Mike Ashley: "I've loved owning Newcastle"

[Spider Jerusalem]

Ashley: "What a shame I've been forced to sell the club - I was going to spend loads of money and everything."

 

Aye, whatever. Get it sold, collect your thirty pieces of silver and fuck off you slimy cunt.

 

nothing but another attempted PR exercise, like all the other bullshit including buying pints for half the bigg market

 

 

 

You realise that there's always a purpose behind someone conducting a PR exercise? People don't just do them willy nilly.

 

What do you think was the purpose behind this PR Exercise, and the thinking behind that?

 

I would say it's because he's got no chance of selling the club and is stuck with us.  His only option is to suck up or sell the fixtures and fittings and write off the rest.  With the squad we've got the latter is looking unlikely.

[indi]

Ashley: "What a shame I've been forced to sell the club - I was going to spend loads of money and everything."

 

Aye, whatever. Get it sold, collect your thirty pieces of silver and fuck off you slimy cunt.

 

nothing but another attempted PR exercise, like all the other bullshit including buying pints for half the bigg market

 

 

 

You realise that there's always a purpose behind someone conducting a PR exercise? People don't just do them willy nilly.

 

What do you think was the purpose behind this PR Exercise, and the thinking behind that?

 

I would say it's because he's got no chance of selling the club and is stuck with us.  His only option is to suck up or sell the fixtures and fittings and write off the rest.  With the squad we've got the latter is looking unlikely.

 

So your answer to the first part is to "suck up" to the fans?

 

What about the second part? Why would he want to do that? Please don't create a circular argument by saying because he's got no choice.

[NE5]

 

mine isnt as much speculation though, because i actually touch upon some things that have happened  - ie ending up with a loanee from uruguay rather than any of those big name expensive players - funny how none of them came off when there was a fee involved yet we can bring in an inexperienced loanee in the space of a day.

 

The club had been heading that way the season before Ashley bought the club, so it's not just him. Like I pointed out in the other post, you could say "how come the Woodgate & Huth transfers couldn't come off, and yet 4 months later bring in an American centre-back who'd never played in the top-leagues before".

 

is this the 'shepherd did it so ashley can as well' argument? from what i remember we all criticised shepherd and a fair few wanted him out? is it okay for ashley to do it but not shepherd? this is not a partisan game you know - ashley vs shepherd. either we hold both to the same standards or we dont. it seems far too many people are still in thrall to ashley because he got rid of the loathed shepherd. well when the pig starts acting and dressing like the farmer he deposed, you dont back the pig, you go after him as you did the farmer.

 

and anyway, shepherd had a proven track record in funding his managers, ashley doesnt. even in a climate of clubs spending more than they ever have due to extra tv revenue.

 

This is a very fair point as well to be honest. We have to try and be fair and even-handed in the way that we judge the people in charge of the club.

 

Personally, I wasn't as anti-Shepherd as some, but I did have the feeling that he'd taken us as far as he could.

 

In today's climate, the same might even apply to Ashley as he doesn't appear to have the money available to him to really take us to where we want to be as quickly as we want to get there - especially when you see the money a lot of other clubs have now, we're just falling further and further behind.

 

The only answer may be a Lerner type or a Abu-Dhabhi group type to give us any sort of "quick fix".

 

even though i criticise ashley, id be fine if he came out and started acting like Lerner, learned from his mistakes and backed the manager with funds. i dont have anything against him personally, just the way he has owned the club. if he changes that, then ill give him a chance and, if he proves himself, will have no further problem with him. i dont care if the owner is a fat scrap metal dealer from byker or an oil mogul from dubai, the personalities arent important, just the actions. since there;s little prospects of him selling "id love it" if he could make his time in charge a success.

 

haven't commented on this exchange between Johnny and Rich, I've read it with interest so far, but that is exactly how I feel too. Personalities don't matter to me, and never have. If Ashley suddenly started to act - genuinely - like a good owner and someone who understood that for a club like us everything starts with having a good team on the pitch, and made the right decisions I'd give him a go. And we all know what those decisions are, but I don't think he will make them. He's got it wrong from the start and it seems to me that he has his mindset, it hasn't worked, and so thats it so far as he is concerned.

