Gallowgate Toon

Martins can take a chance in one or two

 

Give over man.

He had 2 chances yesterday, buried one if i'm correct.

Well ok one in two might be pushing the boat, but he takes at least one from 3, Cisse though his profligacy is incredible.

I still say try and hijack the Cisse transfer in the summer.

 

I'd say in terms of productivity they offer pretty much the same. If i was a defender though, id be a bit more scared of Martins than i would of Cisse.

 

I'd say Cisse brings a more aggressive and in your face style than Martins does.

 

More direct, better footballing brain, better finisher.

Cisse is possibly the most inconsistent finisher in the league, he has had some woeful misses like one from 2 yards out against Man U, Martins can take a chance in one or two, Cisse takes about 5 attempts.

Scored more than Owen in half the time.

 

Well ok i know Owen's had injuries but so has Martins over that last season and a half, they've played the same amount of games this season, 5 i think and Owen's got 3 and Oba's had 2.

 

What stats are you using, lad?  I'm not slagging off Martins (who may have been a bit off-pace, esp in 2nd half, but I usually like to give players a couple matches back before I complain too much about that sort of thing).  Owen's record for NUFC is 1 in 2.  Martins' is about 1 in 3 -- which is still quite good, imo.  Owen has scored 23 goals in something like 45 matches for NUFC.  The problem with that stat being the 45 matches in three seasons...but that's still a better than Oba's 22 (I think) in approx. 70.  Definitely a better ratio for Owen.  That said, it's rather unfair to say Oba's not quality because he's not Michael Owen.  Not many players are.  Owen's quality is unquestionable (how many strikers score 1 in 2 in the Premiership over 10 seasons?).  It's unfair to Oba to constantly compare him to Owen.  Try looking at Oba on his own merits, not someone else's.  A 1 in 3 striker is quite valuable, especially one who can be well-utilized to get the best out of a 1 in 2 striker (see the 4-3-3 from last season). 

Martins has played 84 and scored 29 but in a way it's unfair because he played on the wing for a good few games last season plus he had to settle in which Owen has never had to really do with this league and he's had his own niggling injuries to deal with. Owen has played 53 and scored 25. Owen is a better striker i'm just saying Martins has scored more goals which he has, i'm not getting into goals a game ratios.

Scored more than Owen in half the time.

Well ok i know Owen's had injuries but so has Martins over that last season and a half, they've played the same amount of games this season, 5 i think and Owen's got 3 and Oba's had 2.

Confidence looks very low tbh and Kinnear even said this week he gets really frustrated with himself cause he has really high standards, that explains his problems for me like playing safe recently and trying too hard no to make a mistake that he ends up making one. We also don't know what role he's being asked to play either and a lot of the time, it seems he doesn't know himself, looks like a different player at the moment, he looked hungrier last night though and finally showed some of his pace when he went round the full back and also when he ran onto a through ball the CB had about 5 yards head start and he comfortably got past him.

I think overall when Oba isn't confident, he's not very bright because he wants to play it too safe and not do the dangerous and selfish thing that Kinnear has asked him to do.

 

Caught talking rubbish.

 

I agree though Mick, its a massive shame we didnt go on and sort out the 3rd goal but thats football. It was the opening of the second half, we didnt impose ourselves and threaten them like in the first but that was because the game became disjointed and broken up by the ref too.

 

The only thing that matters to me and should matter to anyone who cares about this club is the 3 f***ing points!!!!

 

That was the first laugh I've had all day so don't try to get out of it.

 

You're right about the importance of the 3 points, it's all that really matters tonight and I'd settle for a few more games like that if we get 3 points every time.

tonight was about more than the 3 points.

 

confidence was the main thing missing and i doubt the 3 points will get the confidence back because of the way we were hanging on at the end. (you could see the lack of confidence in a few of the players in the 2nd half)

 

No, you're right, a better performance and a 1-2 loss would have been much better.

 

but while the naiveity wont make a difference against west brom, it may cost us points in the future. i think our defence played very well (apart from enrique, who was dodgy as f***) but against better teams we will pay the price for our managers stupidity.

Justify that statement.

 

I thought there was whole debate going on around this club about the quality of the players? Suddenly that debate is gone, the players are clearly a better class than the opposition and its just the manager who is at fault? Let us not forget the utter shithole of absurdity the club has been wallowing in either.

f***ing silly to have 6 players in their own half while we had a corner, that guarantees the opposition possession and brings on more attacks when we could've nailed it 3-1 right there and then.

 

I 'think' that means we had 6 players in their half whilst attacking a corner? How that guarantees anyone possession i have no idea.

sorriy i meant we had 6 men defending in our own half while we had an attacking corner, and it makes it too easy for their defence to get it and start an attack, inviting more pressure onto us.

