Toon1892

Don’t think you’ve read the full posts. I’m saying Howes done a good job given the wage budget and the number of injuries. Sorry if that’s rattled you.

I’m really not. There is no guarantee you’ll sign one of those players on high wages and they won’t flop in the premier league. Theres a reason a proven player usually has a higher salary than an unproven player. Yes signing those unproven players regularly over the long term on lower wages would be amazing. But there hasn’t been a team able to do that long term and it can sometimes backfire- see Everton.

They are! Although there wage bill is joint 6th highest in the league (40% higher than ours). They will probably end up finishing 5th? So not too dissimilar to their wage bill.

Yes but my point is over the short term your position can fluctuate from season to season in comparison to your wage bill. Over the long term there is a clear trend between league position and wage bill. Hence if we want to consistently get into the top 4 we need to increase our wage bill. That goes for all clubs. Brighton included. Our board and owners are well aware of this.

This is why the top clubs are bringing in a wages to turnover ratio. To even better their stance as the top 6. Once that is brought in it’ll be so difficult to compete.

A prime example is Joelinton. He is one of the best midfielders in the league and wants to be compensated like one of the best midfielders in the league. We can’t afford that yet due to FFP. Therefore it is likely that we will have to sell him and buy a player that isn’t as good as Joelinton but who’s wages we can afford. The wage bill is the key metric amongst any sport finances.

Why? Over the long term that’s what happens. Welcome to the premier league. Yes we need to increase the wage bill to become more competitive. Generally the teams with the better players finish higher up the table. Generally the better players cost more money on a weekly basis. It’s how sport works. Sorry to break that to you.

Let’s agree to disagree then. If you think it’s sustainable for the 8th highest wage bill to consistently get top 4. I’m not going to be able to convince you otherwise.

Did you even read my post? I explained all of that.

Final point on this because I’m probably boring people to death. Net spend is irrelevant when comparing a clubs expenditure. Given it is never adjusted for inflation. Net spend is a measure used by the top clubs to stay at the top. If the league was truly fair you would allow the clubs below the top teams to spend to catch up. The only true measure the league could bring in would be to have a salary cap. The same for every club. IE no clubs wage bill is allowed to exceed X million a year. It is then fair for everyone. I understand the teams at the top won’t want this as it would mean the league would become so competitive. How great would it be though. 20 clubs on an even footing.

On this- unless we have bad management at some point we are likely to remain around the league table position of our gross salary spend. We can’t hope for manager miracles every season. It isn’t sustainable or realistic. The board will know this hence why Howe’s position is safe. The only way to break the top 4 consistently is to up the wages but as you know we are currently restricted due to ffp. A new manager isn’t suddenly going to get more out of Ritchie, Dummet, Lascelles, Krafth etc than Howe has. The wider squad, including the bulk of the academy (which wasn’t invested in for 15 years) just isn’t there yet. As a fan base we have to understand this and be patient.

I’m not sure everything went our way last season. We had the 4th highest injuries in the league. Often to key players such as Isak and Wilson. (Key last year). https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/premier-league-injury-table-22-23-liverpool-chelsea-arsenal-man-utd We also had some unfortunate suspensions at key times to Pope and Bruno. If Isak and Wilson weren’t coming back from injury slightly out of form we would have won that cup final. Proof of bold- I’m a chartered accountant so I just looked at the accounts. But a quick summary which isn’t entirely accurate but still demonstrates the points- https://www.givemesport.com/premier-league-wage-bill/ You shouldn’t really look at net spend since the takeover. That only compensated for the lack of net spend under Ashley. As a chartered accountant, the far better measure is gross wage costs to compare budget to budget. The bottom line is Howe has done an incredible job since he took over. I don’t believe there would have been many managers to have been able to do what he has done. Unfortunately fans then set their expectations based on the amazing work he’s done. We’re now back in line this season with our gross wage ranking. (Still pretty amazing given the amount of injuries and fixtures and suspensions we’ve had this season). Stay patient and keep the faith…

But but but we aren’t in the top 4 with the 8th highest wage bill and record injuries. He has to go LOL

Or just looking at the facts and using sensible rationale to appraise him? Honest question- where did you expect we’d be right now when Eddie Howe was appointed? Did you think we’d be top 4 every season? Did you think we’d have top 4 one out of the two seasons? Did you think we’d be in the championship? Unproven? He got a team into the champions league with a tiny wage budget. Our wage budget was closer to 20th place than 4th place. That has only happened a handful of times.

