Jonas Gutierrez

[Cajun]

Selling Milner and N'Zogbia sent us down. I can't imagine for one moment that if we'd kept them that we'd be in the same position. I know neither of them were overly productive in their time here but at least they'd have scored a couple and created a couple.

 

I like Jonas for his effort but he produces nothing at all.

 

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia.

 

N'Zogbia was the bigger loss of the two, without a doubt for me. Was absolutely furious at the sale.

 

The guy had pace and dribbling, and was the only player in the squad who used it relatively effectively. Fuck JFK for getting rid of that for what I presume to be xenophobic reasons.

 

Prior to being droped by JFK once Duff returned from injury (and after one average game), N'Zog down the left and Jonas down the right looked like an excellent wing partnership. End product and pace down one flank, ball retention and carrying it forward under pressure down the other. Having a two-flanked attach has always reduced the impact of teams doubling up on one player, as most teams did with Jonas. Certainly remember there being a thread where many of us were getting excited at this combination.

 

Had he not been sold, I think we'd have stayed up.

 

What's the assist and goal stats for last season for:

 

Zoggy

Milner

Jonas

 

?

 

 

 

According to this:

 

http://www.premierleague.com/page/Statistics

 

For premier league only:

 

Milner got 9 assists, puts him in the top 8 of the league. Only scored 3 though. Similar to last time he was at Villa.

 

Jonas got 4 assists and 0 goals.

 

N'Zogbia got 3 assists and 2 goals.

 

So those two together nearly got as many as Milner, roll on the excuses, stats don't mean anything etc etc..

[Chris_R]

Selling Milner and N'Zogbia sent us down. I can't imagine for one moment that if we'd kept them that we'd be in the same position. I know neither of them were overly productive in their time here but at least they'd have scored a couple and created a couple.

 

I like Jonas for his effort but he produces nothing at all.

 

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia.

 

I didn't want rid of either of them, but I'd have been happy had either of them been replaced.

 

Instead they were just sold. That's what put us up shit creek.

[Cajun]

Keegan was forced into playing a different formation which worked, would Milner have worked in that formation? I reckon he would, quite well.

 

Not as if he has gone off and proved all the critics right is it? Done very well at a side who have gone considerably better than we have in recent years.

 

Possibly would have fit in, but that's debateable. At the time a few people on here were saying he'd have fitted into Geremi's position, but Geremi, despite the lack of legs, has the ability to play a good pass unlike Milner, and is more of a team player on the ball (will release the ball quickly, play quick one-twos, play short, etc). Milner imo is a one-dimensional player who hasn't got a decent assist outside of crossing for years. Get the ball on the wing, check in and out, float it into the box. If he were in that formation on the right of a central midfield trio, he'd be adding work rate only, because aside from that I view him as being the paceless equivalent of N'Zogbia -  a selfish, head down player who runs into dead ends alot and doesn't know how to play a team game. He's just not a central midfielder for me, much like Gurthrie or Barton aren't wingers.

 

As for Villa, he's been poor everytime I've seen him play imo. Villa fans might say he's been class, £12m well spent, so on and so forth, and although I'd respect their opinions, I'd view it as being no different to the pro-Milner views we had whilst he was with us, floating endless crosses into no-mans land and wasting promising position after promising position. He's a hard working lad who'll chip in with the odd goal/assist and will constantly try to put crosses into the box, so there'll always be people who admire or rate that.

 

1. I honestly think one of the reasons why Villa haven't challenged, and won't be challenging, for 4th spot is because of signing Milner. They should have looked to add pace and dribbling (or technical ability and creativity) down the right to compliment Young down the left. As stated before, a two flanked attack is infinitely better than a one flanked attack with a workhorse on the other flank (unless the team has world class players spread throughout it). If the pacey winger on the one flank has an off day, or comes across a fullback on form who he can't get the better off, the service/penetration/creativity is not stiffled for the entire team if there's a pacey or creative winger on the other flank. So Villa could have improved the team greatly in this respect. Instead, they've added an average workhorse for big money on that side, a "trier" who on a good day might put in a decent cross or two, and as a result they haven't improved from the year before, despite the big outlay.

 

 

1  

 

2. you were just saying how N'Zogbia and Jonas worked so well together because one did all the attacking crossing etc and the other was the worker, now you are saying thats a bad thing?

 

 

[tmonkey]

Selling Milner and N'Zogbia sent us down. I can't imagine for one moment that if we'd kept them that we'd be in the same position. I know neither of them were overly productive in their time here but at least they'd have scored a couple and created a couple.

