TRon Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 Sounds nice. My own view is that with Sam leaving and taking his entourage with him - and his philosophy by the sound of it - Bolton will sink back into obscurity pretty quickly. Playing cultured football makes a good soundbite but usually only the big clubs have the resources to do it effectively. If Bolton end up flirting with relegation under Little Sam's new philosophy, I wonder whether they will look back and think it wasn't so bad after all under Allardyce? People are quick to comment that we will struggle now that Big Sam has left, but there was already a suggestion that other teams had sussed out his 'philosophy' long before he left. For example, our form since the turn of the year would have seen us relegated had we not had such a good start. We already have the players for a passing game, unless of course you think that players like Ivan Campo were taught to hoof the ball half the length of the pitch at Real Madrid! True we may struggle against the 'big' clubs but we won't be playing the top four every week will we? He was there 8 yrs and managed to challenge for Europe for a good few of those. If his philosophy was sussed, how come more teams with better resources kept finishing below Bolton? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohmelads Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 We all sussed out Sam's philosophy years ago. Finding a way to beat it is another matter. I remember Souness tried to fight fire with fire and put a team out to go and beat Bolton at their own game. It didn't work because we had a team of midgets and we got bullied off the park, their players were also far more used to that style of game. We just played right into their hands. Arsenal have tried to let their quality do the talking but they tend to struggle against Bolton too because they don't get the time on the ball that they would like. Bolton have given Chelsea some very tough games (and beaten them) too but that's because the two formations tend to cancel each other out and make for an even, scrappy game. My main worry about Allardyce is how he can take that style of football to another level. It is possible, Chelsea and Liverpool are utterly boring teams who are not too dissimilar to Bolton, they just have better players all over the park. It'll be interesting to see which of our players flourish under the new system and which flop. Some won't like it at all, some will get a new lease of life. If we can bring the best out of players like Emre and Duff we'll be laughing, but equally if we see Owen and Martins struggling out wide we might have problems. Gonna be an interesting season either way... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest trotter58 Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 He was there 8 yrs and managed to challenge for Europe for a good few of those. If his philosophy was sussed, how come more teams with better resources kept finishing below Bolton? I repeat. We finished seventh because we had a very good start to the season. Our form since January would have seen us relegated had it been mirrored in the first half of the season. Maybe it took other teams this long to suss out out tactics because outside the top four, the Premier League actually isn't very good. We played Arsenal at the Emirates towards the end of the season. They were 4th and we were 5th. A win would have seen us climb above them. They won 2-1 but it could have been 10-1 so one-sided was it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest maznislav Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 I expect to win a cup in the next two seasons. Also I think that after three years we can compete for a CL place. As for the other managers, I didn't expected much from Dalglish and Gullit, I was excited when we appointed SBR and I was very pleased when he brought us in the top four. I was very disappointed with the Souness appointment and with Roeder's one as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 He was there 8 yrs and managed to challenge for Europe for a good few of those. If his philosophy was sussed, how come more teams with better resources kept finishing below Bolton? I repeat. We finished seventh because we had a very good start to the season. Our form since January would have seen us relegated had it been mirrored in the first half of the season. Maybe it took other teams this long to suss out out tactics because outside the top four, the Premier League actually isn't very good. We played Arsenal at the Emirates towards the end of the season. They were 4th and we were 5th. A win would have seen us climb above them. They won 2-1 but it could have been 10-1 so one-sided was it. So you are using the latter part of last season as your yardstick, when Sam had already probably decided he'd had enough - rather than judge him over a long, successful, and loyal period of 8 yrs as Bolton manager. Interesting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest trotter58 Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 So you are using the latter part of last season as your yardstick, when Sam had already probably decided he'd had enough - rather than judge him over a long, successful, and loyal period of 8 yrs as Bolton manager. Interesting. No, i'm saying that by the time he left, other teams had sussed him out. There isn't much point in using his achievements eight seasons ago to illustrate that argument would there? Please try to keep up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 I'm not using his achievements eight seasons ago, I'm saying that for the past eight seasons Bolton have done consistently well, especially the last few seasons in particular. So let me make this clear, I am not referring to his first few months, or his last few months, but his tenure in charge as a whole. Most neutral observers would probably argue that for the size of club and resources available, Bolton have consistently over-achieved under Sam Allardyce. Teams who have 'sussed' Bolton, quite a few of them probably need to suss how to muster a few more points instead IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon55544 Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 I'm not using his achievements eight seasons ago, I'm saying that for the past eight seasons Bolton have done consistently well, especially the last few seasons in particular. So let me make this clear, I am not referring to his first few months, or his last few months, but his tenure in charge as a whole. Most neutral observers would probably argue that for the size of club and resources available, Bolton have consistently over-achieved under Sam Allardyce. Teams who have 'sussed' Bolton, quite a few of them probably need to suss how to muster a few more points instead IMO. I agree, I also think that SA basically stop giving a shit when he wasnt given money in Jan because had Bolton backed him they could of finished 4th. All that talk about SA fines players who shoot outside the box aint as bad as it sounds they get