 

 

 

 

[NJS]

I am intrigued as to why you expect to die so young?  I don't know you, so perhaps you have an illness, if so please accept my apologies.  It just seemed such a strange thing to say, to expect to die so young.

 

It's mainly paranoia - my Dad died when he was 66 and I have a tendency which I fight an ongoing battle against to be a fat cunt.

 

Newcastle United is what you want it to be!

 

 

Undoubtedly - my point was that Hall and Keegan and the rest have given us a glimpse of a higher life and going back to "just" the things we all enjoy about following the club is disappointing to say the least - theres a line in Sit Down by James which sums it up - "If I hadn't seen such riches I could live with being poor".

 

 

[NE5]

 

Again though I'd say if he wasn't able or willing to see this coming (particularly when employing someone like Kevin Keegan) then he's seriously misguided. The fans were bound to be majorly pissed off about something at some point, that's what tends to happen in football.

 

I didn't see it coming and I've been going to games since the late 60's.

 

oh dear

 

 

[NE5]

 

Honestly?

 

There was massive worry when Wise/Jimenez/Vetere were brought in as people rightly realised that it was going to lead to problems with Keegan. There was continued worry (on NUFC.com and on here, etc.) when it appeared Keegan had very little input into the negotiations/signings of players, further than just naming them/sanctioning them.

 

I was personally skeptical, but as usual I hoped it would work and believed it could, which as always proved to be my downfall. When you tend to hope for the best/look on the bright side with this club, you tend to get kicked in the bollocks. Over and over again.

 

Everyone's worst fears were eventually realised, but it's hard to say it was a complete shock when it happened how it happened and the reaction, in particular, was completely expected.

 

Keegan and the others were appointed within days of each other and Keegan claimed that he knew that we would be bringing in the new structure and even claimed that he was given 3 names and had preferred Wise as DoF.  If the timing had been different then I might have been worried but Keegan was even asked something about him leaving last time and claiming something about the job not being what it said in the brochure, he said that this time he wasn't given a brochure.

 

When he was asked about how much he had been promised to spend he was always vague and claimed that he'd have to try and persuade Ashley to spend, I can't remember if he said that he hoped Ashley would fall in love with the team or something. 

 

Keegan didn't look/sound right to me for a good long while, if you know what I mean. There were a lot of times where I was struggling to believe if he actually believed what he was saying... I did wonder whether he was often saying things to defend his position/put pressure on the board to back him/in order to try and keep the peace.

 

I think a more accurate reflection of KK was the tirade after the Chelsea game (tirade may be a strong word) as a lot of pent-up frustration appeared to bubble out of him.

 

Despite the improvements on the field something didn't seem right and as the months went by things seemed to be getting more and more suspicious. People were skeptical enough to make it a prominent question (first one asked?) to Mort once upon a time as well.

 

I dunno. You'll remember me saying for a good few months prior to the KK walkout that things were a bit rotten, the posts will be on here somewhere.

 

indeed, and all of this WAS posted and noted by some at the time, but denied by others. IMO it was as obvious as night becomes day and Keegan walking was only a matter of time.

 

 

[NJS]

This is actually a genuine question, please read it at one:

 

Could anyone from the more hardcore Keegan supporters tell me at what point we move beyond talking about Keegan, accept that he's gone and Ashley remains and start trying to make the best of a bad job?

 

When do the needs of the club - staving off the threat of relegation, encouraging the owner to re-engage (ie spend money/hire a proper manager) - become important enough to outweigh people's personal views of the individuals involved and get everyone pulling in the same direction?

 

Even under Shepherd, when the club was in a much worse position financially and had equally bad periods on the pitch, it still felt like everyone was essentially pulling in the same direction most of the time, now it feels like the club's being torn apart by the people who are supposed to care for it the most. It reminds me of parents who have split up fighting for custody of their kids, they're both so obsessed with the battle and so sure that only they can look after them properly, that they don't notice that it's totally ruining their kids' lives. That's what NUFC is right now, a dysfunctional family. The only difference is that the parents (Ashley/Fans) can't split up, but instead of trying to peacefully coexist and get on with what's best for their kid (NUFC), they're still too busy fighting about whose fault it was. What we need is Relate.

