 2 European Cups with it. Bottom line is he's a damn good player, he's proven that in the PL, it's nothing to do with him being English or in the same mould as Shearer, it's to do with his ability and he fills one of our needs.

I don't know if it's realistic or not but I think we should go for Rafael Van der Vaart, great player but really just to see some more of his Mrs, she's stunning, best reason to click on the Beeb home page atm

I disagree, we also have a choice not to take the risk. I know it sounds crazy but I think it could be done. I know I haven't really explained myself there. I'll try make some sense for once. I rate Dean Ashton, he's a quality player, he could very well be a huge player for this club, but he's got an injury record, this makes him a risk. I don't see anyone out there, with a proven ability in the PL, who can have as big an impact in the role of CF and that we realistically could attract, than Ashton. A strong target man is just what we need, since we really can't rely on Viduka, and Ashton fits the bill completely. It's a risk and at 10 mill a huge risk, but a risk I think we must take if we want to progress. But as I said earlier, I think we are being used here to bump up his contract offer.

The players are on their post-season holidays at the minute. Would you be happy if you boss brought you in on your holidays to sort out work business? I would certainly be pissed off. You can argue that it'll be sorted out with advisors and crap and need not involve the player but I bet they'd like to be there. We're not even into the transfer window yet and the players are still all away on their holidays, just give it time. Two things, talks could have been started well before the end of the season. The club publically announced that they were waiting to secure our PL status before opening talks. Secondly, the bulk of the talking does not require the parcipation of the player himself, it's done with the representatives, being on hioliday has no bearing. As a matter of point, how long should these things actually take anyway, I want xxx amount, club willling to pay XXX. I want a couple of bonuses, and a contract condition or two. It's really not as complicated as people would have you believe. If you ask me it's all a bunch stalling tactics from one or both sides. a) Our Premier League status did need to be secured before we began negotiations, and it is a load of claptrap to suggest otherwise. b) How do you know that we aren't just waiting for these players to come home, speak to the manager and put pen to paper? a) when the hell did I say that ?? The PL status was secured BEFORE the end of the season, a couple of weeks before !! b) Like I said the players don't do a lot of talking anymore. It's agents and lawyers, all the player does is sign on the bottom line, in this digital age, he could be anywhere in the world to do that. a) The bit in bold. Perhaps I misunderstood the context though. Regardless, things don't get done in two weeks. The average Premier League contract extension can take take months to sort out, and people had other jobs to be doing in the last two weeks of the season, namely Ramage and Carr and making our summer plans. b) Annoy the player on hos holiday, plus miss the opportunity for photographs, champagne, handshakes, hobnobbing and the full boardroom class experience. I don't think so. Besides, Owen is a family man, and if he has committed time to his family and kids, he wouldn't lose any of it to agents/club officials etc. a) I'll repeat, PL status was secured before the end of the season. 2 weeks is enough time to sort it out, it's not that complicated, this is my point, in the 'real' world much more complicated deals are brokered within smaller time frames. It's all about stalling, who's doing the stalling with the Owen deal, I don't know, the club maybe or the player. They'll also have known weeks before the PL status was secured who they wanted to release and who they wanted to resign and most probably what they wanted to offer. b) Yeah the 2 minute phone call from my agent securing a new contract is so annoying ?? The photo session could still take place when he returns, how many times have we heard the line "xxxx has agreed to sign a new deal, and he'll put pen to paper when he returns from a much earned holiday in the carribean" ? Instead all we get is that the 2nd phase of talks begin on the 15th June. You would think we were talking about the takeover of a multinational business here, not a contract of employment.

We won't do much better than Ashton. Even with his injury record, we won't be able to attract better. Paying upto 10 mill for him is a risk we have to take. It might very well not come off, but we have little choice but to take the risk.

The itk guy says it 3 players to be done by the end of the week. Dos santos is near enough certain to be one, the guy says the other guy either plays for portugal or plays in portugal, and the 3rd is probably Bostock but people still havnt clocked on yet. There are a number of options bubbling away. Bostock has already had an official announcement of sorts so I would discount him as one of the 3 if there are going to be simultaneous announcements for 3 players. If there are 3 deals coming to fruition they could be announced on Friday as at the weekend Levy and Alexander (the Company Secretary) depart for annual vacations. BTW, I've got considerable doubts that Veloso will be one of the three, if indeed there are three. When those two go on holiday, will business lull for a few weeks? By then they'll have sorted out most if not all of their business, so it won't matter. Damn good way to go about things IYAM. Wish we could learn a lesson or two.

