brummie

Except Lerner has bought and is running Villa for the Lerner family trust, which is worth in excess of $6bn - the 1.3bn is his own, personal wealth. The trust also owns the Cleveland Browns which alone are worth a shade under a billion dollars. I'd be sceptical of all of the above figures. Exceptionally rich people are never going to have the full extent of their worth known.

Ha ha. No chance of that. Aaron Hughes, on the other hand .....

Why does building a casino always get mention in football takeovers? You don't need to buy a football club to build a casino, and you can't just build a casino where you want, either.

Indeed, and at the moment Liverpool are looking seriously like they might not get a Champions League place for next year, and are said to be "shitting it", given that they are in huge amount of debt and need to build a new stadium (unless this proposed takeover goes through, obv). That's how important CL football is these days. If you look at some of the stuff coming out of the G14 about clubs wanting to protect their income streams it is quite frightening - these clubs are effectively hinting at *guaranteed* CL football for themselves. If that happens, we may as well all pack up and go home.

I think a lot of clubs will look at selling stadium naming rights, however, the figures Arsenal got for their naming rights aren't a good yardstick to use. Arsenal were selling naming rights of a brand new stadium, which has never been known as anything else. Selling rights for an established stadium won't bring in anything like the same amount. We're having this discussion on some of our boards, and the general consensus is "so long as they pay up, they can call it what they like, we'll still call it villa park" - sponsors know this, and the price will be lower accordingly. Things are going to get interesting with the West Ham takeover and now tonight they're talking about George Gillet buying Liverpool, with 4 CL places to go for, there's going to be a lot of pissed off billionaires not getting the return they want on their money.

What about getting into the Champions League? That's where the real money is. Alternatively, they could just be looking at cutting costs and increasing profit margin that way.

as if, Glen: 'right bos, I spunked that 25m on some crocks in Jan, now where's that 50 you promised for the summer?' Surely the clever thing to have done would have been to not say anything about how much they were going to spend in January. If a club knows you've got that kind of cash, and knows what kind of player you're looking for, they'll hold you to ransom. Damned if you do, damned if you don't, I suppose. have they said much about their long term plans?

Upson did well playing in a shit side, mind. Dunn I agree is a good player but have you seen the size of him recently? He clearly likes his pies.

The difference between the takeovers of West Ham, Villa, Portsmouth and (possibly about to happen) Leicester and the potential Belgravia one is that the first four are being headed by identifiable individuals with an interest either in sport in general, or football in particular. The Belgravia takeover doesn't seem to have that, which is a bit worrysome. Who are they? Aren't they representing some sort of hedge fund? If so, I'd be a little concerned, as clearly the profit motive is going to be in the prime (which may be the case in the other clubs mentioned, too, but in this case it is obvious from the start). Given that, maybe it would be better to put up with FS in the short term in the hope that someone more transparent than Belgravia comes through for a better longer term solution (which, now the club have set a precedent by talking to possible buyers, is bound to happen)?

I suppose i can understand them really, though, benefit of hindsight and what not. He's mainly a motivator, to be honest, I reckon the only similar (availabalish) manager in the Prem who works on those lines is Allardyce. I'd love to see him get the Toon job, I reckon he'd be made for the job, and he'd get results.

Fair enough. You might want to consider avoiding threads entitled "Martin O'Neill" then. ;-)

Possibly, but I don't think so. Like Ferguson and all the best managers, O'Neill has a knack of keeping players on their toes. The challenge for any manager is sustaining the players' interest after the initial novelty has worn off, and keeping their motivation on a high. O'Neill gets under the players' skin and keeps them going. And when Fergie finally retires,MON won't be seen for dust as he hotfoots it to the Theatre of "cheese sandwich" Dreams-thats why he wouldn't sign Lerners offer of a long term deal. His contract is a total red herring. He had a one year rolling contract at Celtic as well. FWIW i don't think he'll ever be Man United manager, that doesn't strike me as the sort of organisation that would be prepared to give MON the total control he obviously demands in his jobs (and is probably the same reason he didn't wind up at Newcastle). I also strongly suspect United will appoint either from within or a previous player. The one job I might worry about MON leaving for is the England one. Any anyway, we're enjoying having him far too much right now to give even a second though to the possibility of him leaving at some point. He signed a 3 year contract when he joined Celtic. And then switched to a rolling contract. He signed the rolling contract when given the job by Ellis. He has since said, when asked about it, numerous times that he'd be happy to sign a longer contract now Lerner is in charge. At the end of the day, if a club wants rid of a manager, or a manager wants out, contracts matter zilch.

