"You're Just a Town Full of Pakis!"

[tmonkey]

i don't think its racist, but wouldn't neccesarily join in

 

The word 'just' makes it racist.

 

However,

 

Brit(ain)

Scot(land)

Paki(stan)

 

means that it shouldnt have negative connotations. Unless 'Brit' is offensive.

 

Shouldnt, but unfortunately does have negative connotations, and is offensive. No different to "nigger", which iirc is derived from "negro" and means "black" in one of the latin languages. Calling a black skinned person "black" shouldnt be offensive, but it obviously is if the general perception of the word is derogatory and offensive.

 

Thats the same for all offensive words. Its not what they literally mean, its what theyre perceived to mean that matters. "Fuck" for example is another word for sex, if you apply the same logic, it shouldnt be offensive because when you say "fuck off" youre merely saying "sex off", but of course it is indeed offensive because or the perception and the understanding of the F word.

[BlueStar]

And it's pretty pointless to compare it to the cartoon debacle, what has the rightness or wrogness of that got to do with the rightness or wrongness of this?

 

It's OK, singing 10 german bombers isn't as bad as the holocaust, making hissing sounds at Spurs fans isn't as bad as killing Palestinians etc etc

[Guest cybermansrevenge]

It's about context really though as it's used in Australia, for example, when talking about the Pakistan cricket team, etc. and it isn't intended to be or considered to be racist there.

 

This doesn't seem to be true these days since  at the Ashes the Australians were asked to stop singing "I'd rather be a Paki than a Pomme" which they changed to the ?more pc "I'd rather be a Puffta than a Pomme".

[Guest alex]

It's about context really though as it's used in Australia, for example, when talking about the Pakistan cricket team, etc. and it isn't intended to be or considered to be racist there.

 

This doesn't seem to be true these days since  at the Ashes the Australians were asked to stop singing "I'd rather be a Paki than a Pomme" which they changed to the ?more pc "I'd rather be a Puffta than a Pomme".

I was once talking to an Aboriginal who told me football (or soccer to him) was a wog sport. Took me while to work that one out.

[Guest Phil K]

It's not the word it's the context.  The phrase You're just a town full of Pakis makes it clear that being a town full of Pakis is a bad thing and a reason to take the piss.

So why arent you taking up cudgels on behalf of Smoggies when rival fans were chanting about "Your a town full of child molestors" over the child abuse thing some years back ? Or the scousers who got a lot of nastiness in the wake of the Jamie Boulger case ?

Wrong colour or religion of victims, perhaps ?

Treat it all the same, or not at all.

[Guest Phil K]

It's about context really though as it's used in Australia, for example, when talking about the Pakistan cricket team, etc. and it isn't intended to be or considered to be racist there.

 

This doesn't seem to be true these days since  at the Ashes the Australians were asked to stop singing "I'd rather be a Paki than a Pomme" which they changed to the ?more pc "I'd rather be a Puffta than a Pomme".

I was once talking to an Aboriginal who told me football (or soccer to him) was a wog sport. Took me while to work that one out.

Thats brilliant.

I recall a Billy Connolly episode where he was told a joke by an Aussie about a Lion licking his arse and the blokes son asked why, and the dad said "He's just eaten an englishman and wants to get the taste out of his mouth !"

That had me larfin....

Thing is, there are those who take offence easily, those who take offence professionally (self-serving BBC/Quango/Council feminists and the rest) those who take offence VIOLENTLY normally organised - remember the Mohammad cartoon riots in Lebanon ? 90% of those they managed to arrested were SYRIAN - I have no doubt its as common here. And finally those who roll their eyes and say "Grow up, man" (a dying breed - too much ££££ to gain - ask the convicted druggies and murderers)

 

And it's pretty pointless to compare it to the cartoon debacle, what has the rightness or wrogness of that got to do with the rightness or wrongness of this?

 

It's OK, singing 10 german bombers isn't as bad as the holocaust, making hissing sounds at Spurs fans isn't as bad as killing Palestinians etc etc

 

Yep, there are none so blind.........

Cause and effect.

 

[LateRegistration]

ive heard that sung at quite a few games by our supporters, particulary at games in the birmingham area

 

iklgizmo has heard it being sung before, haven't been to any away games in the Birmingham area so I can't confirm this but I'm sure others there yesterday will be able to confirm it was being sung.

 

i've been to villa away, blackburn away etc and havn't heard it

 

 

Anybody else confirm this or do we just take the word of one person of a football forum? (no offense to the OP)

 

 

 

Went yesterday but heard nothing.

 

But found this on YouTube it's from underneath at Half Time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkOC6LGnpEc

 

 

Here you go Nobby, listen to that youtube link.

[Dokko]

Have you done anything about it then?