 

I like Jonas for his effort but he produces nothing at all.

 

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia.

 

N'Zogbia was the bigger loss of the two, without a doubt for me. Was absolutely furious at the sale.

 

The guy had pace and dribbling, and was the only player in the squad who used it relatively effectively. f*** JFK for getting rid of that for what I presume to be xenophobic reasons.

 

Prior to being droped by JFK once Duff returned from injury (and after one average game), N'Zog down the left and Jonas down the right looked like an excellent wing partnership. End product and pace down one flank, ball retention and carrying it forward under pressure down the other. Having a two-flanked attach has always reduced the impact of teams doubling up on one player, as most teams did with Jonas. Certainly remember there being a thread where many of us were getting excited at this combination.

 

Had he not been sold, I think we'd have stayed up.

 

What's the assist and goal stats for last season for:

 

Zoggy

Milner

Jonas

 

?

 

What's the point being made though?

 

Jonas and Zog on opposite flanks only happened for a few games whilst Duff was out injured and (iirc) Enrique was fit. And stats won't reflect the fact that a team looked much more dangerous with two complementing wingers in it then without - if Zog beats two players with great skill, puts a peach of a ball in, and Martins heads it eight metres high, stats will never show what happened. We might have lost the games Jonas/Zog played in for all I know, the point is that it looked a very promising "partnership" at the time, far better then the alternatives, and it should have been our first choice based on performance/skill. Instead it was dimsantled pretty quickly because of the reputation of some other player the manager preferred.

[tmonkey]

Keegan was forced into playing a different formation which worked, would Milner have worked in that formation? I reckon he would, quite well.

 

Not as if he has gone off and proved all the critics right is it? Done very well at a side who have gone considerably better than we have in recent years.

 

Possibly would have fit in, but that's debateable. At the time a few people on here were saying he'd have fitted into Geremi's position, but Geremi, despite the lack of legs, has the ability to play a good pass unlike Milner, and is more of a team player on the ball (will release the ball quickly, play quick one-twos, play short, etc). Milner imo is a one-dimensional player who hasn't got a decent assist outside of crossing for years. Get the ball on the wing, check in and out, float it into the box. If he were in that formation on the right of a central midfield trio, he'd be adding work rate only, because aside from that I view him as being the paceless equivalent of N'Zogbia -  a selfish, head down player who runs into dead ends alot and doesn't know how to play a team game. He's just not a central midfielder for me, much like Gurthrie or Barton aren't wingers.

 

As for Villa, he's been poor everytime I've seen him play imo. Villa fans might say he's been class, £12m well spent, so on and so forth, and although I'd respect their opinions, I'd view it as being no different to the pro-Milner views we had whilst he was with us, floating endless crosses into no-mans land and wasting promising position after promising position. He's a hard working lad who'll chip in with the odd goal/assist and will constantly try to put crosses into the box, so there'll always be people who admire or rate that.

 

1. I honestly think one of the reasons why Villa haven't challenged, and won't be challenging, for 4th spot is because of signing Milner. They should have looked to add pace and dribbling (or technical ability and creativity) down the right to compliment Young down the left. As stated before, a two flanked attack is infinitely better than a one flanked attack with a workhorse on the other flank (unless the team has world class players spread throughout it). If the pacey winger on the one flank has an off day, or comes across a fullback on form who he can't get the better off, the service/penetration/creativity is not stiffled for the entire team if there's a pacey or creative winger on the other flank. So Villa could have improved the team greatly in this respect. Instead, they've added an average workhorse for big money on that side, a "trier" who on a good day might put in a decent cross or two, and as a result they haven't improved from the year before, despite the big outlay.

 

 

1   

 

2. you were just saying how N'Zogbia and Jonas worked so well together because one did all the attacking crossing etc and the other was the worker, now you are saying thats a bad thing?

 

 

 

1) ? I think that's a fair comment. The view is that Villa are a 5th/6th calibre team capable of moving up to realistically challenging for 4th spot (i.e. being there, or close, come the final day of the season) if they can improve the first team well enough. Signing Milner has ensured that they missed the opportunity to improve the team's attacking threat and effectiveness imo. It's like spending big to just stay in the same position - the team is no worse off, but it's not better off either, even if the player does chip in according to the stats.