So you’re telling me Howe did better than Klopp in his first full season, including more cup finals? How have you managed to turn that into a negative against Howe? Comparing a Liverpool squad with a wage budget twice as high as ours is a bit of a silly comparison. Fans that are comparing should be using managers that have managed squads with the 7th highest wage bill. Klopp had the second highest wage bill in that period. It really isn’t a fair comparison. Lets compare apples with apples.

I think my point went straight over your head. Never mind

Creasing at this. Did you want a sniper to take them out or something? The atmospheres were hostile. There were pitch invaders. Booing on a regular occurrence. There is none of that for Howe. But if fans carry on disrupting I’m sure it will come soon and then I hope people like you will be proud of yourself. I presume you were the type that boo’d sir Bobby out too.

The accounts on twitter with lots of followers don’t help. It’s in their interest to have a go/ want change/ drum up reactions. The easiest way to do that is to call for Howe to go. Whether they actually want that is a different matter. Unfortunately they have a big influence on the younger fan base and probably those fans who are more easily influenced by what they read on social media. Really sad to see what’s happening with our fans. I used to think we were up there with the best. Not now. If the majority genuinely want Howe gone we have a pathetic fan base and that hurts saying that.

Are you genuinely saying the crowd hostility is the same for Howe now as it was for Bruce!? Like really!? Come on mate…

Apologies if that’s offended you. My point was more fans at games are verifiable. A lot of the online stuff could be coming from mackems/ kids/ people that have supported (followed may be a better word) for 30 mins and want instant success. My point being that the ‘actual’ NUFC fans whether that online followers or people that go to the match are more patient (surely) than what I read on twitter. The fact some people are calling for Howe to go blows my mind. Arteta had two 8th place finishes and Arsenal fans were patient with him. We can’t just change the manager when the going has been tough for 10 games. After a lifetime of supporting this club I’m so disappointed in our fan base and it genuinely makes me sad to see what many fans have become. Even if we had the best manager of all time it was never going to be too 6 every season. We have backup players such as Ritchie, Dummet, Murphy, Lascelles (I could go on). Most people need to get a grip.

Agree with this entirely! Been to 13 away games this season and every home match. What you read online is completely different to what the actual fans that go to games are saying.

I don’t understand why you think Miley and Anderson don’t count because there are injuries. That’s how most youth players get a chance. E.g. Bradley at Liverpool. You can’t just not include them because there’s injuries. At the start of the season Howe could have easily sent Miley out on loan. He could have kept Hayden at a back up cm. Instead he kept Miley knowing that he was going to be used and he has been used. Stop trying to create a narrative by ‘if’s’. Howe is playing Miley and was playing Anderson until injury. I find your last post very contradicting. You’re saying giving youth a chance doesn’t count if you buy the youth player yet arguing Howe isn’t giving youth a chance by not playing Tino and Hall. We’ve spent or will be spending £30M on them. I admit I would have liked to see more of Tino but at the same time understand why we haven’t. Hall hasn’t looked great in the games he’s played. I wouldn’t be surprised if we are underplaying as to not activate the £30m clause to buy him if Ashworth and Howe have decided he isn’t quite good enough or has attitude problems or even can’t afford him due to ffp. Other than Tino, I don’t get what more Howe could have done with youth since he took over. Genuine question but would you have liked to see more youngsters from the academy play instead of any of the main starting 11 last season when we were trying to get top 4?

I’m pretty sure you called people bonkers lol

Let’s agree to disagree then. Its as clear as daylight to me that Howe likes working with young players and he has a track record of bringing those young players through. If you think the opposite that’s fine by me.

I don’t get your point though? Anderson was still starting ahead of an Italian international in those games? A 20 year old is starting ahead of an Italian international in the same position. “He doesn’t give youth a chance”. you’ve been beainwashed by narrative. This isn’t football manager, Howe has developed a hell of a lot of youth players through his career. Ake Solanke Ramsdale Trippier To name a few pre NUFC off the top of my head. He’s great at bringing youth through. I know you don’t want to believe that but one of the main reasons the owners appointed him is because he is great with youth players…