 

I'm trying to move on but the current situation is tainted by those arguments. What Kinnear can do in January has the same context as the summer - the willingness of the owner to go for it.

 

NE5 has said he is willing to forgive and forget if Ashley becomes a "proper" owner and I share that view to a degree but as I've also said, leaving Keegan completely out of it I'm not satisfied that Ashley's actions warrant any kind of trust/confidence - that's why a sale is still my preferred outcome.

 

 

[Baggio]

This is actually a genuine question, please read it at one:

 

Could anyone from the more hardcore Keegan supporters tell me at what point we move beyond talking about Keegan, accept that he's gone and Ashley remains and start trying to make the best of a bad job?

 

When do the needs of the club - staving off the threat of relegation, encouraging the owner to re-engage (ie spend money/hire a proper manager) - become important enough to outweigh people's personal views of the individuals involved and get everyone pulling in the same direction?

 

Even under Shepherd, when the club was in a much worse position financially and had equally bad periods on the pitch, it still felt like everyone was essentially pulling in the same direction most of the time, now it feels like the club's being torn apart by the people who are supposed to care for it the most. It reminds me of parents who have split up fighting for custody of their kids, they're both so obsessed with the battle and so sure that only they can look after them properly, that they don't notice that it's totally ruining their kids' lives. That's what NUFC is right now, a dysfunctional family. The only difference is that the parents (Ashley/Fans) can't split up, but instead of trying to peacefully coexist and get on with what's best for their kid (NUFC), they're still too busy fighting about whose fault it was. What we need is Relate.

 

I'm trying to move on but the current situation is tainted by those arguments. What Kinnear can do in January has the same context as the summer - the willingness of the owner to go for it.

 

NE5 has said he is willing to forgive and forget if Ashley becomes a "proper" owner and I share that view to a degree but as I've also said, leaving Keegan completely out of it I'm not satisfied that Ashley's actions warrant any kind of trust/confidence - that's why a sale is still my preferred outcome.

 

 

 

What would you like to see happen in January?

[OzzieMandias]

We are newcastle united, we are not chelsea/man utd/arsenal! These are teams that are years if not decades ahead of us, and we are never going to compete. Success may only come from a cup campaign but in the meantime I much rather live the highs and lows of yet another below average premiership season, rather than sitting in my house wishing I had a club to support.

 

Is that Arsenal who currently lie beneath another club with a new owner, one who have shown actual ambition and are looking good for a Champions League spot?

 

Lerner wants Villa to be the best, Ashley wants us to be Fulham. As NJS says, if we've no interest in competing we might as well go home.

 

NJS and many others, quite likely including yourself, thought we'd be having a fantastic season if Keegan hadnt left/walked. How does that tie in with what you have just posted?

 

The position the club would have been in under Keegan WAS Ashley's plan. His failure was not being able to execute that plan.

 

Nevermind though eh, Hall, Shepherd, Dalglish, Gullit, Roeder, Souness, Allardyce and Kinnear, all cunts the lot of them.

 

A fantastic season? No. Better than a relegation dogfight? Yes.

 

No, i'm sure you wont want to put a position on where we'd be under Keegan if he had stayed. Too low and you dis-respect his skills, too high and you shoot every argument about the squad investments in the foot. Tricky one to answer.

 

[NE5]

Would you be happy for your grandkids to be watching at team that has won nothing for 60 or 70 years?

 

Perhaps you should encourage them to support Chelsea if you want them to support a team that wins stuff.

 

 

 

Ambition and intent is different to divine rightism -   if we don't want to win things then we might as well give up now.

 

 

 

nailed

 

 

[NE5]

My grandparents' grandkids are doing it.

 

As I grew up in the 70s and  experiencing 74 at the age of 10 and knowing about 69 I had a view of Newcastle United as a club with a proud history that could on occasion have a sniff of winning something without being a top, top club. After relegation and a few years of shite as I stated going to the matches I'd accepted that the chances of that sniff had receded so concentrated on just having a good time at the matches where football almost became secondary - you could say an "Ashley" type viewpoint.