 

Have you contacted the club with the youtube video to complain about racism in the NUFC away crowd?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Have you done anything about it then?

 

Have you contacted the club with the youtube video to complain about racism in the NUFC away crowd?

 

Hmm, I'd be interested to know who actually speaks out about this sort of thing at the time. I once had a go at a guy watching the match in the pub after he called Kieron Dyer a 'black bastard', but he was about 50 and overweight! I'd like to think I would have done it even if he'd been a 6 foot 5 skinhead, or if he'd been with a group of mates, but I wonder  blueconfused.gif

[LateRegistration]

Have you done anything about it then?

 

Have you contacted the club with the youtube video to complain about racism in the NUFC away crowd?

 

Nope, that was never on my agenda. If you read my original post you will see that I actually referred to the away support , in the main as fantastic.

 

I simply wished to state that I heard this being sung at Blackburn and was offended by it.

 

Now the majority N.O faithful have agreed that it is not a nice thing to hear and are quick to condemn those responsible.

 

You on the other hand tried to make it out that I was making it up until you had proof. Others such as Phil K have unbelievably tried to say that this somehow isn't racist and I shouldn't be offended at all. :roll:

[Dokko]

Have you done anything about it then?

 

Have you contacted the club with the youtube video to complain about racism in the NUFC away crowd?

 

Nope, that was never on my agenda. If you read my original post you will see that I actually referred to the away support , in the main as fantastic.

 

I simply wished to state that I heard this being sung at Blackburn and was offended by it.

 

Now the majority N.O faithful have agreed that it is not a nice thing to hear and are quick to condemn those responsible.

 

You on the other hand tried to make it out that I was making it up until you had proof. Others such as Phil K have unbelievably tried to say that this somehow isn't racist and I shouldn't be offended at all. :roll:

 

So i don't believe what someone on the internet tells me without proof.

 

Most people would say i was right to do so, considering not one single person apart from you heard it.

 

If you've got a problem with that then fuking sue me, if you've got a problem with the chants do something about it instead of coming on here whinging about it, next time it might not happen, if you want to tackle racism here's your chance, if i felt offended by it, I would do something, but i wasn't there, and its not my place. (although am in the opinion you should send this video to NUFC, its should be reported)

[LateRegistration]

Have you done anything about it then?

 

Have you contacted the club with the youtube video to complain about racism in the NUFC away crowd?

 

Nope, that was never on my agenda. If you read my original post you will see that I actually referred to the away support , in the main as fantastic.

 

I simply wished to state that I heard this being sung at Blackburn and was offended by it.

 

Now the majority N.O faithful have agreed that it is not a nice thing to hear and are quick to condemn those responsible.

 

You on the other hand tried to make it out that I was making it up until you had proof. Others such as Phil K have unbelievably tried to say that this somehow isn't racist and I shouldn't be offended at all. :roll:

 

So i don't believe what someone on the internet tells me without proof.

 

Most people would say i was right to do so, considering not one single person apart from you heard it.

 

If you've got a problem with that then fuking sue me, if you've got a problem with the chants do something about it instead of coming on here whinging about it, next time it might not happen, if you want to tackle racism here's your chance, if i felt offended by it, I would do something, but i wasn't there, and its not my place. (although am in the opinion you should send this video to NUFC, its should be reported)

 

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

[Dokko]

Have you done anything about it then?

 

Have you contacted the club with the youtube video to complain about racism in the NUFC away crowd?

 

Nope, that was never on my agenda. If you read my original post you will see that I actually referred to the away support , in the main as fantastic.

 

I simply wished to state that I heard this being sung at Blackburn and was offended by it.

 

Now the majority N.O faithful have agreed that it is not a nice thing to hear and are quick to condemn those responsible.

 

You on the other hand tried to make it out that I was making it up until you had proof. Others such as Phil K have unbelievably tried to say that this somehow isn't racist and I shouldn't be offended at all. :roll:

 

So i don't believe what someone on the internet tells me without proof.

 

Most people would say i was right to do so, considering not one single person apart from you heard it.

 

If you've got a problem with that then fuking sue me, if you've got a problem with the chants do something about it instead of coming on here whinging about it, next time it might not happen, if you want to tackle racism here's your chance, if i felt offended by it, I would do something, but i wasn't there, and its not my place. (although am in the opinion you should send this video to NUFC, its should be reported)

 

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

Yes your a whinge if you do nowt about it, grow some balls and tackle the problem, if not (unfortunately) expect to hear it again and again.

 

If you dont send the video to NUFC, i fuking will, someone needs some balls round here, bunch of fairies complaining about something yet do fuk all about it when given the chance.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

I would hope TT's not doubting your right to raise this without having officially reported it, this is discussion forum after all. Ideally you (or someone who witnessed it) would have made a complaint though, I would think that would be the best way to get some proper action taken.

