Guest toonlass Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I am in agreement with the NUSC about one thing and that is that there seems to be a fair amount of incompetence in running the club no matter how much money has or has not been sunk in. Failure to complete on signings, failure to communicate, failure to appoint a calibre manager being obvious causes for complaints. NUSC seems to have built good channels with the press and I would suggest instead of focusing on "Ashley out" they use their links to keep bringing these issues up. Totally agree Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I am in agreement with the NUSC about one thing and that is that there seems to be a fair amount of incompetence in running the club no matter how much money has or has not been sunk in. Failure to complete on signings, failure to communicate, failure to appoint a calibre manager being obvious causes for complaints. NUSC seems to have built good channels with the press and I would suggest instead of focusing on "Ashley out" they use their links to keep bringing these issues up. Totally agree Can't disagree with that, except to point out that maybe the reason NUSC has links with the press is because they are so anti-Ashley. The press wouldn't have wanted to know about them if they had been more reasonable from the start. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brazilianbob Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I accept that Ashley cannot sell the club but I cannot understand how he cannot see that Llambias and co. who are supposedly running the club for him are not making a very good job of it. For Llambias not to communicate to the media or supporters is disgraceful. The club needs leadership and to hide behind the occasionally anonymous statements on the official website is pathetic. I presume he is the person who represents the club at Premier League meetings etc in which case, he is the figurehead of the club. By refusing to speak in public, it indicates to me an unwillingness to accept responsibility for their decisions. (I am not so concerned with the lack of communication from Ashley because you don't hear from the owners of Man Utd, Blackburn, Spurs, Sunderland, Bolton, Chelsea etc. However, you do hear from David Gill, John Williams, Daniel Levy, Niall Quinn, Phil Gartside, Peter Kenyon). And how is Wise qualified to do the job he has been hired for? Originally, we were told he was in charge of recruitment for the Academy but latterly, I have seen comments in the press saying that he is running the club. In what way? Considering he has recently been a manager and a player, how can he have so little empathy with the manager's struggle with the size of the squad and the lack of players in certain positions. As a manager, would he have been happy for someone to buy the players for him. His managerial experience was in the lower leagues so he would not have been scouting Premier League standard players. The press have also reported players trying to have meetings with Wise and being refused. How would he have felt as a player or manager in a similar situation. We don't know whether it is Wise is responsible for the senior players coming in but he is credited with the Academy players. In this respect, we won't know if he is doing a good job for a few years yet. With the emphasis on developing young players which is a long-term strategy, how come Richard Money wanted to leave for Swindon only a few months after taking on the role. City's Academy Manager has been there for years. Why is Money still having to cover the reserves as we have not replaced Adam Sadler. And JFK. If Ashley only wants a competent mid-table team so that Premiership survival is guaranteed, how can he hope to get that with this joke of a manager. He needs a manager who can work with a limited budget, develop young players and make the best of the playing resources available - and someone who does not embarrass himself every time he speaks to the media. I cannot believe that Ashley seriously expects JFK to do anything else other than struggle and ultimately fail. By letting his mates run the club for him, Ashley is destroying the club. With good personnel, he could have a decent mid-table team with the current resources. The supporters would not be so disgruntled and neither would the players and maybe he might make a little more money. I accept the finances are not great but I do believe with different people running the club and a different manager that improvements could be made and I cannot for the life of me understand why Ashley (as a supposed football fan) cannot see this. Somebody please print the above post out and send it to NUSC. I listened last night for 2 hours to the meeting, and I have upmost respect for what they're trying to do, but unfortunately due to early mistakes and some agenda driven committee members they are becoming an Ashley Out lobby group which many supporters do not want to be associated with. They said last night that the overwhelming feedback they get from fans is that they want Ashley gone now, but they fail to see that the reason that might be is that they are now seen as an Anti Ashley group, so the Anti Ashley brigade gravitate towards them. Last night's meeting seemed more like a gathering of all of those who were against Ashley to come and slag him of in various ways. The meeting was supposed to find some common ground between fans, but they failed (at least in the first couple of hours) to even address the point that the club are losing vast amounts of cash and are technically insolvent without Ashley. That was just unbelieveable, given that the main point that those against NUSC's stated views are that the club was massively in the s*** before Ashley, and his net £20m per annum spend sounded quite good if it meant we had a club to support. Ashley is by no means doing a good job, but that is not because he's asset stripping or holding on for a profit, it's because those appointed to run the club have been poor appointments - Llambias, Wise, Keegan - not necessarily bad appointments by themselves, but madness trying to combine them in a management structure. IF NUSC need to change their agenda