Benwell Lad

For me it's definitely a yellow, pretty perplexed with the MOTD lot all saying it was absolutely fine. Also, any chance of a thread title change, cringing every time I see it. Sadly, predictably true. He really doesn't seem to like Colo.

There were some cracking games at the weekend but that point is what makes it for me too. Heard from some Dortmund fans who were at Arsenal last week that they were penned in for 15 minutes after the game. Some lit cigarettes and were told aggressively to put them out or they'd be arrested. They must think WTF is this about compared to the atmosphere they enjoy at home.

Pinched from TF. Has to be said like. All true. Sir Alex Ferguson should answer a question: when was the last time an opposing team was awarded a penalty at the Stretford End of Old Trafford? He should think about the answer (I’ve no idea when it was) and reflect his club has been the beneficiary of some startlingly generous refereeing decisions over many, many years. I’m not about to accuse Manchester United of establishing the kind of web of corruption Moggi established for Juventus in Serie A but Ferguson’s club can’t have fared better from officials than that which Juve did for many years before they were rumbled. I am not suggesting for one moment anyone connected with Manchester United has had any role whatsoever in bribing match officials but what I will say emphatically is that despite being one of the greatest managers ever to have lived and having turned out successive teams with the competitiveness, steel and skill that cannot be denied, they have also bullied, intimidated and manipulated match officials to such a degree that when you play them, it is almost a given, your players will receive yellow cards for things they will routinely get away with Scot free. Take for example Rooney taking three hacks at Collocini as he lay on the ground outside our box in the first half. Please do not tell me had that situation been reversed Collocini would have received a yellow or possibly a red card. Who in a B&W shirt could have pursued the referee around the pitch aggressively questioning his decisions but not being awarded the yellow card? Certainly not Cabaye, who was cautioned for a fraction of what Rooney was guilty of. That could be extended to Ferdinand and Vidic who appeared to have carte blanche to be in the referee’s lug hole constantly, aggressively questioning decisions whereas our lot appeared to be walking a tightrope if they looked at the Ref the wrong way. I have never seen a display of petulance go unpunished as Rafael was as he raged on the touch-line at the linesman. Unbelievable. I don’t know a manager who can escape FA censure in the way Ferguson will, not only form his post-match insulting comments about the linesman but for the snarling, swearing, abusive manner in which he patrolled the touchline, his face contorted with hatred for the officials for doing their jobs. This was Sir Bobby Robson’s friend? Some of the decisions to go Man Utd’s way were comical - Carrick blatantly pushing Ba as he allowed the ball to roll out for a goal-kick, with the Ref then giving Man U the corner amongst a host of other fouls - the assaults on Ba from Ferdinand and Vidic going unpunished throughout the game. But we got a penalty, admittedly a generous one and instead of folding to Man U’s intimidation, the linesman correctly gave their final winning goal an offside . But f*** Ferguson and f*** the media he leads by the nose . This was an incredible display of spirit and defiance by the best set of lads to pull on Black & White shirts in the 40 years I’ve been going to see this mad football club play football matches. I’ve seen better players but I’ve never seen a better bunch of grafters. The manager has assembled a squad of proper footballers, who will give everything for our just and righteous cause. From Krul performing heroics in goal, to Stephen Taylor throwing himself in front of everything, to Cabaye and Guthrie running their bollocks off in the middle of the park to Ba fighting and competing for every single ball for the first minute to the last. We were a picture of hard work and endeavour. I made this Obertan’s best performance, his natural athleticism and pace a constant thorn in the side for Man U down our right hand side in the first half with his decision-making in the critical areas having made a big step up. There was a bit more from Ben Arfa too. Some of his runs, passing as well as excellent work-rate hint at what is to come but truth be told it would be wrong not to hail every single player who turned out in our colours a real hero - Danny Simpson and Ryan Taylor were excellent, Guiiteraz ran his knackas off and Collocini as ever, was imperious. We left Old Trafford (very, very slowly) proud of the lads. They gave us everything and that’s all we ask for. Fair play also to the manager and his staff, whose preparation and tactical plan was absolutely spot on.