Then i understand but then i also would have gone mental if we hadnt had enough back and that "defence" had let in an equaliser. That's a hard call when the side is desperate for the points.

I'm not debating i would have had extra men back cause i would, probably have 4 back, but 6 i find unbelievable, one could have at least ran up taken it short and stayed in the corner but it was just a blind cross in.

 

Caught talking rubbish.

 

I agree though Mick, its a massive shame we didnt go on and sort out the 3rd goal but thats football. It was the opening of the second half, we didnt impose ourselves and threaten them like in the first but that was because the game became disjointed and broken up by the ref too.

 

The only thing that matters to me and should matter to anyone who cares about this club is the 3 f***ing points!!!!

 

That was the first laugh I've had all day so don't try to get out of it.

 

You're right about the importance of the 3 points, it's all that really matters tonight and I'd settle for a few more games like that if we get 3 points every time.

tonight was about more than the 3 points.

 

confidence was the main thing missing and i doubt the 3 points will get the confidence back because of the way we were hanging on at the end. (you could see the lack of confidence in a few of the players in the 2nd half)

 

No, you're right, a better performance and a 1-2 loss would have been much better.

 

but while the naiveity wont make a difference against west brom, it may cost us points in the future. i think our defence played very well (apart from enrique, who was dodgy as f***) but against better teams we will pay the price for our managers stupidity.

Justify that statement.

 

I thought there was whole debate going on around this club about the quality of the players? Suddenly that debate is gone, the players are clearly a better class than the opposition and its just the manager who is at fault? Let us not forget the utter shithole of absurdity the club has been wallowing in either.

f***ing silly to have 6 players in their own half while we had a corner, that guarantees the opposition possession and brings on more attacks when we could've nailed it 3-1 right there and then.

 

I 'think' that means we had 6 players in their half whilst attacking a corner? How that guarantees anyone possession i have no idea.

sorriy i meant we had 6 men defending in our own half while we had an attacking corner, and it makes it too easy for their defence to get it and start an attack, inviting more pressure onto us.

 

Caught talking rubbish.

 

I agree though Mick, its a massive shame we didnt go on and sort out the 3rd goal but thats football. It was the opening of the second half, we didnt impose ourselves and threaten them like in the first but that was because the game became disjointed and broken up by the ref too.

 

The only thing that matters to me and should matter to anyone who cares about this club is the 3 f***ing points!!!!

 

That was the first laugh I've had all day so don't try to get out of it.

 

You're right about the importance of the 3 points, it's all that really matters tonight and I'd settle for a few more games like that if we get 3 points every time.

tonight was about more than the 3 points.

 

confidence was the main thing missing and i doubt the 3 points will get the confidence back because of the way we were hanging on at the end. (you could see the lack of confidence in a few of the players in the 2nd half)

 

No, you're right, a better performance and a 1-2 loss would have been much better.

 

but while the naiveity wont make a difference against west brom, it may cost us points in the future. i think our defence played very well (apart from enrique, who was dodgy as f***) but against better teams we will pay the price for our managers stupidity.

agree about enrique. last season i had no fears when anyone tried to get at him as he just wouldn't let anyone by. tonight he was done inside,outside,by wingers and lumbering forwards whom i would have held up for longer.

Give him a minute to settle, how long has he been in the starting side?

just basics. you dont need to settle to stop a lumbering centre forward turn you inside out. last season he didn't need to settle for me to want him in every game as he didn't let anyone get by him easy.

Beye's been skinned more times this season than e was all of last, getting back to fitness is mental sharpness, anticipating your opponent's next move, without games you don't have that.

not last season. he came straight in and done it. he looked as off the pace as martins.

I don't recall him settling in all that well until the Keegan run came about but it may just be confidence in the end, being told by your boss you're not good enough (Keeegan trying to buy a LB) musn't be great on your esteem.

 

Caught talking rubbish.

 

I agree though Mick, its a massive shame we didnt go on and sort out the 3rd goal but thats football. It was the opening of the second half, we didnt impose ourselves and threaten them like in the first but that was because the game became disjointed and broken up by the ref too.

 

The only thing that matters to me and should matter to anyone who cares about this club is the 3 f***ing points!!!!

 

That was the first laugh I've had all day so don't try to get out of it.

 

You're right about the importance of the 3 points, it's all that really matters tonight and I'd settle for a few more games like that if we get 3 points every time.

tonight was about more than the 3 points.

 

confidence was the main thing missing and i doubt the 3 points will get the confidence back because of the way we were hanging on at the end. (you could see the lack of confidence in a few of the players in the 2nd half)

 

No, you're right, a better performance and a 1-2 loss would have been much better.