and focus on NUFC as it is now i.e propped up financially by Ashley, with no buyer interested. Release a statement or proper set of written principles on the website that actually reflect reality. Use Wallace's post above as a starting point. Express that after the recent financial information they are now aware of the perilous state of the club's finances. Express that they believe that the communication from the club needs to be improved - but stop asking to meet Ashley personally. Until you have a membership which reflects supporters as a whole you have no legitimacy and are nothing more than a pressure group. Express the fans concern at the fact that there is a man with no football experience running the club, and if he is to be retained then he needs an experience Kenyon type character to avoid transfers going tits up. Express thanks that Joe Kinnear took the job in the circumstances and kept us up, but his lack of recent top flight experience should mean that a new manager is brought in June - imagine that, changing manager before a season starts!!! They are all realistic aims/goals for supporters to find common ground behind, and if they were part of an NUSC agenda you could have my tenner. I can't think many fans could argue with those or point in Wallace's post. But running a supporters club based upon "We want Ashley out because he's killing our club" is never going to find common ground between fans because it ignores the reality that is NUFC in 2009. Couldn't agree more. Point well made! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 The fact that Ashley only saw our players train for the first time last week says it all. He has completely underestimated the role he would have as owner of NUFC. Fair play to Kinnear for his persistance on all of this, like, seems to be getting through. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I am in agreement with the NUSC about one thing and that is that there seems to be a fair amount of incompetence in running the club no matter how much money has or has not been sunk in. Failure to complete on signings, failure to communicate, failure to appoint a calibre manager being obvious causes for complaints. NUSC seems to have built good channels with the press and I would suggest instead of focusing on "Ashley out" they use their links to keep bringing these issues up. Totally agree Can't disagree with that, except to point out that maybe the reason NUSC has links with the press is because they are so anti-Ashley. The press wouldn't have wanted to know about them if they had been more reasonable from the start. That actually went through my mind yesterday when I was listening to Simon Bird on the broadcast. I was thinking what's his angle and the answer is probably to shit stir. It 's the nature of the beast with journalists, they need stories and discontent usually makes good copy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest toonlass Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Considering that merchandise, programme costs etc go back to the club are we not cutting our noses off to spite our faces if we boycott them. Ashley (at this time) is not taking any money out of the club. By not buying club merchandise etc we are stopping finance that would be going into the club, but Ashley is only going to bankroll the club so far. If we stop putting the money in, which probably goes a long way towards paying behind the scenes staff (shop workers, customer services, box office staff, stewards etc) we will have less money to go on the players etc as these other people still need to be paid, and the club running costs still need to be paid. I haven't bought anything from Sports Direct since the KK fiasco, as this money does go to Ashley and is not directly associated with Newcastle United, and up to now have not been inside the club shops since KK left, but am struggling to see how taking money away from the club via the merchandising is going to make any difference to how Mike Ashley runs the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I am still quite happy to buy from Sports Direct. Why should I buy from JJB or pasties from Greggs? Have they put anything into my club? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
broonalegeordie Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 how many people turned out last night? were many in favour of ashley staying? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quailman Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 200 or so I believe. By the sounds of things most are against Ashley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 We might well have to replace Kinnear before the end of the season purely and simply to hope for the 'new boss boost'. Could be the only thing that keeps us up. Of course, the question is who comes in instead for that period knowing that the club could very well go down. Horrible mess to be in but I fully expect us to keep Kinnear come hell or high water anyway. Doesn't even take training and not in an aloof MON kind of way, but just a sad loping sit in office drink tea kind of way. Is there any reason I should believe this? is there any reason not to? have you seen us play? Seeing us play I'd be more inclined to believe JFK does take training. I guarantee he doesn't. Calderwood was brought in cause Houghton was doing it practically single handed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikri Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 We might well have to replace Kinnear before the end of the season purely and simply to hope for the 'new boss boost'. Could be the only thing that keeps us up. Of course, the question is who comes in instead for that period knowing that the club could very well go down. Horrible mess to be in but I fully expect us to keep Kinnear come hell or high water anyway. Doesn't even take training and not in an aloof MON kind of way, but just a sad loping sit in office drink tea kind of way. Is there any reason I should believe this? is there any reason not to? have you seen us play? Seeing us play I'd be more inclined to believe JFK does take training. I guarantee he doesn't. Calderwood was brought in cause Houghton was doing it practically single handed. Manager & Assistant both taking a hands-off approach in training? No wonder the team have no fucking idea what to do on the pitch Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpTheToon Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ He's a c**t. Just because he bigs us (the fans) up in the press doesn't mean his agenda is anything other than shit stirring and feeding off scandal. And since when did NUSC become 'an official well run supporters club'?! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ He's a c**t. Just because he bigs us (the fans) up in the press doesn't mean his agenda is anything other than shit stirring and feeding off scandal. And since when did NUSC become 'an official well run supporters club'?! I agree on some of the stuff he's wrote, especially the lack of communication, but other than anger and frustration he hasn't got any answers, same as most of the NUSC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ He's a c**t. Just because he bigs us (the fans) up in the press doesn't mean his agenda is anything other than shit stirring and feeding off scandal. And since when did NUSC become 'an official well run supporters club'?! I agree on some of the stuff he's wrote, especially the lack of communication, but other than anger and frustration he hasn't got any answers, same as most of the NUSC. I'm sick of hearing the same vague things from everyone about how we need to be 'treated with more respect' and all that bollocks. No regime in living memory has ever treated the fans with anything that could be called 'respect', especially not Freddy Shepherd... what we really mean is 'we'd like to be higher up the table please'. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoreboard82 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I think further protests would only put more distance between Ashley and the fans, but i don't understand why Ashley can't keep the fans up to date with the state we're in. If it's bad, so be it. Tell us how bad and we may understand. A clue to what he can do about our situation wouldn't go a miss either. As much as i disagree with how the club is being run, i don't see the point in hounding Ashley out when no-one wants to take over. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnufc22 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ He's a c**t. Just because he bigs us (the fans) up in the press doesn't mean his agenda is anything other than s*** stirring and feeding off scandal. And since when did NUSC become 'an official well run supporters club'?! I agree on some of the stuff he's wrote, especially the lack of communication, but other than anger and frustration he hasn't got any answers, same as most of the NUSC. I'm sick of hearing the same vague things from everyone about how we need to be 'treated with more respect' and all that bollocks. No regime in living memory has ever treated the fans with anything that could be called 'respect', especially not Freddy Shepherd... what we really mean is 'we'd like to be higher up the table please'. I wouldnt say its 'we'd like to be higher in the table', fans just want to see ambition surley. And no that does not mean spending loads & loads, yes the wages are acknowledged. I mean ambition by looking to get a better manager in - hearing Kinnear has been offered a contract worries people and dosent give the manager position much credibility if someone who has won 4 games is appointed. If Dennis Wise's role is nothing but helpful, surley there are good manager's who would want that? And talking about Wise, fans just want to know what specifically he does. Because they kinda have just seen a legend leave because of interference and Wise kinda has the title 'director of football'! Fans have just wanted the Chairman to communicate just thoughts on the football side, and his plans, his thinking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ He's a c**t. Just because he bigs us (the fans) up in the press doesn't mean his agenda is anything other than s*** stirring and feeding off scandal. And since when did NUSC become 'an official well run supporters club'?! I agree on some of the stuff he's wrote, especially the lack of communication, but other than anger and frustration he hasn't got any answers, same as most of the NUSC. I'm sick of hearing the same vague things from everyone about how we need to be 'treated with more respect' and all that bollocks. No regime in living memory has ever treated the fans with anything that could be called 'respect', especially not Freddy Shepherd... what we really mean is 'we'd like to be higher up the table please'. Well yeah, but by respect they mean communication from the people who run and currently own NUFC. The communication has been disgusting tbh. Thats lack of respect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timnufc22 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Look at the Hull game, after the FACT statement, there was nothing at all the week leading up to the game, nothing. Nothing about plans to moving forward etc, the system etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Simon Bird who was there last night; http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/02/05/why-newcastle-fans-deserve-more-than-silent-contempt-from-mike-ashley-and-joe-kinnear-by-simon-bird-115875-21099381/ He's a c**t. Just because he bigs us (the fans) up in the press doesn't mean his agenda is anything other than s*** stirring and feeding off scandal. And since when did NUSC become 'an official well run supporters club'?! I agree on some of the stuff he's wrote, especially the lack of communication, but other than anger and frustration he hasn't got any answers, same as most of the NUSC. I'm sick of hearing the same vague things from everyone about how we need to be 'treated with more respect' and all that bollocks. No regime in living memory has ever treated the fans with anything that could be called 'respect', especially not Freddy Shepherd... what we really mean is 'we'd like to be higher up the table please'. Well yeah, but by respect they mean communication from the people who run and currently own NUFC. The communication has