I agree. Never been his biggest fan but he has been excellent lately. A bit like Saylor when he actually started to look like a Premier League player at the end of last season. Still not sure if we need better to move on to a higher level but for now he's doing his reputation no harm at all.

He may or may not be mad but he certainly seems to think everyone else, especially Sunderland fans are. The music rant showed him up and so far this season he's fobbed them off with :- They pile too much pressure on with the level of expectation. Getting beat by and being below Newcastle is the reason for everything going wrong. They need time to gel. LOL FFS it's nearly December and he had a full close season too. Their season will start next game. Aye alreet Steve they've been waiting since last December. This weekend's "I'm no quitter" rant contradicts the fact that he's walked out on virtually every club he's managed. The man's a fool, but that's not to say he should be fired or he's not doing a good job. It just depends who you support really.

While he is yet to turn in a real MoM performance this season HBA excites me in a Jimmy Smith,Tony Green, Gazza kind of way (apologies to younger members) In flashes he looks like a really exceptional player who could open up any team.

When they're "rationalising" by firing modestly paid journalists and backroom people, the obscene amounts they pay to Lawrenson,Hansen,Shearer are a disgrace. None of them add anything to the programme. I'd say cut the bullshit, show more highlights and save money at the same time.

That's an urban myth. Everton fans broke into applause when Alan Ball died, Man United did similar when Best died. Nothing to do with people acting out, they were spontaneous and seemed a better way to show respect than the tired silence. Personally I prefer it. I think silence allows a meditational moment when each person can remember the person being honoured in their own way. Of course it will only take one person to applaud for others to follow and we can't have both. I think silence followed by vocal tributes would be best.

I think the circumstances of his death and the fact that unusually most of the crowd will have seen the man we are honouring play, will make Saturday's tribute more poignant than any other. It should be a minute's silence followed by vocal tributes. Applause only started because some crowds were deemed unable to respect silence and it saved embarrassment.

Pardew's "presidential" air

as much as i agree with that statement, isn't it just about the most bleedin obvious post ever made on here ?

I think it's a part of human nature to have a tendency to be self critical and too inward looking. This probably extends to our teams as football supporters. We are far from perfect, but as someone has already pointed out the real issue should be how we compare to others and right now with a few obvious exceptions we probably compare quite favourably.

Agreed. If you'd told me pre season that a back four which included Simpson and Raylor would have the best record in the league after 13 games I'd have called you insane. But it has so credit where due, to some extent the proof of the pudding is in the eating. That said, like you, I probably still see our present full backs more as squad than first eleven although Simpson has really surprised me in the last few games and looked a lot better than I thought he could be. Re the CH position, you obviously subscribe to the opinion that we can have 4 established premier league central defenders on our books. Fair enough so do quite a few others. Of course I'd like it, I just doubt how pragmatic it would be.

You've put that very well, which is part of the point I was trying to make, along with that we have had to use our squad already and we've done well and that even when we were playing regular European football our squad was no better and probably not as good as the present one.

Aye, an injury to one of our CB's and it's curtains. Undoubtedly it would be a big problem, particularly if it was Colo who I think is irrreplacable. But do you think we can attract a good premier league standard CH right now who may be fourth choice when Williamson is fit ?

That is my point. Of course we could improve, but we are deluding ourselves if we think we are big enough or rich enough to have 11 top players sitting patiently. Our squad has already been tested this season and towards the end of last seson it was stretched to breaking point and it has done pretty well when called upon. Also as I said, covering players and academy products give us better cover than the last time we had decent first elevens, imo.