 

2) I've not said Jonas was the "worker". My definition of a worker is someone who works hard off the ball - both Jonas and Milner do that very well. But Jonas is a ball carrier and helps retention, i.e. he can dribble past players and make the ball stick to him when he's under pressure in tight spots. That can drive the team forward from defensive or nothing situations when the team is camped in their own half. His end product is s***, but how many times did he win a free kick or corner having dribbled from within his own half, with noone to pass to around him, and forced the play in our favour?

 

Having that on one flank, and a player with pace, dribbling, can cut inside or go down the line, and end product, down the other flank, is a pretty useful combination. It's not as effective when you have a player who's similar to the pacey winger down the other flank, but in fact isn't pacey and has similar flaws (inconsistent, inaccurate, head-down and run into brick walls, limited team-play).

[Cajun]

Milner got 9 assists and 3 goals in the league for Villa, as easy as it is to dismiss stats (and I do it myself sometimes) you only have to look at the players who always occupy the top spots to see they do kind of mean something (above Milner is Kuyt, Ireland, Lampard, Gerrard, Fabregas, Berbatov and Van Persie).

 

Milner is no superstar but he is a lot better than people give him credit for. I think and have said on numerous times before you are one of the best football posters on here but you seem to have a real grudge against Milner for some reason and that seems to be clouding your usually very good judgement.

 

Milner and Young is a good wing partnership, as good (well better if I am honest) than Jonas and N'Zogbia.

 

Looks like his team mates appreciate him too:

 

http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/england/2009/06/08/1311888/john-carew-heaps-praise-on-aston-villa-team-mate-james

 

Some of the comments that article left out of the interview:

 

Carew is grateful that Young and Milner gave Villa an attacking strength on both wings last season.

 

“It’s a nice balance, they both have the same job but they have different ways of playing,” he said.

 

“We have two of the best wingers in the league and we are really lucky to have them.”

 

 

[Dokko]

Selling Milner and N'Zogbia sent us down. I can't imagine for one moment that if we'd kept them that we'd be in the same position. I know neither of them were overly productive in their time here but at least they'd have scored a couple and created a couple.

 

I like Jonas for his effort but he produces nothing at all.

 

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia.

 

N'Zogbia was the bigger loss of the two, without a doubt for me. Was absolutely furious at the sale.

 

The guy had pace and dribbling, and was the only player in the squad who used it relatively effectively. Fuck JFK for getting rid of that for what I presume to be xenophobic reasons.

 

Prior to being droped by JFK once Duff returned from injury (and after one average game), N'Zog down the left and Jonas down the right looked like an excellent wing partnership. End product and pace down one flank, ball retention and carrying it forward under pressure down the other. Having a two-flanked attach has always reduced the impact of teams doubling up on one player, as most teams did with Jonas. Certainly remember there being a thread where many of us were getting excited at this combination.

 

Had he not been sold, I think we'd have stayed up.

 

What's the assist and goal stats for last season for:

 

Zoggy

Milner

Jonas

 

?

 

 

 

According to this:

 

http://www.premierleague.com/page/Statistics

 

For premier league only:

 

Milner got 9 assists, puts him in the top 8 of the league. Only scored 3 though. Similar to last time he was at Villa.

 

Jonas got 4 assists and 0 goals.

 

N'Zogbia got 3 assists and 2 goals.

 

So those two together nearly got as many as Milner, roll on the excuses, stats don't mean anything etc etc..

 

Thanks.

 

Shows Milner would have kept us up imo.

 

Zoggy debatable,

 

And Jonas relegated.

 

 

[Cajun]

Selling Milner and N'Zogbia sent us down. I can't imagine for one moment that if we'd kept them that we'd be in the same position. I know neither of them were overly productive in their time here but at least they'd have scored a couple and created a couple.

 

I like Jonas for his effort but he produces nothing at all.

 

and I wanted rid of N'Stropbia.

 

N'Zogbia was the bigger loss of the two, without a doubt for me. Was absolutely furious at the sale.

 

The guy had pace and dribbling, and was the only player in the squad who used it relatively effectively. Fuck JFK for getting rid of that for what I presume to be xenophobic reasons.

 

Prior to being droped by JFK once Duff returned from injury (and after one average game), N'Zog down the left and Jonas down the right looked like an excellent wing partnership. End product and pace down one flank, ball retention and carrying it forward under pressure down the other. Having a two-flanked attach has always reduced the impact of teams doubling up on one player, as most teams did with Jonas. Certainly remember there being a thread where many of us were getting excited at this combination.

 

Had he not been sold, I think we'd have stayed up.

 

What's the assist and goal stats for last season for:

 

Zoggy

Milner

Jonas

 

?