 

but while the naiveity wont make a difference against west brom, it may cost us points in the future. i think our defence played very well (apart from enrique, who was dodgy as f***) but against better teams we will pay the price for our managers stupidity.

agree about enrique. last season i had no fears when anyone tried to get at him as he just wouldn't let anyone by. tonight he was done inside,outside,by wingers and lumbering forwards whom i would have held up for longer.

Give him a minute to settle, how long has he been in the starting side?

just basics. you dont need to settle to stop a lumbering centre forward turn you inside out. last season he didn't need to settle for me to want him in every game as he didn't let anyone get by him easy.

Beye's been skinned more times this season than e was all of last, getting back to fitness is mental sharpness, anticipating your opponent's next move, without games you don't have that.

 

Caught talking rubbish.

 

I agree though Mick, its a massive shame we didnt go on and sort out the 3rd goal but thats football. It was the opening of the second half, we didnt impose ourselves and threaten them like in the first but that was because the game became disjointed and broken up by the ref too.

 

The only thing that matters to me and should matter to anyone who cares about this club is the 3 f***ing points!!!!

 

That was the first laugh I've had all day so don't try to get out of it.

 

You're right about the importance of the 3 points, it's all that really matters tonight and I'd settle for a few more games like that if we get 3 points every time.

tonight was about more than the 3 points.

 

confidence was the main thing missing and i doubt the 3 points will get the confidence back because of the way we were hanging on at the end. (you could see the lack of confidence in a few of the players in the 2nd half)

 

No, you're right, a better performance and a 1-2 loss would have been much better.

 

but while the naiveity wont make a difference against west brom, it may cost us points in the future. i think our defence played very well (apart from enrique, who was dodgy as f***) but against better teams we will pay the price for our managers stupidity.

Justify that statement.

 

I thought there was whole debate going on around this club about the quality of the players? Suddenly that debate is gone, the players are clearly a better class than the opposition and its just the manager who is at fault? Let us not forget the utter shithole of absurdity the club has been wallowing in either.

Fucking silly to have 6 players in their own half while we had a corner, that guarantees the opposition possession and brings on more attacks when we could've nailed it 3-1 right there and then.

Tbf to Enrique he's nowhere near fit, like Beye, so if we're going to be fair we might say he's just rusty.

if it had been taylor ?

 

Where was Taylor?

about 10 yds to the left.

 

 

serious question...what would folk have said if that had been taylor that got caught out for the goal ?

 

 

what would folk have said if butt or taylor had ducked (i know it wouldn't have stopped it) from richardsons free kick on saturday the way jonas did ?

I personally would say the same for Taylor as i've said for Colo as i don't think Taylor's as bad as people say.

What i did notice about Taylor in the first half, is how slow he is to react to anything, WBA had a chance and they got round and Given saved and Coloccini was sliding infront of Given trying to block the shot, up pops Taylor strolling about on the edge of the D as it went out for a corner, Barton told him to wake up but it was shambolic defending.

Apart from the goal, looked really good again to me did a lot of organizing today too which i thought was good. Thought he was unlucky for the goal but considering all the pressure on us in that second half, its good that only one chance went through from about 7.

 

To be fair to him on the goal he was tracking the run of the player then the ball was played inside of him and he couldn't change his run in time.

if it had been taylor ?

Would've gone down clutching his chest.

Apart from the goal, looked really good again to me did a lot of organizing today too which i thought was good. Thought he was unlucky for the goal but considering all the pressure on us in that second half, its good that only one chance went through from about 7.

If we had another decent CB i'd have Colo there tbh excellent reader of the game and a decent passer of the ball.

If Owen was on the field, he would have gone off imo, JK doesn't want to take off the team's motivator cause apart from Shay there's nobody else to take the armband.

On the mackem's second goal, if Butt had done his job properly then he wouldn't have been making that tackle from the back, he would have been making it from the front.

Give Xisco half an hour on Tuesday imo but start Ameobi.

Pretty much fickleness defined in this thread. Martins was the shit when we played Man U and the months before that, he was the saviour to season when we had that run of games with KK. Cause he's been injured and played  played twice since, he's now shit and over-rated, wish people on here would stick to their guns instead of making the most extremist remarks about a player who has undoubted quality and without him we never win any games. If anyone is the most over-rated in our squad it has to be Zoggy.

Barton will be the fittest player in our squad tbh.

Some decent substitutions please.

Loving the fact that the mackems now think that Ferdinand is the greatest defender to grace the PL because he managed to win headers against a player who is 6 inches smaller than him.

He need a competent partner next to him mind.

makes me feel sick when i think of what him and Faye would have been like.

 

This. On paper at least, a fantastic combination.

Faye is by no means a great defender average at reading the game etc but he is just perfect foil for Colo imo.

He need a competent partner next to him mind.

makes me feel sick when i think of what him and Faye would have been like.