How long can Sam paper over the cracks?

[La Parka]

Change the thread title to:

 

"How long can we keep deluding ourselves that we have a good team"

 

 

 

Allardyce can only have himself to blame if that's the case, he spent £18 million on Smith, Barton and Enrique.  He's brought in 9 players so has the basis of a full team of his own players if he wanted to play them, it might even be slightly more balanced than the one he actually does pick.

 

£18m sadly buys you average players today Mick, which is what all those players he signed are (at the moment anyway). You rarely get in good quality for £18m. I mean West Ham spent that much on Nobby, Dyer and Parker from us which just goes to show you what you get or rather what you don't for your money. Of course you can buy some quality even for little, Beye for example and Viduka on a free, but in generall you need big big money to break away from mid-table, ala Man City. Or you can do it by slowly building the squad, weeding out the tat and bringing in quality over time like Everton have done.

 

Blackburn are fantastic at buying cheap and doing well:

 

Nelson: Free

Warnock: 2m

Samba: 250k

Emerton: 2.5m

Bentley: Undisclosed (bet it wasn't a lot)

Pederson: 2.5m

Robbie Savage: 2m

Tuguy: Nominal Fee

Roque Santa Cruz: 3m

Beni Mc Carthy: 2.5m

 

For the price of one Michael Owen. Less even.

 

 

The main obsevation from my point of view is the fact Hughes was given *time* to build. Everton is a similar story. Hughes has a pretty good transfer record though.

 

That is good never realised.

4 of those would walk into our side.

 

My best friend is a Blackburn Fan.

 

Samba is an absolute rock. The best 250k ever? Santa Cruz was a stupidly good bargain also!

 

I'd take Bentley, Nelson, Samba, Warnock, Santa Cruz without thinking tbh.

 

Benni is a bit of a strange one. He has been very dissapointing this season. Blackburn fans dislike him.

 

.......................Given......................

Beye....Nelson....Samba....Warnock

Bentley..Savage....Emre.....Charles

..............Martins...Santa Cruz........

 

 

 

[Guest Knightrider]

Change the thread title to:

 

"How long can we keep deluding ourselves that we have a good team"

 

 

 

Allardyce can only have himself to blame if that's the case, he spent £18 million on Smith, Barton and Enrique.  He's brought in 9 players so has the basis of a full team of his own players if he wanted to play them, it might even be slightly more balanced than the one he actually does pick.

 

£18m sadly buys you average players today Mick, which is what all those players he signed are (at the moment anyway). You rarely get in good quality for £18m. I mean West Ham spent that much on Nobby, Dyer and Parker from us which just goes to show you what you get or rather what you don't for your money. Of course you can buy some quality even for little, Beye for example and Viduka on a free, but in generall you need big big money to break away from mid-table, ala Man City. Or you can do it by slowly building the squad, weeding out the tat and bringing in quality over time like Everton have done.

 

Blackburn are fantastic at buying cheap and doing well:

 

Nelson: Free

Warnock: 2m

Samba: 250k

Emerton: 2.5m

Bentley: Undisclosed (bet it wasn't a lot)

Pederson: 2.5m

Robbie Savage: 2m

Tuguy: Nominal Fee

Roque Santa Cruz: 3m

Beni Mc Carthy: 2.5m

 

For the price of one Michael Owen. Less even.

 

 

The main obsevation from my point of view is the fact Hughes was given *time* to build. Everton is a similar story. Hughes has a pretty good transfer record though.

 

That could be said of Big Sam at Bolton who did the same. Of course you can still buy quality relatively cheaply but such players tend to become available via certain circumstances or have to be scouted a length of time. Hughes didn't buy them all in one go, he found them at different stages and has had time to work on them. Give Hughes £18m in January and he'd go and buy a Barton for £5m or a Smith for £6m. I.e. that money won't go a long way and most certainly not on real quality.

 

Everyone knows the best time to do transfer business is in between windows and most of the better spending sprees in the Premiership have cam when funds have been limited. Just look at the vast sums Fergie, Mourinho and Benitez have all spent on average players when they've been on spending sprees.

 

It really doesn't go far. It's easy to buy players with a fixed budget on forums where every player's worth is good value for money, where every player will be a good buy and where you can stretch funds a long way. In real life it's proving to be the opposite for all managers.

 

That's why I'd rather we spent £18m on say two top players rather than on 5 average ones. That's what we are going to need in the long run. Big Sam and the board had to buy the type of players they did because they didn't have the time to scout some real bargains and they didn't have the funds to buy real quality so you will get a mixed batch and that's what we got.