 

 

 

According to this:

 

http://www.premierleague.com/page/Statistics

 

For premier league only:

 

Milner got 9 assists, puts him in the top 8 of the league. Only scored 3 though. Similar to last time he was at Villa.

 

Jonas got 4 assists and 0 goals.

 

N'Zogbia got 3 assists and 2 goals.

 

So those two together nearly got as many as Milner, roll on the excuses, stats don't mean anything etc etc..

 

Thanks.

 

Shows Milner would have kept us up imo.

 

Zoggy debatable,

 

And Jonas relegated.

 

 

 

I wouldn't say it definitely shows he would have kept us up as he was in a better team but it gives this "no end product" thing a few thoughts. Like the last time he was there.

 

Milners fault or Newcastles fault? He doesn't seem to have the same problems at Villa, both times he has been there he has been holding his own in the fight for player of the season.

[Bad Mongo]

 

We weren't relegated when Keegan's team started to play good football as soon as Milner was injured and Smith/Duff were dropped.

 

We started playing well when we had Viduka in the team, as we needed someone to hold up the ball due to the fact that no one we had are able to get at the end of a cross.

[Cajun]

 

We weren't relegated when Keegan's team started to play good football as soon as Milner was injured and Smith/Duff were dropped.

 

We started playing well when we had Viduka in the team, as we needed someone to hold up the ball due to the fact that no one we had are able to get at the end of a cross.

 

Another good point, I don't know why the finger was so often pointed at Milner. Ok he did have some very bad games here but a lot of the time the only person even close to getting in the box was Martins and 5 of the opposition defenders yet it was Milner fault for not getting a cross in.

 

Now he is at a team where there is something to aim for and surprise suprise he is getting some assists.

[Guest gggg]

When Milner was in the Villa team they were in relegation form themselves, he only got in when everybody turned shit and they hardly won another game.

[Cajun]

When Milner was in the Villa team they were in relegation form themselves, he only got in when everybody turned shit and they hardly won another game.

 

All his fault.

[Ishmael]

When Milner was in the Villa team they were in relegation form themselves, he only got in when everybody turned shit and they hardly won another game.

 

Finding this laughable. 

[tmonkey]

Milner got 9 assists and 3 goals in the league for Villa, as easy as it is to dismiss stats (and I do it myself sometimes) you only have to look at the players who always occupy the top spots to see they do kind of mean something (above Milner is Kuyt, Ireland, Lampard, Gerrard, Fabregas, Berbatov and Van Persie).

 

Milner is no superstar but he is a lot better than people give him credit for. I think and have said on numerous times before you are one of the best football posters on here but you seem to have a real grudge against Milner for some reason and that seems to be clouding your usually very good judgement.

 

Milner and Young is a good wing partnership, as good (well better if I am honest) than Jonas and N'Zogbia.

 

Looks like his team mates appreciate him too:

 

http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/england/2009/06/08/1311888/john-carew-heaps-praise-on-aston-villa-team-mate-james

 

Some of the comments that article left out of the interview:

 

Carew is grateful that Young and Milner gave Villa an attacking strength on both wings last season.

 

“It’s a nice balance, they both have the same job but they have different ways of playing,” he said.

 

“We have two of the best wingers in the league and we are really lucky to have them.”

 

I have no grudge against Milner, well I hope not as he's not done anything to me personally, I just don't rate him very highly at all. There have been times when I certainly could see a potentially good winger in him, that game against Chelsea down the left flank a year or two ago was pure class, but in the long run that imo it turned out that that was a one-off game where he gave what may have been an off-form fullback a torrid time.

 

Milner's stats may be somewhat impressive, but I can only go by what I've seen of him (no different to the Owen debate, where his stats suggest he was pretty decent for us whereas that contradicts what many of us will have seen on the pitch). There have been numerous games where Milner has just been a waste of a position for Villa, someone who when the team works hard to put the opposition on the back foot, gets the ball on the flank and then it's out for a goal kick, into the keeper's hands or over the head of his teammates. And he's done it repetitively throughout an entire game. Over the course of a season he may have a decent number of assists, and he'll have more for Villa because Villa are a better side with better strikers and teammates, but how many moves or promising situations will he have broken down to get that? It's sounds ridiculous to say 10-20 woeful crosses before putting in a good one, but that's what Milner often does.

