Terry Venables turned down chance to manage Newcastle in 2008

[NJS]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

A new manager would have just got in the way when Ashley sold the club which he's been trying to do all year.

 

When giving him a chance it was easy to believe his denials even when the NY firm confirmed talks but now I know what a liar he is its obvious there was something to all those reports.

 

All the protests/fallout have done is bring matters to a head.

 

 

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

Good post.

 

If the fans' protests secured Ashley's departure, what would be the obection to that?

 

I think you need to re-read what I've quoted as a good post as it has nothing to do with your question.

[Kimbo]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

A new manager would have just got in the way when Ashley sold the club which he's been trying to do all year.

 

When giving him a chance it was easy to believe his denials even when the NY firm confirmed talks but now I know what a liar he is its obvious there was something to all those reports.

 

All the protests/fallout have done is bring matters to a head.

 

Source? I thought he had been putting people like Ambani and the new City owners off.

 

The protests haven't brought anything to a head, we're just as confused, befuddled, and bewildered as ever.

[Tsunami]

El Tel was apparently offered the job on a game for game basis - that could never work. He wouldn't know where he was & the players would be the same. Give the man a 3 month contract; if we are sold in the meantime pay up his contract from the profits that Ashley is looking to make.

 

The fans would give El Tel support; we have too. It is going from bad to worse. All we need now is for the Nigerians to confirm their bid and Ashley to accept. Aaaarghhhhhh.

[Baggio]

Getting pretty f***ing tired of wankers saying the fans are to blame for all this mess, tbh.

 

Did we force Keegan out to start this entire farce? No, so shut the f*** up.

 

I'm not saying the fans are fully to blame but some need to look at themselves. Remember that vitriol that Allardyce faced after only a few months (Liverpool at home)? Managers, especially in this country, will have noted something like that.

 

I'm not saying the fans are perfect and have acted with complete dignity throughout this. But put it this way, nobody was against Ashley until Keegan felt he had to walk out. Well, apart from NE5.

 

Most were at least content with the way we were moving forward, on and off the pitch. The fans are NOT responsible for the mess we now find ourselves in as a club.

 

They have to shoulder some of the blame though.

 

'Some' being the key word. They probably overreacted to possibly our best ever manager walking out throwing the club into turmoil. No surprise whatsoever. The way some people on here go on you'd think everything was brilliant before the Hull game and I'm bored of it.

 

As a group the fans are way down on the 'these people f***ed up' list.

 

Certainly we've had a part to play in the situation with the campaigning and cockney mafia stuff. Because of our reaction, the volatile man that is Ashley made that premature statement of selling the club, which has now created the situation whereby even Terry Venables is not interested in the job. He's done exactly what the fans were campaigning for, and now we're suffering for it.

 

No doubt Ashley should have ignored the protests, kept quiet, appointed a new manager, then sold the club behind the scenes if that was his true aim. And no doubt there are other people responsible for Keegan walking out. But theres a missing step in between Keegan walking out and the club becoming such a mess that it cant even appoint someone s*** like Venables. As per his official statement, Ashley has listened to the fans and given us what we want. We cant campaign for something, then expect to be absolved of any blame when that campaign is a success. But then, we like to have our cake and eat it too...

 

Excellent post.

 

Keegan walking out was a problem because of the timing but it wasn't a disaster as long as we could have got a decent replacement in, the likes of Deschamps, Zico and Terim were all reported to be interested, the problem was made 10 x worse by the fans threatening to boycott merchandise and food inside the ground as that left Ashley in a position where he felt he had to sell, it was a mistake by Ashley to announce his plans to sell before getting a new manager in but it was the protests that turned a s*** situation into the complete nightmare we've got on our hands now.

 

And when Terim, Deschamps or Zico found out that there isn't any money to spend and that Dennis Wise signs the players and not them?

 

As far as I'm concerned KK walking exposed the set up and owner for what they really are - the setup being a sham and the owner not really being in it because he loves the club, is one of us and wants what's best for the club, i.e. a genuine long-term commitment to the club.

 

I'd rather know that than not know it, I'd rather it got into the open sooner rather than later. The fact it did isn't the problem though, its how the people at the centre of it STILL have handled it all. Evidently very badly. They go from one fuck up to another.

 

The very fact that they have tried to install a temporary manager shows just how clueless they really are. Even had Venables accepted, there is no chance in hell the players would respond to a manager who may or may not be here next month or whenever and there is even less chance of the team being turned around in that time rendering the appointment useless.

 

That's the level of amateur inexperience and downright cluelessness that has caused all this and made it worse and not fans protesting or some daft banner, they are just byproducts of their mismanagement and so is KK's resignation.

