CaliMag Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 That is not really a fair comparison. There is pretty clear consensus that Butt is not up to it and that would include Hughton. Smith was doing well early on but has faded ... and like above, even Hughton knows this. It's entirely fair, the players have achieved the same as the manager, why are double standards fair? But they haven't. Butt - not up to it even in the Championship. Most everyone agrees (including Hughton lately and Butt is not offered a new contract) Hughton - does well in the Championship Not the same. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Hughton has managed to plug holes in a sinking ship, picked up a few decent players on the cheap who are doing the business and has guided us to top of the league. I see no problem with this achievement. If Shearer had done the same thing, everyone would be rimming him. People have taken a dislike to Hughton because, nice bloke or not, *we* didn't choose him. If there's one thing about our fans, we cannot stand to have someone forced upon us. We want to pull the strings at all times. That's fine, but rumour has it no-one wanted to take the poisoned chalice at the beginning of the season. Shearer went AWOL and no managers of worth were linked to us. Hughton has pulled us up by the bootstraps and is doing a pretty canny job considering all of the prophecies propagated by the harbingers of doom at the end of last season. He has my respect for doing his job well, quietly and without complaint, despite having to put up with a bunch of ungrateful bastards in the shape of a selection of our support. What else could he be doing right? I'm not aware that *any* manager has had a flawless season and we're on target to match some of the highest points totals on record. We may not be playing "sexy football" and some of our player may not be underperforming, but every club has these problems. The team will only grow under Hughton and, given some trust in the transfer market, who is to say that he wouldn't be able to pull a few rabbits out of the hat? As for your Smith and Butt comment - you know what, I'd keep them both as squad players until such time as we're fortunate enough to be in a position where top-drawer players actually want to come to us. If they don't perform in the Premiership, as for all you know they might do given it'll likely be the start of their respective swansongs, we can get rid then. It's not often that newly-promoted teams can have two proven England internationals as reserves. As impact players, Smith especially can still do a job. I'm going to be positive until such time as I have cause to be otherwise. I doubt very much that anybody have taken a dislike to Hughton because we didn't choose him. If that was the case then we'd have never liked any manager of player as we have no say in any of them arriving at the club. I wasn't wanting Shearer here as he was unproven but I don't see how he went AWOL, he could have done nothing more than he did to get the job other than just turning up and doing the job that he wasn't offered. The main reason that we are where we are is because this league is light years behind the standard of the Premiership and the poor players we had last season are mainly the same this season but are performing at a much lower level. I might be wrong but I think that goes for at least 50% of our players and I have seen nothing to suggest that Hughton will be able to do anything in the top division. We shouldn't keep anybody just because of what they've done this season if it means that we are going to struggle next season. We'll not have the luxury of playing teams like Preston and Peterborough. If we go up and face a team that has as many pops at goal as Swansea did then we’ll not come out of it with a point like we did the other week. Our players haven’t become world beaters, they are playing in a league where you can play crap and you’ll not always be punished for it. This season we’ve won points because the opposition has been poor yet even the poor teams in the Premiership will kill us if we go about our game in the same manner as we have this season. If we go away and play defensively in the Premiership we’ll get the same as we did against Derby in the Premiership, we’ll get nothing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 He's done a good job, we are top of the league, what more can we ask. Why can't Hughton get us playing like Brazil instead of just winning games? He has had a full fucking transfer window as manager to sort this shit out and it's not like he has a shoestring budget to work on the useless prick! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest toonlass Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 He's done a good job, we are top of the league, what more can we ask. Why can't Hughton get us playing like Brazil instead of just winning games? He has had a full fucking transfer window as manager to sort this shit out and it's not like he has a shoestring budget to work on the useless prick! Aye, how dare he have us winning games 5-1, 4-1 and 3-0 and top of the league in February. He should be damn ashamed man! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I just don't get why people slate Hughton continuously. Ok so he isn't Mr Charisma, but we are still top of the league and looking to be heading straight back up. There were loads of Newcastle fans (not necessarily on here) who were saying there was no way we would be heading straight back up this season, and who had us written off before a ball was kicked in August. Personally I think he has gotten the attitude in the dressing room spot on, he makes some mistakes with his substitutions at times (i.e. not giving attacking players long enough when he brings them on) but then again he has brought on Ryan Taylor and Pancrate on twice on in the last two games and got a goal from it. It would be madness not to let him have a go in the Premiership if we go up in the summer, but Mike Ashley has to back him financially to a decent level or we will be f***ed whether we have Hughton or Alex Ferguson. If Hughton deserves to stay because of what we've done so far this season then so does Nicky Butt, so does Alan Smith and so does every other player who as pulled on a shirt for us this season. Will you and others be happy for us to start next season with the same squad as we have now because of what the players have done in this division? Brilliant post. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Read the bit in bold, aye? I read all of your post and my post was not just to you even though I did quote you. How many players do think we'll need to bring in and for what starting positions? I think we'll need 5 or 6 players who will have to come straight in and do a job in our starting 11. The only player who I think we've brought in who could turn out to be a Premiership player and better than what we had before he arrived is Routledge and that's far from a certainty. Williams will be good cover at centre half but I don't think he's better than what we already had in our starting 11 without injuries. Simpson is probably good enough but only because of what we'll have in defence if every body is fit and if Coloccini has improved since the end of last season and isn't just getting away with it because of the poor quality of our current opposition. In midfield I think we're relying on Routledge coming good and Jonas being able to create something on the left and that's far from certain as I think he could be a luxury because he has little or no end product which could be a problem. Our central midfield just isn't anywhere near good enough to be anything other than back up and we'd be in deep shit if we ever had to play them all together like we do now. I think the best that we can expect form our forwards is that Carroll and Lovenkrands could be used as players who can cover others. If I'm right about the players then it just shows the gulf between the two divisions and why we can get away with what we have now, the same goes for Hughton who I think is good enough for where we are but not for where we want to go. We don't have anybody who is better than Owen or Martins were. We don't have anybody who can touch either Bassong or Beye. The only thing that we'll have over our last Premiership campaign is a bit more stability, I don't know if that will be enough. I think Hughton will be here next season and I hope that he does well, I’ll not hold my breath on the outcome of that. I think a lot of people are going to be a bit sick when they see that we're not as good as they thing we are. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I just don't get why people slate Hughton continuously. Ok so he isn't Mr Charisma, but we are still top of the league and looking to be heading straight back up. There were loads of Newcastle fans (not necessarily on here) who were saying there was no way we would be heading straight back up this season, and who had us written off before a ball was kicked in August. Personally I think he has gotten the attitude in the dressing room spot on, he makes some mistakes with his substitutions at times (i.e. not giving attacking players long enough when he brings them on) but then again he has brought on Ryan Taylor and Pancrate on twice on in the last two games and got a goal from it. It would be madness not to let him have a go in the Premiership if we go up in the summer, but Mike Ashley has to back him financially to a decent level or we will be f***ed whether we have Hughton or Alex Ferguson. If Hughton deserves to stay because of what we've done so far this season then so does Nicky Butt, so does Alan Smith and so does every other player who as pulled on a shirt for us this season. Will you and others be happy for us to start next season with the same squad as we have now because of what the players have done in this division? Brilliant post. It really isn't. How can you compare a manager at the beginning of his career making a very positive start to two senior players (who Hughton himself has shown no fear in dropping) who are apparently on the wane. Chalk and farking cheese. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Mick's talking a lot of sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest toonlass Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I wonder where they get the myth that Newcastle United fans would rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 It really isn't. How can you compare a manager at the beginning of his career showing a very positive start to two senior players (he himself has had no fear in dropping) who are apparently on the wane. Chalk and farking cheese. People seem quite happy to compare performance in the Championship with possible performance in the Premiership, again chalk and cheese. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 It's like saying Silvestre is a world class defender because he won a few titles with Manchester United. I don't see how Hughton getting so many wins with some of these bang average (being kind) players can be used as any sort of negative. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I wonder where they get the myth that Newcastle United fans would rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 Do you not think that's a myth? To be honest that comment is more a reflection on you than anybody else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I wonder where they get the myth that Newcastle United fans would rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 Must have missed that. Care to point it out? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I just don't get why people slate Hughton continuously. Ok so he isn't Mr Charisma, but we are still top of the league and looking to be heading straight back up. There were loads of Newcastle fans (not necessarily on here) who were saying there was no way we would be heading straight back up this season, and who had us written off before a ball was kicked in August. Personally I think he has gotten the attitude in the dressing room spot on, he makes some mistakes with his substitutions at times (i.e. not giving attacking players long enough when he brings them on) but then again he has brought on Ryan Taylor and Pancrate on twice on in the last two games and got a goal from it. It would be madness not to let him have a go in the Premiership if we go up in the summer, but Mike Ashley has to back him financially to a decent level or we will be f***ed whether we have Hughton or Alex Ferguson. If Hughton deserves to stay because of what we've done so far this season then so does Nicky Butt, so does Alan Smith and so does every other player who as pulled on a shirt for us this season. Will you and others be happy for us to start next season with the same squad as we have now because of what the players have done in this division? Brilliant post. It really isn't. How can you compare a manager at the beginning of his career making a very positive start to two senior players (who Hughton himself has shown no fear in dropping) who are apparently on the wane. Chalk and farking cheese. He didn't compare Hughton to only two players though, did he? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest toonlass Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I wonder where they get the myth that Newcastle United fans would rather lose 4-3 than win 1-0 Do you not think that's a myth? Not when you are around showing the world that it's true! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foluwashola Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Get promoted.....give Chrissy a pat on the back......remove all traces of him from the football club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 It's like saying Silvestre is a world class defender because he won a few titles with Manchester United. I don't see how Hughton getting so many wins with some of these bang average (being kind) players can be used as any sort of negative. The results aren't negative, the way we have got some of those results just shows how bad this league is and how you can't judge people on the results alone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Get promoted.....give Chrissy a pat on the back......remove all traces of him from the football club. Bit harsh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Get promoted.....give Chrissy a pat on the back......remove all traces of him from the football club. I don't see why he couldn't be kept on as a coach. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Not when you are around showing the world that it's true! Like I said, that's a reflection on you because I've never said that but you've implied that it's true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Get promoted.....give Chrissy a pat on the back......remove all traces of him from the football club. I wouldn't go that far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Get promoted.....give Chrissy a pat on the back......remove all traces of him from the football club. I wouldn't go that far. No way would you pat him on the back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foluwashola Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Perhaps I worded it slightly harshly Seriously however if he lets himself be demoted to a coach he really is a rather weak human being. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Perhaps I worded it slightly harshly Seriously however if he lets himself be demoted to a coach he really is a rather weak human being. Or someone who knows his limits. He wouldn't win no matter what he decided to do with some though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Perhaps I worded it slightly harshly Seriously however if he lets himself be demoted to a coach he really is a rather weak human being. Or someone who knows his limits. He wouldn't win no matter what he decided to do with some though. I'd have a massive amount of respect for him if he stepped down in the summer tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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