 

John Hall and Kevin Keegan changed that attitude and stirred something in me and others that still burns - a desire to see us go beyond that attitude of the 70s and actually become a top club. Bobby Robson and yes Freddie Shepherd also shared that desire.

 

Mike Ashley has never spoken about wanting any of that - he has never named a target or an aim beyond financial stability - it was left to Keegan again when he was appointed to talk about at least having a go at the top 4 or maybe winning a cup.

 

What I see now is people arguing for going back to the defeatist attitude of the past where they talk about "enjoyment" and "stability" by which they mean not rattling any feathers or being scared of having a go because as far as I can see one club out of dozens who've tried have gone a bit tits up (Leeds). Even then they haven't folded - they could still come back but that's not good enough for the doom merchants who despite never having seen a "big" club fold for donkeys years seem to think we're heading there.

 

I'm 44 and possibly having 20 or 30 years left I would like to see us win something and more importantly try and win something. That may sound selfish but I also want it to happen for people who are kids now so that the won't have memories based on trudging around Cambridge and Shrewsbury. I've said this before - given how much debt the top clubs have I'd rather the club was in debt (though manageable) and competing than being "stable" and seeing 10th as a good season.

 

 

 

nailed again. Excellent stuff.

 

 

[NJS]

What would you like to see happen in January?

 

Disregarding a sale I'd honestly like Ashley to seriously invest in the team - either from a real "I want to come back" view or a "fuck me this league is shit, a bit of money would give me a chance of getting it back in terms of being a better prospect".

 

 

It sounds daft given everything I've said but given the points spread I think 3 or 4 good players would give us a chance of finishing quite high despite Kinnear - the most frustrating thing in all of this is that most people recognise that with a bit more effort we could have had a good season - note that frustration includes disappointment with Keegan. It does not however deflect blame from the main cause imo,

[Spider Jerusalem]

Ashley: "What a shame I've been forced to sell the club - I was going to spend loads of money and everything."

 

Aye, whatever. Get it sold, collect your thirty pieces of silver and fuck off you slimy cunt.

 

nothing but another attempted PR exercise, like all the other bullshit including buying pints for half the bigg market

 

 

 

You realise that there's always a purpose behind someone conducting a PR exercise? People don't just do them willy nilly.

 

What do you think was the purpose behind this PR Exercise, and the thinking behind that?

 

I would say it's because he's got no chance of selling the club and is stuck with us.  His only option is to suck up or sell the fixtures and fittings and write off the rest.  With the squad we've got the latter is looking unlikely.

 

So your answer to the first part is to "suck up" to the fans?

 

What about the second part? Why would he want to do that? Please don't create a circular argument by saying because he's got no choice.

 

To be honest I thought I did give the thinking behind this.  He has only two options at the minute - sit it out or have a fire sale.  A fire sale is ulikely because the value of the squad that he has failed to invest in wouldn't get him that much back and that is the only real saleable asset that we have.  The only real option that he has is to mke life more comfortable for himself until a couple of years down the line he is able to offload us.

Sucking up to the fans seems to be working as well, as whenever he or the pro-Ashley media release one of these powder-puff 'I've been hard done by' pieces you have more and more people on this and other boards saying 'well he's not that bad a guy really'.

 

Of course another reason is he could be trying the Jedi Mind Trick on some poor sucker looking to possibly buy us - 'This is the club you're looking for.  Come on buy it, it's fucking smashing.  Honest!'.

[NE5]

So if Ashley does put money into the club in January then you will back down and admit Keegan was wrong to walk out?

 

 

The only reason he will spend money now is fear of relegation to protect his investment. If we were say 8th and Kinnear said give me some money as we've got a chance of UEFA he'd have got fuck all.

 

So you're either blaming Kinnear for throwing the game away or you're saying it wasn't his fault because he wasn't left with enough midfielders, do you think Keegan would have thrown the game away last week under the same circumstances?

 

It's a combination of both  - he made the worst out of the tools he'd been left by under-investment.

 

Keegan would have had the amazing plan of trying to score another goal.

 

 

right again.

