Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 First of all every one of those England under 21 lads did themselves, their team, manager and their country extremely proud tonight with their bravery, passion, spirit and effort but the stark reality is that all those wonderful English traits that the rest of the world envies sadly means nowt when you come home a loser and that's what we are as a footballing nation - losers. And if we are to end this embarrassing series of failures we need to change our attitudes and outlook on the game we like to pretend we gave to the world, and starting now, because we are failing our kids. No doubt the media, pundits, fans and the coaching staff at the FA will crow about our bravery in the face of adversity and champion it to the masses, however while we kid ourselves the host nation Holland will be preparing for a final where they'll be hoping to retain their crown... It is time we stopped focusing on traits such as passion, desire, commitment, effort and spirit because all these traits do is knack our players, physically, mentally, tactically and most important of all - technically. Had we retained the ball just by an extra 20% more, we wouldn't have been so knackered from chasing the ball. Had our players been more tactically switched on we wouldn't have been as exposed as we were. Had we more technical qualities we wouldn't have surrendered so much territory. The Dutch were extremely poor yet still looked more comfortable on the ball, more tactically aware and kept possession much better than we did. On the continent they teach players to let the ball do all the hard work while it is the exact opposite in the UK. I've read a few comments criticising Stuart Pearce and yes, his tactics and methods didn't exactly help the cause but he's just a symptom of the malaise in our game, and knows no better than to go backs to the wall, chests out, chin up, fight. That's the way he was schooled, and so have his players, right from the age they started kicking a ball. Things need to change at that level right the way up if England as a nation are to win major honours and to produce top players. For the past 6 months or so since my 8 year-old nephew has been playing for a local junior football club I've been all over the North East watching kids' football and I can tell you now that the emphasis isn't on skill, freedom of expression or technique but the very things that our lads in Holland displayed so honestly. The sad thing is if we developed other areas of our game, we'd be almost unbeatable because no team or player outside of England is as honest as our lot. Nah the under 21s lads didn't fail, they've been failed. I'm sick of seeing an English side lose after putting up a monumental fight. :'( Anyway, well done England under 21s... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alan Shearer 9 Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 It's alwawys the English wawy, and I can't see it changing in the near future Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest graemeh72 Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 First of all every one of those England u..................................................................................... ................................................................. ................................................................ Anyway, well done England under 21s... Thats an excellent post !!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Coach HTT - Sometimes I look at the size of your post & dont read them but when I do you write some corkers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 It's alwawys the English wawy, and I can't see it changing in the near future Aye, you're probably right which is very frustrating because we can all see where our problems lie yet year after year we hope because we have a Wayne Rooney in our team or a David Beckham we can compete and end the failure. And when they fail we barrack them as being not good enough or overhyped. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Just puts into perspective how big a pair of wankers Agbonlahor and Bentley are.Should be hung for treason tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Lets, again, put it into perspective. Semi Final of european u21's some class performance's bright young players on the way! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest graemeh72 Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Lets, again, put it into perspective. Semi Final of european u21's some class performance's bright young players on the way! eerrr I'm not saying this to be controversial but we fluked it to the semis Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toontownman Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Good read, almost home page article worthy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 It's alwawys the English wawy, and I can't see it changing in the near future The English way these days is to score and then try and defend it,generally far too deeply.I think it comes from Svens days in Italy and has spread through the national set up.Not our way though and we've been continually caught out playing this way at international level since 2002. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 the way i looked at it was they werent really any better than us and only equalised in the dying minutes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Lets, again, put it into perspective. Semi Final of european u21's some class performance's bright young players on the way! eerrr I'm not saying this to be controversial but we fluked it to the semis Bollocks like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovejoy Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 best post on here in bloody ages Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Watching the game against Holland tonight was so like the seniors against France a few years back in the Euros or Portugal in the last World Cup. Surrender possession, sit deep, hope the individuals win it for us. When that fails, come out fighting before losing on pens. I've never felt so sorry for a team or bunch of players outside of my own Newcastle. Seeing Milner crying at the end, Taylor hobbling and throwing himself at everything despite being injured... :-[ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Watching the game against Holland tonight was so like the seniors against France a few years back in the Euros or Portugal in the last World Cup. Surrender possession, sit deep, hope the individuals win it for us. When that fails, come out fighting before losing on pens. Go back further to Brazil 2002 where we did it against 10 fucking men! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Watching the game against Holland tonight was so like the seniors against France a few years back in the Euros or Portugal in the last World Cup. Surrender possession, sit deep, hope the individuals win it for us. When that fails, come out fighting before losing on pens. Go back further to Brazil 2002 where we did it against 10 fucking men! I forgot about that. This is no coincidence, this pattern exists because as a nation that's how we are schooled to play when up against good opposition. Yet when we play like we can do, full of pace and tempo, we invariably do well, regardless of the opposition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Lets, again, put it into perspective. Semi Final of european u21's some class performance's bright young players on the way! eerrr I'm not saying this to be controversial but we fluked it to the semis Bollocks like. Aye, that particular comment was bollocks. But we were always gonna bottle it. (Didn't see much of the game today, but conceding in the last minute and taking penalties up until breaking point - where we break - backs up my point) THAT is typical England. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest optimistic nit Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 thing is though, the only ones playing tonight who i reckon would be good enough to have an international career with england are baines and young. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Coach HTT - Sometimes I look at the size of your post & dont read them but when I do you write some corkers Well cheers for that, this is something very close to my heart as like I said the bairn is being schooled in the very same way and no matter what we say to him, we can't control an entire team or his coaches and indeed junior football as a whole which is frightening and barbaric the way they play the game, kids, in so-called organised football. I actually found myself saying to him the other day because he was dilly-dallying "shoot early man, gotta be quicker" and not long after when he got on the ball again and was in a position to shoot he panicked and sent it well wide, because of me. I gave myself a slap for that and told him to ignore me. He's 8 FFS. I was talking to a scout the other week at one of these mini-soccer tournaments and I asked him straight what are you looking for and he said "speed, strength, work ethic and powerful shooting- the rest can be taught". From 6-8 year old kids.... boils my piss. Now look up and down the academies and the only players that seem to make it are the big, powerful athletic type players or the quick, hard working players where as the skilful players just disappear. Our own academy is littered with such "failures" We do have the talent though, I see it every week, we have good players with good skills, but they are kind of being conditioned to an archaic way of playing football or de-coached of all their natural instincts, expression and flair in the pursuit of effort, guts and spirit which has somehow been mistaken as the sign of a winner. Take Noble for example, who according to that commentator off Sky, told him he had to change his game while at WHU's academy in order to make it, which the commentator actually praised him for... He's went from a ball playing schemer to a Scott Parker type player apparently. Today he just looks like a very very average player in the middle of the park, a clogger. Indeed Parker as a youngster was noted for his skills on the ball, yet today he's become just another midfield grafter or as Souness called him a proper player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest optimistic nit Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 if you were american you would have been suscribed ritalin a long time ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Lets, again, put it into perspective. Semi Final of european u21's some class performance's bright young players on the way! eerrr I'm not saying this to be controversial but we fluked it to the semis Bollocks like. Aye, that particular comment was bollocks. But we were always gonna bottle it. (Didn't see much of the game today, but conceding in the last minute and taking penalties up until breaking point - where we break - backs up my point) THAT is typical England. bottle it....for fucks sake...over half an hours worth of penalties,we got beat,we didnt bottle it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Conceded in the last minute, though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 thing is though, the only ones playing tonight who i reckon would be good enough to have an international career with england are baines and young. Yet the Dutch, I could see half of them playing for Holland or doing well at a higher level or rather adapting further on in their development. That's why foreign players succeed in different leagues because their minds are tuned to deal with all kinds of different situations and of course, having the technical ability, makes it all that more easier. What was I saying about making the ball do all the work?! BTW I can't see any of them having a very good career for England, not even our own Taylor, despite a few of them having the talent. Carson is probably the one who could get a regular game at that level in a few years time but the rest I'm not so sure, more is the pitty. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 Watching the game against Holland tonight was so like the seniors against France a few years back in the Euros or Portugal in the last World Cup. Surrender possession, sit deep, hope the individuals win it for us. When that fails, come out fighting before losing on pens. Go back further to Brazil 2002 where we did it against 10 fucking men! Just remembered, it gets worse - Argentina France 98, we did the same thing, although being a man down changed things but they were brittle at the back and had we kept possession better and used the pace of Owen better and the strengths of Shearer instead of shouting them back like Pearce did all game tonight... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted June 20, 2007 Share Posted June 20, 2007 i agree with grassroots to a small extent,re the coaching to youngsters(primarily those outside of acadamies etc) too much of this is left to numpties who have passed an FA badge or two,basically meaning they are safe to work with kids....an annecdote...whilst watching my (at the time)8yr old nephew play for his team,one of his team mates got through on goal,the oppositions manager shouted at his defenders "tek him oot",i volleyed back a "fuckin arsehole"..after the player shot wide the ref done well to go over and have a word with el twatto on the other touchline but by then the damage was done. at that age coaches should be looking for improvment in all parts of football not just victories. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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