[Dave]

Having the players means nothing if you don't know where to play them.

 

How anyone can argue that N'Zogbia's talents aren't wasted at left back is beyond me.

 

I think people way overrate N'Zogbia, he's good but he's no more than that (at the moment) and hasn't convinced me on the left-wing to the point where he MUST play there. He's done no better than Milner has and he's not even left-footed. I'd personally still play him wide left though, but I can see why he isn't and I'm certainly not going to boo like a little girl because he's being played at left-back

 

I agree with your first point but I don't think we do have the players anyway.

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

[Parky]

Having the players means nothing if you don't know where to play them.

 

How anyone can argue that N'Zogbia's talents aren't wasted at left back is beyond me.

 

I think people way overrate N'Zogbia, he's good but he's no more than that (at the moment) and hasn't convinced me on the left-wing to the point where he MUST play there. He's done no better than Milner has and he's not even left-footed. I'd personally still play him wide left though, but I can see why he isn't and I'm certainly not going to boo like a little girl because he's being played at left-back

 

I agree with your first point but I don't think we do have the players anyway.

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

If there is one campaign I intermittently subscribe to on his board it is to play Zoggy (one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

[Baggio]

Having the players means nothing if you don't know where to play them.

 

How anyone can argue that N'Zogbia's talents aren't wasted at left back is beyond me.

 

I think people way overrate N'Zogbia, he's good but he's no more than that (at the moment) and hasn't convinced me on the left-wing to the point where he MUST play there. He's done no better than Milner has and he's not even left-footed. I'd personally still play him wide left though, but I can see why he isn't and I'm certainly not going to boo like a little girl because he's being played at left-back

 

I agree with your first point but I don't think we do have the players anyway.

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

If there is one campaign I intermittently subscribe to on his board it is to play Zoggy (one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Not like you to exaggerate, Parky.

[Zero]

 

Of course we can attract a good manager, the likes of Roeder and Souness were down to Shepherd.  If you seriously think that the likes of O'Niel wouldn't have come to Newcastle because its too far from London your mad.  Just as mad as to consider that Shepherd would even know who Ramos is never mind consider chasing him as our manager.

 

I know how they play and the depressing thing is its an incredibly limited tactic.  Its enough to get you just so far playing horrendous Football.  But forget about Europe or competing any higher then 6th place playing Bolton style Football.  Why don't you go ahead and tell me why I shouldn't be depressed at the idea of a manager who seems incapable of any other tactic, I look forward to this great insight.....

1. I did believe that we are an attractive team for managing in the past but now I didn't. Just think, for the last 6 years, how many world class managers have come to England: Mourinho, Benitez, Ramos, Eriksson...ONeill, Grant and Jol arguable but they do have qualities. And that what we get was shittest manager in the league. Yea you can claim that Shepherd was the major factor but on the otherhand I don't think he was stubborn enough to turn down someone like Hitzfield. And ok now what we get is Sam, imo a risky but good choice but definitely not in the same class as Mourinho and Benitez. Is that really mad to think we aren't really that attractive?

 

2. Ok, this is very arguable I know, but in my opinion you should NEVER think Sam wanna turns Newcastle into another Bolton who just know long ball, header and luck.

 

Again, this is very arguable, but here is my understanding.

Sam is a defense-first type manager for sure, and the first priority he is doing in Newcastle is to implement his DEFENSE TACTIC which is proven in Bolton. I am ok for this, and I also don't think anyone will object about this right?

If we just evaluate our defense this season, is that really our defense tactic is s***? Or is that some of our playey becomes Bramble again and cost us silly goals? Think again, Fulham, Derby, etc, many goals we lose this season were due to silly mistake of Cacapa and Rozehnal, or the unstoppable fluke goals. When we are using Taylor and Faye, who are less error-prone, our defense looks the most solid one we have since Robson era, even though we are having a LB who is frequently out of position. You can blame Sam for buying two s*** centre back, which is really his fault---f****** hell the Rozehnal is the worse version of Andy O'Brien---but other than that Sam has really did a great job for our defense. I am particularly impressed by his effort for trying to restore our pressing in Robson era. It is completely different from the one under Souness, which our player just running like headless chicken. The defense is much more systematic and consistent---ok, except the s*** errors by the new Bramble/OBrien.