 

On top of this, he has no pace. A winger without pace had better be exceptionally talented to compensate, ala Nobby Solano. But he's not exceptionally talented. He's has a few tricks in his locker, but he's a very limited player technically imo, and it often shows whenever he's not in one of his normal positions. For us, particularly in his last season here, whenever he was on the end of a decent chance he'd completely fluff his lines and look a bit fo a donkey. Bit like Nolan when receiving the ball in the penalty box, just doesn't look right when the ball is only slightly difficult to control.

 

I'm not saying Milner is shit, it's fair enough that you think he's good, I'm just arguing that imo he's a very average winger with real limitations, limitations that make him a bad teamplayer when the team is in possession of the ball, a player who'll often relieve the opposition of any pressure his own team is putting them under. O'Neill was mad to not only pay £12m for him, but also think that he was going to actually improve the team. They were a better side with Agbonlahor down the right, even though he's a striker playing out of position.

[Cajun]

Thats the difference, Newcastle fans will say Owen was shit where as Villa fans don't say the same about Milner. Although you have already covered that and basically said you won't believe them anyway.

 

If you believe your judgement of him over a handfull of games is better than theirs over a season then fair enough.

[Guest westamfan]

Milner reminds me of a slightly better Keith Gillespie

[Bad Mongo]

Exactly. And he wasn't helped by Fat Sam's tactics of having him cross right footed from the left side of the box for much of the season. The crosses were often accurate enough, but easily defended against. Notice how he didn't play like that under Keegan or O'Neill? He's adaptable and will do as he's told. Milner is a more than decent player; unspectacular, but more than good enough for us.

 

Apart from Given, he was our best player. He's far better than anything we've got.

[tmonkey]

Thats the difference, Newcastle fans will say Owen was s*** where as Villa fans don't say the same about Milner. Although you have already covered that and basically said you won't believe them anyway.

 

If you believe your judgement of him over a handfull of games is better than theirs over a season then fair enough.

 

My point about Villa fans and their views of Milner is that I'm referring to Milner's time at NUFC, and the fact that plenty of fans were happy with him until his last season here when patience wore thin. So at that specific point in time, I'd say the majority of NUFC fans were happy with Milner despite his flaws, because he's the type of player that fans in general will like - tries hard, chips in with assists/goals, can't fault him for effort, so on and so forth. At the time, I wasn't overly happy with Milner, because a winger with no pace, little teamplay or technical ability (aside from a few routine tricks he's great at) and such abhorrent inconsistency isn't for me.

 

Looking at a Villa forum:

 

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=53561&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

 

"I expected more from Milner. Can't fault the lad for effort and commitment, but he doesn't offer enough attacking wise down that right hand side, he's a workhorse, but he's better than that. O'Neill needs to give him a licence to get forward and take some of the pressure off Young on the left, which will also make us a little less predictable. "

 

There's at least one Villa fan out there with slightly similar views.

[Spider Jerusalem]

He's far better than anything we've got.

 

To be honest that's a given, considering that from the point he left last season we had no right winger at all.  We had a right-footed winger that perfers to play on the left with no end product, a broken ex-superstar who would often 'play' on the right but would be even more ineffective than in his real position and a whinger with a bad attitude who would sulf if played out of position, or played in his regular position.  A the minute we need to get three players, one left and two right, to give us a chance next year, as Gutierrez will be gone soon and nobody will take Duff off our hands.

[Cajun]

Thats the difference, Newcastle fans will say Owen was s*** where as Villa fans don't say the same about Milner. Although you have already covered that and basically said you won't believe them anyway.

 

If you believe your judgement of him over a handfull of games is better than theirs over a season then fair enough.

 

My point about Villa fans and their views of Milner is that I'm referring to Milner's time at NUFC, and the fact that plenty of fans were happy with him until his last season here when patience wore thin. So at that specific point in time, I'd say the majority of NUFC fans were happy with Milner despite his flaws, because he's the type of player that fans in general will like - tries hard, chips in with assists/goals, can't fault him for effort, so on and so forth. At the time, I wasn't overly happy with Milner, because a winger with no pace, little teamplay or technical ability (aside from a few routine tricks he's great at) and such abhorrent inconsistency isn't for me.

 

Looking at a Villa forum:

 

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=53561&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

 

"I expected more from Milner. Can't fault the lad for effort and commitment, but he doesn't offer enough attacking wise down that right hand side, he's a workhorse, but he's better than that. O'Neill needs to give him a licence to get forward and take some of the pressure off Young on the left, which will also make us a little less predictable. "

 

There's at least one Villa fan out there with slightly similar views.