 

 

[S.S.R.]

If he'd said "Let's be realistic, the top four are miles away - even if we bid for the top players, only the mercenaries would look at us seriously; but what we can do is compete with Villa, Spurs and Everton." and backed this up in the transfer windows, I'd support him.

[NE5]

Ashley: "What a shame I've been forced to sell the club - I was going to spend loads of money and everything."

 

Aye, whatever. Get it sold, collect your thirty pieces of silver and fuck off you slimy cunt.

 

nothing but another attempted PR exercise, like all the other bullshit including buying pints for half the bigg market

 

 

 

You realise that there's always a purpose behind someone conducting a PR exercise? People don't just do them willy nilly.

 

What do you think was the purpose behind this PR Exercise, and the thinking behind that?

 

to delude people perhaps ?

 

He wants to come back to games perhaps ? Trying to ride the storm perhaps ? Hoping it will die down and he will get back down to running this "cost efficient" football club with the idea that staying in the premiership is success, and people will think that this is OK because this Mike Ashley is a good bloke or something ?

 

Bollocks to that. I want a good team on the pitch, and like it or not, it means behaving like the other clubs who have good teams on the pitch.

 

 

[NE5]

This is actually a genuine question, please read it at one:

 

Could anyone from the more hardcore Keegan supporters tell me at what point we move beyond talking about Keegan, accept that he's gone and Ashley remains and start trying to make the best of a bad job?

 

When do the needs of the club - staving off the threat of relegation, encouraging the owner to re-engage (ie spend money/hire a proper manager) - become important enough to outweigh people's personal views of the individuals involved and get everyone pulling in the same direction?

 

Even under Shepherd, when the club was in a much worse position financially and had equally bad periods on the pitch, it still felt like everyone was essentially pulling in the same direction most of the time, now it feels like the club's being torn apart by the people who are supposed to care for it the most. It reminds me of parents who have split up fighting for custody of their kids, they're both so obsessed with the battle and so sure that only they can look after them properly, that they don't notice that it's totally ruining their kids' lives. That's what NUFC is right now, a dysfunctional family. The only difference is that the parents (Ashley/Fans) can't split up, but instead of trying to peacefully coexist and get on with what's best for their kid (NUFC), they're still too busy fighting about whose fault it was. What we need is Relate.

 

I'm trying to move on but the current situation is tainted by those arguments. What Kinnear can do in January has the same context as the summer - the willingness of the owner to go for it.

 

NE5 has said he is willing to forgive and forget if Ashley becomes a "proper" owner and I share that view to a degree but as I've also said, leaving Keegan completely out of it I'm not satisfied that Ashley's actions warrant any kind of trust/confidence - that's why a sale is still my preferred outcome.

 

 

only because - as people have said - its for the clubs immediate future, it would take a lot to convince me, but all I want is the best for the club.

 

 

[indi]

This is actually a genuine question, please read it at one:

 

Could anyone from the more hardcore Keegan supporters tell me at what point we move beyond talking about Keegan, accept that he's gone and Ashley remains and start trying to make the best of a bad job?

 

When do the needs of the club - staving off the threat of relegation, encouraging the owner to re-engage (ie spend money/hire a proper manager) - become important enough to outweigh people's personal views of the individuals involved and get everyone pulling in the same direction?

 

Even under Shepherd, when the club was in a much worse position financially and had equally bad periods on the pitch, it still felt like everyone was essentially pulling in the same direction most of the time, now it feels like the club's being torn apart by the people who are supposed to care for it the most. It reminds me of parents who have split up fighting for custody of their kids, they're both so obsessed with the battle and so sure that only they can look after them properly, that they don't notice that it's totally ruining their kids' lives. That's what NUFC is right now, a dysfunctional family. The only difference is that the parents (Ashley/Fans) can't split up, but instead of trying to peacefully coexist and get on with what's best for their kid (NUFC), they're still too busy fighting about whose fault it was. What we need is Relate.

 

I'm trying to move on but the current situation is tainted by those arguments. What Kinnear can do in January has the same context as the summer - the willingness of the owner to go for it.

