Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Seriously this lark has to stop it is limiting our options all over the place. Sam's safety first I only want to see away to the big 4 and never in other games. The mf three should be a holding DM, an allround midfielder with good passing skills and license to move up and an attaking midfielder who should generate tempo and attack the box with late runs. ....and who be they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Roeder was slaughtered for it tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridman Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I also think Allardyce should enforce a rule, whoever passes the ball to Butt will be fined for 2 weeks of wages. Problem solved? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Thought someone was going to cook up some half arsed defence for it by mentioning Gattuso and Pirlo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Who else do you suggest he plays until Barton and Emre are back? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 N'Zogbia Butt Geremi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 All this being unbeaten and in the top 6 is getting too much for me as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keefaz Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Thought someone was going to cook up some half arsed defence for it by mentioning Gattuso and Pirlo. I did, but then deleted it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 ..............Owen Milner...................Martins ....Zoggy Butt Geremi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Who else do you suggest he plays until Barton and Emre are back? .................Geremi............. .......Smith..............Zoggy.... For now. Later replace Smith with Barton. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonDevil Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 ..............Owen Milner...................Martins ....Zoggy Butt Geremi Yup. Smith has got to be dropped. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Play N'Zogbia in a position he's very poor in and which neutralizes his game? Good thinking Batman. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Play N'Zogbia in a position he's very poor in and which neutralizes his game? Good thinking Batman. You clearly haven't the first clue how a 433 works... Shades of Arteta plays in the middle? :giggle: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Play N'Zogbia in a position he's very poor in and which neutralizes his game? Good thinking Batman. You clearly haven't the first clue how a 433 works... Shades of Arteta plays in the middle? :giggle: Don't fucking patronise me Enid Blyton. The three in the middle are central players. Or is Frank Lampard a winger now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmymag Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 1-0 to the Geordie Boys.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Play N'Zogbia in a position he's very poor in and which neutralizes his game? Good thinking Batman. You clearly haven't the first clue how a 433 works... Shades of Arteta plays in the middle? :giggle: Don't fucking patronise me Enid Blyton. The three in the middle are central players. Or is Frank Lampard a winger now? The center left sided midfielder in a 433 interchanges with the left forward (who cycles like a Diouf) pretty much ( although diff variation) as Zoggy did with Milner yesterday. If you are suggesting we play Zoggy as a winger then it isn't 433 then is it? If on the other hand you want him on the left of a forward 3 that is a different debate to do with forwards and not midfielders. Try not to be so disparaging in future and I will give you the same respect. Which is it? Afterthought: I and I suspect like you would rather we play a 442 with Zoggy and Duff etc as proper wingers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Play N'Zogbia in a position he's very poor in and which neutralizes his game? Good thinking Batman. You clearly haven't the first clue how a 433 works... Shades of Arteta plays in the middle? :giggle: Don't fucking patronise me Enid Blyton. The three in the middle are central players. Or is Frank Lampard a winger now? The center left sided midfielder in a 433 interchanges with the left forward (who cycles like a Diouf) pretty much ( although diff variation) as Zoggy did with Milner yesterday. If you are suggesting we play Zoggy as a winger then it isn't 433 then is it? If on the other hand you want him on the left of a forward 3 that is a different debate to do with forwards and not midfielders. Try not to be so disparaging in future and I will give you the same respect. Which is it? He can play on the 'wing' as one of the front 3, he's not cut out for central midfield, not to mention that he neutralizes what he's best at which is beating his full back with pace. There's a reason Mourinho never used/uses Duff, SWP, Robben in one of the central 3 whether they "interchange" or not - why have I never seen Frank Lampard or Michael Ballack charging down the wing towards the full back btw? Maybe Jose doesn't have the first clue how a 4-3-3 works eh? