fredbob

There is a flipside to all this, of course its a generous offer in our eyes but can anyone think of a time where a player has signed a reduced-pay contract extension?

 

In a game where people get salary increases for turning down advances from rival clubs and salary increases for international call ups i dont think this offer will sit well with Owen, i can see this being rejected to be honest.

 

Then again, how many players have been given a £100+k contract at 25, and then still offered £90k aged 29?

 

Will Owen see it that way though? Do you think he'll consider himself lucky to get that offer in what he (and others) will consider the peak of his career?

 

To be fair to Owen he's a world class striker and not a player you can honestly ategorically doesnt warrant a £100k wage in the first place, it'd be a massive thing for him to be takng a pay cut whilst players like Lampard and Terry are getting a pay rise AND longer contracts offers at older ages. How do you think that will bode for him?

 

People get salary increases because other clubs will pay them that amount, Owen started on a wage far more then anyone else were willing to or even could pay.  He's a world class striker IMO that would be worth £100,000 a week if he wasn't injury prone he's not stupid so he'll realise that has to be taken into account.  Remember, we're not just talking anout £90,000 a week, more then anyone else will pay IMO, we're talking about a 4 year contract which means he'll still be on £90,000 when he's 33.  For a player with such major injury problems that's an incredible deal.  If he doesn't see it that way then I hope we don't offer him a penny more.

I think theres a of a prestige issue here more than a monetary one. Lampard is a prime example of that. The injury record is a moot point ot be honest Mark Viduka being a prime example of that as well.

There is a flipside to all this, of course its a generous offer in our eyes but can anyone think of a time where a player has signed a reduced-pay contract extension?

 

In a game where people get salary increases for turning down advances from rival clubs and salary increases for international call ups i dont think this offer will sit well with Owen, i can see this being rejected to be honest.

 

That normally happens because the other clubs are willing to pay those higher salaries though, this is a unique issue due to his age and the monstrous amount of money we're supposedly paying him already.

Can you envisage a situation where Owen will be on the free transfer list with no teams going near him becaseu of his wage? How often does the oppurtunity to sign a 1 in 2 striker come about?

In todays game £100k isnt a unique thing, even Sol Campbell is on £90k...

There is a flipside to all this, of course its a generous offer in our eyes but can anyone think of a time where a player has signed a reduced-pay contract extension?

 

In a game where people get salary increases for turning down advances from rival clubs and salary increases for international call ups i dont think this offer will sit well with Owen, i can see this being rejected to be honest.

 

Then again, how many players have been given a £100+k contract at 25, and then still offered £90k aged 29?

Will Owen see it that way though? Do you think he'll consider himself lucky to get that offer in what he (and others) will consider the peak of his career?

To be fair to Owen he's a world class striker and not a player you can honestly ategorically doesnt warrant a £100k wage in the first place, it'd be a massive thing for him to be takng a pay cut whilst players like Lampard and Terry are getting a pay rise AND longer contracts offers at older ages. How do you think that will bode for him?

There is a flipside to all this, of course its a generous offer in our eyes but can anyone think of a time where a player has signed a reduced-pay contract extension?

In a game where people get salary increases for turning down advances from rival clubs and salary increases for international call ups i dont think this offer will sit well with Owen, i can see this being rejected to be honest.

I cant for the life of me see any benefit in selling him full stop. He's shown glimpses - more often than not, and is still young, he's not an overly expensive aquisition and definitely isnt a flop, if he was 27-28 id still keep him as a back up but the fact that he has time on his side is a big plus point fo me.

i hope this offer has a deadline. if he hasnt signed by a certain date (ie. soon) then we should retract the contract. im one of owen's biggest fans but if he's going to be stringing us along waiting for other offers for the next 6 months to then leave on a free and leave us with no replacement then i'd rather we cut our losses, let him leave on a free and started looking for a summer replacement asap.

 

if he signs it by the end of the year then i'll be delighted of course.

 

Agree with that. If he's not going to sign this or something very similar we should accept it and put all our resources (and the money) into finding someone else for the next few years. They probably wouldn't be as good but at least they'll be here.

I'd be very very surprised if he signs before January. He, like any person has to consider whats best for him and not whats best for the club so if that means gauging yours options come January, then so be it.

To be fair, with the situation how it is, i wouldnt be surprised if the club are already scouting for replacements, im sure they'll not allow themselves to get into a position where they're totally unprepared for an Owen rejection.

Doubt they'd allow him to leave to a rival club, also cant really envisage a drastic change in form at any club in the prem for him.

From The Times' Top 50 British footballers of 2008.....they've gotta be joking!!

 

32. Steven Taylor

 

The defender is that rare thing, something for Newcastle fans to be optimistic about. The England under-21s mainstay, now 22, has been a lynchpin at the back even as all tumbles around him.

 

Should really go in the 'We hate Newcastle United' thread.

 

 

take your head out of the sand and change "trophy" to "great" and it would be a major step forward for you and many others.

 

I'm not surprised in the slightest that MICK can't find it in himself to admit that Shepherd has trumped soopa mike in the ambition stakes.

 

 

 

     

 

and with the expected lack of a constructive reply, I'll go and get some shuteye now.

