Guest neesy111 Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 On a side note, it's annoying how so many refs seem think that just because a challenge results in a penalty it is necessarily also worthy of a yellow. Agree with this. It's so rare that a tackle in the box is reckless or cynical and worthy of a yellow card (although there was one at Norwich the other week that could've been red IIRC) Ayala tackle wasn't it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Ambivalent. This would be good in the first half of games, no-one likes the double penalty so early on tipping the balance of the game But in the last minutes of the second half, when the conversion rate for penalties in tight games drops from about 80% to 60%, the idea of an attempt to get the ball saving the player from the red card as well would make the cynical bring down an even better gamble. If anything, the punishment for that kind of thing should be increased. I have no idea how you could sort it out though, without something crazy like having a rule where any foul in the box by when there are no other opposing players between the ball and the goal meaning there isn't a keeper for the penalty - which would put the conversion at at 100%, totally swinging it the other way. If it's a cynical foul it's still a red. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
polpolpol Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Ambivalent. This would be good in the first half of games, no-one likes the double penalty so early on tipping the balance of the game But in the last minutes of the second half, when the conversion rate for penalties in tight games drops from about 80% to 60%, the idea of an attempt to get the ball saving the player from the red card as well would make the cynical bring down an even better gamble. If anything, the punishment for that kind of thing should be increased. I have no idea how you could sort it out though, without something crazy like having a rule where any foul in the box by when there are no other opposing players between the ball and the goal meaning there isn't a keeper for the penalty - which would put the conversion at at 100%, totally swinging it the other way. If it's a cynical foul it's still a red. Sure, but if the criterion is 'no opportunity of playing the ball', there are plenty of situations in which a player can disguise a cynical foul as an attempt which has some validity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 All good ideas but if the ref is a complete tool, which most in our country are. If the changes are implemented, its then down to the ref's own point of view on any given incident, as we've seen our ref's are shocking. First and foremost we must get better ref's, secondly then use the technology availableto help them get even better. If you overlook those two points then as "numbers" pointed out, its just more for them to get wrong, poor officials make poor decisions. The refs aren't nearly as incompetent as you make out. All this rule is asking them to judge is whether or not a) an offence is inside the box* and b) there was an attempt to get the ball. If anything it reduces the amount of opinion involved. If any professional referee struggles with these basics then we really are in trouble. *Yes, I know. Dont agree about ours refs mate, just my opinion obviously but i think they some of the worst i've ever seen, and i watch a hell of a lot of football. I've said on here before about when i attended (I ref my kid and other teams in youth football) the refs course and didn't finish it, i had a big disagreement with the ref teaching us, he had never played and the videos and work set out was drawn up clearly by people who hadn't played either. I've played and what you are taught on the course is completely wrong to how it should be, again imo, and thats why i think our refs are poor, its how they are taught, just one example is that you are told not to talk to players at all, that right there is just plain stupid, communication is everything, again imo. If a player commits a foul i explain why i have given it, 99 times out of a 100 that ends any backchat right there, for me you are taught to be arrogant and not to listen when you ref, its just not the right way to do it. All my opinion of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 It looks like they will be ruling out any goals being scored when giving a ball back after the opposing team kicked out of play to stop play for an injury or other reason. What? You can no longer score when giving the ball back to the opposing team via a throw in, drop ball etc. Ah, you mean directly? Can't remember that ever happening tbh, even though I always think we should shoot. It's happened a couple of times in the past by accident IIRC. Nice changes - I do like the sound of a 4th sub in extra time too Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowlingcrofty Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect I agree with this, its the aggression shown that should warrant the red card, speak to a ref politely is ok but not to go right into his face screaming, swearing and with real rage, this though is one of the problems with have in ours and in other countries, some footballers seems to have a real aggression thing at the ref, in a way you dont see in other sports. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect Or just apply one of the basic laws of the game. A player who is guilty of using offensive, insulting or abusive language or gestures must be sent off. A yellow is standard for any protest. Never been applied. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect Or just apply one of the basic laws of the game. A player who is guilty of using offensive, insulting or abusive language or gestures must be sent off. A yellow is standard for any protest. Never been applied. Exactly, as I said on the previous page the referees just need to be backed in enforcing the dissent laws. This idea of the referee as someone to be questioned, abused and generally thought a fool needs to be stopped... and it can only be done by them growing some bollocks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Ruining a game because someone tells a ref to fuck off would be a bit ott like, he's a big boy he'll get over it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect Or just apply one of the basic laws of the game. A player who is guilty of using offensive, insulting or abusive language or gestures must be sent off. A yellow is standard for any protest. Never been applied. Exactly, as I said on the previous page the referees just need to be backed in enforcing the dissent laws. This idea of the referee as someone to be questioned, abused and generally thought a fool needs to be stopped... and it can only be done by them growing some bollocks. True but this also has to start from the very bottom with kids, from the kids coaches to their parents, drummed into them not to abuse the refs, its going to take along time to do it but its has to start from the very beginning of a football career. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Ruining a game because someone tells a ref to fuck off would be a bit ott like, he's a big boy he'll get over it. Not really the point though. Teachers get over kids calling them a cunt, but they still put the fucker in detention. It can't be accepted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect Or just apply one of the basic laws of the game. A player who is guilty of using offensive, insulting or abusive language or gestures must be sent off. A yellow is standard for any protest. Never been applied. Exactly, as I said on the previous page the referees just need to be backed in enforcing the dissent laws. This idea of the referee as someone to be questioned, abused and generally thought a fool needs to be stopped... and it can only be done by them growing some bollocks. True but this also has to start from the very bottom with kids, from the kids coaches to their parents, drummed into them not to abuse the refs, its going to take along time to do it but its has to start from the very beginning of a football career. Totally true, but getting the Premier League in order is a good way to set an example. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Ruining a game because someone tells a ref to fuck off would be a bit ott like, he's a big boy he'll get over it. The person who tells the referee to fuck off would be ruining the game. The referee is applying the laws of the game and if he doesn't apply them he will ruin many games. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Ruining a game because someone tells a ref to fuck off would be a bit ott like, he's a big boy he'll get over it. Then dont swear, the player ruined the game not the ref by swearing, swearing out loud if you make a mistake fair enough, the ref can have a quiet word and tell him to not do it but to swear directly at the ref, 100% the players fault. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Give anyone who confronts the ref about a decision (other than the captain) a straight red card. They'd soon learn respect Or just apply one of the basic laws of the game. A player who is guilty of using offensive, insulting or abusive language or gestures must be sent off. A yellow is standard for any protest. Never been applied. Exactly, as I said on the previous page the referees just need to be backed in enforcing the dissent laws. This idea of the referee as someone to be questioned, abused and generally thought a fool needs to be stopped... and it can only be done by them growing some bollocks. True but this also has to start from the very bottom with kids, from the kids coaches to their parents, drummed into them not to abuse the refs, its going to take along time to do it but its has to start from the very beginning of a football career. Totally true, but getting the Premier League in order is a good way to set an example. Totally agree mate, its got to hand in hand though, start with the kids all the way up to the top. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I really do feel like turning a game off when a referee is abused in a moment of high emotions like, ruins my day. Honestly it's not even that much of an issue, give them a yellow card and tell them to get on with the game, they continue to moan then send them off. No need to go on a power trip. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I really do feel like turning a game off when a referee is abused in a moment of high emotions like, ruins my day. Honestly it's not even that much of an issue, give them a yellow card and tell them to get on with the game, they continue to moan then send them off. No need to go on a power trip. Applying the laws of the game is not a power trip. It would also mean Rooney gets sent off in every single match he plays, which can't be bad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 What about players swearing at a referee in Mayan or Spanish or something? Is Torres allowed to call a referee a cunt but Lampard isn't? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 What about players swearing at a referee in Mayan or Spanish or something? Is Torres allowed to call a referee a cunt but Lampard isn't? Most refs can speak parts of other languages I'm sure, the ones with any ambition would anyway. I think there's a Premier League rule that you shouldn't speak anything other than English to refs anyway... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I really do feel like turning a game off when a referee is abused in a moment of high emotions like, ruins my day. Honestly it's not even that much of an issue, give them a yellow card and tell them to get on with the game, they continue to moan then send them off. No need to go on a power trip. Applying the laws of the game is not a power trip. It would also mean Rooney gets sent off in every single match he plays, which can't be bad. It's a law that would allow a referee to go on a power trip. It's daft for so many reasons though: Referee sends off 1 player for calling him a twat; gets called a wanker for the rest of the game by 50,000. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliGupter Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I really do feel like turning a game off when a referee is abused in a moment of high emotions like, ruins my day. Honestly it's not even that much of an issue, give them a yellow card and tell them to get on with the game, they continue to moan then send them off. No need to go on a power trip. Applying the laws of the game is not a power trip. It would also mean Rooney gets sent off in every single match he plays, which can't be bad. It's a law that would allow a referee to go on a power trip. It's daft for so many reasons though: Referee sends off 1 player for calling him a twat; gets called a wanker for the rest of the game by 50,000. Sending players off for that would make very little difference to the amount he is abused by fans. He has no control over the fans, I'm not sure what your point is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Village Idiot Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I agree with the change, always wanted something like this to happen because a penalty+sending off just kills off a lot of games. The only problem is that it may encourage cheating inside the box, since you aren't risking a sending off you'll rather do whatever you can to stop an obvious goal. I understand that if it's cynical the sending off will still apply, but that's asking the ref to use his own judgement in situations that aren't that clear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 My point is this rule is supposed to encourage respect towards the referee when it's only going to turn the match sour (and without fail turn the crowd onto the referee). The referee will all ways be abused for sending off players, it just makes more sense when he's been abused for enforsing a rule that isn't in place to 'protect' him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 It would be wonderful if referees actually brandished cards instead of tolerated so much dissent. The more difficult it is to referee and build yourself up from a local ref to PL standard, then refereeing in general will not be as good as it could be. Everyone bitches about the quality of referees, but it's not their problem- it's ours. They are the best available for the job. Far better we pay PL referees £2m a season- crap footballers can earn that easily- so should the refs. Give people a reason to excel. £80k or whatever they get is simply not enough. And we need to get away from the idea that they all need to earn their stripes on a Sunday morning for years before being considered for the next step up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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