 

I can understand his need to get evidence though, this is the internet. Sure he wasn't trying to accuse you of making it up.

 

OK, peacemaking over!

[Dokko]

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

I would hope TT's not doubting your right to raise this without having officially reported it, this is discussion forum after all. Ideally you (or someone who witnessed it) would have made a complaint though, I would think that would be the best way to get some proper action taken.

 

I can understand his need to get evidence though, this is the internet. Sure he wasn't trying to accuse you of making it up.

 

OK, peacemaking over!

 

This about sums it up.

 

I dont like to think we've a racist element to us, i hate the idea, but im not going to take a storey like this for gospel without proof. I don't know the OP, for all i know he could be a mackem WUM. The youtube video proved him right, and now am of the opinion something needs to be done about this, more than just talk about it on a NUFC forum.

 

Also, it should be the OP as he is from a pakistani decent (IIRC), therefore the complaint will be taken seriously. It wont from me, who is a white, and wasn't even there!

 

[LateRegistration]

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

I would hope TT's not doubting your right to raise this without having officially reported it, this is discussion forum after all. Ideally you (or someone who witnessed it) would have made a complaint though, I would think that would be the best way to get some proper action taken.

 

I can understand his need to get evidence though, this is the internet. Sure he wasn't trying to accuse you of making it up.

 

OK, peacemaking over!

 

This about sums it up.

 

I dont like to think we've a racist element to us, i hate the idea, but im not going to take a storey like this for gospel without proof. I don't know the OP, for all i know he could be a mackem WUM. The youtube video proved him right, and now am of the opinion something needs to be done about this, more than just talk about it on a NUFC forum.

 

Fair enough. At the time of making the original post though I knew nothing about the youtube clip, so essentially all I had was my word.

[Dokko]

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

I would hope TT's not doubting your right to raise this without having officially reported it, this is discussion forum after all. Ideally you (or someone who witnessed it) would have made a complaint though, I would think that would be the best way to get some proper action taken.

 

I can understand his need to get evidence though, this is the internet. Sure he wasn't trying to accuse you of making it up.

 

OK, peacemaking over!

 

This about sums it up.

 

I dont like to think we've a racist element to us, i hate the idea, but im not going to take a storey like this for gospel without proof. I don't know the OP, for all i know he could be a mackem WUM. The youtube video proved him right, and now am of the opinion something needs to be done about this, more than just talk about it on a NUFC forum.

 

Fair enough. At the time of making the original post though I knew nothing about the youtube clip, so essentially all I had was my word.

 

All i had was your word, and for me it wasn't enough.

 

Don't feel offended by that, its just the internet isnt a place i trust.

 

Now, back to business, i still think you should complain. The club will take it seriously imo, and i think everyone would give you backing for doing it. But really it has to be you, or someone who was there.

[Kitman]

It's not the word it's the context.  The phrase You're just a town full of Pakis makes it clear that being a town full of Pakis is a bad thing and a reason to take the piss.

So why arent you taking up cudgels on behalf of Smoggies when rival fans were chanting about "Your a town full of child molestors" over the child abuse thing some years back ? Or the scousers who got a lot of nastiness in the wake of the Jamie Boulger case ?

Wrong colour or religion of victims, perhaps ?

Treat it all the same, or not at all.

 

I'm sorry but that's a pompous load of pish.  The question was 'Is it racist'?  The answer is 'Yes' for the reason I outlined.  I'm not taking up cudgels on anyone's behalf, I'm answering the question.

[ujpest doza]

Surely it was more a statement of Fact?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Lights blue touch paper and sits back ready to enjoy the fireworks tongue.gif

[LateRegistration]

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

I would hope TT's not doubting your right to raise this without having officially reported it, this is discussion forum after all. Ideally you (or someone who witnessed it) would have made a complaint though, I would think that would be the best way to get some proper action taken.

 

I can understand his need to get evidence though, this is the internet. Sure he wasn't trying to accuse you of making it up.

 

OK, peacemaking over!

 

This about sums it up.

 

I dont like to think we've a racist element to us, i hate the idea, but im not going to take a storey like this for gospel without proof. I don't know the OP, for all i know he could be a mackem WUM. The youtube video proved him right, and now am of the opinion something needs to be done about this, more than just talk about it on a NUFC forum.

 

Fair enough. At the time of making the original post though I knew nothing about the youtube clip, so essentially all I had was my word.

 

All i had was your word, and for me it wasn't enough.

 

Don't feel offended by that, its just the internet isnt a place i trust.

 

Now, back to business, i still think you should complain. The club will take it seriously imo, and i think everyone would give you backing for doing it. But really it has to be you, or someone who was there.