 

The major problem is our offense. Here why I still defend Sam is because I think it is unfair to judge him by Bolton's style. Look at the players he had. Yea you can said they have Diouf, Anelka, or even Okocha or Campo etc but the truth is the players are just s***, so s*** that they are facing relegation immediately. If you are the manager would you ask these type of players, who were acquired due to extremely limited of funds, to play beautiful footballs? In another words, and it is a matter of belief that, do you think Sam is really willing to play like that or just he is forced to? Yea I know everyone will fire me for this and saying what we are doing now is the proof, but I do have different views. In my opinion, he is trying to consolidate the defense, in the highest order, that attacking type players like Emre are sacrificed. Then he will start to make some attacking plays, like long ball, left side attack etc which will not affect our defense. So our attack is simply limited by the players like Butt, Smith, etc who are good tacklers but never a good passer.

 

We are a club much bigger than Bolton, and for sure we should be able to supply more resources to him. My argument here is, due to his preference in consolidating defense and limited human resource(face it), he is forced to play like that. If he has more time and resources, spend some cash and bring in the players he want like Okocha, I don't think he will still ask the team to attack like that. We can definitely play a lot better if we have better players. Just an example, when we have Duff back to the left last game, we really have two wingers and start to play like what we are in the past. He knows how to do it, just he didn't.

 

So here is another problem, which I do think he should be blamed, is that he is clearly showing the message of "I don't care about this season's result", and that's why even Wullie is firing at him. I really understand this and the season ticket holder is calling his head for this. "Oh my god why do that?" "We can play better!" I also have such questions before the Arsenal game but now I understand why: he has written this season off and use it for rebuilding and training his tactics. This is consistent with his words at the start of the season. At that time, he has already claimed that he needs time and ask us to be patient until he can really do something. At that time, I do believe everyone like me thinks that the message is "Sorry the club is problematic and I need a lot of time to change things." And his statement has been already forgotten after the excellent start of the season that we think "The team is good and is capable of a top 6 finish." I think this is correct too, but that makes his message silly right? You can do it immediately then why ask for 2 seasons time? And now when I look back our results, our performances, I think what Sam Allardyce really meant at that time is "Sorry lads, result is not my priority this season, you gotta face a difficult time until I accomplish my tactics, get in the players I want and trained them well." Result is sacrificed for his long term plan, and that's what he meant, in my opinion.

 

The strongest proof, and the only proof I have, is the flashing quality we have made sometimes this season. I don't think people will argue about this too. In our normal setup things are really poor, but sometimes we can also play like a team that definitely can have a top 6 finish. The substitution of Emre, Duff, the hold up play of Viduka and Smith, and impressive pressing tactics we performed during Arsenal...all these are simply non-existent for the last 3-4 years.

 

I know it's f****** irritating to watch the team playing when it's f****** obvious to change a very simple bit and play a lot better, and it's so silly that people either think he is mentally retarded or he is forcing a contract termination by Ashley. But for me, as he has already announced that he needs time and his only priority this season is our defense but not our result, I will give him time to do that. I am also very depressed if we really become the 2nd Bolton but I will only judge that after he has completed his tactics. If he plays long ball, header and luck again I must be on your side, cursing him to die and suffer in Hell etc anything you like.

 

But now, at least now, I understand what he's doing, and I think it is possible that he can success, so I will give him the time he asked, 2 seasons.

[Parky]

Having the players means nothing if you don't know where to play them.

 

How anyone can argue that N'Zogbia's talents aren't wasted at left back is beyond me.

 

I think people way overrate N'Zogbia, he's good but he's no more than that (at the moment) and hasn't convinced me on the left-wing to the point where he MUST play there. He's done no better than Milner has and he's not even left-footed. I'd personally still play him wide left though, but I can see why he isn't and I'm certainly not going to boo like a little girl because he's being played at left-back

 

I agree with your first point but I don't think we do have the players anyway.

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

If there is one campaign I intermittently subscribe to on his board it is to play Zoggy (one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Not like you to exaggerate, Parky.

 

Well it just wouldn't be me would it? 

[Guest Knightrider]

Having the players means nothing if you don't know where to play them.

 

How anyone can argue that N'Zogbia's talents aren't wasted at left back is beyond me.

 

I think people way overrate N'Zogbia, he's good but he's no more than that (at the moment) and hasn't convinced me on the left-wing to the point where he MUST play there. He's done no better than Milner has and he's not even left-footed. I'd personally still play him wide left though, but I can see why he isn't and I'm certainly not going to boo like a little girl because he's being played at left-back

 

I agree with your first point but I don't think we do have the players anyway.