Possibly, but I don't think so. Like Ferguson and all the best managers, O'Neill has a knack of keeping players on their toes. The challenge for any manager is sustaining the players' interest after the initial novelty has worn off, and keeping their motivation on a high. O'Neill gets under the players' skin and keeps them going. And when Fergie finally retires,MON won't be seen for dust as he hotfoots it to the Theatre of "cheese sandwich" Dreams-thats why he wouldn't sign Lerners offer of a long term deal. His contract is a total red herring. He had a one year rolling contract at Celtic as well. FWIW i don't think he'll ever be Man United manager, that doesn't strike me as the sort of organisation that would be prepared to give MON the total control he obviously demands in his jobs (and is probably the same reason he didn't wind up at Newcastle). I also strongly suspect United will appoint either from within or a previous player. The one job I might worry about MON leaving for is the England one. Any anyway, we're enjoying having him far too much right now to give even a second though to the possibility of him leaving at some point.

I've thought for a while you've got the best keeper in the League, and after watching that today, I now know you have. He was absolutely fucking awesome.

3 million? You're having a laugh. He is English and an international, they'll demand at least 10 million for him. Not that he's worth it. His international record looks impressive at first glance, until you see who he scored his goals against. His Liverpool record is average at best, and anyone who pays that sort of money for him is mad. At our place there is a "we should never have sold him" faction, he will always be one of those players who divides opinion, but in mine, he's nowt special.

Surely not Boro! Frankly, we're lucky we're not in the Championship this season after last year's badness. The last 5 years have been entirely forgettable.

Vastly superior points tally? 15 more? Hmmm. And i did point out in the original post that you had one season less than us to base your results on. Although by the looks of it, we'll make up those 15 pts by the end of this season ;-) (I'm joking, don't bite) The point i was making was not that one is better than the other, it was that we're effectively two clubs in the same second level of clubs, with similar expectations, and with similar failure to reach them. Spurs are there, too, as are Everton. And now, given the massive gap between the top and the second level of clubs, I don't think that is ever going to change, sadly. In fact, if it does change, i think the only way it will be is if Liverpool drop out of it.

lol, u say 5/9... we say 4/5 or 9/14 Aren't statistics great? ;-)

He would have, as well. You should have seen how dreadfully shit we were last season to fully appreciate what he has done. The only other "touchable" (ie not Wenger, Ferguson, Mourinho or Benitez) manager with that kind of motivational ability is Sam Allardyce, I reckon. He'd be my choice as Toon boss.

As often quoted here, we've finished above Newcastle 5 out of the last 9 seasons, and that's without spending any real money and with the worst chairman in the world. Since the Prem started you are the 5th best team, we are the 6th (yes, I know you had one season less there, but there's still not a very big gap). As far as European football goes, as someone pointed out in this very thread, not only are we used to it, we've actually won something there too, although you have had more of it recently, of course. Just to illustrate this point, here are the records for the last 10 years. 2006 - NU 7th AV 16th newcastle highest 2005 - NU 14th AV 10th villa highest 2004 - NU 6th AV 7th newcastle highest 2003 - NU 3rd AV 16th newcastle highest 2002 - NU 4th AV 8th newcastle highest 2001 - NU 11th AV 8th villa highest 2000 - NU 11th AV 6th villa highest 1999 - NU 13th AV 6th villa highest 1998 - NU 13th AV 7th villa highest 1997 - NU 2nd AV 5th newcastle highest 5 times you finished higher, 5 times we did. I'd say that's a pretty evenly balanced record of mediocrity on both sides, don't make out comparing you to Villa is like comparing you to Boro, it is a totally different comparison. Difference is, when we've been higher, we've been a lot higher. When you've been higher, more often than not we've both been mid-table. That's fair comment, although still debatable. I can see one occasion when you were higher and we were both in the top 5 and two where we were top 6 (ie European place) and you were mid table. As stated, the premiership stats show you as the 5th and us as the 6th most successful clubs in that time. The total number of places difference between you and us in season whcih you finished higher is 32, the other way around it is 25. Better in your favour, but not hugely. Plus, we've finished as high as you ever have in the Prem (ie 2nd) and we've won two league cups in that time, too, whereas Newcastle haven't won anything (although to be fair, how you managed to avoid silverware in your best spell is beyond me, and imho extremely unlucky) The point I'm trying to make is that expectations at both clubs are not massively dissimilar and both clubs have been largely mediocre and underperformed for too long. To read some of the comments above, you'd think you were comparing Newcastle with Portsmouth or something.