 

And before you or any fucker starts I did not protest nor did I specifically want Ashley out. I wasn't stupid enough to think everything was going to be OK though.

 

Without going into it all over again Keegan clearly had some sort of say in transfers up until something happened behind the scenes where Wise felt he had to go over his head to get players in, you were on about him turning Skjelbred down yesterday which he wouldn't have been able to do if he had no say at all and if those managers came in with no idea of how the club was run after all of the publicity about what was going on then they would have been walking into it with their eyes closed.

 

As for appointing a temporary manager, what would you do considering no manager of worth would come here with no job security? Stick with Hughton?

[Baggio]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

A new manager would have just got in the way when Ashley sold the club which he's been trying to do all year.

 

When giving him a chance it was easy to believe his denials even when the NY firm confirmed talks but now I know what a liar he is its obvious there was something to all those reports.

 

All the protests/fallout have done is bring matters to a head.

 

Source? I thought he had been putting people like Ambani and the new City owners off.

 

The protests haven't brought anything to a head, we're just as confused, befuddled, and bewildered as ever.

 

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

[Guest Howaythetoon]

"Newcastle's talks with Terry Venables over appointing the ex-England coach as their interim manager have hit an impasse, BBC Sport understands.

 

Newcastle want to appoint Venables on a match-by-match basis but the 65-year-old wants a longer-term offer. "

 

BBC.

 

how dare the fans not offer him a longer deal.

 

But... but... it was the banner that put him off.

 

Of course Terry Venables or anyone for that matter doesn't want to work on a match to match basis, that is absurd and totally unrealistic that the very idea of it should come with straight jackets because its insane and shows you just how desparate these buffoons running the show really are, what next I wonder. I dread to think, seriously.

 

How the hell would Venables or anyone be able to raise morale, confidence, belief and actually put together a team to win matches knowing the next match could be the last match. No player would ever commit to such a 'deal' either. Yeah, I'm Charles N'Zogbia and Venables wants me to work my balls off for him, to commit to his ideas and plans. What for, for these plans, ideas and the relationship to disappear a few weeks later?

 

And beyond all that, what about the fans, how the fuck are we meant to have any faith or trust in Venables knowing he could be gone a week or so later?

 

You couldn't write this shit honestly.

[NJS]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

A new manager would have just got in the way when Ashley sold the club which he's been trying to do all year.

 

When giving him a chance it was easy to believe his denials even when the NY firm confirmed talks but now I know what a liar he is its obvious there was something to all those reports.

 

All the protests/fallout have done is bring matters to a head.

 

Source? I thought he had been putting people like Ambani and the new City owners off.

 

The protests haven't brought anything to a head, we're just as confused, befuddled, and bewildered as ever.

 

I'm talking a while ago - this if from July:

 

http://www.football.virginmedia.com/page/NewcastleUnitedDetail/0,,12555~1339369,00.html

 

There was talk of DIC before that as well.

 

 

[johnnypd]

aye you've got to give him a decent contract, say up to 2009. if we get bought out in the meantime and have to pay him off then it's an unavoidable cost you can put down to the unique situation we're in.

[tmonkey]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

A new manager would have just got in the way when Ashley sold the club which he's been trying to do all year.

 

When giving him a chance it was easy to believe his denials even when the NY firm confirmed talks but now I know what a liar he is its obvious there was something to all those reports.

 

All the protests/fallout have done is bring matters to a head.

 

Source? I thought he had been putting people like Ambani and the new City owners off.

 

The protests haven't brought anything to a head, we're just as confused, befuddled, and bewildered as ever.

 

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

It'll all fall on deaf ears anyway. Even Keegan's own, direcly quoted words regarding Ashley are totally ignored. Had Keegan thought Ashley was a devious piece of shit, he'd never had said what he did regarding Ashley.

[NJS]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

[Big Geordie]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

If anything, it gave Ashley the excuse to sell up - given  the rumours that had persisted for months. I'll say again, that if you choose to keep your mouth shut, then you have to accept what you are given.

[Guest fraser]

Can't believe folk are still blaming the reaction of the fans? The club (whoever it has been ran by) has taken the piss out of us for years and people had finally had enough with the latest debacle. No protests mean that you have to accept how your club is ran and also be prepared to take what you are served with. That's what's happened for the last 40/50 years and look what it's got us - 1 Fairs Cup when it should have been a lot more.

 

What did the protests achieve exactly? All it did was provoke Ashley into publicly putting the club up for sale, which has left us in limbo. If it had never happened we may have had a new manager by now. Quite a few of us said protests would make the situation worse, don't shoot us for being right.

 

Good post.

 

If the fans' protests secured Ashley's departure, what would be the obection to that?

 

I think you need to re-read what I've quoted as a good post as it has nothing to do with your question.

