Stottie

U21 final about to start. You can watch it online on UEFA tv. https://www.uefa.tv/match/live/243053/2036152

I'll agree with that. The main stat we don't do well on, i.e., not in the top 6, isn't chance creation but possession. All the goals and chances we created last year, pretty much Top 3, were with 52% possession. fwiw, in 21-22, we averaged 40% possession under Bruce and Howe combined. A 12% improvement in one year may be a new record. It might be worth tweeting someone at Opta. The flip applies too, so we conceded the equal lowest number of goals, but from our opponents taking 48% of the passes. Man City's opponents scored the same number of goals, joint fewest, but from only 36% of the ball. If we control the ball a bit better and take a few more chances, we should be confident of emulating last season or going better. 14 draws means lotsa points were left out there. 14 draws into 6 wins, 4 draws and 4 defeats would give us 8 more points.

Just because this thread needs more stats. 100 games' worth for both players, for teams of a similar level. Barnes is a full year younger than Bowen.

Fun with stats says he's got three goals and three assists in just 661 minutes as a sub. Small sample, but very impressive, almost cheat code level. He's also scored 9 of his 35 league goals with his weaker (left) foot, off 9 xG. Hitting xG off your weaker foot is pretty good. The highlight reel has him going down the outside and scoring with his left. https://understat.com/player/6681 Just for the "is a CL player?" issue, aren't his stats better than Trossard's?

Yes, my impression is it would be this year's Nick Pope. Not flashy, and yes, coming from a relegated club, but a no-risk effective player for a low price and low wages. An upgrade on Murphy (who I do like) for certain. Isak should be playing a lot next year, so that should satisfy anyone's need for flair.

Yeah, if you think folk are being judgemental about his "with my babies" photo, you ain't seen nothing yet!

With Maxi, you have to remember he had two seasons bailing out a clueless c*nt of a manager playing "hit it to Maxi" ball. That's a lot to unlearn. I said it on another thread but the main issue is his xG, basically him not getting into goalscoring positions. Thanks to the wonders of stats, we can rank him against other players in the team for expected goals per shot. He is easily the worst of all our attacking players. He's shooting on average from positions where a statistically average player will score only 1 in 16. Even Bruno, who shoots from farther out, is 1 is 10. Under Howe in 22/23, Maxi's chance creation for others was top notch and he's young enough to suggest there still could be a player in there, though maybe not as a first choice in a "intensity is our identity" setup. For us to carry him with his limited defensive contribution, he's going have to start scoring more. Miggy did it as a player who's older, so I wouldn't completely rule it out just yet. The financial stuff is beyond me, but if it makes sense to sell him, so be it. I think of all of our players as replaceable, especially now with the recruitment team we have. Clinging to what we have in already is Ashley-era thinking that we don't need to do any more.

There'll be quite a few bubbling under that top 6 too, Maguire, Sancho, Nunez, VVD etc. Assuming Nunez isn't top 6.

Our squad is a prime example, but it's not just the quality of the wide player but the actual type as well. Joelinton and Miggy are both wide forwards who create little, especially Miggy. Look at their goals vs. assists. The obvious tactic then is to not play them together. Either Joelinton left and Murphy (get to the byline crosser) right or ASM (creator extraordinaire) left and Miggy right. Gordon is an option too of course. The aim is to get both creation and goal threat from the flanks. One thing with ASM is how low his xG is. He shoots, but only from poor positions. Maybe its on the player, but he does not get into good goalscoring positions. It would be a sign of player and team improvement to see ASM score a tap in.

Ideally the Saudis would buy one of the cheaper Liverpool players to shut up their "oh we're so pure" fans, and then buy one of ours for Ruben Neves money. It won't be just yet, but my lingering dread is that the Saudis pay massively for Salah just as he stops producing and Liverpool are happy to offload.

That's Salah, Saka, Martinelli, Rashford level. Big big money. Barnes is a fine player but that's too high a target. Even Mitoma was only something like 7 goals 7 assists, and not guaranteed. We kept him very very quiet at SJP. Miggy doesn't create, he just combines with Trippier or Bruno (who create) or finishes. He won't be up for it, but if our system is "forward at RW", we could try Isak there. Maybe a fun thing to try in preseason. His second against Spurs was a right forward's goal.

Kev from Statsbomb wrote an article saying Almiron was posing a much larger goal threat just before the hot streak started. So Howe definitely changed things up with him. Almiron scored something like four from outside the box, so I would agree that is unlikely. However, for me, the slate is clear for all of the Cabbagehead era. I wouldn't judge any player based on that. It sounds like they were barely training.

Everton are now relegation fodder so its hard to achieve much there. He's got 5 in 12 for England U21 and is starting again today in 40 minutes time.

Cheers! One was Miggy's goal as a sub that had to be added in after. Transfermarkt didn't have it down as "RW". The tl:dr and anti-stats version is that I think our widemen (and the team in general) are better than they are given credit for.