been disgusting tbh. Thats lack of respect. I just don't buy that, I can't think of anything that the Ashley could have said. If he'd come out and said "you were in crippling debt, I saved this club and from now on we'll have to run on a budget", he would be getting the same stick he is now because of how bad we're doing. And we think his managerial appointment was shit, when has an owen ever justified those decision to the fans publicly? It just doesn't happen. Same with the appointment of Llambias, he's not going to publicly admit that his own chairman is shit. What about forcing Keegan out? The club have already made a number of statements on that, and we still hate Ashley anyway. That's just my opinion, I just haven't heard anyone suggest anything plausible that they would like to hear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Darth Toon Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 What about forcing Keegan out? The club have already made a number of statements on that, and we still hate Ashley anyway. Have they? I only remember one, and it was full of easily-falsifiable FACTS! Have to say I'm impressed by Simon Bird's article, and it does seem the NUSC are making significant progress in being taken seriously. Good luck to them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 just don't buy that, I can't think of anything that the Ashley could have said. If he'd come out and said "you were in crippling debt, I saved this club and from now on we'll have to run on a budget", he would be getting the same stick he is now because of how bad we're doing. And we think his managerial appointment was s***, when has an owen ever justified those decision to the fans publicly? It just doesn't happen. Same with the appointment of Llambias, he's not going to publicly admit that his own chairman is s***. What about forcing Keegan out? The club have already made a number of statements on that, and we still hate Ashley anyway. That's just my opinion, I just haven't heard anyone suggest anything plausible that they would like to hear. So its ok for them to sit in silence whilst they blew a 4th transfer window and the club faces a relegation scrap. Nice aye. I would like them to come out and explain why the made certain decisions. Will it be what i what i want to hear from them?, maybe not but at least its an attempt to communicate the issues that the club faces. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 just don't buy that, I can't think of anything that the Ashley could have said. If he'd come out and said "you were in crippling debt, I saved this club and from now on we'll have to run on a budget", he would be getting the same stick he is now because of how bad we're doing. And we think his managerial appointment was s***, when has an owen ever justified those decision to the fans publicly? It just doesn't happen. Same with the appointment of Llambias, he's not going to publicly admit that his own chairman is s***. What about forcing Keegan out? The club have already made a number of statements on that, and we still hate Ashley anyway. That's just my opinion, I just haven't heard anyone suggest anything plausible that they would like to hear. So its ok for them to sit in silence whilst they blew a 4th transfer window and the club faces a relegation scrap. Nice aye. I would like them to come out and explain why the made certain decisions. Will it be what i what i want to hear from them?, maybe not but at least its an attempt to communicate the issues that the club faces. Well the fact that we didn't get as many players as we wanted speaks for itself, I don't see how they could justify or explain it, and to try to would just be to invite ridicule... that's what Joe Kinnear has been doing. Fair enough if you have specific things you want to hear, and if you really would accept them then you're a better man than most. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 just don't buy that, I can't think of anything that the Ashley could have said. If he'd come out and said "you were in crippling debt, I saved this club and from now on we'll have to run on a budget", he would be getting the same stick he is now because of how bad we're doing. And we think his managerial appointment was s***, when has an owen ever justified those decision to the fans publicly? It just doesn't happen. Same with the appointment of Llambias, he's not going to publicly admit that his own chairman is s***. What about forcing Keegan out? The club have already made a number of statements on that, and we still hate Ashley anyway. That's just my opinion, I just haven't heard anyone suggest anything plausible that they would like to hear. So its ok for them to sit in silence whilst they blew a 4th transfer window and the club faces a relegation scrap. Nice aye. I would like them to come out and explain why the made certain decisions. Will it be what i what i want to hear from them?, maybe not but at least its an attempt to communicate the issues that the club faces. Well the fact that we didn't get as many players as we wanted speaks for itself, I don't see how they could justify or explain it, and to try to would just be to invite ridicule... that's what Joe Kinnear has been doing. Fair enough if you have specific things you want to hear, and if you really would accept them then you're a better man than most. So your happy for them to say nothing even tho the clubs in the worst shape it has been in its prem history? You dont even want them to attempt to communicate with the fans, the ones who turn out week in week out which keeps the club going? Strange. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 So your happy for them to say nothing even tho the clubs in the worst shape it has been in its prem history? You dont even want them to attempt to communicate with the fans, the ones who turn out week in week out which keeps the club going? Strange. Dude, I'm far from happy, that would be ridiculous. I'm just saying that I think the issue of 'communication' is a red herring, and just a way for people to express their different grievances. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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