 

Quite amazing that some people blame me for these sort of threads when I get a response like that   

 

Thank f**k.

Needs to sleep off all that shandy.

I'll happily put my neck on the line and say he was a trophy signing. Im from the school of building a good team then dotting it with stars, not vica versa, like Keegan and SBR.

 

Now that we seem to have a good team i think its a smarter move to sign him up, might as well.

 

take your head out of the sand and change "trophy" to "great" and it would be a major step forward for you and many others.

 

I'm not surprised in the slightest that MICK can't find it in himself to admit that Shepherd has trumped soopa mike in the ambition stakes.

 

 

Too easy sometimes. Back from the pub i take it?

I'll happily put my neck on the line and say he was a trophy signing. Im from the school of building a good team then dotting it with stars, not vica versa, like Keegan and SBR.

Now that we seem to have a good team i think its a smarter move to sign him up, might as well.

This could be a big week for newcsatle, I for one will be estatic if the game gets our 2 formers managers back.

God bless Brittania.

 

The other speaker was Peter Lee - he of the 'fans bid'. Basically, there was a lot he said he couldn't say due to disclosures etc. He says that the 300,000 NUFC fans sticking in a grand each isn't neccesarily the case. According to him, there are 'substantial funds' already in place to buy the club and for transfers. Some of those involved are NUFC fans, but some aren't. The group includes business people, football fans, football/sports experts and celebrities, all of whom want to be a part of making NUFC a club for the fans and the wider community with strong fan representation. According to him, they would hope to fully take over the club by the end of the season, with a partial takeover taking place sooner. He also says that something major is going to happen this week that will make 'world headlines' and be 'bigger than Keegan'. (we've heard stuff like this before haven't we?)

 

 

Anything more been said about this?

 

Absolutely nothing. That was pretty much the last we (NUSC) heard from Peter Lee. In fact I think that was the last anyone heard from him.

 

Just a quick comment regarding the e-mails some of you may have got. Basically we sent that out to help us gague people's feelings. So thank you for responding, and please let us know your reasons, whether they're good or bad. We'll be looking at people's reasons and that will help us to maybe address/justify issues people may have.

 

We've also been discussing a few things aside from the Ashley issue - more on the social side of things, because contrary to what some people think (and to be fair its an issue that has dominated us so far) we're not solely an anti-Ashley movement, or an anti-Southern movement etc (as my mother and grandparents are from London the latter would be a bit hypocritical of me if that was the case).

 

As for the 'Christmas Carol' poem and the countdown. They both highlight something serious.

 

Basically that the January transfer window is rapidly closing, and that we need to both make new signings to bolster the squad and also make sure that we keep a hold of our better players. We're in a relegation battle and our season could hinge on what happens during the next month.

You'd of been better off just writing that, things like those poems and clock just highlight a real immaturity regarding the issue. I persoanlly believe you;ve shot yourself in the foot regarding the way you;ve gone about things. This latest statement is how it should of been done in the first place, and with it coming after the 2 earliers less professionall statements you've undermined any credibilty you had as an organisation.

Combine the diplomatic public statement with poems and clock, you;re sending ridiculously contradictory and unprofessional messages.

Has your group done anything publically which promotes the unique status that nufc has amongst the people of newcastle? Maybe trying to attack the bias anti nufc media and stereotype attached to nufc and its fans may be more beneficial for the club and may help galvanise things within your organisation with all fans of differeing views....

Man City or Liverpool will be our only competition in the Prem, still think theres a very good chance of him signing for us.

mascherano is a bit of a monster iyam, very strong, imposing and a non stop runner.

 

at this stage of development, i see guthrie as more of a scholes (without the goals) or emre type, lots of short and first time passes, darting around markers, nice touches and turns and so on, but im not sure he'll develop further in that direction. i dont think you can pin him down to one role or another, if he finds a niche he will do so naturally a couple of years down the line rather than have it imposed on him now.

Just goes to show how subjective football actually is, we both see completely different types of players in the same person. 

I don't really think Guthrie has the physicality to be a defensive midfielder. He's a player who can sit back, but he can't really tackle or get players off the ball.

Really? I've watched him knock a fair few players off the ball, I also cant remeber seeing the likes of Maschereano and Carrick being overly physical in their game. Keep an eye on the number of times you see him in defensive positions shaking players of the ball, its more than you relaise.

The difference between attacking and defensive midfielder is that i believe DM can be coached into players. The likes of Speed and Viera never started their careers as DM but both learned how to play the holding role with great effect. Attacking midfielders need to be able to pick a pass and shoot consistently, something i don't believe can be coached, or at least not as easily.

 

Guthrie has alot of the core attributes for a DM; good ball retention, disciplined movement and despite not being a hollywood tackler, he knows how to work the space and retain the ball. Like i have always said, senior players should be given the responsibilty to teach younsters like guthrie.

Spot on, attacking play is so much more celrebral and intuitive, its all about interpretation of movement from other players and making a decision within seconds. I think you either have it or you dont, contrast that with defensive work and stuff like closing down players, finding good positions and hustling -players for posession is all replicable in a training scenario. You cant replaicates instances like a through ball in a training scenario.