Murphy scored at a similar rate when playing right wing. One was the freaky Spurs shot, but the other two were tap ins. We led the league in hitting the woodwork, so that has to be weighed against any "our lads can't score all them again!" type theory. We also have to be wary of lingering Cabbageheed era views of our players. We are now seeing coached versions of them, not flukey hot streak versions, like Willock when he was on loan. Miggy was immense vs. Brighton at the end of the season, he didn't score, but was all over them. It certainly quashed any doubts I had about him. Offtopic, but here's ASM vs. Joelinton as left wingers. One a super creative winger and the other an above-average wide forward who's also a (not shown here) super ball-winner/destroyer. Not a bad pair to have. It opens up lots of tactical options.

The cricket's was a bit dull at the end of the Aussie innings, so I listed this up from transfermarkt. Our production from LW and RW in the PL in 22/23. Does not include players switching positions or Willock going down left wing from midfield etc. LW Maxi P24 G1 A5 1103 mins Joelinton P11 G4 A1 990 mins Murphy P6 G1 A1 336 mins Isak P5 G0 A1 376 mins Fraser P4 G0 A0 230 mins Gordon P3 G0 A0 163 mins Anderson P1 G0 A0 20 mins Total G6 A8 3218 min RW Miggy P30 G11 A2 2429 mins (wolves sub added) Murphy P18 G3 A1 731 mins Anderson P1 G0 A0 78 mins Gordon P1 G0 A0 26 mins Fraser P1 G0 A0 9 mins Total G13 A3 3273 mins (Gordon is down as an "AM" for when he scored) RW should also include heavy crossing from Trippier but its too complicated to work out with free stats. Couldn't be bothered to look up Ritchie for his few minutes. Anyway, I don't think the above totals are that bad. They're not Saka/Martinelli level for sure, but we are where we are in the journey. Right should be around one goal or assist in two games when Trippier is added in. Our best mid, Bruno, also plays hangs out a lot on the right side. Left produced what it produced with limited support from LB. A paid stats account could probably work out xG and xGa from the different sides. There were some notable misses off Maxi setups. Whoscored has us attacking 39% down the right, 26% up the middle, and 35% up the left. Left just edged right 15% vs. 13% with shots.

The nerdy Athletic Tactics podcast that has Michael Cox on said back in Feb that Willock would be perfect as the new Gini in Liverpool's midfield. He was the first name they mentioned. +1 to the opinion that he's better shooting, maybe just more hit-the-target shooting like Isak, from being elite.

Thanks for the reply. Leicester have provided some great entertainment in recent seasons and I wish you well. It was ultimately deserved but I'm still surprised you were relegated. That has to be one of the strongest squads to go down.

Great summary. I doubt anyone foresaw relegation, but it was clear in summer 22 that Leicester were only going backwards, with Schmiechel (sp?) going and not being replaced and no money for signings at all. Fair play to Maddison and his people for being the first to try and jump ship, regardless of how serious they were in inviting us to bid. fwiw, I reckon a Maddison for cash and Dubravak deal in summer 22 would have kept them up. A season of decent goalkeeping would have done more for them than Maddison's (very good) contribution. As its worked out, Tielemans, Rodgers and now Maddison have got out with their reputations mostly intact. It's a waste though and a team with Leicester's squad shouldn't have been relegated. The Champo is not a pushover and there is no guarantee they'll come back up. There's a good chance some of their players won't have relegation contracts and will remain on Prem wages. Isak, Tonali and Gordon even prove we can go big for players we want badly enough. It just can't have been the case here.

No, I meant the people panicking on Twitter because we didn't sign Madisson or Szobo. I bet many of them are forgetting about Gordon.

I wonder what percentage of them have written Anthony Gordon off already?

A three of Szobo, Mac Allister and Trent sounds like them conceding 47 goals again. I'll start worrying when they get a ball-playing DM (Caicedo etc). And a right back.

Quoted to highlight Murphy being above Almiron, who doesn't cross the ball and will not register expected assists. I'm a bit surprised Isak isn't higher, and suspect his numbers must have dropped off as he was played wide. The numbers were higher earlier in the season. First question with Zaha is "does he press?" because if he doesn't, that's less output than ASM for another passenger.

Quite a lot to process here. Maddison's great, and not joining us won't change that. I suspect we wanted him based on our 21-22 view of what we had and where we wanted to be and now aren't that fussed based on our updated 22-23 view of what we have and where we want to be. Well, not fussed enough to pay what must be higher wages than when we bid on him. I can't see us bidding on a playing wanting 175k in summer 22. He must have signalled he would take much less a year ago. I reckon Eddie etc's updated views on midfield based on 22-23 are why we've gone for Tonali, which no-one saw coming. No one was saying "get another box to box mid". Even the "upgrade Longstaff" people wanted a conventional DM, which Tonali clearly isn't. Maddison is widely seen as a low-block door opener, but perhaps we don't need one. In our final vs. low block game, ironically Leicester home, we created chances galore and hit the woodwork three times. All that game suggested was that we needed more luck and better finishing. We finished the season creating way more chances than the earlier mega-vexing draws vs. Bournemouth, Palace etc. I feel we have far more guile now. If we do need a ten, Isak can clearly do it, and probably Miggy too. Miggy is a funny one because he's a goal threat but never hits the line and creates for others. Far more crosses went in when Murphy was playing there. Miggy's pressing is incessant, so there is a mad bastard pressing #10 in there, every center half's nightmare.

For lovers of symmetry.