KaKa

Why is Ings not taking this for goodness sake? Could have done with the fantasy points.

Lascelles man

What a re-introduction to the side

Demarai Gray £1.7million. Gets his first goal for Everton. Going to be interesting seeing the Everton lot eat their words on him. Also had a really good debut last week.

1 minute ago, brummie said:

 

You've been much the better team for all but the last ten minutes of the half.

 

We have been absolutely shite. Why El Ghazi gets starts is beyond me. I actually thought Ramsey had a shout for best player on our side so far.

 

No Grealish, obviously, but also no Watkins or Bailey and we can't make the ball stick at your end of the pitch enough.

And yet we're still losing the game. Very bad sign IMO.

Your lot are in a bit of limbo at the moment with the new players coming in and having not bedded in. Just realised Traore managed to get injured again too and isn't available.

Your missing quite a few of your better performers and we don't look like we will capitalise in any way shape or form. Could easily see Bailey come on do something decent and it will lead to the game being sewn up, as we don't tend to improve after the half under Bruce.

We are so embarrassing man. 

The likes of Bailey and Watkins aren't even featuring yet and these lot are giving us the business. Losing with them starting El Ghazi and that kid Ramsey.

Oh dear. Bruce out.

Looking at the two teams I think we might actually win this.

If we get dealt with easily, then like others have said it's a sign we are in big big trouble.

That Harvey Elliot is such a classy looking player. 

23 minutes ago, Smal said:

We really need a left wing back don't we? The current competition is Matt Ritchie or Jamal Lewis  

Jetro is sat at home doing nothing right now. Wish we'd send Ritchie back to Bournemouth and bring Willems back, especially now we've gone back to a wing back system.

Fully expecting his new 5 year deal to be confirmed any day now.

God ... if this guy goes to Everton and returns to the top form he found with Rafa back in the day. It would be so incredibly enjoyable to see Bruce squirm about it when it comes up 

16 minutes ago, BlueStar said:

 

Well this one is £65, is the word Newcastle" worth 100 quid?

 

https://castore.com/collections/new-collection/products/navy-pro-tek-suba-logo-hoody?variant=39435214389385

Just had a look on their site and there seem to be a fair number that are in that £165 range that are the more high performance clothing.

Just looking at their site I had no idea they even positioned themselves as a premium sports brand. Got some pretty pricey gear on there.

2 minutes ago, HTT II said:

That’s always been the way and always will be, me I’m sick of pussy cutting around the issue, if you boo taken the knee you’re a fucking knacker and most likely don’t like anyone that isn’t white and don’t like them dirty foreigners either, they can go and fuck off because they are the type who claim not to be racist and act like they aren’t - when not booing taking the knee, sharing memes about dirty Muslims and other foreigners on social media etc. They are the worst, again they can fuck off absolute dregs of society!

Unfortunately my experience of these things has been a life long one. I cannot tell you how many encounters I have had with people that will smile in your face and say all the right things and then you start hearing something different behind your back.

Ironically there are then those that say some of the daftest things openly, but at least you can then confront them on it and hash it out with them and they can often see where they are completely misguided.

I cannot even begin to express how complicated and tiresome these things can be man.   

5 minutes ago, HTT II said:

Nah they are racists cunts like, if you weren’t that way inclined it wouldn’t bother you at all. 

From what I can see the whole thing has become massively politicized and is seemingly used as a way to identify which way people lean politically. And this is now leading to a whole different argument and fight altogether. It's a complete and utter mess.

For me personally I would never presume or label people racist based on booing the knee, that is a very serious accusation to make and carries a lot of weight man. People really need to be careful with that. Think it is seriously trivializing things. And as I mentioned previously just because someone is behind the kneeling that doesn't mean they are not doing something completely different behind closed doors. Hence why I can't take the backing of the kneeling seriously at all.

That is scandalous.

2 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

I’m not sure I fully understand where you’re coming from.
 

Of course there will still be racism in the future, all we can do is look for progress.

 

And maybe people will debate the gesture and object to it, as they do to anything that demands change, thought or threatens the status quo. 

 

I just don’t see why that means it isn’t worthwhile.
 

Speaking as a white person who thought they knew a fair bit, there are many dimensions to the race issue that I wasn’t aware of before Black Lives Matter made me look into anti-racism in much more detail. 

Okay, but I'm assuming you were never racist in the first place.

The kind of people that hold these kinds of views are completely uninterested in these sorts of gestures, and if anything revel in all the fuss that comes about from it, and can't wait for the next chance to carry on.

4 minutes ago, ManDoon said:

That’s fair, I’m not saying I don’t think it  is still openly expressed it definitely is but I mean from a harm reduction standpoint it’s better than even if people have those sort of beliefs, in a decent society they can’t express them openly or harmfully.

 

I think also there might be some who feel the reaction from those around them as a rejection of those beliefs and begin to question it. There will of course alway be racists, ultimately education and socializing with people is the only way to really prevent that but I don’t think any attempt is therefore useless. 
 

Newcastle is honestly one of the most inclusive cities I’ve ever lived in, from my own experience things have changed significantly over the years in other parts of the country. It would be unheard of for someone to be openly gay at school, but now it’s totally different, and that’s through public conversation and discourse. The laws didn’t change. So I think it is possible to make progress for sure. 

 

I hear you, and the bit in bold I certainly agree with most. I think we all just have to be more patient with each other. I think over time familiarity with different people is ultimately what helps change these sorts of views if anything ever will. It's certainly going to come with a lot of growing pains in the meantime though.