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Afterthought: I and I suspect like you would rather we play a 442 with Zoggy and Duff etc as proper wingers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Play N'Zogbia in a position he's very poor in and which neutralizes his game? Good thinking Batman. You clearly haven't the first clue how a 433 works... Shades of Arteta plays in the middle? :giggle: Don't fucking patronise me Enid Blyton. The three in the middle are central players. Or is Frank Lampard a winger now? The center left sided midfielder in a 433 interchanges with the left forward (who cycles like a Diouf) pretty much ( although diff variation) as Zoggy did with Milner yesterday. If you are suggesting we play Zoggy as a winger then it isn't 433 then is it? If on the other hand you want him on the left of a forward 3 that is a different debate to do with forwards and not midfielders. Try not to be so disparaging in future and I will give you the same respect. Which is it? He can play on the 'wing' as one of the front 3, he's not cut out for central midfield, not to mention that he neutralizes what he's best at which is beating his full back with pace. There's a reason Mourinho never used/uses Duff, SWP, Robben in one of the central 3 whether they "interchange" or not - why have I never seen Frank Lampard or Michael Ballack charging down the wing towards the full back btw? Maybe Jose doesn't have the first clue how a 4-3-3 works eh? They don't really play a proper 433 anymore mainly due to Mourinho's hankering for extra cover in the shape of Makelele. EDIT: And Essien and Mikel tend to hold the middle...It's overkill really and typical hyperdefensive approach of Mourinho. It's more of a 451 with Cole doing the overlap. Fact is stranger than fiction in the sense that Allardyce's ideas at Bolton and what he probably will try and put into practice for us is more exotic and intersting than the stodge Mourinho dishes up. I'm only bitching about the need for 2 DM's. Interchanging is the heart of a 433 giving options in the second phase ie if Milner/Duff cuts in then Zoggy goes wide and visa versa. Zoggy and later Barton shouldn't feel trapped in the middle...I know it looks like that on paper. Quiroz and Fergie used to argue about this all the time I reckon.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I agree too, but at the moment he is hamstrung, pardon the expression by the loss of Barton and Emre. He realises this and changed it around in the last two games. Personally as mentioned, I'd rather see us playing 4-4-2, at home anyway, it will be interesting to see what happens when Enrique, Barton and Emre are all ready. I think 4-3-3 means we don't get the best from our best players (our strikers and our wingers) and means we can't fit as many in as we should have. I think the return to form of Owen may force the 4-4-2, which for me is a good thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I agree too, but at the moment he is hamstrung, pardon the expression by the loss of Barton and Emre. He realises this and changed it around in the last two games. Personally as mentioned, I'd rather see us playing 4-4-2, at home anyway, it will be interesting to see what happens when Enrique, Barton and Emre are all ready. I think 4-3-3 means we don't get the best from our best players (our strikers and our wingers) and means we can't fit as many in as we should have. I think the return to form of Owen may force the 4-4-2, which for me is a good thing. Totally agree with all of that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohmelads Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I agree too, but at the moment he is hamstrung, pardon the expression by the loss of Barton and Emre. He realises this and changed it around in the last two games. Personally as mentioned, I'd rather see us playing 4-4-2, at home anyway, it will be interesting to see what happens when Enrique, Barton and Emre are all ready. I think 4-3-3 means we don't get the best from our best players (our strikers and our wingers) and means we can't fit as many in as we should have. I think the return to form of Owen may force the 4-4-2, which for me is a good thing. Sums up my thoughts as well. Everyone's talking about the midfield, but I think Viduka's been a problem in this 4-3-3. He might have the build but he clearly doesn't have the legs for such a demanding role. On his own he's easy prey for two defenders and lacks the movement to be beating them to balls, the games so far have been largely passing him by. Put a striker alongside him and that all changes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 I agree too, but at the moment he is hamstrung, pardon the expression by the loss of Barton and Emre. He realises this and changed it around in the last two games. Personally as mentioned, I'd rather see us playing 4-4-2, at home anyway, it will be interesting to see what happens when Enrique, Barton and Emre are all ready. I think 4-3-3 means we don't get the best from our best players (our strikers and our wingers) and means we can't fit as many in as we should have. I think the return to form of Owen may force the 4-4-2, which for me is a good thing. Sums up my thoughts as well. Everyone's talking about the midfield, but I think Viduka's been a problem in this 4-3-3. He might have the build but he clearly doesn't have the legs for such a demanding role. On his own he's easy prey for two defenders and lacks the movement to be beating them to balls, the games so far have been largely passing him by. Put a striker alongside him and that all changes. Yup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 If Sam changes from 4-3-3 I'll eat my hat, he may alternate every now and again but I honestly can't see him not sticking with it, ideal personnel or no ideal personnel. Then again he is a progressive manager and didn't always use 4-3-3 at Bolton, he started out 4-5-1, went to 4-4-2, tried 3-5-2 out and eventually stuck on 4-3-3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted September 2, 2007 Share Posted September 2, 2007 Would rather play 4-4-2 but for the sake of the thread, when all fit it would probably be (as a front 6): Butt Emre Barton Martins N'Zogbia Viduka But that would mean dropping Owen (best striker) and dropping Milner (undeserved), Thats why I want us to play 4-4-2. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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