 

NE5 has said he is willing to forgive and forget if Ashley becomes a "proper" owner and I share that view to a degree but as I've also said, leaving Keegan completely out of it I'm not satisfied that Ashley's actions warrant any kind of trust/confidence - that's why a sale is still my preferred outcome.

 

 

 

That's fair enough, but he could be saying similar things about the fans, someone needs to make the first move and then the other side needs to recognise that for what it is and then we move forward from there. Do you not think that this admission of making mistakes by Ashley could be a very tentative first move? Could he not be testing the water by saying this and seeing what the fans' reaction is? People will say it's not enough, that words are meaningless and only actions matter, but most people - if they're honest - use words then actions and if the response to the words that would have preceded the actions is totally negative, then people rarely follow through with those actions.

 

There are a lot of people holding onto things that simply aren't going to happen, Keegan coming back for example, how many people are still clinging to that hope? Based upon what!?! The evidence points distinctly towards that never happening, but people are still allowing themselves to continue believing it will and it's not helping anyone. The sale of the club is increasingly looking like it'll become the same kind of thing. I have to say, I now hold out almost zero hope of that happening in the short to mid-term future, certainly not in a way that will be beneficial to NUFC. In fact, the only way I can see it happening is if Ashley gets so sick of it that he essentially gives it away to anyone prepared to take it, regardless of whether or not it's good for the club, and that's something that scares the shit out of me. I think that if the situation is that Ashley simply has no way back with a significant proportion of the club's fans then there's a significant danger that's the way we're headed. We've reached a deadlock, something needs to give and a lot of the things that could give would be a disaster for the club.

[Baggio]

Do you not think that this admission of making mistakes by Ashley could be a very tentative first move? Could he not be testing the water by saying this and seeing what the fans' reaction is?

 

Funny you should say that because the bloke involved with NUSC suggested he come out and admit he made mistakes as part of giving it another go.

[Taylor Swift]

Do you not think that this admission of making mistakes by Ashley could be a very tentative first move? Could he not be testing the water by saying this and seeing what the fans' reaction is?

 

Funny you should say that because the bloke involved with NUSC suggested he come out and admit he made mistakes as part of giving it another go.

 

Exactly. I'd be interested to hear what they say about this. To me, it doesn't matter what he says but to them, it should seem as if it's the first step in trying to make amends. Hopefully he follows it up in January.

[indi]

Do you not think that this admission of making mistakes by Ashley could be a very tentative first move? Could he not be testing the water by saying this and seeing what the fans' reaction is?

 

Funny you should say that because the bloke involved with NUSC suggested he come out and admit he made mistakes as part of giving it another go.

 

Exactly. At first I thought "hypocrites!" then I realised I was being irrational and saw it for what it was, an acceptance of the reality of the situation and a first step towards a rapprochement, it must have been quite a courageous decision, considering the likely reaction of their members. Good on them. I reckon this is Ashley's response and I hope we can build upon this.

[fredbob]

We are newcastle united, we are not chelsea/man utd/arsenal! These are teams that are years if not decades ahead of us, and we are never going to compete. Success may only come from a cup campaign but in the meantime I much rather live the highs and lows of yet another below average premiership season, rather than sitting in my house wishing I had a club to support.

 

Is that Arsenal who currently lie beneath another club with a new owner, one who have shown actual ambition and are looking good for a Champions League spot?

 

Lerner wants Villa to be the best, Ashley wants us to be Fulham. As NJS says, if we've no interest in competing we might as well go home.

 

NJS and many others, quite likely including yourself, thought we'd be having a fantastic season if Keegan hadnt left/walked. How does that tie in with what you have just posted?

 

The position the club would have been in under Keegan WAS Ashley's plan. His failure was not being able to execute that plan.

 

Nevermind though eh, Hall, Shepherd, Dalglish, Gullit, Roeder, Souness, Allardyce and Kinnear, all cunts the lot of them.

 

A fantastic season? No. Better than a relegation dogfight? Yes.

 

No, i'm sure you wont want to put a position on where we'd be under Keegan if he had stayed. Too low and you dis-respect his skills, too high and you shoot every argument about the squad investments in the foot. Tricky one to answer.

 

Spot on.