If not Sam, who then?

[Robster]

I know the type of manager we don't need and that's defensive minded managers. Newcastle fans want to be entertained. Unlike the media bollocks "we'd rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0" we would rather win 4-3 than grind out 1-0 wins. Don't tell me you can't win games with entertaining football. Look at Man U and Arsenal. Ferguson and Wenger's teams play attacking football. We aren't in their league but teams like Reading and Man City have a go at entertaining. In hindsight Sven would have been a good choice for us (although based on his England days you would never have guessed he would play attacking football).

 

We need a motivator. Someone who can inspire the team to come flying out the blocks at the start of both halves of the game. I can't stand Allardyce's "we must worry about what the opposition can do" attitude. It should be let the opposition worry about us.

 

I am not convinced that an all together defensive manager would be that unpopular here, so long as we were getting the results. I think most of us realised that when Sam came along.

However, because of his baffling ideas and team selections, his defensive thinking just gives us a handy stick to whack him with.

If we were top of the clean sheet charts and had another 10 points on the board, I genuinely think we would all be as happy as pigs in shit, given that he has just arrived here.

The fact that his defensive tactics have done us no good is really putting the pressure on him

[Guest Brummiemag]

Get a proven manager in such as Scolari who plays attractive, entertaining football and then give him the time and resources to deliver a year on year improvement

[GM]

I was going to start a new thread for this, but thought it pointless, so i'll do it here. Let's list all the positive changes that sam has made to this club. I'll start:

 

10. saved costs in ball boys, as they are not needed as much cause the fans up in the stands get to throw the ball back onto the pitch more, due to our scientific percentages tactics

 

Seriously?

 

[Guest gggg]

Get a proven manager in such as Scolari who plays attractive, entertaining football and then give him the time and resources to deliver a year on year improvement

 

So much wrong for a short post

[Guest SellSholaFor1M]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're fucking joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

[Guest Knightrider]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're fucking joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

[Guest SellSholaFor1M]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're f****** joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

 

Souness would do much better than Fat Sam if he was in charge of the current squad of players, without a shadow of a doubt.

 

The football Souness played was infinitely better than Fat Sam's, and that's saying something.

 

If you're claiming it isn't, you're lying.

[Guest Knightrider]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're f****** joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

 

Souness would do much better than Fat Sam if he was in charge of the current squad of players, without a shadow of a doubt.

 

The football Souness played was infinitely better than Fat Sam's, and that's saying something.

 

If you're claiming it isn't, you're lying.

 

Even with 50m he fucked things up. And I don't know about you but losing as we did to Wigan's reserves with a full strength team was infinitely worse than anything Allardyce has served up.

 

I love how you slagged everyone on here for wanting Souness out 15 months into the job citing he needed time and money and that the club was fucked up yet you want rid of Allardyce who statistically is doing no worse in under 20 games having inherited his and Roeder's mess and not even had any real money yet to spend.

 

You stamp your feet though

[Guest SellSholaFor1M]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're f****** joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

 

Souness would do much better than Fat Sam if he was in charge of the current squad of players, without a shadow of a doubt.

 

The football Souness played was infinitely better than Fat Sam's, and that's saying something.

 

If you're claiming it isn't, you're lying.

 

Even with 50m he f***** things up I don't know about you but losing as we did to Wigan's reserves with a full strength team was worse than anything Allardyce has served up.

 

That last bit is debateable. Actually no it isn't. Drawing at home to Derby and losing away to them is worse in my book, when you consider that this Derby side have only picked up 7 points and are more than likely going to be challenging the mackems lowest ever points tally.

 

Failing to get a shot on target or even a corner in a HOME game is also much worse.

 

As is managing just one against Wigan away.

 

The fact is we have played maybe 200 minutes of good football all season, the rest has been absolutely terrible. Honestly tell me Souness was worse than that?

 

Look at the injuries Souness had. Never once was he able to field his strongest XI or anything close to it, yet he still didn't do as bad as Allardyce is doing right now.

 

Argue otherwise.

[Guest SellSholaFor1M]

I love how you slagged everyone on here for wanting Souness out 15 months into the job citing he needed time and money and that the club was f***** up yet you want rid of Allardyce who statistically is doing no worse in under 20 games having inherited his and Roeder's mess and not even had any real money yet to spend.

 

You stamp your feet though

 

Ah a post edit.

 

I think you'll find I slagged people off for never giving the man a chance in the first place, and wanting him out at the first sign of potential trouble even though Souness had an injury list that any manager would struggle with, with the exception of the Wengers of our world.

 

Allardyce IS doing statistically worse, our points tally may be better but look at the opposition we've played, the injuries we haven't had, etc etc. You're clutching at straws here by claiming Fat Sam is doing better statistically.