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

Watching a different game then, I thought he was average at both ends in the main. I'm not going to rip into his game though because he's doing well overall and there weren't many good performers yesterday.

[Zero]

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

Dave, just a question, don't you think Charles attack better when he plays at LB? I remember when he plays LW he isn't that productive.

[Guest Knightrider]

(one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Steady on

 

[Rob W]

I think the Zog is the only one of players that would interest the top 6 right now - maybe Taylor.... but no-one else

 

Our French Friend in Norf Landahn woudl probably pay serious money for him  for a start

[Parky]

(one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Steady on

 

 

I'm sorry I rate him, although I realise that rating our own players is tantamount to a crime on this board. 

[La Parka]

 

Of course we can attract a good manager, the likes of Roeder and Souness were down to Shepherd.  If you seriously think that the likes of O'Niel wouldn't have come to Newcastle because its too far from London your mad.  Just as mad as to consider that Shepherd would even know who Ramos is never mind consider chasing him as our manager.

 

I know how they play and the depressing thing is its an incredibly limited tactic.  Its enough to get you just so far playing horrendous Football.  But forget about Europe or competing any higher then 6th place playing Bolton style Football.  Why don't you go ahead and tell me why I shouldn't be depressed at the idea of a manager who seems incapable of any other tactic, I look forward to this great insight.....

1. I did believe that we are an attractive team for managing in the past but now I didn't. Just think, for the last 6 years, how many world class managers have come to England: Mourinho, Benitez, Ramos, Eriksson...ONeill, Grant and Jol arguable but they do have qualities. And that what we get was shittest manager in the league. Yea you can claim that Shepherd was the major factor but on the otherhand I don't think he was stubborn enough to turn down someone like Hitzfield. And ok now what we get is Sam, imo a risky but good choice but definitely not in the same class as Mourinho and Benitez. Is that really mad to think we aren't really that attractive?

 

2. Ok, this is very arguable I know, but in my opinion you should NEVER think Sam wanna turns Newcastle into another Bolton who just know long ball, header and luck.

 

Again, this is very arguable, but here is my understanding.

Sam is a defense-first type manager for sure, and the first priority he is doing in Newcastle is to implement his DEFENSE TACTIC which is proven in Bolton. I am ok for this, and I also don't think anyone will object about this right?

If we just evaluate our defense this season, is that really our defense tactic is s***? Or is that some of our playey becomes Bramble again and cost us silly goals? Think again, Fulham, Derby, etc, many goals we lose this season were due to silly mistake of Cacapa and Rozehnal, or the unstoppable fluke goals. When we are using Taylor and Faye, who are less error-prone, our defense looks the most solid one we have since Robson era, even though we are having a LB who is frequently out of position. You can blame Sam for buying two s*** centre back, which is really his fault---f****** hell the Rozehnal is since the worse version of Andy O'Brien---but other than that Sam has really did a great job for our defense. I am particularly impressed by his effort for trying to restore our pressing in Robson era. It is completely different from the one under Souness, which our player just running like headless chicken. The defense is much more systematic and consistent---ok, except the s*** errors by the new Bramble/OBrien.

 

The major problem is our offense. Here why I still defend Sam is because I think it is unfair to judge him by Bolton's style. Look at the players he had. Yea you can said they have Diouf, Anelka, or even Okocha or Campo etc but the truth is the players are just s***, so s*** that they are facing relegation immediately. If you are the manager would you ask these type of players, who were acquired due to extremely limited of funds, to play beautiful footballs? In another words, and it is a matter of belief that, do you think Sam is really willing to play like that or just he is forced to? Yea I know everyone will fire me for this and saying what we are doing now is the proof, but I do have different views. In my opinion, he is trying to consolidate the defense, in the highest order, that attacking type players like Emre are sacrificed. Then he will start to make some attacking plays, like long ball, left side attack etc which will not affect our defense. So our attack is simply limited by the players like Butt, Smith, etc who are good tacklers but never a good passer.

 

We are a club much bigger than Bolton, and for sure we should be able to supply more resources to him. My argument here is, due to his preference in consolidating defense and limited human resource(face it), he is forced to play like that. If he has more time and resources, spend some cash and bring in the players he want like Okocha, I don't think he will still ask the team to attack like that. We can definitely play a lot better if we have better players. Just an example, when we have Duff back to the left last game, we really have two wingers and start to play like what we are in the past. He knows how to do it, just he didn't.

