Save Newcastle United

[indi]

 

So, you're not going to address the questions that have been posed and the issues that have been raised about the practicality of fan ownership, you're just going to eulogise about it again!!

 

I have addressed them or at least discussed them. What format do you want it in, a business plan or something?

 

You quite clearly haven't addressed them!!

 

How are you going to get the money?

 

How are you going to get over the issue of there being no feasible combination of contribution and number of contributors, so that everyone owns an even share?

 

What are the fans actually going to get for their money? A vote once a year on who runs the club? How is that different to a PLC? Are the owners not going to be able to see the team they own play, are they still going to have to buy a season ticket, if not what happens to the people who's season tickets are taken by the owners? etc etc etc.

 

How are the fans going to be able to acquire the working capital to maintain the day to day running of the club? Given that; the club makes a loss, the club has large debts, the fans weren't happy with the amount being spent on transfers already and wanted more, banks will be less willing to loan money to a bunch of fans, and those fans have no money of their own to put in.

 

You haven't answered a single one of those questions, the format I would like it in is called an answer, preferably one that actually is an answer and isn't some waffley hyperbole about what a wonderful thing it would be for the fans to run the club and how it would warm the cockles of your heart, that is specifically how I don't want it and is how you have "answered" it previously, hence why I'm still asking you for a proper answer!! 

 

Therein lies the reason that I am against fan ownership of a club as big as NUFC, fans by their very nature are unrealistic, they are unable to distinguish between reality and fantasy, they're not interested in the practicalities of running a football club in real life.

 

You have such a low opinion of your fellow fans Indi. This is why a supporters club has been set up or one of the main reasons, to promote ourselves in true colors rather than how the media portray us which I can understand gives others a false idea of us, but fellow fans too? To say fans can't distinguish between reality and fantasy is bollocks, utter bollocks and highly patronising which to be frank, I find to be quite the norm on here these days. It seems no-one can really say what they feel without some sneering cock being smart, arsey or jumping on a high horse. And how do you know fans are not interested in the practicalities of running a football club anyway? In fact I'd say this here forum is living proof they are as the running of the club in all areas is debated more than anything else on here and has been for ages. Fans are interested, very much so. It isn't all about transfers, new players and football.

 

No, I have a high opinion of my fellow fans, as fans. I have a lower opinion of my fellow fans when they're pretending that they know how to run a football club. As I said, fans are great at being fans - unsurprisingly - the things that make them great at being fans, make them fucking shite at being the owners of football clubs. If the fans were actually concentrating on what they excel at and getting behind the team, instead of playing at being businessmen and making demands which they hadn't considered the consequences of, then perhaps we'd have won against Hull and be looking to continue a promising start to the season against West Ham, instead of being total disaster area.

 

As for people being a cock and getting on their high-horse, well that's a matter of opinion and you're entitled to yours, just as I am to mine and it just so happens to be different to yours, now there's a surprise, eh?

 

People have raised issue after issue with this, yet no-one who supports it has addressed any of them, let alone provided a convincing counter-argument. I'm bored of asking questions and raising issues that get ignored, so I'm not going to raise any more (there are s***-loads, by the way) and I'm not going to repeat myself either, it should be pretty obvious why I'm against the idea already, but I'll spell it out for you if you want.

 

Why do you want people to address these all-important "issues" you talk of when you're clearly dead set against it (we get the message) and would only mock and put down anyway as you've done so several times now.

 

Why don't you want people to address these issues, they are the issues you're going to have to address if you're going to do this, afterall. I've asked a number of what I believe to be pertinent questions for anyone seriously considering this to answer and I've asked them a number of times. No-one has answered them, and yet a number of people, particularly you, have continued to bang the drum for this idea, offering up enthusiasm and excitement by the bucket-load, but very little in the way of substance. Sorry, but when grown men are playing at make-believe football club chairman, but are being all earnest about it as if it's reality, then it's a bit hard not to take the piss a little, sorry. I know that makes me a bad person, but well, I am a bad person, so what you gonna do?

 

Fans are irrational, they think with their heart not their head, that is not the way to run a football club, that is the way to ruin a football club. Look at what's happened over the last few weeks, a whole load of people acting based upon emotion rather than rationale have taken what was a promising situation for this club (the first season we've gone into for a long time where I've genuinely felt positive about the club and where it was heading) and totally f***ed it up, not only that but the club itself has been torn apart and lies in ruins, it's a f***ing mess of epic proportions. KK, the fans, and subsequently, the board, have all let emotion get the better of them and have made shocking decisions due to that, like I said emotion is not the way to run a football club.

 

Yeah, blame the fans, it is all our fault. Silly us, we are the ones that have screwed this up for you. I apologise 100 times, please forgive me. Get over yourself man and this self pity it's pathetic, have some pride in your fellow fans who are and always have been the best thing about this club.

 

Give fans something to believe in and don't do anything to f*** that up and they are putty in your hands.

 

Oh and in case this didn't register first time, fans won't be running the club, there is a difference between owning and running.

 

Well yeah, the fans are actually partly to blame for what's happened over the last few weeks, so you are some of the ones who have screwed this up for me, you, Ashley and Keegan, great job lads, well done. 

 

Self pity!?! I don't feel any self pity, you're one of the ones that got all teary-eyed and moist-knickered because someone quit their job for fuck's sake!!

 

I prefer to have pride in things that actually make me proud - if that's alright with you, of course? - and the protests and all the other totally over the top reactions to Keegan quitting do not fall under that heading I'm afraid. Now, if the few thousand people who've travelled down to West Ham tomorrow were to roar on the team and give show them just how good our support can be - as I'm hopeful they will - then I'll be proud of that, that'll be something well worth being proud of.

 

Oh and in case it didn't register the first, second, third, and possibly fourth time, you need to define what role the fans would actually have in the running of the club, because if they have none, or too little, then what's the point in them owning it and if they have too much what's to stop it turning into the disaster it inevitably would? Something even you tacitly admit by trying to draw a line between ownership and management.

 

Fan ownership is a recipe for disaster. The very fact that some fans are deluded enough to think that they're going to raise £300m plus and buy the club, shows just how tenuous grip on reality the kind of people who want to do this have, you can't have people like that in charge of NUFC, the club would go out of business within a week. You don't put the lunatics in charge of the asylum.

 

There are several fan owned clubs that prove otherwise, that fans owning their clubs is not a recipe for disaster. Two of the world's biggest clubs are owned by their fans for example.

 

Neither of which were ever bought by their fans, so neither of which provide a model for NUFC to follow, as I asked before, and you ignored, when did Barca's fans ever have to raise £300m to buy the club? There are plenty of problems with running things in the Barca/Real mould anyway, you've been asked about this too, by other people, I notice you've not answered their questions either.

[Stu]

can't agree more with indi - very well put 

[La Parka]

Save the club from its fans.

[Skeletor]

Indi just gave a complete master class in laying down some pwnage.