fined something like £10 or £20 if they miss the target and at the end of the season the money collected goes to charity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fraser Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 He was there 8 yrs and managed to challenge for Europe for a good few of those. If his philosophy was sussed, how come more teams with better resources kept finishing below Bolton? I repeat. We finished seventh because we had a very good start to the season. Our form since January would have seen us relegated had it been mirrored in the first half of the season. Maybe it took other teams this long to suss out out tactics because outside the top four, the Premier League actually isn't very good. We played Arsenal at the Emirates towards the end of the season. They were 4th and we were 5th. A win would have seen us climb above them. They won 2-1 but it could have been 10-1 so one-sided was it. I doubt you'll ever see Bolton 5th again in the Premier League unless its alphabetical order; that's how good a job he did for you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest robertbobo Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 One thing is for sure - they'll die for the shirt or they won't be playing. Bye bye Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. Wasn't a Big Sam fan when he was at Bolton - wasn't happy with the Viduka signing - but deep down I know Viduka will have been told - work your balls off son - or else. Really can't wait for the new season - still feel bad for Roeder who's heart was in the right place but Parker and the rest just took the piss. Big Sam emptied / sold the majority of the wasters within a few days of his appointment. Next season I really really feel assured that if we lose a game we'll go home knowing we gave it our best shot and still feel proud to be black and white. Add to that the new regime and ny gut feeling is we're going places - Toon Toon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Invicta_Toon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest robertbobo Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Invicta_Toon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. bloody disgrace? sort yourself out FFS he was pushed out the bloody door, why do you think Barton was announced so quickly, Big Fat Bastard already knew he was going to sell Parker if he could get Barton Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fraser Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. bloody disgrace? sort yourself out FFS he was pushed out the bloody door, why do you think Barton was announced so quickly, Big Fat b****** already knew he was going to sell Parker if he could get Barton Don't think anyone was forced to do anything; it clearly suited everybody's purpose to have a change around, including Scott's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Invicta_Toon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. bloody disgrace? sort yourself out FFS he was pushed out the bloody door, why do you think Barton was announced so quickly, Big Fat b****** already knew he was going to sell Parker if he could get Barton Don't think anyone was forced to do anything; it clearly suited everybody's purpose to have a change around, including Scott's. a new job is always handy when you know you're not even going to get a chance to play Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dr. Pongle Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. What a ridiculous thing to say. You obviously missed his first season with us and in his second season he faltered - mainly because he didn't know whether he was an attacking or defensive midfielder, and that was down to Roeder's lack of tactical nous. In a nutshell, Parker was a brilliant signing and I'm furious he was replaced with a total scumbag of a character in Joey Barton. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Invicta_Toon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 http://www.talkofthetyne.net/mediac/400_300/media/Parker~Wig.jpg bloody disgrace Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Johan Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 People here really need to get a grip. You sir are the fucking disgrace along with the other idiots who will boo their own players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
greydos Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. Nigel Reo Coker? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Invicta_Toon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 People here really need to get a grip. You sir are the fucking disgrace along with the other idiots who will boo their own players. who are you talking to? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fraser Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. Nigel Reo Coker? Joey Barton (well, nearly). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. Nigel Reo Coker? Joey Barton (well, nearly). Nearly as in he wasn't Man City captain? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alberto2005 Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Parker who was obviously one of those that Butt and Harper were having a go at when they said that there were players in the dressing room who didn't want to play for us. that's crap What other CAPTAIN of a Premiership club, a club which had just welcomed a new manager and brand new owners with money to burn would fly speedily out the door at the first chance. Sad but true. Personally I thought he was a cracking player at Charlton. Didn't quite cut it at Chelsea and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. Nigel Reo Coker? Joey Barton (well, nearly). I got the impression he was reluctant to leave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 and was a bloody disgrace at NUFC. What a ridiculous thing to say. You obviously missed his first season with us and in his second season he faltered - mainly because he didn't know whether he was an attacking or defensive midfielder, and that was down to Roeder's lack of tactical nous. In a nutshell, Parker was a brilliant signing and I'm furious he was replaced with a total scumbag of a character in Joey Barton. I don't think anybody really knows whether Parker's an attacking or defensive midfielder. Personally I'm not sure he does either job well enough to justify playing ahead of a specialist, so have no problem with him leaving for West Ham for £7m. Although we probably could have got £22m the way they are chucking money at everyone in a desperate attempt to prove they are big time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrEe Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 when I look at our NUFC team, I know, that we can deffently reach uefa if big Sam manages our club right. Right now our team spirit is probly the lowest in the premeir league. if Big Sam can get all our players pulling in the same direction, I see no reason why we can't fnish in the top 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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