 

So here is another problem, which I do think he should be blamed, is that he is clearly showing the message of "I don't care about this season's result", and that's why even Wullie is firing at him. I really understand this and the season ticket holder is calling his head for this. "Oh my god why do that?" "We can play better!" I also have such questions before the Arsenal game but now I understand why: he has written this season off and use it for rebuilding and training his tactics. This is consistent with his words at the start of the season. At that time, he has already claimed that he needs time and ask us to be patient until he can really do something. At that time, I do believe everyone like me thinks that the message is "Sorry the club is problematic and I need a lot of time to change things." And his statement has been already forgotten after the excellent start of the season that we think "The team is good and is capable of a top 6 finish." I think this is correct too, but that makes his message silly right? You can do it immediately then why ask for 2 seasons time? And now when I look back our results, our performances, I think what Sam Allardyce really meant at that time is "Sorry lads, result is not my priority this season, you gotta face a difficult time until I accomplish my tactics, get in the players I want and trained them well." Result is sacrificed for his long term plan, and that's what he meant, in my opinion.

 

The strongest proof, and the only proof I have, is the flashing quality we have made sometimes this season. I don't think people will argue about this too. In our normal setup things are really poor, but sometimes we can also play like a team that definitely can have a top 6 finish. The substitution of Emre, Duff, the hold up play of Viduka and Smith, and impressive pressing tactics we performed during Arsenal...all these are simply non-existent for the last 3-4 years.

 

I know it's f****** irritating to watch the team playing when it's f****** obvious to change a very simple bit and play a lot better, but it's so silly that people either think he is mentally retarded or he is forcing a contract termination by Ashley. But for me, as he has already announced that he needs time and his only priority this season is our defense but not our result, I will give him time to do that. I am also very depressed if we really become the 2nd Bolton but I will only judge that after he has completed his tactics. If he plays long ball, header and luck again I must be on your side, cursing him to die and suffer in Hell etc anything you like.

 

But now, at least now, I understand what he's doing, and I think it is possible that he can success, so I will give him the time he asked, 2 seasons.

 

Top post!

 

I hope you are right in section 2.

 

We just need to give him time. Change is the last thing we need.

[Guest Knightrider]

(one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Steady on

 

 

I'm sorry I rate him, although I realise that rating our own players is tantamount to a crime on this board. 

 

I rate him too, and rating our own is like a crime on here I agree, but overrating them is also popular on here too. He's good, nothing more.

[Dave]

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

Dave, just a question, don't you think Charles attack better when he plays at LB? I remember when he plays LW he isn't that productive.

 

How many times has he started on the wing though? I see what you're saying, but it stands to reason that his attributes should be used where they can do the most damage.

 

Not to mention the fact he's pap at defending.

[Guest Knightrider]

I think the Zog is the only one of players that would interest the top 6 right now - maybe Taylor.... but no-one else

 

Our French Friend in Norf Landahn woudl probably pay serious money for him  for a start

 

I don't think Man Utd, Chelsea or Arsenal would want N'Zogbia as they have better players or other ideas down their left. I think Liverpool and Spurs would kill for him though.

[La Parka]

 

N'Zogbia was head and shoulders above anyone else yesterday. They were scared shitless of him, yet much of the time he was 40 yards from goal.

 

Dave, just a question, don't you think Charles attack better when he plays at LB? I remember when he plays LW he isn't that productive.

 

How many times has he started on the wing though? I see what you're saying, but it stands to reason that his attributes should be used where they can do the most damage.

 

Not to mention the fact he's pap at defending.

 

Mainly his positioning, but it makes sense seen as though he has played his whole life on the wing. He also loses the ball frequently at left back, trying to pass it out.

 

I agree he needs to be pushed forward, to the left wing. I agree he is a good player and has the potential to be a really good talent. He needs the games, the training and the personal attributes to push on and become the player he has the potential to be.

[Parky]

(one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Steady on

 

 

I'm sorry I rate him, although I realise that rating our own players is tantamount to a crime on this board. 

 

I rate him too, and rating our own is like a crime on here I agree, but overrating them is also popular on here too. He's good, nothing more.

 

...for those who play predominantly on the left I only have Ronaldo, Hleb, Bentley and Giggs ahead of him. For me he is neck and neck with the likes of Ashey Young, Petrov etc..Given the chance regularly on the left that is.

[Mick]

 

Watching a different game then, I thought he was average at both ends in the main. I'm not going to rip into his game though because he's doing well overall and there weren't many good performers yesterday.

