Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 If there was a simmering discontent with Sammy Dice at the highest level and doubts had begun to be voiced, especially within the context of the growing evidence of supporter disenchantment with performances, would it not have been better to wait till the summer? If as it seems Ashley was growing impatient to stamp his mark on the club, shouldn't he (with no football background and scant knowledge) have held fire till a longer period of deliberation and discussion was available ie the summer. A time when many more managers get itchy feet, get fired, or end associations with national teams. Wouldn't the wisest move in all reality have been to take stock and canvass opionion from experts, contacts, agents and friends during the summer break? Pick a man from a shortlist carefully assembled, perhaps a world class or international class manager. What exactly is the driving force behind this farce? Please help me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest elbee909 Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 If there was a simmering discontent with Sammy Dice at the highest level and doubts had begun to be voiced, especially within the context of the growing evidence of supporter disenchantment with performances, would it not have been better to wait till the summer? If as it seems Ashley was growing impatient to stamp his mark on the club, shouldn't he (with no football background and scant knowledge) have held fire till a longer period of deliberation and discussion was available ie the summer. A time when many more managers get itchy feet, get fired, or end associations with national teams. Wouldn't the wisest move in all reality have been to take stock and canvass opionion from experts, contacts, agents and friends during the summer break. Pick a man from a shortlist carefully assembled, perhaps a world class or international class manager. What exactly is the driving force behing this farce? Please help me. I think you're beyond help, Parky sir. Don't believe the hype, save the throwing of dog eggs until it's happened. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Micktoon Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Agree, I've got a sore neck from shaking my head for the last few days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 He's ended a nightmare a few month early, what's wrong with that? Sam Allardyce couldn't cut it, all he had to do was play 442, players in the right position, motivate them, and get some wins under his belt. That's all he had to do, that would of proved to the board he could do the job, instead the stubborn tit had to do it his way, which was the most boring crap, disjointed football thats been served up here in years. He had to go, he was a failure, he failed at everything on the pitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mouldy_uk Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I'm going to reserve judgement until the new manager (Redknapp?) is officially appointed, until then I don't think it's possible to really say they have failed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I'm going to reserve judgement until the new manager (Redknapp?) is officially appointed, until then I don't think it's possible to really say they have failed. Unless they pull a 'big rabbit' out of the hat this fiasco is an abject failure of reason, common sense and sorely lacks any clear judgement. It smacks of a child who can't wait till christmas day to open his presents. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/1084/turgidsonsr7.jpg I'd like to hold off judgement on a thing like that, sir, until all the facts are in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gggg Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I think he did listen to his friends, who recommended their mate Redknapp. They met days/weeks ago and he accepted the job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mouldy_uk Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I'm going to reserve judgement until the new manager (Redknapp?) is officially appointed, until then I don't think it's possible to really say they have failed. Unless they pull a 'big rabbit' out of the hat this fiasco is an abject failure of reason, common sense and sorely lacks any clear judgement. It smacks of a child who can't wait till christmas day to open his presents. Agreed, but maybe a tiny part of me is still hoping they may just pull it off! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 the clamouring for an international class manager,while it would be nice may be beyobd us. i have posted recently that the likes of mourinho would come if the conditions were right (wages and a big enough transfer kitty). i have no doubt we would pay top wages but it looks like we may not be getting the abramovic size spending we had hoped for, though probably still more than the previous regime (thats for you NE5). the question we should be asking is who is the best that we could get on those terms ? as for redkanpp, if true, yes i'd deffo have him instead of allardyce Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom_NUFC Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 I'd definitely take Redknapp over Allardyce, but I'm still far from sure that I want him as manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. Part of the longer term problem now will be is that it is clear that that the role of the owner is too blurred with the safety net of an independant thinking chairman. Regardless of how Redknapp performs I see no due dilligence in this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. http://xkcd.com/258/ Yeah, you're right Parkster, there are plenty of hopeless sides below us. Like Derby for instance. And the mighty Wigan. Now only if we could take points off them! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummie Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 All the standing with the away fans in his Toon shirt stuff was good to see - I mean that, an owner with no airs and graces, excellent - but is it really possible to maintain the required level of emotional detachment to make big, big football decisions like this and to get them right, when you're surrounding yourself with the fans on match day? I don't expect many of you will agree with me on that, but I can see how even the best businessmen can make bad decisions in football (god knows, enough of them have) when they let their emotional involvement take over. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chizzletooth Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 No one can say they failed until we see how the new man does. Simple as. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest exilim Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Where's Coach HTT? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. Part of the longer term problem now will be is that it is clear that that the role of the owner is too blurred with the safety net of an independant thinking chairman. Regardless of how Redknapp performs I see no due dilligence in this. i feel we'd have been a lot closer to relegation than you think Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. http://xkcd.com/258/ Yeah, you're right Parkster, there are plenty of hopeless sides below us. Like Derby for instance. And the mighty Wigan. Now only if we could take points off them! Are you happy at how this change in manager has been handled? The timing? The cost? The lack of ambition? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Li3nZ Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 If there was a simmering discontent with Sammy Dice at the highest level and doubts had begun to be voiced, especially within the context of the growing evidence of supporter disenchantment with performances, would it not have been better to wait till the summer? If as it seems Ashley was growing impatient to stamp his mark on the club, shouldn't he (with no football background and scant knowledge) have held fire till a longer period of deliberation and discussion was available ie the summer. A time when many more managers get itchy feet, get fired, or end associations with national teams. Wouldn't the wisest move in all reality have been to take stock and canvass opionion from experts, contacts, agents and friends during the summer break? Pick a man from a shortlist carefully assembled, perhaps a world class or international class manager. What exactly is the driving force behind this farce? Please help me. Which part of this is the definition of failure? Surely this can only be defined with hindsight? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 All the standing with the away fans in his Toon shirt stuff was good to see - I mean that, an owner with no airs and graces, excellent - but is it really possible to maintain the required level of emotional detachment to make big, big football decisions like this and to get them right, when you're surrounding yourself with the fans on match day? I don't expect many of you will agree with me on that, but I can see how even the best businessmen can make bad decisions in football (god knows, enough of them have) when they let their emotional involvement take over. Excelllent post and surely one of the key indicies that has led to a grotesque lapse in judgement which will echo in all our professional dealing for seasons to come. Who in all reality would want to work with us now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. http://xkcd.com/258/ Yeah, you're right Parkster, there are plenty of hopeless sides below us. Like Derby for instance. And the mighty Wigan. Now only if we could take points off them! Are you happy at how this change in manager has been handled? The timing? The cost? The lack of ambition? Happy? No. Do I feel it was necessary? Yes. Just like many of you felt Sam needed time to do things his way, why shouldn't Ashley be granted that same privilege? Ashley's first test should be assessed on the next managerial appointment. Who that is, remains to be seen, of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 If there was a simmering discontent with Sammy Dice at the highest level and doubts had begun to be voiced, especially within the context of the growing evidence of supporter disenchantment with performances, would it not have been better to wait till the summer? If as it seems Ashley was growing impatient to stamp his mark on the club, shouldn't he (with no football background and scant knowledge) have held fire till a longer period of deliberation and discussion was available ie the summer. A time when many more managers get itchy feet, get fired, or end associations with national teams. Wouldn't the wisest move in all reality have been to take stock and canvass opionion from experts, contacts, agents and friends during the summer break? Pick a man from a shortlist carefully assembled, perhaps a world class or international class manager. What exactly is the driving force behind this farce? Please help me. Which part of this is the definition of failure? Surely this can only be defined with hindsight? Unless this process delivers a world class manager it is a total faiure in communications of what we are as a club and what we are about regarding long term goals and how we want to work and build. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. http://xkcd.com/258/ Yeah, you're right Parkster, there are plenty of hopeless sides below us. Like Derby for instance. And the mighty Wigan. Now only if we could take points off them! Are you happy at how this change in manager has been handled? The timing? The cost? The lack of ambition? the timing i'm ok with the cost was out of ashleys hands really the ambition.......we'll have to see..if he spends £100mill in the summer i'd think he could have persuaded a bigger name...if we only have £30mill we wouldn't have got one Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 Allardyce couldn't beat top-table sides, he couldn't beat mid-table fodder, he lost to relegation candidates, and failed to beat Premiership promotion candidates. We sit 11th in the table, with trips to pretty much all the big four and a tougher line up than most... How close would Allardyce have to take us to the relegation battle before his sacking was necessary would you say Parky? We wouldn't have been relegated or been close to it this season. There are too many hopeless sides below us. We're 11th ffs!! People don't need the to create a spectre of relegation to justify this and if they do then it shows we are collectively grasping at straws to make ourselves feel better at what we clearly see as fundamental failure of judgement. http://xkcd.com/258/ Yeah, you're right Parkster, there are plenty of hopeless sides below us. Like Derby for instance. And the mighty Wigan. Now only if we could take points off them! Are you happy at how this change in manager has been handled? The timing? The cost? The lack of ambition? Happy? No. Do I feel it was necessary? Yes. Just like many of you felt Sam needed time to do things his way, why shouldn't Ashley be granted that same privilege? Ashley's first test should be assessed on the next managerial appointment. Who that is, remains to be seen, of course. He's in Hong Kong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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