As often quoted here, we've finished above Newcastle 5 out of the last 9 seasons, and that's without spending any real money and with the worst chairman in the world. Since the Prem started you are the 5th best team, we are the 6th (yes, I know you had one season less there, but there's still not a very big gap). As far as European football goes, as someone pointed out in this very thread, not only are we used to it, we've actually won something there too, although you have had more of it recently, of course. Just to illustrate this point, here are the records for the last 10 years. 2006 - NU 7th AV 16th newcastle highest 2005 - NU 14th AV 10th villa highest 2004 - NU 6th AV 7th newcastle highest 2003 - NU 3rd AV 16th newcastle highest 2002 - NU 4th AV 8th newcastle highest 2001 - NU 11th AV 8th villa highest 2000 - NU 11th AV 6th villa highest 1999 - NU 13th AV 6th villa highest 1998 - NU 13th AV 7th villa highest 1997 - NU 2nd AV 5th newcastle highest 5 times you finished higher, 5 times we did. I'd say that's a pretty evenly balanced record of mediocrity on both sides, don't make out comparing you to Villa is like comparing you to Boro, it is a totally different comparison.

No it doesn't. He is on a one year rolling contract, which is the way he has always operated.

I don't want to sound aggressive, but what arrogant nonsense. You think expectations at a club like Villa are any lower than they are at Newcastle? There's a second tranche of clubs in England with similar expectation levels, and that includes both Villa and Newcastle.

the villa fans i know, have high ambitions just like us, i know quite a lot of villa fans and i don't know any who would be happy with 12th tbh they all want to be playing in europe etc like us, but tbf they've done something in europe we've done f**k all i don't blame him what so ever for going to villa, i mean the newcastle job is almost as hard as the england job, and if i was a nuetral manager i would have probably gone to villa with everything they having going for them at the moment, We wouldn't be happy with 12th normally, but given the fact that MON was appointed less than 2 weeks before the start of the season, had no money to spend as the takeover didnt go through in time, and had to work with what we *thought* was a shit squad under O'Leary, we'd have taken a top half finish for this season. For what its worth, I think a lot of the reasons MON came to us is that he is a Midlands football man. He won the European Cup twice with Forest then shortly after we won the league and the European Cup. This was a time when Midlands football was on a high. He knows about our history, he knows we've only won worthless cack like League Cups since then, he knows we've got higher expectations than that. One thing we could see straight away was that he understood the club, understood the frustrations of the fans, and understood what we were looking for. I also think the argument that he wouldnt want to work for FS has a certain amount of truth. He took the Villa job when Ellis was still in charge, but everyone knew Lerner's takeover was on the way. There were three other consortia in the running at the time, and they'd all said that whatever happened, they supported the appointment of MON. Interesting that before he was appointed, MON actually met several times with Lerner. He knew what sort of regime was coming to the club, what sort of money would be involved, and that the board would devolve everything on the football side to him. Could you ever see FS being happy with that? He's an astute judge of character, O'Neill, and he seems to have judged this board right. They've made all the right noises, simple stuff like open training sessions at VP, free travel to Chelsea, recognising the EC winning side around Villa Park rather than pretending it never happened like Ellis did. We even get board members posting on the three main Villa message boards. That's how quickly the atmosphere around the club has changed, and goes a long way towards explaining why MON took the job.

I noticed that, too. I think that mentally, Milner IS still at Villa (I'm messing about, not taking the piss) (although, I've possibly got a point)