 

So you have ignored the majority of comments that suggest he will be a key player for them next season and have chosen the ONE comment that slightly resembled what you say about him

[Dokko]

Thats the difference, Newcastle fans will say Owen was s*** where as Villa fans don't say the same about Milner. Although you have already covered that and basically said you won't believe them anyway.

 

If you believe your judgement of him over a handfull of games is better than theirs over a season then fair enough.

 

My point about Villa fans and their views of Milner is that I'm referring to Milner's time at NUFC, and the fact that plenty of fans were happy with him until his last season here when patience wore thin. So at that specific point in time, I'd say the majority of NUFC fans were happy with Milner despite his flaws, because he's the type of player that fans in general will like - tries hard, chips in with assists/goals, can't fault him for effort, so on and so forth. At the time, I wasn't overly happy with Milner, because a winger with no pace, little teamplay or technical ability (aside from a few routine tricks he's great at) and such abhorrent inconsistency isn't for me.

 

Looking at a Villa forum:

 

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=53561&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

 

"I expected more from Milner. Can't fault the lad for effort and commitment, but he doesn't offer enough attacking wise down that right hand side, he's a workhorse, but he's better than that. O'Neill needs to give him a licence to get forward and take some of the pressure off Young on the left, which will also make us a little less predictable. "

 

There's at least one Villa fan out there with slightly similar views.

 

So you have ignored the majority of comments that suggest he will be a key player for them next season and have chosen the ONE comment that slightly resembled what you say about him

 

[tmonkey]

Milner reminds me of a slightly better Keith Gillespie

 

That's like saying Kevin Nolan reminds me of a slightly better Kaka.

[Cajun]

To be fair if you continue to look on that forum there is mixed opinion about Milner (although the vast majority is good). A lot of the talk we had (best position etc).

 

He isn't world class so obviously has faults, like the majority of players.

 

Imo he is a good player, nothing special but gives something to the team and we would have been better with him last year. Could we have turned £12m down? Fuck off could we! its a shame it wasn't used properly though.

 

I can't be arsed to argue anymore, I have my opinion and others have theirs. I just feel some go a little over the top on the lad (ie at times blaming him solely for us being shit) but each to their own.

 

Hopefully we get promoted next season and can discuss again bringing in players of his quality.

[tmonkey]

Thats the difference, Newcastle fans will say Owen was s*** where as Villa fans don't say the same about Milner. Although you have already covered that and basically said you won't believe them anyway.

 

If you believe your judgement of him over a handfull of games is better than theirs over a season then fair enough.

 

My point about Villa fans and their views of Milner is that I'm referring to Milner's time at NUFC, and the fact that plenty of fans were happy with him until his last season here when patience wore thin. So at that specific point in time, I'd say the majority of NUFC fans were happy with Milner despite his flaws, because he's the type of player that fans in general will like - tries hard, chips in with assists/goals, can't fault him for effort, so on and so forth. At the time, I wasn't overly happy with Milner, because a winger with no pace, little teamplay or technical ability (aside from a few routine tricks he's great at) and such abhorrent inconsistency isn't for me.

 

Looking at a Villa forum:

 

http://www.villatalk.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=53561&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

 

"I expected more from Milner. Can't fault the lad for effort and commitment, but he doesn't offer enough attacking wise down that right hand side, he's a workhorse, but he's better than that. O'Neill needs to give him a licence to get forward and take some of the pressure off Young on the left, which will also make us a little less predictable. "

 

There's at least one Villa fan out there with slightly similar views.

 

So you have ignored the majority of comments that suggest he will be a key player for them next season and have chosen the ONE comment that slightly resembled what you say about him

 

Yes? I dont see how you're failing to understand what I'm saying. The point is that the majority are going to like him and be happy with him, just like Newcastle fans prior to his last season here. The dissenters will be in the minority, even more so with Villa being relatively successful.

 

I looked up one thread with Milner in it, and found a viewpoint by a Villa fan that backs up what I've been saying. That doesn't mean I'm right, just like it doesn't mean the Villa fans' opinion is right. On the other side of the coin, concluding that Milner has been good for Villa because the majority of Villa fans are happy with him is flawed logic. Chlesea fans were happy with Duff in his last season there, chanting his name whenever he had the ball, yet I could see what a useless pile of shit he was and couldn't understand why they were so happy with such a useless player. But they were hardly going to complain about a "solid" hard worker when they were winning the title, were they?

[Cajun]

Teams like Chelsea, Man Utd (their fans still like Smith) etc.. can support those sort of players because of the quality around them. Villa aren't exactly on that level and can't afford to carry players.

 

Anyway i'm off