Guest Knightrider Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 They simply didn't turn up, we can blame Roeder or whatever all we like, not one of them performed to even half their ability though and when that happens, you will lose every single time. They get paid fortunes and have a cushty life, they train a few hours a week and yet when results go wrong, it is always the manager who gets it in the neck, well they were 90% responsible for last night. I'm not absolving Roeder of any blame here BTW, he's as clueless as they come in the main, but you could hear him shout "pass the ball", but still, they continued to hoof it long. If I had my own way I'd get rid of most of them before Roeder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Players, referees, manager, chairman, board etc. They're all to blame. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest given take Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 i blame martins for yesterday. he missed a sitter. sell him Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 They simply didn't turn up, we can blame Roeder or whatever all we like, not one of them performed to even half their ability though and when that happens, you will lose every single time. They get paid fortunes and have a cushty life, they train a few hours a week and yet when results go wrong, it is always the manager who gets it in the neck, well they were 90% responsible for last night. I'm not absolving Roeder of any blame here BTW, he's as clueless as they come in the main, but you could hear him shout "pass the ball", but still, they continued to hoof it long. If I had my own way I'd get rid of most of them before of Roeder. Agreed. I remember they actually pointed that out during the coverage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest elbee909 Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Hearing Roeder shout 'pass the ball' was particularly depressing. He might has well have shouted 'score goals'. How do you make players accountable, performance related pay or something? Bosses can be sacked, players seem to be able to dodge that particular bullet by default, and that for me makes them complacent. "Oh no, I'm going to lose my place in the team! Still, £25k comes into the bank account so do I _really_ care..." - got to wonder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newcastle Fan Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Players, manager, chairman, board etc. They're all to blame. That,But Roeder takes most of the blame because of the fact that the players don't pick themselves.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Luque Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Our players didnt want to win as much as they shouldve wanted to...only butt and emre really wanted to win this. What we need is a fat cat millionare who drives the team on and wants to win games no matter what. Like lampard and gerrard. Not always the best players, but they are influencial and want to win no matter what... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Players, referees, manager, chairman, board etc. They're all to blame. In general yes, but those 90 minutes last night were ultimately the fault of the players, they did nothing right and everything wrong. We can blame the tactics or the preparation all we like but that should not excuse any of those in Black & White for their basic failures such as passing the ball, work-rate and generally having any guts whatsoever - things they all lacked on the night. Had they played to even 70% of their ability and not zero (even Given looked like a sunday-league 'keeper) we would all be sitting here looking forward to the Quarter-Finals, AZ were nothing special, ordinary in fact, but we just stepped aside and handed them the tie on a plate by simply not turning up. While the manager is responsible for training and selecting the players, he can do very little to effect their performances once they enter the pitch, and on that front they should all look at themselves in the mirror and hand their sorry heads in shame. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Players, referees, manager, chairman, board etc. They're all to blame. In general yes, but those 90 minutes last night were ultimately the fault of the players, they did nothing right and everything wrong. We can blame the tactics or the preparation all we like but that should not excuse any of those in Black & White for their basic failures such as passing the ball, work-rate and generally having any guts whatsoever - things they all lacked on the night. Had they played to even 70% of their ability and not zero (even Given looked like a sunday-league 'keeper) we would all be sitting here looking forward to the Quarter-Finals, AZ were nothing special, ordinary in fact, but we just stepped aside and handed them the tie on a plate by simply not turning up. While the manager is responsible for training and selecting the players, he can do very little to effect their performances once they enter the pitch, and on that front they should all look at themselves in the mirror and hand their sorry heads in shame. I agree with all of that HTT, but tbh it was more of a general point about who is to blame for our disappointing season overall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 The players also have to take a huge slice of the blame for that too Mel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eaststar Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Players, manager, chairman, board etc. They're all to blame. That,added to the fact that the players don't pick themselves.. I agree. Also u can have crap players yet have a great team. Look at wat Steve Coppell is doin with Reading and Mark Hughes with Blackburn etc. I guess the differenting point is that these managers have had time with these players...but Roeder has had ample time. He should know all/most the players by now and IF HE HAD A SYSTEM he would have implemented it and would have got the players implementing it. Bottom line is he's out of his depth and he is not a good coach/manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 They simply didn't turn up, we can blame Roeder or whatever all we like, not one of them performed to even half their ability though and when that happens, you will lose every single time. They get paid fortunes and have a cushty life, they train a few hours a week and yet when results go wrong, it is always the manager who gets it in the neck, well they were 90% responsible for last night. I'm not absolving Roeder of any blame here BTW, he's as clueless as they come in the main, but you could hear him shout "pass the ball", but still, they continued to hoof it long. If I had my own way I'd get rid of most of them before Roeder. I hope this sets a new tone among certain posters, certainly it is something I've been saying myself for a fair while. Somehow I doubt it though. Alkmaar are a good team, and they passed and moved better than us. And there was the difference and why they got through. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 The players also have to take a huge slice of the blame for that too Mel. I'm well aware. As I said, they're all to blame in way or another. The players in particular right now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE5 Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 The players also have to take a huge slice of the blame for that too Mel. I'm well aware. As I said, they're all to blame in way or another. The players in particular right now. spectacularly back tracking Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrette Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 The players also have to take a huge slice of the blame for that too Mel. I'm well aware. As I said, they're all to blame in way or another. The players in particular right now. spectacularly back tracking What are you on about? My first post in this thread blamed them all for it. So again, what are you on about? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamesD Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Ultimetly, its the players on the field responsible for what happens in the game. Managers are often the scapegoats for incredibly shit preformances. Had martins been able to get his hattrick last week, or one of a number of other chances gone in, we'd be through. Not saying i liked the way we approached the second leg, but "keep it tight" doesnt mean play like shit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Invicta_Toon Posted March 16, 2007 Share Posted March 16, 2007 Players, manager, chairman, board etc. They're all to blame. That,But Roeder takes most of the blame because of the fact that the players don't pick themselves.. who were the other 11 players we had available then? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Again, I feel the players have to take a massive slice of the blame and responsibility. Yes Roeder's substitutions and selections are shite, but are the players doing enough? Are they playing as well as they can and should be? Do they want it badly? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leazes1986 Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Team selection was awful so Roeder takes a lot of blame but the players definitely have to take some blame. Don't expect anything from Carr and Babayaro because they aren't good enough to give anymore than they actually do. They are both piss poor. Butt, Parker, Dyer and Martins are much better players than they shown today though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicago_shearer Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Again, I feel the players have to take a massive slice of the blame and responsibility. Yes Roeder's substitutions and selections are s****, but are the players doing enough? Are they playing as well as they can and should be? Do they want it badly? Well said. No use in scapegoating the manager (although I'm more or less convinced that he too has lost the plot). Formations & team selections have little to do with successfully being able to pass the ball to a teammate, defend a corner or beat your man. Some people seem to think there is a top 4 or 5 team lurking beneath the absolute shite we've seen on display this season. There isn't. A clearout is needed. This club needs an enema. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicago_shearer Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Butt, Parker, Dyer and Martins are much better players than they shown today though. And they only have themselves to blame. I blame Roeder for picking a poor team and using his substitutions foolishly. I don't blame him for Scott Parker - an England international and league winner - being unable to pass forwards or Obafemi Martins - formerly of Inter Milan - being unable to control the ball. Unacceptable for the wages they earn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmonkey Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Again, I feel the players have to take a massive slice of the blame and responsibility. Yes Roeder's substitutions and selections are s****, but are the players doing enough? Are they playing as well as they can and should be? Do they want it badly? And thats where the manager earns his corn. Its the job of the manager to motivate the players, and if he feels he doesnt have the players who will respond to him, to then bring in ones that he thinks will. Hes failed in both aspects. He takes the most responsibility with regards to the performance - this is what hes employed to do. If hes shit tactically, and shit in the transfer market, the least we can expect is him to be able to motivate his players - otherwise, why the hell is he in the job? A few of us said this about Roeder a while ago - he has no motivational skills, expecially last season when he was caretaker apart from the first game. Far too many games weve come out with absolutely no urgency, determination or hunger, except when weve played a good side and the players have motivated themselves. Roeder does fuck all motivationally, the ONLY thing he seems to be able to do is give his players a bollocking at half time, and thats normally been the only way weve had a response. Prime example last season was the derby against Sunderland. We came out for the first half looking as though we couldnt give a shit, and it took a 1-0 deficit against the Premiership's worst ever side for Roeder to get a response from his players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Again, I feel the players have to take a massive slice of the blame and responsibility. Yes Roeder's substitutions and selections are s****, but are the players doing enough? Are they playing as well as they can and should be? Do they want it badly? And thats where the manager earns his corn. Its the job of the manager to motivate the players, and if he feels he doesnt have the players who will respond to him, to then bring in ones that he thinks will. Hes failed in both aspects. He takes the most responsibility with regards to the performance - this is what hes employed to do. If hes shit tactically, and shit in the transfer market, the least we can expect is him to be able to motivate his players - otherwise, why the hell is he in the job? A few of us said this about Roeder a while ago - he has no motivational skills, expecially last season when he was caretaker apart from the first game. Far too many games weve come out with absolutely no urgency, determination or hunger, except when weve played a good side and the players have motivated themselves. Roeder does fuck all motivationally, the ONLY thing he seems to be able to do is give his players a bollocking at half time, and thats normally been the only way weve had a response. Prime example last season was the derby against Sunderland. We came out for the first half looking as though we couldnt give a shit, and it took a 1-0 deficit against the Premiership's worst ever side for Roeder to get a response from his players. Absolutely. He is utterly incapable of making hard decisions, and utterly negative in his selections and tactics. Only wishing to be judged by fellow professionals and with no time for criticism from supporters, he blamed anything other than the players until finally, lacking any other excuses, absolutely hammers some sections of his team. To gee them up he threatens that they are now playing for their lives but then predictably, he elects to fill his starting 11 with his 'undroppables' who with comparatively little to prove, give yet another passionless, ineffective performance (not helped by Roeder doing fuck all on the touchline again). So who can he possibly blame this time other than himself, well the oppositions tactics of course, for having the temerity to try something something his team singularly failed to do at AZ, and well... the supporters. Get fucked Glenn. Yes, yes, the players must shoulder some element of blame, but to think that Roeder is getting too great a slice of criticism aimed at him is just yet more sympathetic cobblers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NUFC4 Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 revamp the whole fucking squad imo. the only keepers for me are: martins, owen, ameobi, dyer, milner, emre, n'zogbia, taylor, solano, and the youngsters ship everyone else out and start a new, fucking shit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 i agree with that... whether Roeder did a 'cr*p job' selecting them, on the field today were 11 VERY well paid players, all playing in their correct positions (bar Dyer, who many on here argue is better up front). They didnt perform. When you pick 11 players in their correct positions, who are earning on average £40k/week, you expect more than that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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