Id really like to see Guthrie as a DM, i think he could be a star player for us. 

as for defensive weaknesses - where do you start? Off the ball he is poor, his reading of the game is nothing special, his tackling is shit, and he is lightweight so lacks the ability to physically challenge others. most importantly for me he also lacks an engine - you wont see him boss a game and pop up everywhere winning the ball. not that important if he is paired with a physically imposing midfield destroyer but we don't have one atm.

Probably the exact oppoisite of what i saw, i actually thought that he had all of what you say he didnt, excet for a big tackle in him, i see him as an excellent option for dedicated holding midfielder.

Irish connection there as well! Im sure he's been on our radar before and will be again with Kinnear at the helm. Wouldnt mind signing him for competition on both wings.

As for Guthrie, fuk me he's done well.

 

Called it wrong like many people, but he's stepped up his game since arriving, no one can deny that or judge it was going to happen.

The thing thats gets me so optimistic about Guthrie is that hes such a simple player yet effective player, he doesnt have anything complicated or difficult in his game which means he'll rarely suffer from poor form.

That sort of journalism isnt fit for the daily sport.

But could Michael Owen — whose wife, Louise, was spotted in tears on the day he joined Newcastle — ever bring himself to sign for Wigan?

What a cunt Taylor actually is.

People want to complain about the squad being thin but dont want to acknowledge that the first team has been the best in 4 years. Personally in terms of priority, id rather the first team was sorted before we squad built.

 

Either way one thing categorically isnt more imporant than the other so the wiegting in cirticsim should be equal.

 

We're 1 or 2 players away from being a top 6 first team but a little bit more from being a top 6 squad. When was the last time we could say that? where does the credit go for this?

 

 

We're not though as we don't have a manager competent enough to achieve this.

 

That doesnt change the fact that its a first team capable of finishing in the top 6. I dont think we have the squad to fininsh in the top6 but we definitely have the first team.

 

But it's a squad game we play in now. Or so we get told often enough.

 

How much investement is required to build a squad that is capable of going from 12th to 6th? And is that a reasonable expectation from the fans?

 

To jump from that position? I don't know many that expected top 6. I know people like myself who thought it was attainable as we had the right manager, but only if he was given the right backing by the board. And there's more to backing a manager than just throwing money at him btw.

 

I dont understand either the squad is or isnt good enough to get into the top6? I dont understan how people can use the strength of the squad as a criticsm agaisnt theboard yet openely acknowledge that its good enough to break the top 6. (the person in charge is completely irrelavnt as a gauge as to how good the squad is)

 

Either the squad is poor and incapable of getting a good position which counts agaisnt the board, or its good and is capable of doing well and so should count for the board.

 

It's quite simply really, the squad wasn't good enough last season, but Keegan proved he could actually get them playing. Unlike his predecessor.

So your saying the quality of the squad is good enough for top 6 with a competent manager but not good enough for a top 6 finihs with a poor manager?

People want to complain about the squad being thin but dont want to acknowledge that the first team has been the best in 4 years. Personally in terms of priority, id rather the first team was sorted before we squad built.

 

Either way one thing categorically isnt more imporant than the other so the wiegting in cirticsim should be equal.

 

We're 1 or 2 players away from being a top 6 first team but a little bit more from being a top 6 squad. When was the last time we could say that? where does the credit go for this?

 

 

We're not though as we don't have a manager competent enough to achieve this.

 

That doesnt change the fact that its a first team capable of finishing in the top 6. I dont think we have the squad to fininsh in the top6 but we definitely have the first team.

 

But it's a squad game we play in now. Or so we get told often enough.

 

How much investement is required to build a squad that is capable of going from 12th to 6th? And is that a reasonable expectation from the fans?

 

To jump from that position? I don't know many that expected top 6. I know people like myself who thought it was attainable as we had the right manager, but only if he was given the right backing by the board. And there's more to backing a manager than just throwing money at him btw.

I dont understand either the squad is or isnt good enough to get into the top6? I dont understan how people can use the strength of the squad as a criticsm agaisnt theboard yet openely acknowledge that its good enough to break the top 6. (the person in charge is completely irrelavnt as a gauge as to how good the squad is)

Either the squad is poor and incapable of getting a good position which counts agaisnt the board, or its good and is capable of doing well and so should count for the board.

People want to complain about the squad being thin but dont want to acknowledge that the first team has been the best in 4 years. Personally in terms of priority, id rather the first team was sorted before we squad built.

 

Either way one thing categorically isnt more imporant than the other so the wiegting in cirticsim should be equal.

 

We're 1 or 2 players away from being a top 6 first team but a little bit more from being a top 6 squad. When was the last time we could say that? where does the credit go for this?

 

 

We're not though as we don't have a manager competent enough to achieve this.

 

That doesnt change the fact that its a first team capable of finishing in the top 6. I dont think we have the squad to fininsh in the top6 but we definitely have the first team.

 

But it's a squad game we play in now. Or so we get told often enough.

How much investement is required to build a squad that is capable of going from 12th to 6th? And is that a reasonable expectation from the fans?