 

Well like I say I never planned to originally, but with this youtube clip I think I will. I'm in the uni library at the moment but I will look into it later.

[Dokko]

So now I'm whinging for bringing this up, unbelievable!

 

I would hope TT's not doubting your right to raise this without having officially reported it, this is discussion forum after all. Ideally you (or someone who witnessed it) would have made a complaint though, I would think that would be the best way to get some proper action taken.

 

I can understand his need to get evidence though, this is the internet. Sure he wasn't trying to accuse you of making it up.

 

OK, peacemaking over!

 

This about sums it up.

 

I dont like to think we've a racist element to us, i hate the idea, but im not going to take a storey like this for gospel without proof. I don't know the OP, for all i know he could be a mackem WUM. The youtube video proved him right, and now am of the opinion something needs to be done about this, more than just talk about it on a NUFC forum.

 

Fair enough. At the time of making the original post though I knew nothing about the youtube clip, so essentially all I had was my word.

 

All i had was your word, and for me it wasn't enough.

 

Don't feel offended by that, its just the internet isnt a place i trust.

 

Now, back to business, i still think you should complain. The club will take it seriously imo, and i think everyone would give you backing for doing it. But really it has to be you, or someone who was there.

 

Well like I say I never planned to originally, but with this youtube clip I think I will. I'm in the uni library at the moment but I will look into it later.

 

Good lad. 100% behind you doing this. Don't care if they were the greatest soopa fans tbh, they deserve to removed from sporting venues for good (although i doubt they'll be caught, but it does bring attention to a problem that i certainly didn't know we had)

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Good lad. 100% behind you doing this. Don't care if they were the greatest soopa fans tbh, they deserve to removed from sporting venues for good (although i doubt they'll be caught, but it does bring attention to a problem that i certainly didn't know we had)

 

Seconded, let us know what kind of a response you get, I hope it's a promise of action being taken.

[ChezGiven]

I do want to say that we dont have as bad a problem as elsewhere.

 

I presume everyone was aware of what happened in Paris the night we played Vigo? Paris Ultras forming allegiance with the 'arabes' (Algerian/N. African immigrants who live in the suburbs of Paris).

 

They were playing one of the Israeli teams and they chanted Nazi salutes during the match. After the game a French Israeli fan was targetted by Nazi and 'arabe' fans. The lad was being kicked so brutally that an undercover policemen had to jump in. The policemen was black and they said they were going to kill both of them.

 

The fans then started beating up both of them and prevented the policeman using his radio or his CS gas. The policemen did however manage to drag the Israeli fan and himself away. Not sure on the exact following details (different in media than i heard elsewhere) but then the policemen was able to access a gun concealed on him. When they were attacked again (got to remember the young lad was going to be killed) he fired his gun and injured one PSG fan and killed the other. This prompted protests from the fans aganst the police (what arseholes).

 

There were lots of questions about the incident and i dont think a situation like that would ever arise in the UK due to better policing but i do want to highlight that the british game has done a hell of a lot to make football inclusive for all. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I wasn't aware of that Chez, but I do know it's often said the problem is much worse in other parts of Europe. As long as we continue to report and speak out against incidents like the one LateReg talks about, we should continue to make progress (whilst recognising we still have work to do).

[Dokko]

I do want to say that we dont have as bad a problem as elsewhere.

 

I presume everyone was aware of what happened in Paris the night we played Vigo? Paris Ultras forming allegiance with the 'arabes' (Algerian/N. African immigrants who live in the suburbs of Paris).

 

They were playing one of the Israeli teams and they chanted Nazi salutes during the match. After the game a French Israeli fan was targetted by Nazi and 'arabe' fans. The lad was being kicked so brutally that an undercover policemen had to jump in. The policemen was black and they said they were going to kill both of them.

 

The fans then started beating up both of them and prevented the policeman using his radio or his CS gas. The policemen did however manage to drag the Israeli fan and himself away. Not sure on the exact following details (different in media than i heard elsewhere) but then the policemen was able to access a gun concealed on him. When they were attacked again (got to remember the young lad was going to be killed) he fired his gun and injured one PSG fan and killed the other. This prompted protests from the fans aganst the police (what arseholes).

 

There were lots of questions about the incident and i dont think a situation like that would ever arise in the UK due to better policing but i do want to highlight that the british game has done a hell of a lot to make football inclusive for all. 

 

Of course this is extreme, and we've passed those days, but if there is room for improvement, it must be done.

 

Undercover fans traveling with away support to ID abusive & racist fans wouldn't cost the club too much, and when a bunch of fans are prosecuted together over a series of matches, i doubt we'll ever have a problem again. Again the UK would lead the way in combating racism, and this time it could be our club driving change.

 

That's what i'd hope would happen, i very much doubt it though