 

What will giving him more money achieve? It won't change his tactics, his style of play, etc etc...

[Keefaz]

I remember Souness playing shite, clueless formations and getting nowhere with them in much the same way as Allardyce is doing, tbh. Shola and Bellamy on the wings, etc.

[Gallowgate Toon]

Stick with Sam, he'll come good in the end.

[Guest Knightrider]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're f****** joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

 

Souness would do much better than Fat Sam if he was in charge of the current squad of players, without a shadow of a doubt.

 

The football Souness played was infinitely better than Fat Sam's, and that's saying something.

 

If you're claiming it isn't, you're lying.

 

Even with 50m he f***** things up I don't know about you but losing as we did to Wigan's reserves with a full strength team was worse than anything Allardyce has served up.

 

That last bit is debateable. Actually no it isn't. Drawing at home to Derby and losing away to them is worse in my book, when you consider that this Derby side have only picked up 7 points and are more than likely going to be challenging the mackems lowest ever points tally.

 

Failing to get a shot on target or even a corner in a HOME game is also much worse.

 

As is managing just one against Wigan away.

 

The fact is we have played maybe 200 minutes of good football all season, the rest has been absolutely terrible. Honestly tell me Souness was worse than that?

 

Look at the injuries Souness had. Never once was he able to field his strongest XI or anything close to it, yet he still didn't do as bad as Allardyce is doing right now.

 

Argue otherwise.

 

4-1 at home to Fulham? Souness was a complete disaster for Newcastle on and off the pitch. Much worse than Big Sam, mind the new man has only been here a shit and a shave so it would be unfair to judge who is worse just yet.

 

You're a hypocrite man, you won't give the new man time yet you slagged those who wouldn't give Souness any either. Btw, many gave Souness plenty of time, on here and at SJP.

[Mowen]

Souness was undoubtably worse for NUFC than Allardyce could be, unless he sends us down. Souness took a team that had finished 4th, 3rd and 5th and took them well down the league. He pretty much destroyed them. Allardyce can't possibly destroy a team to that extent, given that he's inheriting a team that gained our lowest ever PL points total.

[La Parka]

Souness was undoubtably worse for NUFC than Allardyce could be, unless he sends us down. Souness took a team that had finished 4th, 3rd and 5th and took them well down the league. He pretty much destroyed them. Allardyce can't possibly destroy a team to that extent, given that he's inheriting a team that gained our lowest ever PL points total.

 

The major point.

 

We were FUCKING SHIT even before Sam took over.

 

A summer of losing all the deadwood then attempting to sign replacements, despite our poor league position was always going to be hard.

 

We are 11th FFS, its hardly end of the world stuff.

 

Sam will come good with time.

[gonufc]

Souness was undoubtably worse for NUFC than Allardyce could be, unless he sends us down. Souness took a team that had finished 4th, 3rd and 5th and took them well down the league. He pretty much destroyed them. Allardyce can't possibly destroy a team to that extent, given that he's inheriting a team that gained our lowest ever PL points total.

 

The major point.

 

We were f****** s*** even before Sam took over.

 

A summer of losing all the deadwood then attempting to sign replacements, despite our poor league position was always going to be hard.

 

We are 11th FFS, its hardly end of the world stuff.

 

Sam will come good with time.

 

Good to see some sense around here. We're a mid table club and no more at the moment. Sam is a very good manager and needs time to make the squad his own.

[Mick]

 

Good to see some sense around here. We're a mid table club and no more at the moment. Sam is a very good manager and needs time to make the squad his own.

 

Good managers tend to realise when they get something wrong and try to avoid repeating the same mistakes, Allardyce doesn't.  Why is Allardyce a 'very good manager?'

[Yorkie]

There's fuck all available in the way of managers.

[Guest Knightrider]

 

Good to see some sense around here. We're a mid table club and no more at the moment. Sam is a very good manager and needs time to make the squad his own.

 

Good managers tend to realise when they get something wrong and try to avoid repeating the same mistakes, Allardyce doesn't.  Why is Allardyce a 'very good manager?'

 

Good managers also stick to what they know best and try to change the players or get rid of them. Wenger said when he took over at Arsenal the first thing he did was try and change the way the back-five played because that was the base of his team, i.e. how he wanted his team to play, from the back. He had many difficulties trying to change these old fahsioned English players with limited technical ability to change, much less convince them. He did it by telling them he'd add a few extra years to their careers and with it they'd be able to make more money so they listened and when the results started coming through he had them eating out of the palm of his hand.

 

Fergie did likewise at Man Utd, he went in and said no more drinking. Only he didn't have the success Wenger had so he got rid of the drinkers and party animals.