Now that the ridiculous assertion that we had played "nobody" seems to have been blown perhaps another of the criticisms levelled at us deserves an airing. The often trawled out claim that we have a paper thin squad - voiced most recently by one M.Owen on MOTD2 last night. Now no one in their right mind would claim that we have a squad like Man City or Chelsea nor that a couple of decent acquisitions wouldn't go a long way to consolidating our progress, but apart from that we have a pretty decent squad. Anyone who may still have a programme from our most recent decent teams, i.e. those managed by KK and SBR, have a look at those squads. Outside of very impessive first elevens you were looking at the likes of Wayne Quinn, Diego GAvilan, JAmie McClen, Brian Kerr, James Coppinger,Stuart Green, Jimmy Crawford, Des Hamilton, David Burt etc etc as immediate cover. No disrespect to the afore mentioned but the present covering players enhanced by some great academy products look a lot better than what we had then. Indeed already this season we have played quite a few who would have been considered no more than squad cover in the summer but they have done excellently and helped us achieve a great start. We must be realistic too, we'd all like another quality central defender, but assuming we have three when Williamson is fit how many clubs can afford to keep 4 top quality central defenders happy. It's probably unrealistic to think we have enough going for us to attract a good premier league centre half who will be happy to be our fourth choice, so like just about every other club, in the unfortunate situation where 2 out of 3 are out we'll have to make do with a stand in player. Anyway, now the other myth has been blown, the lazy pundits will be able to wheel this one out now, but overall while there is room for improvement we don't have a bad squad and it certainly looks healthier than it was on the last occasions we we were up at the right end of the league.

Difficult as that supposition may be Ian, I think it runs a lot deeper than that mate. They have allowed a bad manager to spend unpreceded amounts of money and the situation looks pretty rotten from top to bottom.

Mackems have to realise that the way their club is now structured getting rid of Bruce is not an easy option and to do so will not be some magic wand act which will make things improve. Bruce has been totally backed by the power brokers in the club, Quinn and Short, to an extent where the entire infrastructure and squad is a Bruce creation. They barely have the resources to buy out Bruce's long and lucrative contract let alone an entire coaching and backroom staff and it's unlikely a new manager would wish to have Bruce's buddies imposed on him. That's not to mention the paying squad - the ridiculous contracts they have handed out to the likes of Brown, O'Shea etc means they will be going nowhere for quite a while so any new guy would be pretty much dealing with the sub-standard players they already have. All in all they look pretty facked with or without Bruce due to the faith that was placed in him.

It's often the "off the record" encounters which say most about people who are famous.

If I were one of the many loyal Sunderland fans who come from South Tyneside, Northumberland or north Durham, who would probably consider themselves to be Geordies who support Sunderland, I'd be very offended by their discriminatory and derogatory use of the word "Geordie" when they're protesting about their dreadful manager and team.

That's The Sun finished if true. New corp, it's time it all ended. Rupert Murdoch, how much blood on your hands do you want? it's more than just that, it's the populace that craves the shitey celeb scandal and tittle tattle, if the population didn't want it they wouldn't have a market to sell it to. So true.

I'm the opposite tbh, I can't help but feel that there has to be a bigger picture to the event. I am devastated by what's happened and hope that if true then who ever is behind feels the weight of his death on their shoulders until their dying day. Never mind crap about reporters just doing their job, there has to be a line that should not be crossed, it's not journalism it's ruining people's lives to sell papers. I can see how and why you'd feel that, but to me it sounds like just needing a reason for it, as that would make the whole thing easier to understand. As it is, it's just completely baffling, no one understands why, and I think that's what's leading to these kinds of rumours. Not trying to start an argument here btw, it's not the time or the place, I respect your opinions, I just needed to get that said. Your more then likely right tbh, I hope you are infact. The most recent comparable event was prbably two years ago when Robert Enke the German goalkeeper took his own life. He was ten years younger than Speed and still playing at the highest level. In his case there was a very clear reason for his depression, the death of his 2 year old daughter. Suicide just seems so much worse than any other type of death.

Superb again yesterday. Too good to not be playing regularly. Nice problem for the manager to have but as we're finding out already when injuries, suspensions etc kick in everybody gets to play a part over the course of a season.

So sad, devastating and puzzling too. I was in Amsterdam when I heard, for Newcastle supporters, Welsh football fans and others too it will probably be a JFK/Diana type moment where you will always remember where you heard the tragic news. A wonderful footballer, possibly underated by some but never by fellow professionals. Probably the best midfield header of a ball I have ever seen. So sad.