 

You don't understand why you said the post was good then.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

Turned down because of the asking price that's why. Not because he didn't want to sell. He's secretly been courting interest since he bought us, I say secretly, the press have been running with this since he took over like they ran with the unrest stories since KK took over, which were proven correct. In fact for a club that doesn't talk, the media seem (sadly) to know a lot, a lot more even than the numpties running the club.

[Mick]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

Why would he turn down offers if he was looking to sell?  He wasn't looking to sell until the protests, like it or not.

[Guest Phil K]

But... but... it was the banner that put him off.

The banner and the attitude of many of our more moronic supporters helped, yes.

[Baggio]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

I thought he was looking for more investors to help out financially, like QPR have to use his words.

 

It would make no sense if he was 'whoring' the club around yet refused to even speak to a consortium interested in purchasing the club.

[Mick]

 

If anything, it gave Ashley the excuse to sell up - given  the rumours that had persisted for months. I'll say again, that if you choose to keep your mouth shut, then you have to accept what you are given.

 

Why would Ashley need an excuse?  I'm sure if he had wanted to sell then he could have come up with something instead of waiting for a protest.

[johnnypd]

that ashley wants out so soon suggests he was looking at selling the club a couple of years after buying it. rather odd how he leaves at the first sign of trouble rather than sticking it out like Shepherd did.

 

imo he was thinking he'd maintain us in the premierleague at little to no cost to him (shown by the failure to spend), reap in the profits of extra tv money, wait for overseas tv rights to rise, keep Keegan in charge to keep the fans happy + secure some future revenue streams while he failed to show ambition. then he'd sell to some rich foreigner. his next step wouldve been to get planning permission on the land surrounding SJP, but not developing it himself, just to raise the value of the club. this is shown by his preliminary discussions with NCC for a skyscraper on the gallowgate carpark. no viability in that plan at the present but getting opp for such a dense development within the next 7 years would easily net him tens of millions extra.

 

a bit like his gamble on HBOS it didnt come off as the keegan and (most) the fans were intelligent enough to see through his charade, this risked destabilising his entire plan so he's getting out.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

that ashley wants out so soon suggests he was looking at selling the club a couple of years after buying it. rather odd how he leaves at the first sign of trouble rather than sticking it out like Shepherd did.

 

imo he was thinking he'd maintain us in the premierleague at little to no cost to him (shown by the failure to spend), reap in the profits of extra tv money, wait for overseas tv rights to rise, keep Keegan in charge to keep the fans happy + secure some future revenue streams while he failed to show ambition. then he'd sell to some rich foreigner. his next step wouldve been to get planning permission on the land surrounding SJP, but not developing it himself, just to raise the value of the club. this is shown by his preliminary discussions with NCC for a skyscraper on the gallowgate carpark. no viability in that plan at the present but getting opp for such a dense development within the next 7 years would easily net him tens of millions extra.

 

a bit like his gamble on HBOS it didnt come off as the keegan and (most) the fans were intelligent enough to see through his charade, this risked destabilising his entire plan so he's getting out.

 

Good analysis.

[NJS]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

Why would he turn down offers if he was looking to sell?  He wasn't looking to sell until the protests, like it or not.

 

Not the full £450M.

[NJS]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

I thought he was looking for more investors to help out financially, like QPR have to use his words.

 

 

Another statement which seemed to make sense but as I said, given his other BS I don't believe anything he ever said.

 

 

[Guest Edd]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

Turned down because of the asking price that's why. Not because he didn't want to sell. He's secretly been courting interest since he bought us, I say secretly, the press have been running with this since he took over like they ran with the unrest stories since KK took over, which were proven correct. In fact for a club that doesn't talk, the media seem (sadly) to know a lot, a lot more even than the numpties running the club.

 

Is it ok if I also selectively pick media stories to counteract your argument?

[Willow]

jesus, I'm so pissed off about nufc right now I'm actually laughing like a madman...I'm on the edge 

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Didn't John Gibson write an article the other week about some consortium moving in a few months ago but Ashley wouldn't even speak with them?

 

Turning down approaches is one thing and I'd have no problem in seeing that as showing his commitment but quite a few articles suggesting "whoring" appeared in the early summer - as Robster has said on the other thread I feel his "listening to the fans" is a get-out clause for something he was trying to do anyway.

 

 

 

Turned down because of the asking price that's why. Not because he didn't want to sell. He's secretly been courting interest since he bought us, I say secretly, the press have been running with this since he took over like they ran with the unrest stories since KK took over, which were proven correct. In fact for a club that doesn't talk, the media seem (sadly) to know a lot, a lot more even than the numpties running the club.

 

Is it ok if I also selectively pick media stories to counteract your argument?

 

No.