The players are on their post-season holidays at the minute. Would you be happy if you boss brought you in on your holidays to sort out work business? I would certainly be pissed off. You can argue that it'll be sorted out with advisors and crap and need not involve the player but I bet they'd like to be there. We're not even into the transfer window yet and the players are still all away on their holidays, just give it time. Two things, talks could have been started well before the end of the season. The club publically announced that they were waiting to secure our PL status before opening talks. Secondly, the bulk of the talking does not require the parcipation of the player himself, it's done with the representatives, being on hioliday has no bearing. As a matter of point, how long should these things actually take anyway, I want xxx amount, club willling to pay XXX. I want a couple of bonuses, and a contract condition or two. It's really not as complicated as people would have you believe. If you ask me it's all a bunch stalling tactics from one or both sides. a) Our Premier League status did need to be secured before we began negotiations, and it is a load of claptrap to suggest otherwise. b) How do you know that we aren't just waiting for these players to come home, speak to the manager and put pen to paper? a) when the hell did I say that ?? The PL status was secured BEFORE the end of the season, a couple of weeks before !! b) Like I said the players don't do a lot of talking anymore. It's agents and lawyers, all the player does is sign on the bottom line, in this digital age, he could be anywhere in the world to do that.

Can you not go back to your own club's board. Your wind ups are lame to say the least. You just repeat the same thing over and over and over again, FFS we know you live in France, you are not the only football supporter that doesn't live in Newcastle or even England !!!

I'm sad for them, but as you said, it's been a fabulous ride from the Unibond premeirship or whatever they were in to the top league in Scotland.

That's a very, very good deal for us then. Good job Morty, or whomever arranged this.

The players are on their post-season holidays at the minute. Would you be happy if you boss brought you in on your holidays to sort out work business? I would certainly be pissed off. You can argue that it'll be sorted out with advisors and crap and need not involve the player but I bet they'd like to be there. We're not even into the transfer window yet and the players are still all away on their holidays, just give it time. Two things, talks could have been started well before the end of the season. The club publically announced that they were waiting to secure our PL status before opening talks. Secondly, the bulk of the talking does not require the parcipation of the player himself, it's done with the representatives, being on hioliday has no bearing. As a matter of point, how long should these things actually take anyway, I want xxx amount, club willling to pay XXX. I want a couple of bonuses, and a contract condition or two. It's really not as complicated as people would have you believe. If you ask me it's all a bunch stalling tactics from one or both sides.

Like I said previously in this thread. Without the benefit of hindsight, at the time of the signing I thought oh good, good player but questioned that we needed him, since this was a postion of relative strength for us, we had much more pressing gaps to fill, that we never truely filled that summer.

The lack of activity on the contract situations of both Owen and Taylor are a bit worrying for me. Surely we've had enough time to either get the deals done or come to an agreement that either don't want them or they don't want us, by now. Our place in the PL for next season has been secured for well over a month now, that's more than enough time to sort this out. The worry is that, there's two key births in your squad that are doubtful, how can you plan your transfer activity if you don't know if you need to replace a player or not ? I would like the contracts sorted out before we dip into the market, if we've got to find a replacement for Owen then that's a hefty wedge of the kitty we'll have to putr aside because with his injury record and contract situation, the replacement will not be self financed through the sale of Owen. If they are not planning to talk to him until the 15th June, I think we may as well write off June for buying anyone that significantly eats into our supposedly small trasfer budget. This summer is starting to worry me.

I'd heard that, at the time that Keegan left Man City, a lot of senior players were rather pissed off with him and weren't sorry to see him go. A lot of people assume that players like Dunne would be eager to be reunited with Keegan, but I'm wouldn't be confident of that. pissed off why? The training was boring and old-fashioned. Keegan had lost his spark and was a rather non-inspirational presence. Allegedly. Pearce came in after KK left and changed their fortunes, in the same manner that Roeder did with Souness here. I remember loads of people on this board saying we should go after Pearce, there was even talk of him becoming England boss. But he later went on to prove he's not up to it. The KK at Man City worries me, if I'm honest. I was delighted he'd returned and after the poor start, over the moon the way he got the players playing again. But the events since the Chelsea game have me a little apprehensive that, we could see Man City's KK rather than our own KK.

Since the takeover by Ashley and then KK coming back, The Chron don't have the same role anymore as NUFC's and the board's propaganda tool. Ryder, is hopelessly out of his depth when oliver takes time out, reminds me a bit of a YTS trying to do a grown ups job. Oliver himself has little to feed on anyone. I get the impression that KK found out about him many moons ago and won't entertain him. He's probably still got a few contacts within the club, but nothing like he used to under the old regime. I think now, when they want to leak something they leak it to the nationals.

Got a feeling we are being used to hike up the contract offer.