 

Also, good players tend to adapt and hungry players tend to have a great desire to improve as much as they can.

 

Big Sam has every right to come here and enforce his ways and methods and has every right to expect his players to shape up or ship out.

 

Yes managers do change too, i.e. working with what they have and making compromises, but for all we know the manager has already tried that, in fact it's clear he has tried that. You just had to listen to his pre-match comments before the Arsenal game to realise that.

 

Anyway, all hysteria aside and typical NUFC circusry, we aren't doing too bad. From where I sit anyway. 11th in the table is just about right looking at the players we have and taking into consideration this is a whole new era where things will take time.

 

Edit: Mourinho did the same too.

 

Mind it's easier to change things when the environment is geared towards success where as it's very tough when starting from scratch. That's why it took Big Sam a long time to get Bolton to where he wanted them to go and why it took Fergie 5 years, or more closer to home, Sir Bobby all of 2 seasons. Will sam get that chance? I doubt it but he and we need it. Unless there is an available miracle worker around the corner guaranteed to get us moving forwards a lot quicker....

[gonufc]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're f****** joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

 

Souness would do much better than Fat Sam if he was in charge of the current squad of players, without a shadow of a doubt.

 

The football Souness played was infinitely better than Fat Sam's, and that's saying something.

 

If you're claiming it isn't, you're lying.

 

mackems.gif

[Mick]

 

Good managers also stick to what they know best and try to change the players or get rid of them. Wenger said when he took over at Arsenal the first thing he did was try and change the way the back-five played because that was the base of his team, i.e. how he wanted his team to play, from the back. He had many difficulties trying to change these old fahsioned English players with limited technical ability to change, much less convince them. He did it by telling them he'd add a few extra years to their careers and with it they'd be able to make more money so they listened and when the results started coming through he had them eating out of the palm of his hand.

 

Fergie did likewise at Man Utd, he went in and said no more drinking. Only he didn't have the success Wenger had so he got rid of the drinkers and party animals.

 

Also, good players tend to adapt and hungry players tend to have a great desire to improve as much as they can.

 

Big Sam has every right to come here and enforce his ways and methods and has every right to expect his players to shape up or ship out.

 

Yes managers do change too, i.e. working with what they have and making compromises, but for all we know the manager has already tried that, in fact it's clear he has tried that. You just had to listen to his pre-match comments before the Arsenal game to realise that.

 

Anyway, all hysteria aside and typical NUFC circusry, we aren't doing too bad. From where I sit anyway. 11th in the table is just about right looking at the players we have and taking into consideration this is a whole new era where things will take time.

 

Edit: Mourinho did the same too.

 

Mind it's easier to change things when the environment is geared towards success where as it's very tough when starting from scratch. That's why it took Big Sam a long time to get Bolton to where he wanted them to go and why it took Fergie 5 years, or more closer to home, Sir Bobby all of 2 seasons. Will sam get that chance? I doubt it but he and we need it. Unless there is an available miracle worker around the corner guaranteed to get us moving forwards a lot quicker....

 

None of that has anything to do with us constantly dropping points because the manager doesn't recognise he's part of the problem.

[Guest Knightrider]

 

Good managers also stick to what they know best and try to change the players or get rid of them. Wenger said when he took over at Arsenal the first thing he did was try and change the way the back-five played because that was the base of his team, i.e. how he wanted his team to play, from the back. He had many difficulties trying to change these old fahsioned English players with limited technical ability to change, much less convince them. He did it by telling them he'd add a few extra years to their careers and with it they'd be able to make more money so they listened and when the results started coming through he had them eating out of the palm of his hand.

 

Fergie did likewise at Man Utd, he went in and said no more drinking. Only he didn't have the success Wenger had so he got rid of the drinkers and party animals.

 

Also, good players tend to adapt and hungry players tend to have a great desire to improve as much as they can.

 

Big Sam has every right to come here and enforce his ways and methods and has every right to expect his players to shape up or ship out.

 

Yes managers do change too, i.e. working with what they have and making compromises, but for all we know the manager has already tried that, in fact it's clear he has tried that. You just had to listen to his pre-match comments before the Arsenal game to realise that.

 

Anyway, all hysteria aside and typical NUFC circusry, we aren't doing too bad. From where I sit anyway. 11th in the table is just about right looking at the players we have and taking into consideration this is a whole new era where things will take time.

 

Edit: Mourinho did the same too.

 

Mind it's easier to change things when the environment is geared towards success where as it's very tough when starting from scratch. That's why it took Big Sam a long time to get Bolton to where he wanted them to go and why it took Fergie 5 years, or more closer to home, Sir Bobby all of 2 seasons. Will sam get that chance? I doubt it but he and we need it. Unless there is an available miracle worker around the corner guaranteed to get us moving forwards a lot quicker....