 

I must have watched the same game as Dave because I also thought N'Zogbia was by far our best player.

[Guest Knightrider]

(one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Steady on

 

 

I'm sorry I rate him, although I realise that rating our own players is tantamount to a crime on this board. 

 

I rate him too, and rating our own is like a crime on here I agree, but overrating them is also popular on here too. He's good, nothing more.

 

...for those who play predominantly on the left I only have Ronaldo, Hleb, Bentley and Giggs ahead of him. For me he is neck and neck with the likes of Ashey Young, Petrov etc..Given the chance regularly on the left that is.

 

I have Malouda, Ronaldo, Giggs, Rosiky, Diouf, Pedersen, Young, Petrov, Taylor, Utaka, and Downing as either better or just as good on their day.

[Zero]

 

How many times has he started on the wing though? I see what you're saying, but it stands to reason that his attributes should be used where they can do the most damage.

 

Not to mention the fact he's pap at defending.

 

Not just this season, including the last, or even the Souness, SBR era, yes he did have some flashes but I do think he performs, on average, the best in LB. You are right that the evidence isn't that much, and I also agree we should give him a run at LW to see how he performs first, but is it really a bad idea to convert him into a LB, which the France U-21 manager also share the same view?

 

He is shit in positioning but some of his tackling and movement is good, I can still remember that great heading he made during the match versus Asenal, the one that direct save us a goal.

[Guest Knightrider]

 

Watching a different game then, I thought he was average at both ends in the main. I'm not going to rip into his game though because he's doing well overall and there weren't many good performers yesterday.

 

I must have watched the same game as Dave because I also thought N'Zogbia was by far our best player.

 

I don't think any stood out to be by far and away our best player, with the exception of Beye (overall) and Milner in the first-half. N'Zogbia had his moments but I can't remember much of what he did if I'm being honest. That's just my own perception of the game though which I admit have grown hazy since as it was one of those to forget type of performances. I can't even remember Viduka doing much apart from his goals and my mate swears blind he was excellent.

[Parky]

(one of the best left sided players in the whole fucking league) in his correct position.

 

Steady on

 

 

I'm sorry I rate him, although I realise that rating our own players is tantamount to a crime on this board. 

 

I rate him too, and rating our own is like a crime on here I agree, but overrating them is also popular on here too. He's good, nothing more.

 

...for those who play predominantly on the left I only have Ronaldo, Hleb, Bentley and Giggs ahead of him. For me he is neck and neck with the likes of Ashey Young, Petrov etc..Given the chance regularly on the left that is.

 

I have Malouda, Ronaldo, Giggs, Rosiky, Diouf, Pedersen, Young, Petrov, Taylor, Utaka, and Downing as either better or just as good on their day.

 

FYP.

 

Malouda is slightly better than Zoggy currently but won't be long term. He comes inside too much and rarely takes on his man without diving..Abidal is the last Malouda...now switched back to left back at Barca. Niether of them are as fluid as Zogg.

This is Giggs last season and he often moves into the middle in the second half these days.

Rosicky is a CM who drifts wide on the left when Hleb switches wings to the right. Wenger would love Zoggy on the left for Arsenal.

Diouf is a joke right?

Petrov is slightly better but much older.

Taylor? No.

Utaka is a right winger.

Downing is basically shit who can't beat his man and has no pace.

[La Parka]

 

How many times has he started on the wing though? I see what you're saying, but it stands to reason that his attributes should be used where they can do the most damage.

 

Not to mention the fact he's pap at defending.

 

Not just this season, including the last, or even the Souness, SBR era, yes he did have some flashes but I do think he performs, on average, the best in LB. You are right that the evidence isn't that much, and I also agree we should give him a run at LW to see how he performs first, but is it really a bad idea to convert him into a LB, which the France U-21 manager also share the same view?

 

He is s*** in positioning but some of his tackling and movement is good, I can still remember that great heading he made during the match versus Asenal, the one that direct save us a goal.

 

I can see where you are coming from, but a lot of his good defensive work is down to his pace. He backs off a lot when he is one on one with a winger allowing them to get a cross in, he loses his positioning an awful lot... however.. it is a new role to him, and perhaps, with more work he could be a good leftback. Whether Sam saw this in traning or went for the old square pegs trick we wont know. Its clear Duff and Milner are the preferred wingers at present, at least in Sams mind...

[Zero]

Ay yea, just conincidence in my opinion, it's Sam who convert Ricardo Gardner from a LW into a LB, a player which is very similar to Charles---different class though.