In the immediate I don't think it's at all helpful when people start accusing others of being racist so lightly over the more trivial things, as this engenders more divisiveness and ill will. I think we really need to try and move away from that.

2 minutes ago, ManDoon said:

I specially remember hearing a conversation on a bus when I was teenager of two lads lamenting the fact they couldn’t go “paki bashing”

anymore. So I do think having public awareness of issues is good because you wouldn't hear that conversation today.
 

Whoever they were targeting doesn’t have the choice of moving on, or not letting it affect them because they are gonna get violently attacked for no reason. It’s not that simple. That was a regular sentiment in the midlands in the early 2000s 

There's a post on here about how folks were hearing people being openly racist in the pub after the England loss on penalties. This kind of talk is still alive and well in my opinion. So this stuff still goes on to varying degrees.

Ultimately, where we differ in opinion is that you believe that having people be less open in the way they might express these things means some progress is being made. I don't agree though, ultimately they still feel the same way and still teach their kids the same thing, and are just now more sly about it, which in some ways is even more concerning.

1 minute ago, ManDoon said:

Of course there are yeah, but I mean I still don’t think that means we shouldn’t have any symbolic gestures. And no I don’t believe that but I don’t really see your point. Nothing ever works 100 percent so let’s not bother with it? 
 

Imo it’s good to highlight issues in society because it keeps them at the forefront of public consciousness. It also outs the racists booing it. We can both have laws and also have gestures such a kneeling. 

Okay, so let's assume everyone stops booing this gesture. So what? All sorted now then? All it really means is that they're just going along with it in public. It's a completely empty meaningless process.

As soon as they're hidden online or a part of a big enough crowd it will be the same stuff we've seen for decades now. Decades.

Just now, ManDoon said:

Did I call you racist? Don’t think so. Just not surprised there would be a crossover between anti vaxx/not supporting taking the knee.

 

Damn, daft lad, hurtful. Also that’s great, please feel free to not respond to anything I say.

I've seen a few comments on here in this sort of vein now, and honestly I just feel like black folks are being used as pawns in a larger political debate that is happening in society now, and honestly that just sucks, and it is really unfortunate.

15 minutes ago, ManDoon said:

Obviously I can’t speak to the experience of black people, and Kaka has a more lived experience than me, but his argument strikes me as one from a position of privilege. Sure you can surround yourself with decent people and move on, but not everyone can. There will be plenty of people out there having to deal with shitty racist cunts. That’s the reality. Of course one gesture doesn’t “stop racism”, but what the hell so let’s not do anything at all, to try and stop any societal ill because it won’t eradicate the problem.

 

Also quelle surprise ToonArmy doesn’t think kneeling is a good idea, I’m shocked. 

Are there not laws now in place to punish people for these offences? Let the authorities focus on that.

All this other stuff is just complete nonsense and is now just causing more palava with people now trivialising racism to whether or not folks boo players kneeling. Do you really expect me to believe everyone that applauds that kneeling is not carrying on a completely different way in private? No chance.

35 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

 

I don't really think this argument makes sense. It's highlighting the situation, it's getting people talking about it, it has already worked. It's saying that we acknowledge that racism is a problem and we want to bring it into the open. It's not really meant to reduce racial tension, maybe racial tension needs to increase a bit so that every group can have their voices heard.

 

If your argument is that nothing can improve racism, then I don't quite get it. 

All sounds really nice. At the end of the day though, in a few months we'll have another stadium making monkey noises or more players getting abuse on social media.

Another big fuss will be made about how awful it is and maybe we'll progress from kneeling to having everyone lay completely prostrate on the floor to encourage even more acknowledgement and discussion to bring it out into the open further.

And from what I can see all that comes from this is that now people can argue more back and forth accusing this and the other of being racist over whether they boo the kneeling, which completely trivialises the real prejudice people face in reality.

It's all a complete farce. I would encourage anyone that is a minority group to save themselves and learn how to overcome this bullshit for their own well being. Never allow anyone to use this nonsense to get a rise out of you and feel any lesser about who you are.

I look forward to someone explaining to me how it is working. As a black guy I don't see it and never have.

Personally, I have long learnt to move on from all of it for my own sanity. Anyone who indulges in such hatred is not going to end up in a good place anyway. They're setting themselves up for their own suffering.

Complete waste of time waiting on people to change their ways. I'll worry about myself and surround myself with people that have some damned sense and know how to behave.

Just now, Raconteur said:

Yeah, not engaging with any of that. I was seeking clarity, and you provided it. Really disappointing attitude.

Fair enough. Don't worry man. The gestures will continue and all the other things they come up with.

And we'll all get to watch the behaviour continue just as it always has. How long has this all been going on for now? I have absolutely zero faith in these people changing their ways.

Lets see how long they will continue kneeling for. I'm genuinely fascinated to see.

1 minute ago, Raconteur said:

I have to say, that reads a bit like “you can’t stop racism, so don’t try”?

Prove to me you can then. Are you serious? You think kneeling down and all these silly gestures is going to stop racism? For all you know half of the people kneeling are the same ones that will be online spouting racist nonsense as soon as they are angry enough about something.

What you can't stop is angry ignorant people that go about taking their problems out on everyone around them and this is just one of the many ways they do. Most of these people have serious issues in their personal lives and just look for people to lash out at and justify it.

There are laws in place to deal with people that commit these offences, so I really don't understand what all this other meaningless guff is all about.