 

None of that has anything to do with us constantly dropping points because the manager doesn't recognise he's part of the problem.

 

To be fair, Big Sam has constantly made changes which could indicate that he has indeed seen these things and is trying to address them, obviously with no success, or not enough, but to say he's blind as such, well, I think he knows full well what is needed and what works and what doesn't. People bemoan the long ball and the hoof it tactic but when the players were doing that against Derby the manager was telling them not to do it.

 

 

[Mick]

 

To be fair, Big Sam has constantly made changes which could indicate that he has indeed seen these things and is trying to address them, obviously with no success, or not enough, but to say he's blind as such, well, I think he knows full well what is needed and what works and what doesn't. People bemoan the long ball and the hoof it tactic but when the players were doing that against Derby the manager was telling them not to do it.

 

 

 

Going to Wigan and playing 1 up front suggests to me that he doesn't understand his part in our poor performances.  I doubt anybody saw the team and expected anything other than what we ended up with, he did the same against Derby, he gave them too much respect and we ended up with the same, a defeat.

 

He's either thick or too arrogant as far as I can see.  We all make mistakes in our jobs, most of us see them as mistakes and then try to avoid making the same ones again, he seems incapable of this.

[Guest Knightrider]

 

To be fair, Big Sam has constantly made changes which could indicate that he has indeed seen these things and is trying to address them, obviously with no success, or not enough, but to say he's blind as such, well, I think he knows full well what is needed and what works and what doesn't. People bemoan the long ball and the hoof it tactic but when the players were doing that against Derby the manager was telling them not to do it.

 

 

 

Going to Wigan and playing 1 up front suggests to me that he doesn't understand his part in our poor performances.  I doubt anybody saw the team and expected anything other than what we ended up with, he did the same against Derby, he gave them too much respect and we ended up with the same, a defeat.

 

He's either thick or too arrogant as far as I can see.  We all make mistakes in our jobs, most of us see them as mistakes and then try to avoid making the same ones again, he seems incapable of this.

 

So did we lose that match because he played one up top, then?

[Guest SellSholaFor1M]

There is no one else. Sam is the best manager available to us at the moment.

 

You're f****** joking aren't you? I am struggling to name a manager who would do worse than what Fat Sam is achieving right now, with all that talent at his disposal.

 

How about that manager you slagged everyone off on here for wanting rid of, Souness?

 

 

Souness would do much better than Fat Sam if he was in charge of the current squad of players, without a shadow of a doubt.

 

The football Souness played was infinitely better than Fat Sam's, and that's saying something.

 

If you're claiming it isn't, you're lying.

 

Even with 50m he f***** things up I don't know about you but losing as we did to Wigan's reserves with a full strength team was worse than anything Allardyce has served up.

 

That last bit is debateable. Actually no it isn't. Drawing at home to Derby and losing away to them is worse in my book, when you consider that this Derby side have only picked up 7 points and are more than likely going to be challenging the mackems lowest ever points tally.

 

Failing to get a shot on target or even a corner in a HOME game is also much worse.

 

As is managing just one against Wigan away.

 

The fact is we have played maybe 200 minutes of good football all season, the rest has been absolutely terrible. Honestly tell me Souness was worse than that?

 

Look at the injuries Souness had. Never once was he able to field his strongest XI or anything close to it, yet he still didn't do as bad as Allardyce is doing right now.

 

Argue otherwise.

 

4-1 at home to Fulham? Souness was a complete disaster for Newcastle on and off the pitch. Much worse than Big Sam, mind the new man has only been here a s*** and a shave so it would be unfair to judge who is worse just yet.

 

You're a hypocrite man, you won't give the new man time yet you slagged those who wouldn't give Souness any either. Btw, many gave Souness plenty of time, on here and at SJP.

 

I'm not a hypocrite. General rule of thumb, I'm always prepared to give a manager time, because all managers generally need time to get things going. But 6 months into Fat Sam's reign, I see absolutely no positives, I see nothing good been done, and I don't see how giving him more time will change anything - he's adamant on playing the same tactics, the same style and the same formations which just don't suit the club, the fans, and the playing personnel.

 

At least with Souness (and Roeder) you could see some positives. Don't get me wrong, I certainly wasn't sad to see Souness go - the results and performances weren't acceptable, but I feel it COULD have been different without the injuries. With Sam, I don't see how things can be different, in 6 months it's been nothing short of a disaster.

 

But I get the feeling we aren't going to agree with each other. Surely though, the fact that we are debating and comparing the two men shows just how badly Fat Sam is doing? Without injuries and all that too.

 

Disaster, utter disaster.